The 2024-2025 Roster Thread

[OkimLom]

I'm with you. I just thought it was a little odd that a sarcastic tweet about the value of Cozens and referencing Marner, started an earnest discussion about us trading for or signing Marner (and also that the tweet itself made no sense). I would love to have Marner.

Odd maybe, but that’s what these boards are for.

 

[SabresNorth]

No chance I would trade anyone from our "core" right now. It seems like Adams at least recognized it was time to trade a futures/prospect package for one of ehlers/necas.

I think that's the play just need to make it happen ala Tim Murray. Have to add to the NHL roster until we can run 3 NHL caliber 2nd lines.

We have no real top end forward talent outside of Thompson who is probably not a complete player. What we do have is enough ammunition to continue upgrading the roster that we have.

 

[Fjordy]

It's not really an approach since it would never happen lol.

I'm not really sure who on this team is worth keeping. Probably Dahlin and Thompson, though they're both part of the problem, perhaps to some extent due to injury. Keep Byram and Power, but only if you plan on some really defensively sound partners for these guys. Keep Malenstyn and Greenway.

Beyond that you're just straight up buying a whole new hockey team.

Of course it won't happen. I see the youngest team in the league, which is built incorrectly and lacks quality and correct players in important positions. I also question our coaching staff (mainly those who remained after Granato and Appert). I think this is really possible to fix, of course, if desired. I am actually ready to trade many of this team, or rather they are available for the right hockey deal.

 

[Dreakon13]

I think this is really possible to fix, of course, if desired. I am actually ready to trade many of this team, or rather they are available for the right hockey deal.

On paper, I'm sure there's some combination of idealistic moves that could fix it. In reality, I don't think you can swap out enough of the team with quality players fast enough to not break (or further break) the players we plan to keep in the meantime.

 

[TheBarnIsElectric]

My thoughts about the on ice issues…. one of them was mentioned by Ruff. Center. There are a bunch of other issues, but in terms of what’s structurally happening, I agree with Ruff.

Centers are picked more often than any other position in the top 10-20 picks in the first round for a reason. Modern centers are the single most important skater. They support the puck in all three zones.

My son’s AAA coach said his first task in training camp was finding 2 reliable centers. His #1 criteria was hockey IQ. He coached Bedard at an academy in Vancouver, played pro and coached professionally.

I asked him why hockey IQ. It’s because modern centers, and modern hockey, is all about puck support. Centers are supporting low and along the walls in the D zone. They often are starting the transition after they curl. In the offensive zone, they are supporting the wing’s low, medium, and high depending on the game situation. As the D pinch, the center is most often taking their place.

Think about the Bruins. For 50 minutes a night, every player on the team knew they were backed up by Bergeron, Krejci, or Coyle. It’s a huge advantage for a team.

That’s why I advocated hard to take Lundell and then Beniers. It’s why teams take centers high. It’s why Adams traded for McLeod. It’s why Ruff said what he said about Thompson and Cozens.

I don’t see the hockey IQ on the roster to make the team go. Now and again, you can have a center who doesn’t support quite as well and get away with it. Think Briere and Hecht.

Right now the Sabres could get away with having Thompson if they had a 2nd line center who could shore everything up and a winger who could cover for Thompson. A great line for Thompson would be him with Tuch and Greenway, because Greenway can cover. But there’s a gapping hole at 2C, and McLeod is a 3C with some limitations.

This is why you’ll never see me include Ostlund or Helenius in any trade proposals. I’ve watched both play and they both have the hockey IQ to play center.

The team has big issues right now but structurally center is where I’d start.

Agree. This has always been my position. You're as good your C spine, top 4d (especially righties due to scarcity), and G. All roster and draft decisions should prioritize those positions.

It's why Meier was a no for me, and Chychrun was a yes. It's why the Mitts trade was ok and it's why I'd be much less likely to trade Cozens/Kulich/Helenius/Ostlund than others.

It's also why when a good player is available at one of those positions (mostly C and RD right now) you have to pounce and not worry too much about the details (contract/age/trade cost).

It's easy to get caught up in shiny wingers because theres good ones out there all the time. Don't get distracted.

 

[MOGlLNY]

It’s time to get Quinn back in the lineup

 

[Tatanka]

Why I hated the Mitts trade so much. Not because he's a defensive stalwart, but just battles enough to win pucks and is so creative in the O-zone, keeping possession and not allowing easy transition the other way. That, and the fact that Thompson and Cozens just don't have the experience at C from where they grew up playing, or just flat out intelligence enough to be a safety net for his team. So yeah...until Ostlund or Helenius can somehow save the day, this team isn't going anywhere.

With Thompson its not experience it is IQ. A center should see the play for their linemates first. Tage doesn’t even look. He is trying to create his opportunity first and foremost and only looks to pass when all his options to dangle are exhausted. For his career he has less assists than goals. Most of the top 1Cs the ratio is around 1.5 assists to goals. He is a prolific goal scorer when the team defers to him on the power play or off the rush. But in a zone possession game he isn’t looking for the play he is looking for his play. The comment above to push him down is spot on. He could be a solid 2 with some,pp time. But he doesn’t do the things a true 1C needs to do.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

 

[jc17]

My thoughts about the on ice issues…. one of them was mentioned by Ruff. Center. There are a bunch of other issues, but in terms of what’s structurally happening, I agree with Ruff.

Centers are picked more often than any other position in the top 10-20 picks in the first round for a reason. Modern centers are the single most important skater. They support the puck in all three zones.

My son’s AAA coach said his first task in training camp was finding 2 reliable centers. His #1 criteria was hockey IQ. He coached Bedard at an academy in Vancouver, played pro and coached professionally.

I asked him why hockey IQ. It’s because modern centers, and modern hockey, is all about puck support. Centers are supporting low and along the walls in the D zone. They often are starting the transition after they curl. In the offensive zone, they are supporting the wing’s low, medium, and high depending on the game situation. As the D pinch, the center is most often taking their place.

Think about the Bruins. For 50 minutes a night, every player on the team knew they were backed up by Bergeron, Krejci, or Coyle. It’s a huge advantage for a team.

That’s why I advocated hard to take Lundell and then Beniers. It’s why teams take centers high. It’s why Adams traded for McLeod. It’s why Ruff said what he said about Thompson and Cozens.

I don’t see the hockey IQ on the roster to make the team go. Now and again, you can have a center who doesn’t support quite as well and get away with it. Think Briere and Hecht.

Right now the Sabres could get away with having Thompson if they had a 2nd line center who could shore everything up and a winger who could cover for Thompson. A great line for Thompson would be him with Tuch and Greenway, because Greenway can cover. But there’s a gapping hole at 2C, and McLeod is a 3C with some limitations.

This is why you’ll never see me include Ostlund or Helenius in any trade proposals. I’ve watched both play and they both have the hockey IQ to play center.

The team has big issues right now but structurally center is where I’d start.

Power to C is the new Risto to RW!

 

[Fjordy]

 

[toddkaz]

On this team right now through drafting or acquisition(Adams has had 5 years to do it) can anyone name the RHD on this team?

Answer
Connor Clifton.

Thats right, his 5 year plan we have one right handed defenseman. Conner Clifton.

A man with a plan.

 

[OkimLom]

Power to C is the new Risto to RW!

They said they look for IQ in centers…that immediately disqualifies Power

 

[dickiedunnwrotethis]

Agree. This has always been my position. You're as good your C spine, top 4d (especially righties due to scarcity), and G. All roster and draft decisions should prioritize those positions.

It's why Meier was a no for me, and Chychrun was a yes. It's why the Mitts trade was ok and it's why I'd be much less likely to trade Cozens/Kulich/Helenius/Ostlund than others.

It's also why when a good player is available at one of those positions (mostly C and RD right now) you have to pounce and not worry too much about the details (contract/age/trade cost).

It's easy to get caught up in shiny wingers because theres good ones out there all the time. Don't get distracted.

Agree with pretty much everything except the bolded paragraph. The Mitts trade was flawed from the beginning because it was a complete misreading of their center situation. Thompson is not an optimum 1C for the reasons outlined by Tatanka. And Cozens is not a center, he's cosplaying one. That trade has left a pretty grim center spine .

The one good thing about the Mitts trade is that Byram has played well enough to give them the flexibility to trade Power. I don't dislike Power (although I have my doubts), but he should have the most trade value to potentially help fix the balance of our defense core or our dysfunctional top 6.

 

[Chainshot]

They said they look for IQ in centers…that immediately disqualifies Power

IQ isn't Power's issue. With him it's confidence and defensive engagement. He'd make a killer playmaking LW.

 

[Fjordy]

On this team right now through drafting or acquisition(Adams has had 5 years to do it) can anyone name the RHD on this team?

Answer
Connor Clifton.

Thats right, his 5 year plan we have one right handed defenseman. Conner Clifton.

A man with a plan.

Well, there's also Kevyn Adams' favorite player, Henri Jokiharju, who has already found himself a healthy scratch twice.

Agree with pretty much everything except the bolded paragraph. The Mitts trade was flawed from the beginning because it was a complete misreading of their center situation. Thompson is not an optimum 1C for the reasons outlined by Tatanka. And Cozens is not a center, he's cosplaying one. That trade has left a pretty grim center spine .

The one good thing about the Mitts trade is that Byram has played well enough to give them the flexibility to trade Power. I don't dislike Power (although I have my doubts), but he should have the most trade value to potentially help fix the balance of our defense core or our dysfunctional top 6.

Baker and Fairburn said the same thing yesterday, but you have to be careful with that and I'm not sure Adams the one who should do it.

 

[OkimLom]

IQ isn't Power's issue. With him it's confidence and defensive engagement. He'd make a killer playmaking LW.

It may not be THE issue, but it’s one issue of his.

 

[toddkaz]

It may not be THE issue, but it’s one issue of his.

Its hard to tell with players like Power because it the offensive zone he makes high IQ plays.

This team is such a mess on defense it could be that Power doesn't trust his teammates.

So much blown coverage, players out of position, players chasing the puck that everyone on defense looks low IQ even Dahlin at times.

 

[Fearnot]

IQ isn't Power's issue. With him it's confidence and defensive engagement. He'd make a killer playmaking LW.

I'm still thinking about that stretch pass Power did to Tage from behind our goalie to Tage on their blue line tape to tape. Kid would look a million times better on a proper team.

 

[OkimLom]

Its hard to tell with players like Power because it the offensive zone he makes high IQ plays.

This team is such a mess on defense it could be that Power doesn't trust his teammates.

So much blown coverage, players out of position, players chasing the puck that everyone on defense looks low IQ even Dahlin at times.

He makes the same sort of decisions he was making in college, and even those were subpar decisions. As a forward, say as a winger, you could overlook that sort of play. As a center and defenseman, those are magnified quite a bit as those sort of decisions rely on being able support players or as a last line of defense of a scoring chance.

 

[toddkaz]

He makes the same sort of decisions he was making in college, and even those were subpar decisions. As a forward, say as a winger, you could overlook that sort of play. As a center and defenseman, those are magnified quite a bit as those sort of decisions rely on being able support players or as a last line of defense of a scoring chance.

You don't see every center on this team seems to all be making the same mistakes.

No one taught them, not Granato, not Kreuger.

No one can play center on this team, no one can play defense on this team. Its a common theme.

 

[OkimLom]

You don't see every center on this team seems to all be making the same mistakes.

No one taught them, not Granato, not Kreuger.

No one can play center on this team, no one can play defense on this team. Its a common theme.

Agree.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Agree.

Maybe this is what Friedmaan's innuendo last week, and Lindy's emphasis on teaching practices of late mean ?