The downfall of Taylor Hall

[Nogatco Rd]

So the hart is for the mvp of a single team? In 32 team league?

That's literally what it is.

It isn't a 'best player in the league' trophy. It's a 'most valuable player' trophy. Who are you valuable to? Is McDavid valuable to the Islanders? Or the Leafs? Of course not. Some people like to interpret the trophy to mean, 'best player in the league." But that's not technically what it is.

So the actual wording of the trophy intentionally opens up grey areas where someone may not be as good as another player, but could indeed be more valuable to their team than the other player was to theirs.

Only way it could be 'most valuable to the league' is if it was a $$$ related trophy. As in, more McDavid/Hall/whoever merchandise was sold, and more arenas were filled to capacity when this player played there than any other.

You can make a strong case that there were better players than Hall that year, but convincing people that those players meant more to their team than Hall did to the Devils would be much tougher.

MVP is technically supposed to go to the player most valuable to their team, yes, but I’m not sure that’s how it’s actually decided each year.

In the same way the “best defenseman” doesn’t always win the Norris.

 

[Sky04]

The season he won Hart he had 93 points in 76 games, tied 6th in the league. Hischier was 2nd in team scoring with 52 points in 82 games. That's just insane.

Meh, Kucherov had a 54 point gap on the next closest Lightning player last season, Bure's 55 point gap to his next closest teammates is way more insane, 92 to 37 points. Paul Kariya might have the most impressive one given he was only 21 years old at the time and a 64 point gap on his next closest teammate.

 

[Grifter3511]

MVP is technically supposed to go to the player most valuable to their team, yes, but I’m not sure that’s how it’s actually decided each year.

In the same way the “best defenseman” doesn’t always win the Norris.

I agree 100%. I think there's a pretty good amount of room for interpretation.

 

[Sentinel]

Is that a confirmed statistic?

Just those 2? assuming the most recent ones still playing are locks

Perry is iffy to be honest

In the past 70 years -- yes.

Perry is iffy but he will get in on a weak year.

 

[banks]

I know it's been mentioned in the thread a bit already, but his performance with Buffalo was a disgrace. I've never seen a hockey player quit on a team as much as he did in 2020. Only 2 (two!) goals in 39 games. And he looked worse than that number suggests.

He was abysmal for them, doing nothing to stop a 18 game losing streak. He was atrocious. Not just snakebit, playing hurt, or adjusting to a new team. No, this was downright lazy quitting. He was invisible at his best. That awful performance just about cancels out his Hart season, in my opinion. He clearly never wanted to play there, and just took the money they offered and planned to get traded later.

Here's some of his Sabres teammates that scored more goals in less games than Hall that season: Anders Bjork, Curtis Lazar, Toby Rieder, Arttu Routsalainen, Rasmus Asplund. How bad do you have to be as a premiere scoring forward when you're getting out produced by that group??

 

[AfroThunder396]

He hasn't been the same since his knee injury in early 2018-2019. His game was built around dominating the neural zone with his speed, and once he lost a step he turned into a totally different player.

I understand why he wanted out of NJ after that disastrous start in 2019-2020, but the grass isn't always greener on the other side. He followed that up with ARI and BUF, two places he clearly didn't want to be. He seemed happy and effective in Boston, but now in CHI he once again has nothing to play for and an aging body that's failing him.

 

[Ignatius]

I bet he wishes that Seguin went 1OA

 

[jetsforever]

When I read the title I couldn't even think of which team he's on now, so yeah I think he's fallen off

 

[Marlowe Syn]

So the hart is for the mvp of a single team? In 32 team league?

No it goes to the player that was the biggest difference maker for his teamst. It's a little wonky over traditional sports MVP awards, but there it is. I went to Wiki before I replied just to verify to make sure I was thinking right?. Hence the copy and paste. I was not being snarky at all in my post, but upon re-reading I see where it could be thought otherwise. I had no jerk intents in my reply.

 

[SI90]

he has only one 30 goal season in his career. Pretty wild to think that’s it.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

He hasn't been the same since his knee injury in early 2018-2019. His game was built around dominating the neural zone with his speed, and once he lost a step he turned into a totally different player.

I understand why he wanted out of NJ after that disastrous start in 2019-2020, but the grass isn't always greener on the other side. He followed that up with ARI and BUF, two places he clearly didn't want to be. He seemed happy and effective in Boston, but now in CHI he once again has nothing to play for and an aging body that's failing him.

This. When he won the Hart he was just beating everyone in transition. Other skills were above average, but the skating made it all work.

He’s not particularly good at anything else, can look absolutely lost if not in the right spot, and hasn’t been the most likable guy in the past, so meh. Interesting career though.

 

[JimmyH]

compete level

This is the Steve Dangle of sports terms/lingo.

Anyway I went to a Hawks game the other night when they beat Minnesota in OT. Hall stood out as one of the more energetic/deliberate skaters on the ice for Chicago behind Kurashev and Donato. Relative to his team, he's not that bad although he never does anything too fancy or creative. Hall is at his best in the neutral zone and when he has to muscle guys off the puck.

 

[Matty Sundin]

Is that a confirmed statistic?

Just those 2? assuming the most recent ones still playing are locks

Perry is iffy to be honest

Perry is borderline but I think he’s one of those types that gets in eventually despite people thinking he doesn’t. Taylor Hall won’t even in the discussion when his career is over.

 

[93LEAFS]

Is that a confirmed statistic?

Just those 2? assuming the most recent ones still playing are locks

Perry is iffy to be honest

Perry will probably end up getting in on the back of Hockey Canada accomplishments and the cup in addition to his Hart season.

In general, HHOF is a mess on what the criteria is. So, the bar constantly gets lowered.

 

[JuJu Mobb]

Is it still Hall over Seguin?

 

[Macheteops]

Is it still Hall over Seguin?

Seguin by a small margin in my opinion

 

[Matty Sundin]

Is it still Hall over Seguin?

They been flip flopping numerous times throughout their career. Few years ago I would have preferred Hall over Seguin as Seguin looked done and had a brutal contract but has kinda returned to being respectable production again.

 

[RANDOMH3RO]

I feel bad for Hall, even if some of it was his own doing. Got the devils their only hart trophy and then bounced before the devils made the mistake of paying him. For that, I’ll always be a Hall fan. Hope he can extend his career and up his rep as a useful veteran 4th liner and try and win a cup.

 

[tabness]

people trying too hard to analyze this situation

fact is Hall had to deal with some adversity and couldnt deal due to his typical upper middle class suburban background

had he grown up in the hood like Seguin he would be able to handle what life threw at him and adapt better

 

[John Mandalorian]

MVP is technically supposed to go to the player most valuable to their team, yes, but I’m not sure that’s how it’s actually decided each year.

In the same way the “best defenseman” doesn’t always win the Norris.

“Most valuable to his team” is a vaguery whipped up by people in the media to justify various forms of nonsense. Is the best player in college football (ie winner of the Heisman) always a QB?

 

[BB79]

I hate Taylor Hall but at least I admit it’s because of his stupid face not because some rumours about his character

You don't like his big pouty lips, eh?

 

[Jumptheshark]

he has only one 30 goal season in his career. Pretty wild to think that’s it.

What I always found wild was the Devils dumped him less then 16 month after winning the MVP.

The trade tree on the side of the Devils is interesting. One of the players the Devils got when they traded Hall to Arizona was Kevin Bahl who the Devils flipped to Calgary with a 1st for Markstrom.

These are players the Devils have to show for the Hall trade to Arizona

Here is the trade

• 2019-Dec-16 Arizona Coyotes Kevin Bahl, Nate Schnarr, Nick Merkley and conditional round 1 pick in the 2020 draft (Dawson Mercer) and condtional 3rd (Ryder Korxzak) to New Jersey Devils for Blake Speers and Taylor Hall

Markstrom (Bahl and a first)
Jonas Siegenthaler (Traded for Korczak)
Dawson Mercer


All for Hall--Devils made out like bandits

 

[DJN21]

he quit on his team and set personal trade parameters that benefitted only him after being given a boat load of money....I hope obscurity does him well.

 

[thadd]

Giving him the Hart was dumb at the time. Looks dumber now.

Pretty sure the people voting on the Hart trophy winner aren't supposed to take the future into consideration.

 

[archangel2]

Giving him the Hart was dumb at the time. Looks dumber now.

Done to rub it in the nose of oiler fans