Rumor: The All Encompassing Trevor Zegras Thread

[billy piton]

Slaf Suzuki Demidov
CC Dach Zegras
Laine Newhook Heineman
Anderson Evans Gallagher

Win win

If those bullish on Zegras/Dach/Newhook /Laine having the talent to turn the corner and recapture the top 6 potential they've shown in spurts are right, we've got a killer top 9 & the best "4th" line in hockey. Habs lock down a top 3 division spot and start scratching at a long cup contention window.

If those who think the ship has sailed on those players and they are cringe worthy cream puffs that will implode our playoff ambitions... Then we've got a bunch of deadline assets (Z, Laine & Dach, especially with retention) freeing up spots to give Kapanen, Beck & Roy (Farrell?, Tuch?, FloX?) a big '26-'27 audition and we end up with a bottom 3-5 finish & front row ticket to the McKenna sweepstakes (plus a boatload of cap space heading into '26 summer).... Setting the stage to hit '26-'27 right on track.

Personally, I'd prefer that to status quo, or worse, trying to "win" the UFA race in a summer shaping up to be every agent's wet dream

that's just horrible. can't contruct the team without single lefty center capable of winning over 40% of faceoffs.

 

[Miller Time]

I think Zegras was more Hughes/MSL connection than anything else. I think our scouts in charge of drafting for example are doing a great job so far assessing talent. Great mix of skill, speed & size which is what Gorton preached he wanted to build early on in his tenure.

Yup

With that said there is still no excuse for trying to go after Zegras. Gorton especially should know better by now. You don't win with players like that. Look at the two SC finalists in Edmonton and Florida. Both teams are bruisers that play big boy hockey. There are very few floaters/softies on either side. That has been & still is the winning formula for the most part

Nope.

Verhaeghe, Reinhart, Lundell, RNH are all key contributors at fwd for the back to back finalists that are neither "bruisers" nor do they play a physical style of game.
(not to mention the best player on either team...)

There really isn't any evidence of Zegras being "soft" or a "floater", just excessive backlash because of his early career hype and his flashy style of play & personality that rubs so-called traditionalists the wrong way. He's played on a brutal team with brutal coaches most of his career, but in any competitive roster he's played on, he's been clutch & a leader. Like the 4 guys I listed, all of whom except Lundell (who started his career on a cup contending roster) didn't establish themselves as top caliber playoff contributors until past their 25th birthday.

 

[Miller Time]

that's just horrible. can't contruct the team without single lefty center capable of winning over 40% of faceoffs.

Fyi... the Panthers only have 1C (R or L) sitting above 50% in these playoffs, while 3 of their top 4 face off takers are under 40% (#5 is at 41% & #6 at 29%)

Your point doesn't match these current NHL playoffs even though I'd agree that Newhook improving his face off ability or the team adding a depth LH C with strong faceoff ability would be a good idea.

 

[billy piton]

Fyi... the Panthers only have 1C (R or L) sitting above 50% in these playoffs, while 3 of their top 4 face off takers are under 40% (#5 is at 41% & #6 at 29%)

Your point doesn't match these current NHL playoffs even though I'd agree that Newhook improving his face off ability or the team adding a depth LH C with strong faceoff ability would be a good idea.

that's not true, lundell is at 48.2%. the panthers had three regular faceoffs guys with 50% or better on the dot. playoffs are small sample size...

plus, it's not just faceoffs. its the defense in general, penalty kill, etc. zegras, dach, newhook laine, demidov - it's a recipe for disaster.

we need proper two way #2c, or at least proper two way #3c. zegras/dach/newhook combo at #2&#3c won't cut it.

 

[HabzSauce]

Nope.

Verhaeghe, Reinhart, Lundell, RNH are all key contributors at fwd for the back to back finalists that are neither "bruisers" nor do they play a physical style of game.
(not to mention the best player on either team...)

There really isn't any evidence of Zegras being "soft" or a "floater", just excessive backlash because of his early career hype and his flashy style of play & personality that rubs so-called traditionalists the wrong way. He's played on a brutal team with brutal coaches most of his career, but in any competitive roster he's played on, he's been clutch & a leader. Like the 4 guys I listed, all of whom except Lundell (who started his career on a cup contending roster) didn't establish themselves as top caliber playoff contributors until past their 25th birthday.

Lundell, Reinhart & RNH might not be bruisers but they bring good defence & play all over the ice. Same goes for Barkov, and McDavid is McDavid lol enough said. They are also surrounded with bruisers across their respective lineups. I wouldn't call any of those players soft.

I'm not judging Zegras on his character/personality. Personally I think that's getting a bit overblown for the same reasons you mentioned & I agree he would look better on a different team away from Cronin. I'm talking solely about his playstyle. He is a perimeter player who doesn't bring any physicality or defence. That will only be worse come playoff time. That's what I mean by "Soft" & there's plenty evidence of that.

He's basically Marner lite without the defence & no where near as much skill. Huge pass. The only way I could justify getting this type of player is if the Habs were already tough as nails with dogs up and down the lineup (which we are far from). Even then I'd rather stay clear.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Zegras is a soft, weak, overrated gimmick goal specialist, I wouldn't take him for free. We have two 2019 draft busts on the team already we don't need another one. Just stop already.

All wrong.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Lundell, Reinhart & RNH might not be bruisers but they bring good defence & play all over the ice. Same goes for Barkov, and McDavid is McDavid lol enough said. They are also surrounded with bruisers across their respective lineups. I wouldn't call any of those players soft.

I'm not judging Zegras on his character/personality. Personally I think that's getting a bit overblown for the same reasons you mentioned & I agree he would look better on a different team away from Cronin. I'm talking solely about his playstyle. He is a perimeter player who doesn't bring any physicality or defence. That will only be worse come playoff time. That's what I mean by "Soft" & there's plenty evidence of that.

He's basically Marner lite without the defence & no where near as much skill. Huge pass. The only way I could justify getting this type of player is if the Habs were already tough as nails with dogs up and down the lineup (which we are far from). Even then I'd rather stay clear.

Oilers aren't bruisers and Florida are more cheap shot artists than bruisers.

 

[Miller Time]

that's not true, lundell is at 48.2%. the panthers had three regular faceoffs guys with 50% or better on the dot. playoffs are small sample size...

My bad, misread Lundell... But doesn't much change the point...

Can also look at it the other way, Panthers have no RH C over 33% in these playoffs.

The playoff sample size is absolutely relevant to the claim that you can't win in the playoffs without a strong FO performer of a specific handedness... But if you want a larger sample size, look at Panthers regular season RH C's...

plus, it's not just faceoffs. its the defense in general, penalty kill, etc. zegras, dach, newhook laine, demidov - it's a recipe for disaster.

This is another point all together. I replied to your original point, which was not a good argument to make

In the playoffs, your top players play more.
There are more than enough quality PK options in that lineup to be successful.

Plus players like Newhook & Slaf (& perhaps even Demidov eventually) have the skill and talent to be defensive studs at fwd as they mature. Next season we will again be one of the youngest rosters in the league, there's a big difference in a core being at the start of a run vs being in the middle or tail end of one.


[QUOTE="billy piton, post: 200549784, member: 101130
we need proper two way #2c, or at least proper two way #3c. zegras/dach/newhook combo at #2&#3c won't cut it.
[/QUOTE]

I disagree. But, as I said, if the skeptics are right, we get a great shot at McKenna. Win-win.

We aren't going to have a proven cup contending roster next season regardless of what we do, this isn't a video game where you can just force a lopsided trade or disable the cap. Zegras is a realistic target with a cost of acquisition that won't gut our future.

 

[HabzSauce]

Oilers aren't bruisers and Florida are more cheap shot artists than bruisers.

cheap shot artists/bruisers, same thing to me. They're physical. Oilers too are playing physical hockey this year

 

[Adam Michaels]

Did I miss something? Was there a new rumor or report that came out for this thread to be revived?

Or was this a case of a poster randomly deciding he wanted to talk about Zegras?

 

[billy piton]

I disagree. But, as I said, if the skeptics are right, we get a great shot at McKenna. Win-win.

We aren't going to have a proven cup contending roster next season regardless of what we do, this isn't a video game where you can just force a lopsided trade or disable the cap. Zegras is a realistic target with a cost of acquisition that won't gut our future.

last year we had one line that was basically unplayable 5on5. in this constellation we would have two of them. it would again require suzuki to play too much on pk as well as 5on5 in the d-zone, since you cant throw a line where two of the guys are named laine, zegras, demidov, dach and newhook. just waaaaay too many offensive minded players and very few of those who play d.

 

[Miller Time]

Lundell, Reinhart & RNH might not be bruisers but they bring good defence & play all over the ice. Same goes for Barkov, and McDavid is McDavid lol enough said. They are also surrounded with bruisers across their respective lineups. I wouldn't call any of those players soft.

Zegras' overall game has improved considerably. RNH was not "good defensively" at 23-24 either. Vearhaghe couldn't crack an NHL roster until he was 24 (& was the only minus winger, & worst +/- fwd, on a cup winning team).

Talented players willing to put in the work to improve get better over time and play more complete games in their 25-30 years than in their 20-24... Bennett (who plays a very different style) couldn't get ice time with the flames because 4 different coaches didn't trust his defensive game enough... The last of which, old school Darryl Sutter who loves gritty players essentially ending his time in that organization because he didn't think he'd ever figure it out.

I wouldn't call Zegras 'soft'. That label has little grounding in his actual compete level, it seems purely based in a backlash against his style of game & personality.

Not to different than the people who call Hutson "soft" because of his style & stature... Ditto CC.

I suppose there's a semantic clarification required of what defines "soft"... To me, it's less about style of game and more about competitiveness.

i.e taking a hit to make a play vs initiating contact as a part of one's game.

I'm not judging Zegras on his character/personality. Personally I think that's getting a bit overblown for the same reasons you mentioned & I agree he would look better on a different team away from Cronin. I'm talking solely about his playstyle. He is a perimeter player who doesn't bring any physicality or defence. That will only be worse come playoff time. That's what I mean by "Soft" & there's plenty evidence of that.

He's basically Marner lite without the defence & no where near as much skill. Huge pass. The only way I could justify getting this type of player is if the Habs were already tough as nails with dogs up and down the lineup (which we are far from). Even then I'd rather stay clear.

I think Marner is a poor comparison. Yes, he's even more skilled, but also appears to be "soft" and unwilling to adapt his game to the situation. He's also shown a propensity to be weak mentally and turn on his teammates when things go poorly (as a supposed veteran leader... Z has had his own immature moments in his early 20's, but already appears to be making positive & intentional progress in that department as well).

Zegras has been celebrated by his now-former coach for the efforts he's made to play in the "dirty areas"... I don't think that the "perimeter player" narrative fits the progression of his actual play (though ironically, he was more "successful" and certainly more hyped when he was putting up bigger numbers while playing more to his strengths vs trying to round out his game).

 

[Miller Time]

last year we had one line that was basically unplayable 5on5. in this constellation we would have two of them. it would again require suzuki to play too much on pk as well as 5on5 in the d-zone, since you cant throw a line where two of the guys are named laine, zegras, demidov, dach and newhook. just waaaaay too many offensive minded players and very few of those who play d.

I disagree. & One more reminder... If you're right, McKenna sweepstakes ticket is your prize

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Zegras' overall game has improved considerably. RNH was not "good defensively" at 23-24 either. Vearhaghe couldn't crack an NHL roster until he was 24 (& was the only minus winger, & worst +/- fwd, on a cup winning team).

Talented players willing to put in the work to improve get better over time and play more complete games in their 25-30 years than in their 20-24... Bennett (who plays a very different style) couldn't get ice time with the flames because 4 different coaches didn't trust his defensive game enough... The last of which, old school Darryl Sutter who loves gritty players essentially ending his time in that organization because he didn't think he'd ever figure it out.

I wouldn't call Zegras 'soft'. That label has little grounding in his actual compete level, it seems purely based in a backlash against his style of game & personality.

Not to different than the people who call Hutson "soft" because of his style & stature... Ditto CC.

I suppose there's a semantic clarification required of what defines "soft"... To me, it's less about style of game and more about competitiveness.

i.e taking a hit to make a play vs initiating contact as a part of one's game.



I think Marner is a poor comparison. Yes, he's even more skilled, but also appears to be "soft" and unwilling to adapt his game to the situation. He's also shown a propensity to be weak mentally and turn on his teammates when things go poorly (as a supposed veteran leader... Z has had his own immature moments in his early 20's, but already appears to be making positive & intentional progress in that department as well).

Zegras has been celebrated by his now-former coach for the efforts he's made to play in the "dirty areas"... I don't think that the "perimeter player" narrative fits the progression of his actual play (though ironically, he was more "successful" and certainly more hyped when he was putting up bigger numbers while playing more to his strengths vs trying to round out his game).

Agreed and if he is acquired for disposable assets it is worth the risk. He can always be moved if he goes back to his immature ways. They just have to consider the opportunity cost. Could the assets used to get him be used at a later date to get a more important piece.

 

[le_sean]

last year we had one line that was basically unplayable 5on5. in this constellation we would have two of them. it would again require suzuki to play too much on pk as well as 5on5 in the d-zone, since you cant throw a line where two of the guys are named laine, zegras, demidov, dach and newhook. just waaaaay too many offensive minded players and very few of those who play d.

If they were actually productive offensively then it would be less of an issue. But Zegras isn’t actually good anymore, and neither is Laine really.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

If they were actually productive offensively then it would be less of an issue. But Zegras isn’t actually good anymore, and neither is Laine really.

Both are unknowns. Laine produced even though he was never healthy. The question is what will he look like if he is 100% to start the season and can he stay relatively healthy. Zegras was doing well at the end of the season where the games didn't matter. Can he continue that this season.

 

[Miller Time]

If they were actually productive offensively then it would be less of an issue. But Zegras isn’t actually good anymore, and neither is Laine really.

"Not good anymore" kinda like Bennett at 24 (D6 ppg 1/2 of his D1 output)

 

[billy piton]

I disagree. & One more reminder... If you're right, McKenna sweepstakes ticket is your prize

we probably wouldn't be bad enough to have a realistic chance to get 1st overall. it would be just a frustrating season for no purpose.

 

[vokiel]

Both are unknowns. Laine produced even though he was never healthy. The question is what will he look like if he is 100% to start the season and can he stay relatively healthy. Zegras was doing well at the end of the season where the games didn't matter. Can he continue that this season.

Laine produced 75% of his goals on the PP. If we have to compare gambling on Laine vs gambling on Zegras, both with 1 year left, I think I'd rather go with Zegras. It's not like Demidov, Caufield, Suzuki and Hutson couldn't figure out the power play without Laine

 

[HabzSauce]

Zegras' overall game has improved considerably. RNH was not "good defensively" at 23-24 either. Vearhaghe couldn't crack an NHL roster until he was 24 (& was the only minus winger, & worst +/- fwd, on a cup winning team).

Talented players willing to put in the work to improve get better over time and play more complete games in their 25-30 years than in their 20-24... Bennett (who plays a very different style) couldn't get ice time with the flames because 4 different coaches didn't trust his defensive game enough... The last of which, old school Darryl Sutter who loves gritty players essentially ending his time in that organization because he didn't think he'd ever figure it out.

I wouldn't call Zegras 'soft'. That label has little grounding in his actual compete level, it seems purely based in a backlash against his style of game & personality.

Not to different than the people who call Hutson "soft" because of his style & stature... Ditto CC.

I suppose there's a semantic clarification required of what defines "soft"... To me, it's less about style of game and more about competitiveness.

i.e taking a hit to make a play vs initiating contact as a part of one's game.



I think Marner is a poor comparison. Yes, he's even more skilled, but also appears to be "soft" and unwilling to adapt his game to the situation. He's also shown a propensity to be weak mentally and turn on his teammates when things go poorly (as a supposed veteran leader... Z has had his own immature moments in his early 20's, but already appears to be making positive & intentional progress in that department as well).

Zegras has been celebrated by his now-former coach for the efforts he's made to play in the "dirty areas"... I don't think that the "perimeter player" narrative fits the progression of his actual play (though ironically, he was more "successful" and certainly more hyped when he was putting up bigger numbers while playing more to his strengths vs trying to round out his game).

Marner is the epitome of soft. I don't expect Zegras to hit those levels but still think hes a good comparison play style wise. Again - he's a smaller skill player, no physicality & naturally plays perimeter. He might have made improvements but how much better can he get in that department? Heck Caufield has made improvements too but I still wouldn't say he's good defensively.

Hutson & CC might be labeled soft because of their size & but at least they're Uber competitive. And they deliver, they are a sure thing right now. They are the exception. Zegras still has lots to prove, and I don't see that same level of compete on the ice with Zegras

You have way more faith in Zegras than I do lol. I'm surprised you'd be interested given the current makeup of our team. On a team like Florida? They can afford the risk. Not the Habs, we're not even close.

 

[Miller Time]

Marner is the epitome of soft. I don't expect Zegras to hit those levels but still think hes a good comparison play style wise. Again - he's a smaller skill player, no physicality & naturally plays perimeter. He might have made improvements but how much better can he get in that department? Heck Caufield has made improvements too but I still wouldn't say he's good defensively.

Indeed. But, like Caufield, you don't add a skilled player like Z to be a defensively focused player... The overall team defense improves because of how that talent helps tilt possession, transition and offensive zone effectiveness. As long as they are responsible defensively and have high compete levels, it's a net upgrade. Unlike Marner & Matthews, I think Z & CC have that killer instinct and desire to win in them

Hutson & CC might be labeled soft because of their size & but at least they're Uber competitive. And they deliver, they are a sure thing right now. They are the exception. Zegras still has lots to prove, and I don't see that same level of compete on the ice with Zegras

Remember how different CC looked the year after the playoffs under DD, until MSL arrived?

Playing in a losing environment with poor coaching leadership can sap and diminish the competitive spirit of most athletes, especially over an extended period. Z's attitude and effort through the ducks quagmire and coaching black hole is a positive indicator imo.

If he stays in Anh, under Q, I bet we'll see a resurgence similar or more pronounced to what we saw in CC that year. The two of them share a very intense competitive mindset, one has had the benefit of being in a far better environment the past few seasons.

You have way more faith in Zegras than I do lol. I'm surprised you'd be interested given the current makeup of our team. On a team like Florida? They can afford the risk. Not the Habs, we're not even close.

Indeed.

Florida took a risk on Bennett, who had very similar flags and far less demonstrated talent and impact.

Ditto Forsling, Mikola, Verhaeghe and to a certain degree, Reinhart.

Florida became Florida precisely because they filtered the noise and bet on some good "reclamation" projects... Buying low and riding high on the ROI. Z represents that type of bet imo. If he was a sure thing to explode into the top tier first line forward he has the potential to be, he wouldn't be a realistic target without a massive trade cost.

 

[MTL Dirty Birdy]

that's not true, lundell is at 48.2%. the panthers had three regular faceoffs guys with 50% or better on the dot. playoffs are small sample size...

plus, it's not just faceoffs. its the defense in general, penalty kill, etc. zegras, dach, newhook laine, demidov - it's a recipe for disaster.

we need proper two way #2c, or at least proper two way #3c. zegras/dach/newhook combo at #2&#3c won't cut it.

I’m thinking more and more that Horvat would be an exceptional add for us

 

[Captain97]

Why are we still talking about Zegras? He’s the last type of player we need.

We need to get bigger and stronger and tougher to play against.

To me it might be because a physical 2-way C is hard to get. Maybe switching Laine with Zegras (soft skilled guy) and getting a bowling ball of a left winger may be a more likely outcome. Only reason I'm good with it

Send Laine somewhere. 1st + Mailloux for Zegras and send a 2nd + b Prospect for Marchment.

Marchment - Zegras - Demidov

Could be a decent 1nd line.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Pretty embarrassing to have a thread dedicated to a player who isn't on the team and never was.

 

[Justsayin]

Pretty embarrassing to have a thread dedicated to a player who isn't on the team and never was.

36 pages of posts seems to indicate that Habs fans are interested in talking about him.