Olympics: Team USA 2022

[ORRFForever]

...which is why I think it's crazy that there are some people that are actually talking about leaving Gaudreau off. Also another reason Eichel's health is of utmost importance for USA to have a chance, they really need him to be the guy manning the 2nd line.

I don't want Marner on Team Canada, so I can see why some people don't want Gaudreau on the American Team.

***

Eichel's health is a big "IF". Posters should read the thread in the Buffalo forum. If correct...

* Eichel still can't raise his arms above his head.
* Slipped/Bulging disc in his neck.
* He's looking at "experimental surgery" - two words you NEVER want in the same sentence.

I feel really bad for Eichel. Supposedly he's scared because it's not getting better - I think he should take a year off like Crosby did.

For the record: I would NEVER let anyone operate on my neck. Ever!

 

[WarriorofTime]

I don't want Marner on Team Canada, so I can see why some people don't want Gaudreau on the American Team.

Eichel's health is a big if. Posters really should read the thread in the Buffalo forum. If correct...

* Eichel still can't raise his arms above his head.
* Slipped/Bulging disc in his neck.
* He's looking at "experimental surgery" - two words you never want to have in the same sentence.

I really feel bad for the kid and I think he should take a year off - like Crosby did.

Yeah, Gaudreau isn't my most favorite player or anything, but I think the difference is Canada has the luxury of being able to leave Marner off, whereas USA doesn't really have that same luxury.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

The issue is he is a smaller forward and is a bit redundant as Patrick Kane does what Johnny does but at an even better level.

Johnny's last two World Championship tournaments were anything but special.. in fact he looked pretty rough in that last one very frustrated and maybe that's on the officiating but he is a player that can be shut down and his numbers have been declining..we now have a lot of bigger skilled forwards that we are ready to unleash and give that chance to. There are so many talented wingers on this team, hell I didn't even add Wheeler here and I think he is a near lock to make the team.

I love Johnny Hockey and he still makes my team, but this isn't 90 points Johnny right now and if he isn't that there are others who produce as much as he does AND can perform away from the puck.

Going to be a lot of tough calls and upset players IMO.

But this is 90 point Johnny. I don't think you fully understand how terrible Sean Monahan has been the last 2 years. He can't skate, he can't carry the puck, he can't defend, he can't make plays, and he's even lost his ability to finish around the net, the one thing he was actually above average at.

I will say it again, Gaudreau scored 22 points in 16 games under Darryl freakin' Sutter when we was finally separated from Monahan.

He had two more assists in those 16 games away from Monahan than he did in 40 games with Monahan!

He probably would have scored 65-70 points in the shortened season if he were playing with Lindholm and Tkachuk all year.

The narrative that he can be shut down is only true if he is the only decent player on his line - which has been the case for the past few years. This is true of any player - look what Winnipeg did to McDavid.

And if you think his play is in decline you aren't watching the games. If you did, you would know there is no way on earth Matthew Tkachuk should make this team over Johnny Gaudreau (side note, but Matthew Tkachuk is not very good, especially in important games. Brady is significantly better).

In the last 3 years, these are the leading scorers among Americans:

1. Kane 260p
2. Matthews 219p
3. Gaudreau 206p

He's also 3rd in EV scoring.

And Gaudreau's been doing that while carrying the worst "1C" in the league, across 3 different coaches. Kane has Debrincat, Matthews has Marner/Nylander/Tavares.

There is no world where Kane makes Gaudreau redundant. That's the kind of backwards thinking that got Panarin shipped out of Chicago. You take as many world class players as you can get.

 

[ORRFForever]

But this is 90 point Johnny. I don't think you fully understand how terrible Sean Monahan has been the last 2 years. He can't skate, he can't carry the puck, he can't defend, he can't make plays, and he's even lost his ability to finish around the net, the one thing he was actually above average at.

I will say it again, Gaudreau scored 22 points in 16 games under Darryl freakin' Sutter when we was finally separated from Monahan.

He had two more assists in those 16 games away from Monahan than he did in 40 games with Monahan!

He probably would have scored 65-70 points in the shortened season if he were playing with Lindholm and Tkachuk all year.

The narrative that he can be shut down is only true if he is the only decent player on his line - which has been the case for the past few years. This is true of any player - look what Winnipeg did to McDavid.

And if you think his play is in decline you aren't watching the games. If you did, you would know there is no way on earth Matthew Tkachuk should make this team over Johnny Gaudreau (side note, but Matthew Tkachuk is not very good, especially in important games. Brady is significantly better).

In the last 3 years, these are the leading scorers among Americans:

1. Kane 260p
2. Matthews 219p
3. Gaudreau 206p

He's also 3rd in EV scoring.

And Gaudreau's been doing that while carrying the worst "1C" in the league, across 3 different coaches. Kane has Debrincat, Matthews has Marner/Nylander/Tavares.

There is no world where Kane makes Gaudreau redundant. That's the kind of backwards thinking that got Panarin shipped out of Chicago. You take as many world class players as you can get.

I think Gaudreau's playoff performances, just like Mitch Marner, have scared off a lot of posters.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I think Gaudreau's playoff performances, just like Mitch Marner, have scared off a lot of posters.

then why do so many people have Matthew Tkachuk on their rosters??

Gaudreau was the flames best player in the second half of the Stars series. He has had 2 "bad" series where he was shadowed the entire series because nobody else on his line was a threat.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Yes, absolutely nobody in the world is scared of the prospect of the USA trotting Johnny Gaudreau out onto the ice.. but they have no choice but to do so anyways.

 

[ORRFForever]

then why do so many people have Matthew Tkachuk on their rosters??

Gaudreau was the flames best player in the second half of the Stars series. He has had 2 "bad" series where he was shadowed the entire series because nobody else on his line was a threat.

I have to give you credit, you KNEW Marner was going to be great long before anyone else did - so you know your hockey. I've just seen Marner and Gaudreau disappear in big situation / the playoffs, and they're very similar players.

As a Canadian, I don't want Marner within 100 miles of Team Canada, so I can see why some American posters don't want J.G.

 

[ORRFForever]

I mean, the US has 7 of the top 20 goal scorers this year lol... And the #1 & #3 overall goal scorers. 6 of the top 7 goal scorers make my team as only Patches is a no thanks from me.

So not sure what more firepower is needed when 35% of the top 20 goal scorers are Americans...Canada has 6 of the top 20 goal scorers fyi....lol

Are you really going to have Joe Pavelski on the team at 37 years of age?

 

[SanDogBrewin]

Yeah, Gaudreau isn't my most favorite player or anything, but I think the difference is Canada has the luxury of being able to leave Marner off, whereas USA doesn't really have that same luxury.

The US could leave Gaudreau out of the lineups, and many predicted lineups have Johnny off, but still be great. USA could go with many lineups and leave some excellent vets out of the Olympics.

 

[AmericanDream]

But this is 90 point Johnny. I don't think you fully understand how terrible Sean Monahan has been the last 2 years. He can't skate, he can't carry the puck, he can't defend, he can't make plays, and he's even lost his ability to finish around the net, the one thing he was actually above average at.

I will say it again, Gaudreau scored 22 points in 16 games under Darryl freakin' Sutter when we was finally separated from Monahan.

He had two more assists in those 16 games away from Monahan than he did in 40 games with Monahan!

He probably would have scored 65-70 points in the shortened season if he were playing with Lindholm and Tkachuk all year.

The narrative that he can be shut down is only true if he is the only decent player on his line - which has been the case for the past few years. This is true of any player - look what Winnipeg did to McDavid.

And if you think his play is in decline you aren't watching the games. If you did, you would know there is no way on earth Matthew Tkachuk should make this team over Johnny Gaudreau (side note, but Matthew Tkachuk is not very good, especially in important games. Brady is significantly better).

In the last 3 years, these are the leading scorers among Americans:

1. Kane 260p
2. Matthews 219p
3. Gaudreau 206p

He's also 3rd in EV scoring.

And Gaudreau's been doing that while carrying the worst "1C" in the league, across 3 different coaches. Kane has Debrincat, Matthews has Marner/Nylander/Tavares.

There is no world where Kane makes Gaudreau redundant. That's the kind of backwards thinking that got Panarin shipped out of Chicago. You take as many world class players as you can get.

Gaudreau has been in a decline, stop kidding yourself.

Kane plays with plugs most every year and still dominates. Kane had Pius Suter as a center for God's sake. Kane and Cat made their own magic most nights.

So don't hand me who Johnny's center is it shouldn't matter.

I have watched a ton of Johnny the past few years...he is not 90 point Johnny Hockey but still a damn skilled player. He becomes redundant as Kane already is a liability in his own end at times you will have some trouble with two players like that in a tournament like this.

He has a lot to prove next year for a lot of folks, still love the guy but we have so many options where we can be very picky hare and don't have to take every skilled forward we have.

 

[ORRFForever]

The US could leave Gaudreau out of the lineups, and many predicted lineups have Johnny off, but still be great. USA could go with many lineups and leave some excellent vets out of the Olympics.

The vets have a ton of experience and provide a lot of offense but they're older and they've let the U.S. down in the past.

The kids don't have the same scoring upside, but their young, fast and hungry.

It's a choice... or a mix.

 

[AmericanDream]

Are you really going to have Joe Pavelski on the team at 37 years of age?

yep.

 

[AmericanDream]

Yeah, not so much worried about guys capable of finishing/putting pucks in net, but worried more so about a lack of creative playmaking forwards. Aside from Kane, the next 3 Americans on the NHL assist total are Defensemen and then you have Guentzel who I like as a player but admittedly gets a lot of points by virtue of playing alongside Crosby, it's great to have defensemen that can pass it around and move the puck up ice but I do think you're going to need more playmaking from your forwards as well... which is why I think it's crazy that there are some people that are actually talking about leaving Gaudreau off. Also another reason Eichel's health is of utmost importance for USA to have a chance, they really need him to be the guy manning the 2nd line.

We definitely need a few centers to step up namely Hughes and Zegras. Overall though, you can mix and match a lot of forwards that can drive the play...which is why I think Wheeler makes this team.

I have Gaudreau on the team but I still have some concerns there. Guys like Boeser, Connor, Tkachuk, and Pavelski all can make passes...they aren't horrible out there but having centers who can skate and carry the puck in zone is something we have to look hard at honestly..

I would rather have more guys who can bury the puck in the net/hard workers than a lot of playmakers...IMO.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

Appoint Lavi or Sullivan for coach and call it a day. No one is going to have any kind of answer for the United States' back end or Hellebuyck/Gibson in net. Any game vs Canada is gonna be Harlem Globetrotters vs a Generals team that's allowed to physically beat the crap out of them.

Trying to watch the Canada score on that lineup clamping down on them only for Patrick Kane dunk on them is gonna be f***ing GLORIOUS

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

Are you really going to have Joe Pavelski on the team at 37 years of age?

Yo if Pavelski's still got the legs next year you're damn right. Don't let age scare you off. Marty St. Louis was good til 38 too. It was amazing watching him play against the Lightning in the SCF last year.

 

[Mathieukferland]

The USA lacks 200 foot centres to the extent that Finland or Canada has them, I would definitely bring Trocheck and Pavelski who I have seen left off some rosters

 

[ORRFForever]

Appoint Lavi or Sullivan for coach and call it a day. No one is going to have any kind of answer for the United States' back end or Hellebuyck/Gibson in net. Any game vs Canada is gonna be Harlem Globetrotters vs a Generals team that's allowed to physically beat the crap out of them.

Trying to watch the Canada score on that lineup clamping down on them only for Patrick Kane dunk on them is gonna be f***ing GLORIOUS

 

[ORRFForever]

Yo if Pavelski's still got the legs next year you're damn right. Don't let age scare you off. Marty St. Louis was good til 38 too. It was amazing watching him play against the Lightning in the SCF last year.

If you want to send a 38 year old, God bless you for it. I won't object.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

If you want to send a 38 year old, God bless you for it. I won't object.

I mean.... I watched a 43 year old man win us a Super Bowl. If Pavs has that kind of juice you don't turn it down

 

[ORRFForever]

The USA lacks 200 foot centres to the extent that Finland or Canada has them, I would definitely bring Trocheck and Pavelski who I have seen left off some rosters

Pavelski is the Energizer Bunny - you know the theme.

The U.S. = the fast, hungry, young players vs the old, grizzled, reliable PPG players.

It will be interesting to see which direction they go.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

We definitely need a few centers to step up namely Hughes and Zegras. Overall though, you can mix and match a lot of forwards that can drive the play...which is why I think Wheeler makes this team.

I have Gaudreau on the team but I still have some concerns there. Guys like Boeser, Connor, Tkachuk, and Pavelski all can make passes...they aren't horrible out there but having centers who can skate and carry the puck in zone is something we have to look hard at honestly..

I would rather have more guys who can bury the puck in the net/hard workers than a lot of playmakers...IMO.

You know Gaudreau scored 36 goals not 2 years ago, right?

Gaudreau has been in a decline, stop kidding yourself.

I watch all of his games, believe me he is nowhere near declining. He was playing some of the best hockey in his career in the last 6 weeks of the season. Only McDavid and Draisaitl scored more points down the stretch.

Kane plays with plugs most every year and still dominates. Kane had Pius Suter as a center for God's sake. Kane and Cat made their own magic most nights.

So don't hand me who Johnny's center is it shouldn't matter.[/quote]

It matters when you don't have a center or a winger. Gaudreau played most of the year with Monahan + Ritchie / Leivo / Simon.

Like you said, Kane had Debrincat + 3 more mins a night of ice time. Johnny had nobody. And then was asked to play dump and chase hockey under Sutter.

I have watched a ton of Johnny the past few years...he is not 90 point Johnny Hockey but still a damn skilled player. He becomes redundant as Kane already is a liability in his own end at times you will have some trouble with two players like that in a tournament like this.

Gaudreau is far from a defensive liability. And he is very easily a top 2 winger on this team. I very much doubt you watch a lot of Calgary games, because if you did there's no way you'd take M Tkachuk over Gaudreau. It's not even remotely close.

He has a lot to prove next year for a lot of folks, still love the guy but we have so many options where we can be very picky hare and don't have to take every skilled forward we have.

The guy who is 3rd in scoring among Americans has nothing to prove.

You know who has a lot to prove? Guys like Boeser who have never cracked 60 points. Or Matthew Tkachuk with 5 points in 15 playoff games.

No offense, but anyone who assembles a roster without Gaudreau in the top 6 just flat out doesn't know what they're talking about.

 

[ORRFForever]

I mean.... I watched a 43 year old man win us a Super Bowl. If Pavs has that kind of juice you don't turn it down

Pavelski is terrific. There are a bunch of American players who amaze me because they've :

1) Gotten better with age;
2) Maintained a HIGH level of play well into their 30's.

Max P, Wheeler, Oshie, Pavelski, Kane have all forgotten forwards are suppose to slow in their 30's - especially their mid to late 30's.

 

[AmericanDream]

You know Gaudreau scored 36 goals not 2 years ago, right?



I watch all of his games, believe me he is nowhere near declining. He was playing some of the best hockey in his career in the last 6 weeks of the season. Only McDavid and Draisaitl scored more points down the stretch.



So don't hand me who Johnny's center is it shouldn't matter.

I love Johnny Hockey...you love him far more. This is clear.

Johnny hasn't performed at an elite level at his last 2 WC's. His last one was really rough.

He has answered the call though which is why he makes my team. But you are watching with blinders on if you don't see some concerns there with his play last few years.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Lacking firepower? What are you talking about?

Does this team not have 3 of the top 10 forwards in the game? And plenty of depth. Not lacking in firepower, unless its in comparison to Canada.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

???

It’s very close between USA, Canada, and to a lesser extent Sweden.

Is Makar, Theodore, Chabot, Hamilton, Ekblad, Doughty, Nurse better than Fox, Slavin, McAvoy, Jones, Werenski, Carlson, McDonagh? Take your pick. Both defenses are great, and this is all hypothetical. Some of those guys probably don’t even get picked.