Proposal: Stoner (maybe small retention) 3rd round (maybe 2nd) for 7th or future considerations

[WhatTheDuck]

a) If he's a great fit as a partner for Vatanen and can play upwards of 20 mins a game, why are Ducks fans trying to get rid of him? Ohhhhhh right, because

b) It doesn't matter if you're good or bad when you're 50-75% overpaid.

You should read a little more carefully, I was speaking in past tense, it should be fairly obvious that Vatanen doesn't play on our bottom pairing anymore.

Anaheim is looking to move him because they have arguably the deepest group of quality NHL ready blueline talent in the league and need to reinvest some of that money into the forward group. There is obviously someone we would prefer to move in Bieksa, but he has a NMC. When you look at the rest of the group, common sense should tell you why Stoner would be the most available.

You're math is off there, bottom pairing veterans who actually bring something to the table make well north of $2M in free agency. Like I said he's 750k - 1M overpaid. It's not like I'm trying to say his value isn't negative, I was pointing out that he isn't useless like uninformed fans will make him out to be.

 

[ThatGuy22]

There will be a bunch of I'll advised posts in this thread claiming Stoner is garbage - he isn't. He's a very steady, physical bottom pairing guy who happens to be paid about 750k - 1M more than he should.

He was a great fit as a partner for Vatanen while the latter was getting his feet under him at the NHL level and the two often took on upwards of 20 mins per game.

If a team has the cap space, and has a young puck mover in need of some insulation on their third pair, this is the perfect fit. As a bonus they likely get paid some sort of solid asset to take him on due to the contract.

Once again, if you're coming into this thread to make a generic comment about Stoner being bad, you're just telling me you haven't watched him play. He's been exactly as advertised when the Ducks signed him.

As a Wild fan, i can assure you i've watched plenty of Stoner. He's not a good NHL level hockey player. All he is a physical presence. He can't make a pass, no offensive skills to speak of. He won't kill you as a 6 or 7. But his minutes should be highly managed.

The contract was laughable the day it was signed, and i'd be shocked if they could move it.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I'd do that in a heartbeat, granted I'm not as high on Larsson as others are.

No kidding, that is laughably horrible for Anaheim, Larsson has way too much upside to consider that.

There are other ways to save money, if the price to move Stoner is more than a B asset than we keep him.

 

[Pennaduck]

a) If he's a great fit as a partner for Vatanen and can play upwards of 20 mins a game, why are Ducks fans trying to get rid of him? Ohhhhhh right, because

b) It doesn't matter if you're good or bad when you're 50-75% overpaid.

No, it is because we have 7 defensemen already under contract, with Lindholm still to sign, and Theodore looks ready to play full time in the NHL. That is 9 D and only 7 spots, so naturally it would benefit us to move two of Fowler/Despres/Stoner so we can be in a better cap situation to sign Lindholm and make room for Theodore.

Also he is not 50 to 75 percent overpaid. He is about 1 million overpaid for a 3rd pairing vet defenseman, which is why we are offering an additional asset to sweeten the pot and why salary retention is a possibility as well.

 

[go4hockey]

Since when is Lupul a 7th round pick or future considerations? Ducks are looking to unload Stoner without taking a player back.

Yea the point is it will be hard to move and will take more than a 3rd for any team to even consider it. Go check what the Hawks had to give up to move one year of Bickel and your trying to move multiple years of bad contract.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Stoner contract is $3,250,000 each season through 2017-18

Would anyone be willing to take this?

5-6 dman. Bad contract

 

[WhatTheDuck]

As a Wild fan, i can assure you i've watched plenty of Stoner. He's not a good NHL level hockey player. All he is a physical presence. He can't make a pass, no offensive skills to speak of. He won't kill you as a 6 or 7. But his minutes should be highly managed.

The contract was laughable the day it was signed, and i'd be shocked if they could move it.

Then you haven't watched much of him in the past two years, you're right that his puck moving game is sub par but that's why he works well with a young PMD. He's more than just a physical presence, he's steady defensively.

 

[go4hockey]

What is so funny? Your acting like Stoner totally sucks he is a decent 3rd pair defenseman just a little overpayed and we could retain a small amount we shouldn't need to take another player back.

He is a 6/7 guy and worth near 1 million salary not worth near what he is making. Good luck moving him without taking something back.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Not to derail things but I don't think you're getting out from the Stoner contract unless there is a large overpayment...not quite Crouse but it's up there.

I think Anaheim is going to have to basically give away Despres.

 

[Not So Mighty]

a) If he's a great fit as a partner for Vatanen and can play upwards of 20 mins a game, why are Ducks fans trying to get rid of him? Ohhhhhh right, because

b) It doesn't matter if you're good or bad when you're 50-75% overpaid.

I don't get the point of your post. You asked a question (and in an antagonistic way for some reason), and then you proceeded to correctly answer your own question.

Yes. We want to get rid of him because he's overpaid and replaceable, and we desperately need that money.

 

[AvsGuy]

I don't get the point of your post. You asked a question (and in an antagonistic way for some reason), and then you proceeded to correctly answer your own question.

Yes. We want to get rid of him because he's overpaid and replaceable, and we desperately need that money.

My point was to be antagonistic.

Duck's fans throughout the thread are trying to rationalize that Clayton Stoner's only a million overpaid, as though paying $2.25 million to a benchwarmer is a rational idea in a salary cap league, when in reality he's making more than twice what a player of his ilk is worth on a good day. Add in the fact that at some point he was supposedly playing more than 20 minutes a game from the 3rd pairing, and I'm not sure anyone here really knows what math is.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Stoner contract is $3,250,000 each season through 2017-18

Would anyone be willing to take this?

The only way Stoner is getting moved, Is bad contract for bad contract. No one is going to help Anaheim here and take Stoner off their hands without a decent incentive coming back from Anaheim a sweetener.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

There are still UFA defenseman available who could fill the same role as Stoner at a fraction of the cost and likely on a 1 year deal.

 

[snipes]

No kidding, that is laughably horrible for Anaheim, Larsson has way too much upside to consider that.

There are other ways to save money, if the price to move Stoner is more than a B asset than we keep him.

Yeah Jacob Larsson has way too much upside to tag into a cap dump. Plus ANA will have some good years with him and Theo on the cheap. No way you guys are adding him into any deal.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

My point was to be antagonistic.

Duck's fans throughout the thread are trying to rationalize that Clayton Stoner's only a million overpaid, as though paying $2.25 million to a benchwarmer is a rational idea in a salary cap league, when in reality he's making more than twice what a player of his ilk is worth on a good day. Add in the fact that at some point he was supposedly playing more than 20 minutes a game from the 3rd pairing, and I'm not sure anyone here really knows what math is.

You're reading comprehension really needs to improve. I said they often played upwards of 20 mins per game. He was on our third pairing, which played more than most third pairings because they were damn effective and could be trusted. 18 mins per game for Stoner in our run to the conference finals last year is hardly "benchwarmer" type ice time.

This is all stuff I wouldn't have to explain to you if you followed the team and watched the guy play. I said that uninformed people will jump into the thread to tell you that this guy is crap, and you're 100% being that guy (there's some math for you).

 

[Leafs87]

Since when is Lupul a 7th round pick or future considerations? Ducks are looking to unload Stoner without taking a player back.

Yeah well if that were possible do you think he'd still be a duck ?

 

[Vipers31]

Stoner is overpaid by a million. Any notion of Bolland or Bickell is indicative of a black/white thought system, where there only is overpaid and not overpaid. Mentioning a name like Larsson in anything but jest is absurd. He's most certainly not taken by anyone for free, but he isn't in the same league of cap dumps.

 

[AvsGuy]

You're reading comprehension really needs to improve. I said they often played upwards of 20 mins per game. He was on our third pairing, which played more than most third pairings because they were damn effective and could be trusted. 18 mins per game for Stoner in our run to the conference finals last year is hardly "benchwarmer" type ice time.

This is all stuff I wouldn't have to explain to you if you followed the team and watched the guy play. I said that uninformed people will jump into the thread to tell you that this guy is crap, and you're 100% being that guy (there's some math for you).

Ok captain, set me straight: list 5 teams on which the current version of Clayton Stoner would not be a catastrophically overpaid #6 defenseman at best. Then narrow that down to the mayyyyybe 1 team who has either the cap space or the motivation to do the Ducks that favour.

 

[Weezeric]

Stoner is overpaid by a million. Any notion of Bolland or Bickell is indicative of a black/white thought system, where there only is overpaid and not overpaid. Mentioning a name like Larsson in anything but jest is absurd. He's most certainly not taken by anyone for free, but he isn't in the same league of cap dumps.

When there are better defenseman sitting without contracts and Anaheim doesn't have enough space to sign 2 key Rfas (one of which is calling the team cheap in the media) I'm sure a team would do them a big favor for next to nothing

 

[Vipers31]

When there are better defenseman sitting without contracts and Anaheim doesn't have enough space to sign 2 key Rfas (one of which is calling the team cheap in the media) I'm sure a team would do them a big favor for next to nothing

Because that clearly is what I outright said and/or at least must have implied.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Ok captain, set me straight: list 5 teams on which the current version of Clayton Stoner would not be a catastrophically overpaid #6 defenseman at best. Then narrow that down to the mayyyyybe 1 team who has either the cap space or the motivation to do the Ducks that favour.

Read back through my posts and you'll clearly see me say that the Ducks would have to pay to get rid of him. That's obviously going to be a major part of the other team's motivation. You're arguing like someone has said he has positive value and no one in this thread has. I was merely pointing out that Stoner is a solid veteran player who happens to be overpaid, and not a piece of trash like some make him out to be. If you spent more time reading what you were responding to instead of looking up stupid gifs this conversation wouldn't be necessary.

List 5 teams - why? We only need to find one team willing to take an asset to take him on, and as I said I'm more than ok with keeping him if the ask is too strong, we have other money that can be dumped.

 

[Weezeric]

Because that clearly is what I outright said and/or at least must have implied.

Well you said a name like Larsson is absurd. To me a 3rd pick is basically nothing. What kind of compensation would you view as reasonable?

 

[haseoke39]

Make it at least a second, you might get interest. You're trying to get a handout for cheap. No team is looking for a stoner for his own sake. A pair of seconds gets it done.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Make it at least a second, you might get interest. You're trying to get a handout for cheap. No team is looking for a stoner for his own sake.

Our 2nd + Stoner for a contract/mid to late pick is probably right in the ball park. If the ask is anything steeper it would be better to keep him and move Despres at a discount.

 

[Weezeric]

Our 2nd + Stoner for a contract/mid to late pick is probably right in the ball park. If the ask is anything steeper it would be better to keep him and move Despres at a discount.

That might be possible in a vacuum, but Anaheim isn't really in a great negotiating position. See the hall/Larson trade for when you're dealing from a position of weakness...