The 2024-2025 Roster Thread

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
59,326
40,586
Rochester, NY
Content is irrelevant. I don't accept his failure. Its irrelevant if the offer is bad then you counter with an equally insulting offer and go from there.

Adams is a failure so by that measure his negotiating tactics are a failure too and there is no context that excuses that.
Bad outcomes do not mean that it was a bad process.

You can do all the right things process-wise and still have bad outcomes.

And in this instance, we do not have enough information to have a facts based opinion about what is going on with the Sabres and trades.

It’s just more negative emotionally charged stuff and that’s it.
 

toddkaz

Registered User
Nov 25, 2022
6,989
4,364
Bad outcomes do not mean that it was a bad process.

You can do all the right things process-wise and still have bad outcomes.

And in this instance, we do not have enough information to have a facts based opinion about what is going on with the Sabres and trades.

It’s just more negative emotionally charged stuff and that’s it.
I beg to differ.

the NHL is a performance based league and is measured by success or failure not if the process was good but we still lost.

No one keeps their job this way. Thats why all GMs and coaches have a life span. Win you keep your job. Lose you are fired.

The process has absolutely nothing to do with that.
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
59,326
40,586
Rochester, NY
I beg to differ.

the NHL is a performance based league and is measured by success or failure not if the process was good but we still lost.

No one keeps their job this way. Thats why all GMs and coaches have a life span. Win you keep your job. Lose you are fired.

The process has absolutely nothing to do with that.
Like I said, it is emotionally charged reactions fueled by the drought and the losing streak more than anything else.
 

Ace

Registered User
Oct 29, 2015
25,648
32,294


Let’s hire the head of Finnish hockey. If nothing else…we know the Joker experiment will end.
 

Fjordy

It's a disaster
Jun 20, 2018
18,542
10,275
The problem isn't the tweet, it's that Adams isn't doing anything, even though the rosters are about to be frozen.
 

Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
59,326
40,586
Rochester, NY
The only thing that matters is winning. And that means whatever process Adams is using is a losing one and thats what matters.
If only ending an 8 year playoff drought after axing dozens of staff was easy…

The problem isn't the tweet, it's that Adams isn't doing anything, even though the rosters are about to be frozen.
You have no idea what Adams could do today.
 

1point21Gigawatts

hell's a gigawatt?
Apr 7, 2010
6,953
3,370
The future
I honestly didn't think i would ever reach this point. And I know that hfboards is not an airport and i don't have to announce my departure. But, for my own sanity, i am taking a break. I will never not love the sabres, but I just can't right now. It's hard to articulate how much i love(d) this franchise and to see what pegula and adams and botterill and murray have done to the legitimacy of said franchise is heart breaking. I am sure i will still watch a few games and i am sure i will get excited if they go on a heater, but until TPegs sells this team or backs the f*** off, i just can't invest anymore of my time, money, emotions, etc into this franchise.

i hope in earnest that better days are ahead.
 

OkimLom

Registered User
May 3, 2010
15,710
7,139
It doesn't make sense to me.
For me, I can believe he visited the players in Montreal. I can also believe he would go in the room and tell them he believes in them (maybe Ruff said something to Terry noticing how the players responded to things in the room and he felt they needed to hear something)

That's as much as I'm willing to go with the "reporting".
 

Der Jaeger

Generational EBUG
Feb 14, 2009
18,240
15,134
Cair Paravel
Pegula clearly thinks he knows what he’s doing. His ego is enormous and that has been clear for a long time. So I really don’t think it’s far fetched for him to think he can make a difference in the psyche of the locker room.
See below
For me, I can believe he visited the players in Montreal. I can also believe he would go in the room and tell them he believes in them (maybe Ruff said something to Terry noticing how the players responded to things in the room and he felt they needed to hear something)

That's as much as I'm willing to go with the "reporting".
I think something along those lines happened.

Ruff asked Adams and Pegula if they could come give the players a "pep talk." It gets reported as Pegula saying the Sabres aren't making big moves. Even if that isn't what was exactly said.

But I could also see Pegula stumbling on his words and saying something that could easily get misconstrued. He's not great at public speaking.
 
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toomuchsauce

Registered User
Jan 7, 2015
2,701
1,713
So, I get it was reported, but do we really think Pegula flew all the way to Montreal just to say "hey, it's good guys, we believe in you!"

I don't buy the reporting.

I think it could make sense, actually, if his talk wasn't intended to be supportive, but rather threatening. Like, "none of you are getting traded out of here to better teams." It's a punishment.

then, devoid of any hope, they went out and played like shit. And, now Adams (reportedly) isn't responding to trade offers.

That would all fit together.
 
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Jim Bob

RIP RJ
Feb 27, 2002
59,326
40,586
Rochester, NY
See below

I think something along those lines happened.

Ruff asked Adams and Pegula if they could come give the players a "pep talk." It gets reported as Pegula saying the Sabres aren't making big moves. Even if that isn't what was exactly said.

But I could also see Pegula stumbling on his words and saying something that could easily get misconstrued. He's not great at public speaking.
Given the completely flat response from the team, I can believe he told them no big deals were coming and they believed in the group. And the players were like, if the owner and GM aren’t going to try, why should we?
 

Sabre the Win

Joke of a Franchise
Jun 27, 2013
13,178
5,746
Given the completely flat response from the team, I can believe he told them no big deals were coming and they believed in the group. And the players were like, if the owner and GM aren’t going to try, why should we?
Or they are more complacent now because they know they aren't going anywhere.

Or they are so disappointed they aren't getting moved out of Buffalo it's crushed all love for hockey in them.
 

Fezzy126

Rebuilding...
May 10, 2017
9,194
12,314
I love Lindy as much as the next person, but the way Adams and Terry have garnered 99% of the criticism doesn't really line up with what we're seeing

Some players are struggling immensely, and weren't last year. It's not just roster construction

And ironically half the people will blame the search for not being thorough while the other half will say it was a good coaching hire, they were just too cheap to get new assistants. Despite these conflicting views, all that matters is that it is kevyn and Terry's fault.

while I'm happy to acknowledge it ultimately falls on them, I wish there was more discussion on the massive underperformance beyond "the roster sucks" and "sell the team"

I was critical of the Lindy hire, but I'm not the type to post the same thing over and over.

But what the hell, I've got nothing better to do, here's a mini rant about Lindy and the other issues we've been yelling about for years:
  • Coaching:
    • Lindy is a good story, and he's an actual NHL level coach, which isn't something we've had here since... well Lindy. However, he has a history of mismanaging his goalies, mishandling youth, and not getting the most out certain players (see Meier, Timo). So far to my eyes, he just looks a step closer to retirement.
    • The assistants. For f***s sake, the assistants. Has Marty Wilford ever been any good anywhere? We know that he coached Anaheim's stacked defense to their worst career years, and they were all in their primes. Why is he still here?
  • Roster Construction:
    • This core/leadership group gets a lot of heat for being mentally soft, but the problem remains that they're too young. Of course there's going to be struggles with confidence, consistency, and commitment to system play. Almost all kids struggle with these issues until their late twenties. So we should hurry up and trade more of these kids before they turn 25 :rolleyes:. In all seriousness, there are too many kids, our top 6 has four players that are 23 or younger. FOUR! If we have any desire to win now, we need to swap out two from Cozens, Peterka, Quinn, and Benson for actual skilled, veteran top 6 forwards.
    • A little expansion on the above point: Quinn and Cozens make up a third of our top 6. They have been dogshit. They haven't just underachieved, on most nights they've been our worst players, absolute black holes. That's the biggest problem with this year's team performance. In the past couple years, the kid line thing worked for a few weeks and then they'd go silent for several more, so everyone was hoping that another year would lead to more consistency (myself included). Except somehow, Quinn turned into Nic Deslauriers without the speed and physicality. I'm not a fan of trading guys under 25 that have flashed the way that Cozens and Quinn have in the past, but Adams needs to figure out this bullshit fast. These two impact roster building plans for the next decade.
    • The defense is constructed like shit. And this year the pairings haven't made any sense either. Ruff continually put together Clifton and Samuelsson. Ok, they can be a pain in the ass to play against, which is good, but once they separate someone from the puck neither one of them can make a good outlet pass to save his life. And if they manage to get into the offensive zone, then what?!? That's on Lindy. As for the rest, Dahlin is awesome, he stays forever (and I've been super critical this year). I didn't like the Power draft pick, didn't like him in college, and I still don't see it. He started off with serious signs of improvement, but the same issues keep cropping up and it's been killing us. Oh, and Byram is a completely redundant skillset. Get rid of him or Power, bring in something else that helps (I used to dream about Ekholm, now it's been Weegar for the past few years).
I've been complaining about the coaching for a decade since they got rid of Ruff the first time. Anyone pointing out that it must be the players because we've had multiple coaches, I can't get there. Everyone we've hired is terrible, most won't even sniff another head coaching job. The one that has gotten another chance (Bylsma), is busy driving the Kraken into mediocrity (he'll be out of the league in a year). Besides, players that "aren't good enough here" or "only know how to lose" continue to go to other places and play better and contribute to winning teams.

Honestly, I'm at a loss. I have no idea how to fix it. Ignoring coaching and just looking at the roster issues - I looked at the standings and some rosters, with so much parity I can't imagine anyone is looking to get rid of the type of player we could use.
Could we pry Troy Terry out of Anaheim? The Ducks look dead in the water so I'd kick those tires.
I mentioned Weegar already, but is Calgary looking to make a move?
Can we convince St Louis to do blockbuster type shakeup that would bring two of Thomas/Neighbours/Buchnevich over? I highly doubt it...
 

OkimLom

Registered User
May 3, 2010
15,710
7,139
Given the completely flat response from the team, I can believe he told them no big deals were coming and they believed in the group. And the players were like, if the owner and GM aren’t going to try, why should we?
It looked like any other flat game that they’ve played in the past.

I doubt Terry is capable of being a motivation sort of guy. He comes across as a very “low energy” sort of guy. I’d be shocked, regardless of what he said, if it did anything to elicit a response from the players, positive or negative.
 

Chainshot

Give 'em Enough Rope
Sponsor
Feb 28, 2002
157,404
112,535
Tarnation
Bad outcomes do not mean that it was a bad process.

You can do all the right things process-wise and still have bad outcomes.

And in this instance, we do not have enough information to have a facts based opinion about what is going on with the Sabres and trades.

It’s just more negative emotionally charged stuff and that’s it.

Yeah, there is plenty of things we can be upset about, but speculating on a spurious source and what is actually going on with any trade talks isn't one of those things.
 

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