The 2024-2025 Roster Thread

Uberpecker

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If they traded Byram for forward help, who would replace him in the top 4, though.

I'd love for Samuelsson to return to form or someone from ROC like Johnson to step up. But just because I want it doesn't mean it's gonna happen.
 

Sabre the Win

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Granlund - No trade protection, Sharks in rebuild, one year away from UFA.

Coleman and/or Kuzmenko - Flames lacks young talent, I think they also talked about rebuilding or something like that.

Zegras and/or Vatrano - Ducks still rebuilding, Zegras is a change of scenery, Vatrano one year away from UFA.

Maccelli and/or Crouse - new team willing to trade, they need help on defense, and we have Byram/Sammy. I don't really believe in the Crouse option, but Maccelli I think real, we lack good playmakers.

St. Louis - There are interesting forwards there and their left side of defense looks questionable. I think a guy like Byram will play in the first pair there, it could be a good option for trade.

Here is an options for you, and this is far from all, just obvious examples, if necessary I can name more.
I think he's very under the radar but hes been stuck on Arizona's now Utah's 3rd line, give him scorers and watch the magic. He can be 15-20 goal 60 assists type player.
 
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Fjordy

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If they traded Byram for forward help, who would replace him in the top 4, though.

I'd love for Samuelsson to return to form or someone from ROC like Johnson to step up. But just because I want it doesn't mean it's gonna happen.
Maybe a guy like Fabbro. Pulock, Whitecloud, Carlo, Borgen, Murphy or one of them.
 

Fjordy

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Seravalli:

-Kevyn Adams has been making a lot of calls around the league to understand what different markets look like

-thinks the Canucks have asked if Bowen Byram was available but the answer was "No" from the Sabres

-Canucks are a terrible trade partner for the Sabres; Sabres have no interest in futures

-issues are a lot deeper than any one player

-around the league, they say that's a team still playing summer hockey

-have to shake it up, have to fix it

-getting a bunch of calls on Jack Quinn
 
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Jim Bob

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For the 14th straight season, the Buffalo Sabres do not look like a playoff team.

The Sabres are 5-7-1 to start the season, look middling at five-on-five and disastrous on special teams with the league’s 31st-best power play and 24th-best penalty kill. Just a month into the season, their chances of ending a lengthy playoff drought already look dim at just 14 percent.

Is there any hope for Buffalo to turn things around?

Maybe — but it all hinges on the team’s second line figuring it out, and that’s been an extreme uphill battle so far.

The selling point for the Sabres going into the year was pretty simple. Tage Thompson and Dylan Cozens would bounce back to anchor a decent top six with a healthy Jack Quinn, while the acquisition of Ryan McLeod and Jason Zucker would form the basis of a strong shutdown line, soaking up tough minutes. Buffalo has seen strong results on two of those fronts — and an absolute disaster on the other. Cozens and Quinn have looked downright unplayable to start, and that’s been enough to sink the Sabres early. (Unused cap space on the opposite wing hasn’t helped either, by the way).

Together the duo has been on the ice for just 39 percent of expected goals and have been outscored 5-3. Considering Cozens’ zone time ratio is right around 50 percent (that’s actually up from last year), there’s a massive lack of efficiency with the puck, mostly on offense where both players’ ability to generate chances is way down. The duo is not producing at all and it’s because they haven’t been able to control the game to any meaningful degree. Just the opposite: Without either on the ice, the Sabres are up 24-17 on the year with 52 percent of expected goals. That’s a massive difference.

Any hope for Cozens and Quinn stems from the prior knowledge that this is a duo that’s worked well in the past. Over the past two seasons, the pair has earned 54 percent of expected goals and both Cozens and Quinn have flashed strong offensive ability. In 2022-23 Cozens scored 2.46 points per 60 at five-on-five while Quinn was at 2.93 last season. That kind of production shouldn’t just evaporate, especially not at the age of 23. That’s the age when both players — both of whom were top-10 picks — should start dominating. While both have offered glimpses of that promise in the past, this season has been anything but.

Right now, the duo is not working. When two guys aren’t going, having them together only exacerbates the issue. The solution should be obvious: split them up.

The challenge there is risking disruption on the two lines that are working, but at a certain point it’s time for a change and it feels like Buffalo has reached that point. The Sabres need to get Cozens and Quinn going and the best bet for that might be pairing them with two players that are already going: JJ Peterka and Thompson.

Those are Buffalo’s two top drivers right now — not Quinn and Cozens — and the team’s best bet is probably having each player lead their own line. In a very small sample, Cozens has looked a lot better with Peterka this year, while Quinn has looked great with Thompson. That flip could be the answer.

After a 5-7-1 start, the odds aren’t on Buffalo’s side. But the answers are on the team’s roster and in the room — it’s on the Sabres to figure out how to get the most of what they have.

16 stats

1. Brand new Tage

At the very least for Buffalo, Thompson looks not just like himself again, but an even stronger version. Through the team’s first 13 games he’s scoring like he did in his breakthrough 2022-23 season with eight goals and 15 points — that’s a 50-goal, 94-point pace. But perhaps more important is that he’s not cheating without the puck to make it happen.

One of the major criticisms of Thompson’s game coming off his breakout season was that he was giving a lot back defensively. In 2022-23 the Sabres allowed 3.3 expected goals against per 60 with Thompson on the ice, 0.32 more than his teammates. And it showed up on the scoresheet too. Thompson made some big under-the-radar strides to clean that up last season, but it came at a great expense to his offense.

The question this year was whether Thompson could put it all together and so far, so good. He’s been the best of both worlds. The Sabres are absolutely dominating their minutes at five-on-five with Thompson on the ice to the tune of 59 percent of expected goals and a 13-6 goal margin. Relative to teammates he’s even better offensively than he was in 2022-23 and that’s in part because of how much stronger he looks without the puck. This year the Sabres are giving up just 2.38 expected goals against per 60 with Thompson on the ice, 0.21 less than his teammates. By Defensive Rating, Thompson has been the team’s best defensive forward.

Thompson is turning into a complete player playing at a franchise level. The Sabres can’t waste that effort.

Seravalli:

-Kevyn Adams has been making a lot of calls around the league to understand what different markets look like

-thinks the Canucks have asked if Bowen Byram was available but the answer was "No" from the Sabres

-Canucks are a terrible trade partner for the Sabres; Sabres have no interest in futures

-issues are a lot deeper than any one player

-around the league, they say that's a team still playing summer hockey

-have to shake it up, have to fix it

-getting a bunch of calls on Jack Quinn
A rule of thumb says that a GM should NOT trade away a struggling player that a bunch of GMs start calling on in hopes that they can get a quality player for pennies on the dollar.
 

Dreakon13

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Seravalli:

...

-issues are a lot deeper than any one player

-around the league, they say that's a team still playing summer hockey

-have to shake it up, have to fix it

The first two points are interesting, and probably very accurate. As much as we want to say "if only they had one more top 6 player", "if only Byram played on his other side and was more defensive"... and while these are the right ideas on paper, the problem runs deeper than that, and it's the reason almost everyone we pick up ends up underperforming here (and our players tend to thrive elsewhere).

That being said with the third point, I'm not sure what "shaking it up" means in this case. I think even if you pick up the hardest working, strongest willed, most talented player in the league, they'll still wither in this environment. Just one new voice against many old ones... at best they'll put up points and win games and cover up the teams inadequacies instead of fixing it, at worst (and more likely) they'll get dragged down with them.

Moves that help the team on paper are great and probably necessary but this team is pretty immune at this point to the fear of big shakeups, rebuilds, retools, etc. It won't snap anyone out of a funk.

IMO, they need a Ruff sized boot in the ass. And keep it there. Keep giving them the "hardest practices we've ever seen since we started covering the Sabres", keep sitting guys that are going through the motions for smarter, hungrier players. Set the standard high and don't reward them unless everyone is playing there.
 
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Jim Bob

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The first two points are interesting, and probably very accurate. As much as we want to say "if only they had one more top 6 player", "if only Byram played on his other side and was more defensive"... and while these are the right ideas on paper, the problem runs deeper than that, and it's the reason almost everyone we pick up ends up underperforming here (and our players tend to thrive elsewhere).

That being said with the third point, I'm not sure what "shaking it up" means in this case. I think even if you pick up the hardest working, strongest willed, most talented player in the league, they'll still wither in this environment. Just one new voice against many old ones... at best they'll put up points and win games and cover up the teams inadequacies instead of fixing it, at worst (and more likely) they'll get dragged down with them.

Moves that help the team on paper are great and probably necessary but this team is pretty immune at this point to the fear of big shakeups, rebuilds, retools, etc. It won't snap anyone out of a funk.

IMO, they need a Ruff sized boot in the ass. And keep it there. Keep giving them the "hardest practices we've ever seen since we started covering the Sabres", keep sitting guys that are going through the motions for smarter, hungrier players. Set the standard high and don't reward them unless everyone is playing there.
Emptying the tank in practice and having nothing left for games will not work out well.
 

Sabresfansince1980

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Emptying the tank in practice and having nothing left for games will not work out well.
I never experienced that one time in my life through years of competitive sports. It was the opposite - the harder we went in practice, the harder we were to play against in games. These guys don't need to hit each other through the boards and risk injury, but going 100% in cardio drills and practicing at game speed would do wonders for their passing and puck control, read and react scenarios.
 

Fjordy

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A rule of thumb says that a GM should NOT trade away a struggling player that a bunch of GMs start calling on in hopes that they can get a quality player for pennies on the dollar.
I agree, but something has to be done, they can't just go with the flow.
The first two points are interesting, and probably very accurate. As much as we want to say "if only they had one more top 6 player", "if only Byram played on his other side and was more defensive"... and while these are the right ideas on paper, the problem runs deeper than that, and it's the reason almost everyone we pick up ends up underperforming here (and our players tend to thrive elsewhere).

That being said with the third point, I'm not sure what "shaking it up" means in this case. I think even if you pick up the hardest working, strongest willed, most talented player in the league, they'll still wither in this environment. Just one new voice against many old ones... at best they'll put up points and win games and cover up the teams inadequacies instead of fixing it, at worst (and more likely) they'll get dragged down with them.

Moves that help the team on paper are great and probably necessary but this team is pretty immune at this point to the fear of big shakeups, rebuilds, retools, etc. It won't snap anyone out of a funk.

IMO, they need a Ruff sized boot in the ass. And keep it there. Keep giving them the "hardest practices we've ever seen since we started covering the Sabres", keep sitting guys that are going through the motions for smarter, hungrier players. Set the standard high and don't reward them unless everyone is playing there.
Shaking it up, probably make some kind of deal.

But not all our players are wasting away.

McLeod is doing well, although the Oilers fans said that they stole the deal and McLeod is not very good.

Zucker just wasted away last season on the third line of Arizona. He also formally plays on the third line with us, but in a completely different way.

Byram already looked not very good in Colorado, as for defense, but our problem with Byram is that we already have Dahlin and Power, all three are left-handed, move the puck, want to play on the PP, more offensive defensemen. It is not Byram's problem that Adams decided to build a very strange defense.

As I said earlier, our global problem is not in the players, our special teams still need to seriously improve (PK is not easy to improve when Kevyn built such a defense). Our second line does nothing and produces nothing at all, and this needs to be fixed somehow as soon as possible, because the first and third lines will not play at their best and produce in every game.
 

Dreakon13

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But not all our players are wasting away.

McLeod is doing well, although the Oilers fans said that they stole the deal and McLeod is not very good.

Zucker just wasted away last season on the third line of Arizona. He also formally plays on the third line with us, but in a completely different way.

Byram already looked not very good in Colorado, as for defense, but our problem with Byram is that we already have Dahlin and Power, all three are left-handed, move the puck, want to play on the PP, more offensive defensemen. It is not Byram's problem that Adams decided to build a very strange defense.

It's a little bit like when Steve Bernier came in and scored two goals his first game. Players are gonna have a honeymoon period, some of them are individually talented or unflappable enough to continue to contribute... but it will cool off. How do these players, and how does this team look when that happens?

The upside with this group is we've seen flashes, but I don't think consistency will come from an endless cycle of trying to replace every inconsistent player with historically consistent ones... I refer back to the idea that they're "still playing summer hockey" and the Ruff-shaped boot imprint.
 

HogtownSabresfan

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I wouldn't call Bylsma a nobody. Or Housely. And he fired Botterill for not being a yes man.
LOL. You are talking about a guy hired in 2015 in Byslma. Every coach afterwards was a nobody. Housley has not had had one head coaching job since he left Buffalo. Botterrill either signed or went along with a $72 M deal for Skinner which even on day one people laughed for being $9 million. Pegula was probably behind it like forcing an O'Reilly trade a day before his bonus due. GMJB was a nobody. That's all Pegula does, which is hire cheap nobodes. I like Ruff but they only grabbed him because New Jersey is paying half his contract.

Pegula is the problem with this team. He is the constant over 14 years. Unfortunately, he is here to stay.
 

HaNotsri

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I'm not sure Novak's a 2nd liner/top 6 help. Nashville tends to keep his ES TOI in the third line range. 2nd PP and absolutely no PKing time (both this year and last).
Not saying he's a good target but a short term goal could be to have a 1st line, two 3rd lines and a 4th line. If our goaltending and defense becomes elite that could be enough for us to become a bubble team at least.
 

Jim Bob

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I never experienced that one time in my life through years of competitive sports. It was the opposite - the harder we went in practice, the harder we were to play against in games. These guys don't need to hit each other through the boards and risk injury, but going 100% in cardio drills and practicing at game speed would do wonders for their passing and puck control, read and react scenarios.
The challenge is that you did not play 82 games at the professional level with all the travel they have to deal with.

There is a reason that sports science and load balancing between games and practices have become a thing throughout pro sports.

Obviously there needs to be a high level of effort and attention in practices. But, the volume of practice needs to be balanced so that they are not worn out for games. And if you look at the number of practices they get in-season, it is generally a lot lower a practice to game ratio than what you had growing up.
 
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Zman5778

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LOL. You are talking about a guy hired in 2015 in Byslma. Every coach afterwards was a nobody. Housley has not had had one head coaching job since he left Buffalo. Botterrill either signed or went along with a $72 M deal for Skinner which even on day one people laughed for being $9 million. Pegula was probably behind it like forcing an O'Reilly trade a day before his bonus due. GMJB was a nobody. That's all Pegula does, which is hire cheap nobodes. I like Ruff but they only grabbed him because New Jersey is paying half his contract.

Pegula is the problem with this team. He is the constant over 14 years. Unfortunately, he is here to stay.

I'm not saying Pegula isn't the problem. But, you're also applying quite a bit of revisionist history to his past hires while looking through a clearly tinted lens.

Botts was a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming GMs in the NHL while with Pittsburgh. He most certainly was not a nobody. Housley was, again, a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming head coach candidates while coaching the Predators defense.
 
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Jim Bob

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I'm not saying Pegula isn't the problem. But, you're also applying quite a bit of revisionist history to his past hires while looking through a clearly tinted lens.

Botts was a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming GMs in the NHL while with Pittsburgh. He most certainly was not a nobody. Housley was, again, a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming head coach candidates while coaching the Predators defense.
Murray and Botterill were both well respected rookie GM candidates.

The problem I have is that after back-to-back rookie GMs not working out, the pivot was not to a GM with experience in the role. But, a third straight rookie GM. And this time it was not someone who was well respected around the league and seen as a great candidate. It was someone with very little front office experience and merely was a Pegula loyalist.
 

HogtownSabresfan

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I'm not saying Pegula isn't the problem. But, you're also applying quite a bit of revisionist history to his past hires while looking through a clearly tinted lens.

Botts was a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming GMs in the NHL while with Pittsburgh. He most certainly was not a nobody. Housley was, again, a WIDELY lauded hire -- he was viewed as one of the best up-and-coming head coach candidates while coaching the Predators defense.

Buffalo is a one radio station, one newspaper town with people who just suck up to the Sabres. Giving Ralph Krueger, an unemployed soccer president with little NHL experience, three years at $3.75 M a year was beyond hilarious. Only Pegula knows who he was competingn with to get this guy at such a high contract. The guy used a few words the under-educated columnist at the Buffalo News had never heard and was lauded as a genius.

Listen, I get it. Pegula came into town as a fan owner selling snake oil about what he would do differently than Golisano. Tom left the team alone and said don't lose money. His big mistake was refusing to sign off on Briere/Drury (the one occasion where he overruled his GM and has admitted it was a mistake.) Pegula refuses to bring in senior personnel over and over again.

I was suckered as much as anyone in the beginning. You wanna believe. But you see him hire a coach this year (who could work out) but mostly for financial reasons. The same coach was not allowed to hire one of his own coaches and is being paid at least partially by Devils.

We remain well below cap, and it is obvious to anyone that $7 M would buy at least one more good winger.

But he has GMKA telling people he has all the resources he needs. It's a joke. Multiple trade deadlines have come and gone, and we never weaponize our cap room.

Pegula is the puppet master at the top. The problem is he is incompetent. He is a poor man's silent Harold Ballard.

I don't trust Terry in any way. And that includes his commitment to the city if he got the right offer for the team
 

Fjordy

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Murray and Botterill were both well respected rookie GM candidates.

The problem I have is that after back-to-back rookie GMs not working out, the pivot was not to a GM with experience in the role. But, a third straight rookie GM. And this time it was not someone who was well respected around the league and seen as a great candidate. It was someone with very little front office experience and merely was a Pegula loyalist.
Absolutely, when two new GMs have already failed, why hire another newbie, especially without any experience of AGM work?
 

Tijuana Donkey Show

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I never said Adams was good. Pegula isn't helping either. As far as trading Mitts, I fully believe he had to trade him. Budget wise Mitts wouldn't fit. There is a reason they don't spend to the cap now. The Sabres have a budget to spend each season. How else do you explain never spending that much more than the cap floor.

Adams didn't know whether that would be the case or not, because Casey publicly said he would like to stay but Adams had yet to talk to his agent about an extension.

BTW $5.75M is fair value for Mitts. Mule and Cozens dumb contracts shouldn't prevent us from signing good contracts.

Edit To be clear, Mitts value would have been really good. He would be a top 2 C or top 2 LW/RW on this roster. The problem this team has with value is our 3C makes $7M. We have to remedy that, which should not include straying away from good value in the top 6.
 
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Sabresfansince1980

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The challenge is that you did not play 82 games at the professional level with all the travel they have to deal with.

There is a reason that sports science and load balancing between games and practices have become a thing throughout pro sports.

Obviously there needs to be a high level of effort and attention in practices. But, the volume of practice needs to be balanced so that they are not worn out for games. And if you look at the number of practices they get in-season, it is generally a lot lower a practice to game ratio than what you had growing up.
The specifics of their practice routine and habits matter here. I think Mittelstadt's comment about never having practiced so hard until his first week with Colorado says a lot though. Maybe it's different now with Ruff...or maybe it's part of the reason other teams think they are still playing summer hockey...
 

DapperCam

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The challenge is that you did not play 82 games at the professional level with all the travel they have to deal with.

There is a reason that sports science and load balancing between games and practices have become a thing throughout pro sports.

Obviously there needs to be a high level of effort and attention in practices. But, the volume of practice needs to be balanced so that they are not worn out for games. And if you look at the number of practices they get in-season, it is generally a lot lower a practice to game ratio than what you had growing up.

I think this is correct in general. But when you have a team that is still playing “summer hockey”, and quite frankly has played lackadaisical for years I think the balance tilts a little bit.

The benefit of getting their butts kicked in practice and practicing hard for a while might be worth it. Also, we have the youngest team in the NHL. If anybody can handle it, they should.
 
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ValJamesDuex

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Seravalli:

-Kevyn Adams has been making a lot of calls around the league to understand what different markets look like

-thinks the Canucks have asked if Bowen Byram was available but the answer was "No" from the Sabres

-Canucks are a terrible trade partner for the Sabres; Sabres have no interest in futures

-issues are a lot deeper than any one player

-around the league, they say that's a team still playing summer hockey

-have to shake it up, have to fix it

-getting a bunch of calls on Jack Quinn
Would you do a basics Elias for Byrum deal ? :sarcasm:
 
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Beerz

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The challenge is that you did not play 82 games at the professional level with all the travel they have to deal with.

There is a reason that sports science and load balancing between games and practices have become a thing throughout pro sports.

Obviously there needs to be a high level of effort and attention in practices. But, the volume of practice needs to be balanced so that they are not worn out for games. And if you look at the number of practices they get in-season, it is generally a lot lower a practice to game ratio than what you had growing up.

Do not take the fact that there is a segment out there now calling itself "Sports Science" as some Holy Bible. It is a business out to make money and to convince the powers that be in Sports that they are needed.

The Science is never settled. We grew up thinking the Food Pyramid was a good thing.. we grew up thinking Pluto was a planet.

They should be going hard in practice.
 

Tijuana Donkey Show

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Mar 14, 2023
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The challenge is that you did not play 82 games at the professional level with all the travel they have to deal with.

There is a reason that sports science and load balancing between games and practices have become a thing throughout pro sports.

Obviously there needs to be a high level of effort and attention in practices. But, the volume of practice needs to be balanced so that they are not worn out for games. And if you look at the number of practices they get in-season, it is generally a lot lower a practice to game ratio than what you had growing up.

I competed in a different sport internationally and lived at the Olympic Training Center for a number of years. Not hockey but I can weigh in a little bit.

Physiology is real and it is very much a thing. Sports science should certainly be adheread to.

But if we are talking about a team that has had multiple players say that they went to much better teams and practices are way harder, I don't think fans need to be careful about saying "practice harder" and don't need to worry about burn out.

Also these guys are top shelf athletes, they can handle a hard practice two days before a game. Sure you don't want to blow their legs off the morning of. But lets say they are on a schedule where they play Monday, have Tuesday and Wednesday off, then play Thursday, these guys can have a really hard practice Wednesday and recover.

For reference, a mid distance runner who spends their entire life preparing to try and win the Olympics. Working towards one day down the track, will likely go for a 60-90 minute run at least once per day, often twice. Some days will be significant work days. All while they are actively competing at the Olympics. Also, it is fairly common to train through events leading up to the Olympics while expecting to compete at a high level.

NHL players can handle hard practices.
 
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