Sportsnet: Stars and Hawks talking Seth Jones

[EddieTheEagle]

Are the Stars planning to LTIR Heisky until playoffs? If they do, they should load up. The have Seggy's room already, no?

This is a year that Dallas should be going for it. Spend what it takes to make yourself terrifying in the post season. The field isn't incredibly difficult in the West with Edmonton probably being your biggest impediment.

Adding Jones would really round out that D group and give the Stars a legit shot. He eats a lot of minutes and can play PP in Heiskanen's absence and be a great PP2 QB for the playoffs. Perhaps they make the deal a bit larger and you add in some forward depth like a Donato.

I'd hope the Hawks are more after young blue-chip forward prospects than draft picks from Dallas. Cupboards are getting full...

 

[McJedi]

No way Nill moves Bichsel, nor should he. He's gonna be fantastic.

Ok - replace with Mavrik Bourque.

 

[eojsmada]

Chicago will need all the help they can get to get to the Cap Floor over the next 2-3 years, with 10.9 in dead contracts coming off after this year. So retaining anything shouldn't be an issue even if they signed Bedard to a mega deal. That and only having 4 players signed after next year will mean they need to work hard to get to the floor every year for awhile.

Just a matter of whether the pieces are there to make it work.

 

[Magic Mittens]

Are the Stars planning to LTIR Heisky until playoffs? If they do, they should load up. The have Seggy's room already, no?

This is a year that Dallas should be going for it. Spend what it takes to make yourself terrifying in the post season. The field isn't incredibly difficult in the West with Edmonton probably being your biggest impediment.

Adding Jones would really round out that D group and give the Stars a legit shot. He eats a lot of minutes and can play PP in Heiskanen's absence and be a great PP2 QB for the playoffs. Perhaps they make the deal a bit larger and you add in some forward depth like a Donato.

I'd hope the Hawks are more after young blue-chip forward prospects than draft picks from Dallas. Cupboards are getting full...

I believe the plan now is for Miro to be back for 2-3 games before the playoffs, but who knows.

 

[EddieTheEagle]

I believe the plan now is for Miro to be back for 2-3 games before the playoffs, but who knows.

I have a feeling Miro suffers a minor "setback" in recovery.

 

[StreetHawk]

Chicago will need all the help they can get to get to the Cap Floor over the next 2-3 years, with 10.9 in dead contracts coming off after this year. So retaining anything shouldn't be an issue even if they signed Bedard to a mega deal. That and only having 4 players signed after next year will mean they need to work hard to get to the floor every year for awhile.

Just a matter of whether the pieces are there to make it work.

Chicago will be a bottom 3 team for a 3rd straight season this year. And had like the 6th worst record back in 2022. As much as their social media wanted to dog Biz, his comments on Bedard's game were fair. To win, you need to be smarter with the puck.

Chicago will need to find some players to help to begin to turn the ship around. Rather than just meet the cap floor. The Ducks appear to be on pace for a 15 plus point improvement, which will still only land them from 3rd worst to like 5th to 7th worst. But, that's still a big jump from a 60 point season. Not going from 60 to 94 points overnight.

 

[eojsmada]

Chicago will be a bottom 3 team for a 3rd straight season this year. And had like the 6th worst record back in 2022. As much as their social media wanted to dog Biz, his comments on Bedard's game were fair. To win, you need to be smarter with the puck.

Chicago will need to find some players to help to begin to turn the ship around. Rather than just meet the cap floor. The Ducks appear to be on pace for a 15 plus point improvement, which will still only land them from 3rd worst to like 5th to 7th worst. But, that's still a big jump from a 60 point season. Not going from 60 to 94 points overnight.

Totally agree. Was just looking at the reality of cap implications as far it is involved with a Seth Jones trade.

 

[oconnor9sean]

Ok - replace with Mavrik Bourque.

Still no. Bourque, Bichsel and Stankoven have been ID'd by Nill as seemingly untouchable. Their skill + ELCs are too valuable for a team that will be looking to avoid a cap crunch.

 

[McJedi]

Still no. Bourque, Bichsel and Stankoven have been ID'd by Nill as seemingly untouchable. Their skill + ELCs are too valuable for a team that will be looking to avoid a cap crunch.

Ok

Seth Jones retained down to $5.75MM ($3.75MM retained per year which is 39.5% of his AAV) for Dumba (dump) + 2026 1st (top 10 protected) + 2027 1st round pick (top 5 protected) + 2nd or 3rd round pick in future + another bad expiring contract to make cap math work?

 

[MicronMega]

Dallas has had success with older veterans, no reason to think that Jones can't have success as a Star with Heiskenen or Harley as a partner. If they can get him with retention it might put them over the top. Jones is playing 25 min a night on a bad team with an interim head coach. Let him play with some structure and I th=nk its a great move

 

[Clint Eastwood]

Yes I would do that deal. Hate dipping into the 2026 draft pool already, but with Jones I don't think Dallas has a weakness (especially if Seguin returns).

Robertson-Hintz-Johnston
Marchment-Duchene-Seguin
Benn-Granlund-Stankoven
Dadonov-Steel-Bourque
(Blackwell)

Heiskanen-Jones
Harley-Lyubushkin
Lindell-Ceci
(Bichsel, Smith)

That's the team to beat in the West if this comes to fruition. That is a loaded lineup.

 

[u2wojo]

I can't see the Hawks retaining to move Jones (certainly not 2 or 3 million per), there simply is no reason to. At the TDL, a team needs slightly more than 2 million in capspace to fit him under the cap the balance of this season. The cap is going up 10 million per each of the next 3 Summers to make his full contract work long term for virtually anyone. Take back a bad contract like Dumba here or Manson in Colorado that runs another year and you give plenty of time for bad money to come off the books and the increases in the cap to easily absorb Jones. While Jones is not a top 10 RHD in the league as his salary suggests, it is hard to argue he is not in the next 10 in the 11-20 range. RHD that eat 25 minutes a game and are good for 40-50 points a season (his career average is 42pts/82 games despite the last 4 years on....to put it kindly....offensively challanged putrid Hawks teams) are a highly desired asset in the NHL. When you are talking retaining 2 million (plus taking a shit contract like Dumba for another year), it is not happening for a late first or even a pair of late first. 30 year old 7.5 million per for 5 years 25 minute a game 40pt RHD are getting nice pieces not scraps. And no Jones does not hold all or even many of the cards with his NMC because his alternative is staying in Chicago and being on shit teams for at the least 2-3 more years.

Dumba, Emil Hemming and the '26 1st for Jones and Donato is about all I can wrap my head around. Otherwise talk to Colorado or even Edmonton (where their GM once paid a fortune in assets to get Jones so he could give him the contract that only now with a massive spike in cap is creeping toward fair). there also is really no harm in the Hawks keeping Jones to mentor/pair with all the young LHD they are transitioning into the NHL.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

.Otherwise talk to Colorado or even Edmonton (where their GM once paid a fortune in assets to get Jones so he could give him the contract that only now with a massive spike in cap is creeping toward fair).

Seth Jones would never waive for Edmonton

 

[u2wojo]

Seth Jones would never waive for Edmonton

Never is pretty absolute and do not underestimate how 4 straight seasons of losing lots and more losing on the near term horizon can change one's thinking. He very well may not have interest in waiving for Edmonton, but landing on a perenial Cup contender for the forseable future might be more of a motivator at this point.

 

[kmwtrucks]

I can't see the Hawks retaining to move Jones (certainly not 2 or 3 million per), there simply is no reason to. At the TDL, a team needs slightly more than 2 million in capspace to fit him under the cap the balance of this season. The cap is going up 10 million per each of the next 3 Summers to make his full contract work long term for virtually anyone. Take back a bad contract like Dumba here or Manson in Colorado that runs another year and you give plenty of time for bad money to come off the books and the increases in the cap to easily absorb Jones. While Jones is not a top 10 RHD in the league as his salary suggests, it is hard to argue he is not in the next 10 in the 11-20 range. RHD that eat 25 minutes a game and are good for 40-50 points a season (his career average is 42pts/82 games despite the last 4 years on....to put it kindly....offensively challanged putrid Hawks teams) are a highly desired asset in the NHL. When you are talking retaining 2 million (plus taking a shit contract like Dumba for another year), it is not happening for a late first or even a pair of late first. 30 year old 7.5 million per for 5 years 25 minute a game 40pt RHD are getting nice pieces not scraps. And no Jones does not hold all or even many of the cards with his NMC because his alternative is staying in Chicago and being on shit teams for at the least 2-3 more years.

Dumba, Emil Hemming and the '26 1st for Jones and Donato is about all I can wrap my head around. Otherwise talk to Colorado or even Edmonton (where their GM once paid a fortune in assets to get Jones so he could give him the contract that only now with a massive spike in cap is creeping toward fair). there also is really no harm in the Hawks keeping Jones to mentor/pair with all the young LHD they are transitioning into the NHL.

you might retain more on Jones to get a bigger return IE at $0 retention he gets a 2nd at 50% he gets a 1st and 2nd. the issue is when would the hawks gave real cap issues and the reality its pretty far down the road. Bedard is the only large raise I can see in the next 4 years. there is really nobody else.

 

[u2wojo]

you might retain more on Jones to get a bigger return IE at $0 retention he gets a 2nd at 50% he gets a 1st and 2nd. the issue is when would the hawks gave real cap issues and the reality its pretty far down the road. Bedard is the only large raise I can see in the next 4 years. there is really nobody else.

Yes retention may get a better return (although the value of that retention to the acquire teams is MUCH less valueable in subsequent years then it has been prior to the coming rapid increase in the cap). Trouba full boat 8 million for another year brought back an actual NHL Dman and a 4th....pretty confident Jones is worth more than a (late at that) 2nd.

 

[BigTomBomber]

Yes retention may get a better return (although the value of that retention to the acquire teams is MUCH less valueable in subsequent years then it has been prior to the coming rapid increase in the cap). Trouba full boat 8 million for another year brought back an actual NHL Dman and a 4th....pretty confident Jones is worth more than a (late at that) 2nd

trouba @ $8m for a single year is much more manageable than if he had 5 years remaining. The term on Jones is a negative (although a bit less with the rapid cap increase projected)

 

[ploppsdman]

Dallas' top prospects are D, so I don't see the stars as a good fit.

I wonder if Marvik Bourque could be on the table with Chicago adding Donato.

 

[Freaky Styley]

I feel like Bourque would have to be involved. Who knows where MacFarland's head is at but I'd assume Mittlestadt or Ritchie would be involved from the Avs side, along with a high pick, so that would be what the Stars are competing with.

From an Avs POV it would suck to lose out on Jones AND improve a division rival. I'd prioritize getting him

 

[Chet Manley]

I've been a fan of enough rebuilding teams to come to the conclusion that if you trade away your best defensemen and/goalies that every mistake your freshly drafted forwards make end up in the back of the net. It's the type of environment that turns a quick tank for talent into a sad sack collection of prospects that could have been better. Just IMO don't trade your best d man unless they force the move.

 

[bov]

People act like Jones is some cap dump, him and Heiskanen would probably be the best D pair in the league or close to it. That would make Dallas the favorite to come out of the west imo.

 

[McJedi]

I can't see the Hawks retaining to move Jones (certainly not 2 or 3 million per), there simply is no reason to. At the TDL, a team needs slightly more than 2 million in capspace to fit him under the cap the balance of this season. The cap is going up 10 million per each of the next 3 Summers to make his full contract work long term for virtually anyone. Take back a bad contract like Dumba here or Manson in Colorado that runs another year and you give plenty of time for bad money to come off the books and the increases in the cap to easily absorb Jones. While Jones is not a top 10 RHD in the league as his salary suggests, it is hard to argue he is not in the next 10 in the 11-20 range. RHD that eat 25 minutes a game and are good for 40-50 points a season (his career average is 42pts/82 games despite the last 4 years on....to put it kindly....offensively challanged putrid Hawks teams) are a highly desired asset in the NHL. When you are talking retaining 2 million (plus taking a shit contract like Dumba for another year), it is not happening for a late first or even a pair of late first. 30 year old 7.5 million per for 5 years 25 minute a game 40pt RHD are getting nice pieces not scraps. And no Jones does not hold all or even many of the cards with his NMC because his alternative is staying in Chicago and being on shit teams for at the least 2-3 more years.

Dumba, Emil Hemming and the '26 1st for Jones and Donato is about all I can wrap my head around. Otherwise talk to Colorado or even Edmonton (where their GM once paid a fortune in assets to get Jones so he could give him the contract that only now with a massive spike in cap is creeping toward fair). there also is really no harm in the Hawks keeping Jones to mentor/pair with all the young LHD they are transitioning into the NHL.

Dallas would have to take Seth Jones at nearly his full AAV for that meager offer.

Otherwise, they have no compensation valid reason to retain for so many years. The retention is the most valuable part of what Chicago is trading away.

 

[u2wojo]

Dallas would have to take Seth Jones at nearly his full AAV for that meager offer.

Otherwise, they have no compensation valid reason to retain for so many years. The retention is the most valuable part of what Chicago is trading away.

Retention is about to be not as valuable as what it has been the past decade. With 10ish million jumps expected in the cap EACH of the next 3 Summers, every team (even those in cap hell) are about to get a get out of jail card and on the flip side, you have a bunch of franchises that will quickly have real issues getting (or wanting to in real payroll dollars) to the cap floor meaning a bigger market for short term bad contracts (especially those front loaded where real salary is less than caphit) and LTIR deals. In the near term paying significant assets to get retention or dump contracts to get cap space will likely be way less of a thing.

Which gets back to a RHD that eats 25 minutes a game and is 40-50 points per year offensive contributor is a desireable asset to many teams. His salary will go from representing 11% of the cap to 10% to 9%, to 8% over the next 3 years. The Hawks have no reason that they have to move Jones at this TDL and I believe/hope would need to see a compelling reason to pull the trigger (as in they are not taking mediocre pieces just to make a trade). The Hawks have last years #2 Levshunov and Rinzel (they likely try signing him when his college season ends) as RHD prospects, but Jones doesn't really block either at this point as both should marinate in the AHL more next season or for sure should not be playing #1RHD in the NHL for 25 minutes a game and #1PP. Murphy contract ends the following year opening a RHD spot for one of the top prospects to move to the NHL or push for a bigger role. The Hawks may do way better trying to move Jones this Summer once teams have the 10 million cap in hand and the RHD musical chairs of UFA's have moved.

 

[JeffP]

I’d take Jones on the Stars real fast, but without retention it will make things pretty hairy in the offseason. Our GM is awesome, intelligent, and sneaky, but hes also pretty conservative and very loyal.

Obviously, I’ll believe it when I see it.

 

[u2wojo]

I’d take Jones on the Stars real fast, but without retention it will make things pretty hairy in the offseason. Our GM is awesome, intelligent, and sneaky, but hes also pretty conservative and very loyal.

Obviously, I’ll believe it when I see it.

If Dumba goes the other way, we are talking about adding Jones at a net cost of 5.75 for next season . The following season, the cap will be 20ish million more than current....estimated to be 104 million.