The defense is 1 piece away from being set.

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Fowler for Janrkrok + Lilijgren + 2nd + Niemela?

We should not deal our 1st for Fowler so hopefully that offer is enough

Fowler would make me much more confident tbh in this defense group

Rielly - Tanev
Fowler - McCabe
OEL - Benoit
Hakipana

Still wish we had gotten Roy or Pesce instead of Tanev as they will be better moving forward and are younger

if you don't have to move a 1st round pick to add a quality piece that's great and I would prefer that.

But you can't let a 1st round pick stop you from adding a quality piece

You have Auston Matthews under contract for 4 more seasons.

The time is NOW.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

I'm not smelling whatever Treliving's stepping in.

Ten years later and Rielly's STILL the best defenseman. The offseason saw them acquire three rejects real contenders no longer wanted. Relatively low cost players with something to prove.

They'll fit in nicely with the high cost players with something to prove here already.

Treliving's making a huge bet on these guys getting good again. Bouncing back to the glory days of younger years. Or if they were never good to begin with all they gotta do is get good now.

Produce more than their cap hit and winner winner chicken dinner.

Let's just assemble a team based on whether the players might provide good value. Because the core suck up so much cap they're forced to slap together a roster by targeting players percieved to be underpaid. The unfortunate reality is that these guys are cheap for a reason.

They stink worse than whatever's on the bottom of Treliving's shoe.

 

[Buds17]

Should we expect or want 3.5M x 4 OEL to be bumped down to the third pairing that soon?

 

[Stephen]

That one piece we are missing is a defenseman who slots ahead of Morgan Rielly. A guy who replaces him as the number one and is just more dependable, better on special teams, and elevates partners around him as a true alpha.

 

[hamzarocks]

That one piece we are missing is a defenseman who slots ahead of Morgan Rielly. A guy who replaces him as the number one and is just more dependable, better on special teams, and elevates partners around him as a true alpha.

That isnt possible to add with the core 4 at 47M next year and Rielly at 7.5M

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Should we expect or want 3.5M x 4 OEL to be bumped down to the third pairing that soon?

Every championship winner either has a forward or the 3rd line good enough to be in the top 6

Or a dman on the bottom pair good enough to be in the top 4

OEL is good enough to be in the top 4, But if you add 1 more piece that knocks him to the 3rd pair You're loaded.

Yes we do want that.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I'm not smelling whatever Treliving's stepping in.

Ten years later and Rielly's STILL the best defenseman. The offseason saw them acquire three rejects real contenders no longer wanted. Relatively low cost players with something to prove.

They'll fit in nicely with the high cost players with something to prove here already.

Treliving's making a huge bet on these guys getting good again. Bouncing back to the glory days of younger years. Or if they were never good to begin with all they gotta do is get good now.

Produce more than their cap hit and winner winner chicken dinner.

Let's just assemble a team based on whether the players might provide good value. Because the core suck up so much cap they're forced to slap together a roster by targeting players percieved to be underpaid. The unfortunate reality is that these guys are cheap for a reason.

They stink worse than whatever's on the bottom of Treliving's shoe.

Having concerns is one thing, I have concerns about certain things, this thread being about one of them.

But you take it to a whole new level.

So I'm going to ask do you like anything ever? Or do you just spend your life hating EVERYTHING this team does?

You seem like an angry person

 

[rumman]

I'm not smelling whatever Treliving's stepping in.

Ten years later and Rielly's STILL the best defenseman. The offseason saw them acquire three rejects real contenders no longer wanted. Relatively low cost players with something to prove.

They'll fit in nicely with the high cost players with something to prove here already.

Treliving's making a huge bet on these guys getting good again. Bouncing back to the glory days of younger years. Or if they were never good to begin with all they gotta do is get good now.

Produce more than their cap hit and winner winner chicken dinner.

Let's just assemble a team based on whether the players might provide good value. Because the core suck up so much cap they're forced to slap together a roster by targeting players percieved to be underpaid. The unfortunate reality is that these guys are cheap for a reason.

They stink worse than whatever's on the bottom of Treliving's shoe.

If Tanev can stay healthy he’ll be our best D man imo…….

 

[notbias]

Fowler for Janrkrok + Lilijgren + 2nd + Niemela?

We should not deal our 1st for Fowler so hopefully that offer is enough

Fowler would make me much more confident tbh in this defense group

Rielly - Tanev
Fowler - McCabe
OEL - Benoit
Hakipana

Still wish we had gotten Roy or Pesce instead of Tanev as they will be better moving forward and are younger

We could just try to get a good D instead of Fowler...

This is the Treliving train of thought... if they were good in 2019, they are good now.

 

[rumman]

That one piece we are missing is a defenseman who slots ahead of Morgan Rielly. A guy who replaces him as the number one and is just more dependable, better on special teams, and elevates partners around him as a true alpha.

If you found a guy like that you wouldn’t need Rielly imo……

 

[notbias]

If Tanev can stay healthy he’ll be our best D man imo…….

False, it'll still be Rielly, unless you thought Brodie was our best D 3 years ago.

Muzzin is the only D that has been on Rielly's level.

 

[conFABulator]

That isnt possible to add with the core 4 at 47M next year and Rielly at 7.5M

I think you are right at this point in time, we can add next year though. The only way to make a big upgrade now would be to move out salary in the form of Kampf, Jarnkrok and Liljegren, that is $7.5M. You replace the two forwards with league minimum guys (Lorentz and Holmberg) and you have about $6M to spend on a Dman. Anyone out there at that number that is a big improvement over Liljegren in the lineup? What acquisition cost?

 

[hamzarocks]

We could just try to get a good D instead of Fowler...

This is the Treliving train of thought... if they were good in 2019, they are good now.

Who do you suggest?

I think you are right at this point in time, we can add next year though. The only way to make a big upgrade now would be to move out salary in the form of Kampf, Jarnkrok and Liljegren, that is $7.5M. You replace the two forwards with league minimum guys (Lorentz and Holmberg) and you have about $6M to spend on a Dman. Anyone out there at that number that is a big improvement over Liljegren in the lineup? What acquisition cost?

If we did that in the summer we could have had Pesce, Roy or with 1M more Skeji

At this point the trade targets would be Fowler, Andersson, Provorov, Connor Murphy, Marcus Pettersson maybe. All would have a cost that we may be hesitant to pay (1st + niemela/danford/minten if they come with extensions or retenion)

 

[notbias]

Who do you suggest?

I'd like to see what we have first in OEL and Liljegren (he has been both great and terrible, hoping we see more great), they are wildcards this year.

Outside of that, not sure who is available, but Cam Fowler is not good anymore.

Marino was available, Murphy might be, I think Sergachev is overrated, but he was moved for relatively cheap if needed an offensive D.

You'd have to see what is available, but I'm not sure Fowler is the answer.

 

[Stephen]

If you found a guy like that you wouldn’t need Rielly imo……

Yeah that’s why I advocated trading and upgrading from Rielly.

 

[conFABulator]

Who do you suggest?


If we did that in the summer we could have had Pesce, Roy or with 1M more Skeji

At this point the trade targets would be Fowler, Andersson, Provorov, Connor Murphy, Marcus Pettersson maybe. All would have a cost that we may be hesitant to pay (1st + niemela/danford/minten if they come with extensions or retenion)

That all sounds about right. We don't really know if any of those three wanted to come here. I suspect we looked into Peace and Skjei and we know we were in on and didn't get Roy. I wanted Skjei also. What would this look like? Liljegren out? OEL not signed?

Reilly Tanev
Skjei Roy
McCabe Hakanpaa
Benoit

I like that more than one what we have now and more than the in-season options you outline. As you said, the acquisition cost is high.

Option A also assumes we could move out Kampf and Jarnkrok. I think that was tougher pre July 1 when no one wanted to take on salaries to now when teams know how much room they have for the year.

 

[thewave]

Yeah that’s why I advocated trading and upgrading from Rielly.

How does he get you an upgrade? You need to bundle him up. The Marner and JT cap is the best way, especially with Marner in play for trade.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I'd like to see what we have first in OEL and Liljegren (he has been both great and terrible, hoping we see more great), they are wildcards this year.

Outside of that, not sure who is available, but Cam Fowler is not good anymore.

Marino was available, Murphy might be, I think Sergachev is overrated, but he was moved for relatively cheap if needed an offensive D.

You'd have to see what is available, but I'm not sure Fowler is the answer.

Fowler is still good he's just a Duck.

There are certain teams where bad stats don't count.

The Ducks are one of those teams.

 

[notbias]

Fowler is still good he's just a Duck.

There are certain teams where bad stats don't count.

The Ducks are one of those teams.

If he is one of the worst Ducks, is he still good?

 

[hamzarocks]

I'd like to see what we have first in OEL and Liljegren (he has been both great and terrible, hoping we see more great), they are wildcards this year.

Outside of that, not sure who is available, but Cam Fowler is not good anymore.

Marino was available, Murphy might be, I think Sergachev is overrated, but he was moved for relatively cheap if needed an offensive D.

You'd have to see what is available, but I'm not sure Fowler is the answer.

Marino and Murphy (still likely able to get at TDL tbh) sure were/are options

Sergachev was not had for cheap. Geekie + Moser + 2nd + 7th, while he is a #2D he makes ~8M

We would need to give Cowan (geekie equivalent) + Lilijgren (Moser equivalent) + 2024 2nd just to equal the value and that doesnt factor

1) Tampa wants to create cap space so they wont retain or take kampf+jarnkrok dumps so we would be in a bind and need to dump those two quickly which likely has us losing future picks that we dont have an abundance of

2) Assumes Tampa does not charge a premium to trade in division to a rival team thus making risk that the above offer would be even accepted by Tampa

Dont think we had assets for a Sergachev move unless it was

Marner+ Lilijgren for Sergachev + Cirelli which I dont know tampa has any interest in as Kucherov is tiers better than Marner and makes less with no huge pay day threats associated with Marner + they got Geuntzel who is ~85% as good as marner at a lower cap hit and works well for what they are going for in their retool

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

If he is one of the worst Ducks, is he still good?

like I said there are certain teams where bad stats don't count.

The Ducks are one of those teams.

The Sharks and Blackhawks also belong in that group.

So did Arizona we'll see if that changes in Utah

 

[notbias]

Marino and Murphy (still likely able to get at TDL tbh) sure were/are options

Marino is not anymore, and who knows about Murphy.

Sergachev was not had for cheap. Geekie + Moser + 2nd + 7th, while he is a #2D he makes ~8M

We would need to give Cowan (geekie equivalent) + Lilijgren (Moser equivalent) + 2024 2nd just to equal the value and that doesnt factor

1) Tampa wants to create cap space so they wont retain or take kampf+jarnkrok dumps so we would be in a bind and need to dump those two quickly which likely has us losing future picks that we dont have an abundance of

2) Assumes Tampa does not charge a premium to trade in division to a rival team thus making risk that the above offer would be even accepted by Tampa

Dont think we had assets for a Sergachev move unless it was

Marner+ Lilijgren for Sergachev + Cirelli which I dont know tampa has any interest in as Kucherov is tiers better than Marner and makes less with no huge pay day threats associated with Marner + they got Geuntzel who is ~85% as good as marner at a lower cap hit and works well for what they are going for in their retool

That makes our team worse.

I was just pointing out Sergachev as you were paying a lot for Fowler and Sergachev wasn't had for much more than you were offering.

like I said there are certain teams where bad stats don't count.

The Ducks are one of those teams.

The Sharks and Blackhawks also belong in that group.

So did Arizona we'll see if that changes in Utah

He is bad relative to other players on Anaheim.

Are we just ignoring that he is bad there all together and hope he turns it around?

 

[hamzarocks]

Marino is not anymore, and who knows about Murphy.



That makes our team worse.

I was just pointing out Sergachev as you were paying a lot for Fowler and Sergachev wasn't had for much more than you were offering.



He is bad relative to other players on Anaheim.

Are we just ignoring that he is bad there all together and hope he turns it around?

Cowan + Lilijgren + 2nd --> Lilijgren

Niemela + Lilijgren + 2nd +Jarnkrok (cap dump piece --> Fowler

Fowler is clearly much cheaper to acquire and would let you run the core 4 back, which MLSE + management + a lot of fans here think is the fix, vs Sergachev being much harder to fit cap wise


Huge difference being Cowan is a prospect with a clear NHL future and a likely top 9 player with 1st line upside vs Niemela a D+5 playwr who will be another undersized Offensive D who nwver makes the NHL and likely heads back to SHL in a few years time

Sergachev + Cirelli > Marner + Lilijgren the team is better so long as Kampf+Janrkrok are sent out and a good winger at 5-6M is signed for top 6 (dont give Tanev 4.5M in thos situation

Tampa wouldn't take that deal as it makes them a worse team, leafs would have jumped at dumping marner and getting Sergachev + Cirelli along with ability to add a top 6RW by not having need to give 3.5M to OEL to be a bottom pairing D for us

 

[notbias]

Cowan + Lilijgren + 2nd --> Lilijgren

Niemela + Lilijgren + 2nd +Jarnkrok (cap dump piece --> Fowler

Fowler is clearly much cheaper to acquire and would let you run the core 4 back, which MLSE + management + a lot of fans here think is the fix, vs Sergachev being much harder to fit cap wise


Huge difference being Cowan is a prospect with a clear NHL future and a likely top 9 player with 1st line upside vs Niemela a D+5 playwr who will be another undersized Offensive D who nwver makes the NHL and likely heads back to SHL in a few years time

Sergachev + Cirelli > Marner + Lilijgren the team is better so long as Kampf+Janrkrok are sent out and a good winger at 5-6M is signed for top 6 (dont give Tanev 4.5M in thos situation

Tampa wouldn't take that deal as it makes them a worse team, leafs would have jumped at dumping marner and getting Sergachev + Cirelli along with ability to add a top 6RW by not having need to give 3.5M to OEL to be a bottom pairing D for us

Prospect knowledge is off.

NHL player knowledge is off.

Not much to respond to.

 

[hamzarocks]

Prospect knowledge is off.

NHL player knowledge is off.

Not much to respond to.

Lol, thanks for the response and keep on sticking to your opinions, bias

One day you may learn something, bias