I thought he faded also, but that can be expected.
As Mosby said, after a solid start he faded. He will be fine.
Recalled/Assigned: The Christian Dvorak Uber Tracker
- Thread starter The Feckless Puck
- Start date
I thought he faded also, but that can be expected.
As Mosby said, after a solid start he faded. He will be fine.
No, he didn't "fade". He randomly had his ice time cut after playing great in what has been the team's best game. There was zero performance reason for him to be taken off of the D's line and put on the fourth line. A coach that preaches play earns ice time stuck someone on the fourth after playing great.
THEN after being on the fourth and getting far less ice time with grinders did it seem his play faded. Or was he put in a position where he couldn't have really done much? You should also note, the games he was on our 4th line are the games our 4th line looked its best.
Last edited:
rt
Clean Hits on Substack
Vinny Boombatz
formerly ctwin22
This is spot on. If you look at the advanced possession stats from the Dvo/Domi/Duclair game, they dominated possession, something to the tune of 58% and created many scoring chances, and yet after that demotion to the 4th line and 8 mins and eventually AHL
It was almost like, yep, wait a minute, that worked too well, you weren't supposed to play that well, let me put you on the 4th line w/Dauphin/White so I know you won't look good so I can send you down
(obviously I'm not saying Tippett thought this, i'm just saying from an observer on the game he played above average with quality linemates, it was odd he would immediately get put on the 4th line and play 8 mins vs. 18 min.)
TheLegend
Hardly Deactivated
Tippett doesn't randomly cut ice time without a reason.
You might not agree with that but, Tippett reviews each game on tape multiple times. Something you nor I have the privilege to access.
Sure.... Dvorak playing the fourth line may make the line great. But Dvorak isn't a future fourth line player. Letting him stagnate on the fourth line isn't going to help him develop into that top 6 forward that everyone feels he will be. Even you admitted that.
BUX7PHX
Registered User
- Jul 7, 2011
- 5,581
- 1,350
We are on game #6 of a long career by Dvorak. We already have an idea of what Dvorak is capable of.
We are at game #9 on the season. We are not certain what lines click and lines that have player chemistry, and we are carrying enough players to create some different mixes. That's what is being asked, but if we get behind early or don't see play that develops chemistry, there goes our chances to continue with those lines often enough.
I do believe that there is better chemistry with Dvorak than other centers. But he is also one of the ones that, on occasion, takes some interesting angles in defending the puck carrier. He may need to work on some F/O skills, which he may not get with Hanzal and Richardson at 62 and 53% respectively. He will still be playing against professionals with speed in the AHL, but the game will slow down a little bit more, especially defensively. I expect that by game #16, he will be back in the NHL. Crouse and Strome should be done with their auditions and I expect Strome to stay and Crouse to go back.
We are at game #9 on the season. We are not certain what lines click and lines that have player chemistry, and we are carrying enough players to create some different mixes. That's what is being asked, but if we get behind early or don't see play that develops chemistry, there goes our chances to continue with those lines often enough.
I do believe that there is better chemistry with Dvorak than other centers. But he is also one of the ones that, on occasion, takes some interesting angles in defending the puck carrier. He may need to work on some F/O skills, which he may not get with Hanzal and Richardson at 62 and 53% respectively. He will still be playing against professionals with speed in the AHL, but the game will slow down a little bit more, especially defensively. I expect that by game #16, he will be back in the NHL. Crouse and Strome should be done with their auditions and I expect Strome to stay and Crouse to go back.
WrinkledPossum
Play Dead
- Apr 23, 2016
- 3,367
- 1,068
I don't understand why Dvorak ended up on the fourth line. His ice time kept building until he he led the team against New York, then suddenly crashed when he went to the 4th line. If Tippett saw something he didn't like you'd think his time would've went from 18 min to 15 or 13. Not 10 min and playing with White and Dauphin.
Regardless of the ice time prior, he could've got 15 min last game, I do prefer him going to the AHL if we're going to continue only playing one of Strome or Dvorak. It's a lot better than being scratched.
Regardless of the ice time prior, he could've got 15 min last game, I do prefer him going to the AHL if we're going to continue only playing one of Strome or Dvorak. It's a lot better than being scratched.
His actions seem to contradict this. Dvo looked good both visually and statistically in that game and was subsequently stuck on the 4th line. It may not have been random, but it wasn't for performance reasons.
Again, it seems his biggest crime was his age.
PhoPhan
Registered User
- Feb 27, 2002
- 14,724
- 100
So players are never confused about decisions made by coaches?
You keep conflating the subjective "I don't understand this" with the objective "this is impossible to understand."
TheLegend
Hardly Deactivated
I'd think a lot of that will depend on the progress of Dvo and Strome.
Hanzal did take a maintenance day today so something wasn't right to begin with.
RemoAZ
Let it burn
I don't think his back will ever be totally sound. He's tall and plays a physical game. Not a good combo for a guy with a history of back injuries.
His condition is chronic and has to be carefully managed. Want no part of re-signing him unless it's for dirt cheap.
The problem with Hanzal is that you end up getting 15% beastmode, unique player in the NHL, 45% Average big center, 40% injured/ineffective
Matias Maccete
Chopping up defenses
- Sep 21, 2014
- 9,713
- 3,650
Dirt cheap or very short term, or both. Hanzal is one of my all time favorite coyotes, but he's just too broken down. I also hope he thinks about his long term health, I'd hate to read a few years after he retires that he's got permanent back issues that affect his day to day life and mobility.
kihekah19*
Registered User
Don't know if the percentages are spot on, but the premise is..... Damn shame.
RemoAZ
Let it burn
Yeah it sure would be nice to have the dominant Hanzal on most night. Just doesn't look like that's possible.
KG
Registered User
- Sep 23, 2010
- 4,872
- 744
We are a much bettet team with Hanzal in the line-up, but he misses 20 games a year and who knows how many of the games he actually plays are at 100%. Do we want that at the raise he's likely to command?
But his injury woes will hurt his trade value, and we will be losing a veteran C with no replacement
But his injury woes will hurt his trade value, and we will be losing a veteran C with no replacement
I'd actually offer him 5 x 3.5m and get it fully insured.
400k raise, but he'd fall in line to what basically an elite bottom 6 center is paid. I'd play him on the 4th line as much as possible, in a specialist role, like Boyd Gordon when he was here. Cut down his minutes and maybe the back problems aren't as bad or they completely go away.
He goes down with an injury? Not a big deal, call someone up. Faceoffs take a hit but your lineup isn't completely shot.
Basically, the Coyotes need to stop playing him as a top center, because they're creating a problem that doesn't need to exist.
400k raise, but he'd fall in line to what basically an elite bottom 6 center is paid. I'd play him on the 4th line as much as possible, in a specialist role, like Boyd Gordon when he was here. Cut down his minutes and maybe the back problems aren't as bad or they completely go away.
He goes down with an injury? Not a big deal, call someone up. Faceoffs take a hit but your lineup isn't completely shot.
Basically, the Coyotes need to stop playing him as a top center, because they're creating a problem that doesn't need to exist.
- Sep 29, 2016
- 12,010
- 5,674
Hanzal won't sign for 3,5. Will be looking for 4 at least. I'd even sign him for 4,5. Will be a decent 3rd line center for many more years. There's always a risk of him getting injured but I agree that's not a big deal as it would free up cap for a replacement.
I like to be strong in the middle. Tampa is a brilliant example. Filppula is their 3rd line center. Making 5 millions but earning every cent of it playing over 17mins per game behind Stamkos and Johnson.
I like to be strong in the middle. Tampa is a brilliant example. Filppula is their 3rd line center. Making 5 millions but earning every cent of it playing over 17mins per game behind Stamkos and Johnson.
- Sep 29, 2016
- 12,010
- 5,674
