Rumor: Something brewing between CAR and CBJ?

[Dan Kelly]

Laine for Kotekenemi and Necas

No but something around Laine for Kotkaneimi would likely be the heart of the trade? I had been hearing about the Canes wanting to dump Kot if they have a chance to?

 

[Dan Kelly]

Well Laine has been underachieving for a few years, is fresh out of player assistance, and has a very ugly contract. So he does have little value.

Laine hasn't played a full season in years, but he was actually still pretty productive 2 and 3 years ago, so yes he'd still have a fair amount of value for a team looking for a scorer. He just has to move on from the dog's breakfast that was last year and get back to the form he showed the previous years! And for the love of gawd play a full season !!

 

[VT]

It's fruitless to try...I've given up as each thread degrades to the same discussion. The only thread I haven't seen "Laine is negative value" discussion (and it's early) is the Preds-CBJ thread. Give it time... Give it time...

Don't even look. After reading it you will realize that the works of school students with brain problems are philosophical treatises in comparison with some of those proposals.

 

[VT]

Werenski played 70 games last year and 13 the year before. Laine played 18 last year and 55 the year before. How many of the games either have played in have even overlapped? The maximum possible is 31 and I’m guessing it’s closer to maybe 20 over the course of 2 years? Not sure that’s the actual problem…

Laine's d-men in 5v5 in 2022/23 season:

Peeke, Gudbranson and Gavrikov are defensive d-men with not too good first pass, especially Peeke. Bayreuther and Berni are AHL players, Berni is defensive d-man. Only Boqvist and Blankenburg are offensive d-men. Also Jenner and especially winger Roslovic were his centers. And now compare Rantanen, Marner, Reinhart (btw, Patrik had more goals in 5v5 than Sam), Tkachuk's brothers etc with him.

2021/22

Better but worse than TOP players in other teams. Btw, Jenner was a center.

 

[LazyCircuits]

Is he related to Jesperi? Brother, cousin?

That’s what happens when you are so focused on spelling a surname you drop the ball on his first name.

 

[Crede777]

CBJ fans - is there any incentive whatsoever for you guys to add KK under ANY circumstance? I’m struggling to find reason in this. I can’t find any. I guess if they did add a Necas, which I also don’t see happening.

Feels like most Laine topics where one team is like “let me give you my trash for your productive player that I will frame as worthless”

The incentive would be to make the cap work for Carolina and not take up a retention slot for Columbus. Plus they get a warm body instead of dead cap. But I agree it's an either/or proposition regarding taking back Kotkaniemi versus retaining on Laine.

 

[ManWithNoName]

Well Laine has been underachieving for a few years, is fresh out of player assistance, and has a very ugly contract. So he does have little value. Certainly not in the same ballpark as Necas or Jarvis who are still getting better every year and don't have that bad contract or players assistance baggage hanging over them.
You are not going to get on ice value for Laine without a very good season under his belt.

How has he been underachieving for a few years? Last season aside he was a PPG player for the two previous seasons.

I agree that he’s value has decreased but that he’s been underachieving for a few years is just false.

 

[HabsQC]

No way the Jackets take 6 x 4.82 for a guy who does nothing. Any GM would just keep Laine and trade him when he has more value like at the deadline

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

No way the Jackets take 6 x 4.82 for a guy who does nothing. Any GM would just keep Laine and trade him when he has more value like at the deadline

Kk does more than “nothing” and holding Laine any longer holds as much risk as it does reward.

 

[HabsQC]

Kk does more than “nothing” and holding Laine any longer holds as much risk as it does reward.

His last playoff performance was quite close to nothing. Actually I think nothing would have been better.


As for Laine, worst case scenario he's gone in 2 years , as for KK you're stuck with him for 6 years.

 

[ProfessorFink22]

Kk does more than “nothing” and holding Laine any longer holds as much risk as it does reward.

Not 6 years worth of risk.

Laine's value is like, what, 2/10 right now? There's honestly very little room for his value to get worse, it's probably a better risk to try and let him regain a 5/10 value or something with even a mediocre season.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Not 6 years worth of risk.

Laine's value is like, what, 2/10 right now? There's honestly very little room for his value to get worse, it's probably a better risk to try and let him regain a 5/10 value or something with even a mediocre season.

There is a ton more risk in a 2 year 8.7 deal than a 6 year 4.8 deal that can be bought out for near nothing for another 2 offseasons.

 

[Boxscore]

There is zero chance Columbus is trading Laine for Kotkaniemi. Less than zero, in fact.

 

[Chan790]

Is he related to Jesperi? Brother, cousin?

Kasperi Kotkaniemi is actually a goalie in Finland and the older brother of Jesperi.

Kasperi Kotkaniemi - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[CannonFire1]

The incentive would be to make the cap work for Carolina and not take up a retention slot for Columbus. Plus they get a warm body instead of dead cap. But I agree it's an either/or proposition regarding taking back Kotkaniemi versus retaining on Laine.

The other negative to trading for Kotkaniemi is clogging a roster spot / taking ice time away from the players Columbus is trying to develop. I would rather just keep Laine.

 

[Dumais]

I would ask Laine to start the season with CBJ (New GM, New Coach) until they get a better offer. If he refuses, I would LOAN him to any European team and leave him there, before trading him for any package that includes KK.

The Canes cap space ain't CBJ's problem, so easy pass on anything the Canes could offer that has to include KK. We got a couple players we could offer up, do the Canes need a goalie? =) hey at least I'm not being disrespectful by offering Elvis for one of your top 6 players.... =D

 

[majormajor]

There is a ton more risk in a 2 year 8.7 deal than a 6 year 4.8 deal that can be bought out for near nothing for another 2 offseasons.

That's certainly not true for the Jackets and it's not true for Carolina either.

For the Jackets they're not loading up to win cups now so having a two year deal is less risky than Kotkaniemi - who gives you a $5m charge now that can be bought out next summer and turned into a ten year $1m annual cap penalty. Ten years starting next summer.

For the Canes Laine gives you much bigger upside, and if it doesn't work you can always find someone to take the last year of a contract. It's low risk. He's much more likely to give you something than Kotkaniemi, and you don't have to worry about the ten year buyout.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Laine is not a low risk acquisition for Carolina. There’s a meaningful opportunity cost attached to him: the insufficient cap space to go long-term with Jarvis and the future benefits of doing that.

 

[domi28]

That's certainly not true for the Jackets and it's not true for Carolina either.

For the Jackets they're not loading up to win cups now so having a two year deal is less risky than Kotkaniemi - who gives you a $5m charge now that can be bought out next summer and turned into a ten year $1m annual cap penalty. Ten years starting next summer.

For the Canes Laine gives you much bigger upside, and if it doesn't work you can always find someone to take the last year of a contract. It's low risk. He's much more likely to give you something than Kotkaniemi, and you don't have to worry about the ten year buyout.

There's no such thing as low risk for an injury prone guy with an $8.7m cap hit no matter how freaky the injuries are. With Jarvis still to be signed I don't see a deal happening between Columbus and Carolina unless Waddell or Tulsky has a complete brain fart.

 

[Whileee]

If you sat down and made a list of all the skills/responsibilities that distinguish a C from a W, you would have an exact list of the weak spots in Necas’ game.

Brind’Amour, who is ALL about the wingers who backcheck and step in for faceoffs and share the puck with their linemates, has made it clear through his lineup choices that he trusts Necas to play C about as much as he trusts him to play goalie.

Which is to say, the Canes are going to be dreadfully thin at C no matter what. It’ll be Aho and three guys who can’t skate. So it actually kind of makes sense that they would at least try to become more cap-efficient at that position, and take a risk on a winger who has some C experience and perhaps some unrealized potential left in his game. It would be a very Canes approach to the problem.

As for Kotkaniemi, it seems far fetched that they could get out from under that contract via trade, but that exact scenario seems to play out every year. There don’t seem to be actual untradeable contracts in this league. It would make sense for them to at least explore the idea with a GM who clearly believes in Kotkaniemi and is still on good terms with everyone in Carolina. Of course it might not get anywhere, but the existence of a conversation would make sense.

Canes often use Staal a lot as their de facto 2C.

Panthers use Bennett as their 2C.

Jets use Lowry as their 2C.

Those are all physical and strong defensive C's that can be supplemented with talented wingers.

The 3 teams had 111, 110 and 110 points last season and were 4th, 2nd and 1st in goals against last season so it's a strategy that can work.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Canes often use Staal a lot as their de facto 2C.

That’s part of the problem for them right now. Staal is still hanging in there as a 3C but he’s probably not more than 2 years from retirement. 2C is beyond his abilities at this point.

 

[Whileee]

I know 3-way trades are pie-in-the sky, but I wonder if McGroarty might add to the mix for a Car-CBJ trade scenario. Also, it's a Sunday afternoon in the NHL dead zone....

McGroarty likely has appeal for the Blue Jackets as a big LW prospect who played at Michigan with two top CBJ prospects (Fantilli and Brindley).

Cap space is a big consideration if Laine is involved.

To CAR: Laine at 5M
To CBJ: McGroarty, Kotkaniemi, Iafallo at 2M
To WPG: Nadeau (or Blake) + 2025 1st (CAR) + 3rd (CAR)

Salary retention:
CBJ 2 x 2M (Laine),
WPG 2 x 1.7M (Laine) and 1 x 2M (Iafallo)

Cap changes (2024-25):
CBJ +120K
CAR +180K
WPG +3.7M

 

[majormajor]

There's no such thing as low risk for an injury prone guy with an $8.7m cap hit no matter how freaky the injuries are. With Jarvis still to be signed I don't see a deal happening between Columbus and Carolina unless Waddell or Tulsky has a complete brain fart.

I didn't say Laine was low risk but you're comparing his risk to the higher probability that you're just wasting cap space on Kotkaniemi.

 

[Bruce Granville]

Kasperi Kotkaniemi is actually a goalie in Finland and the older brother of Jesperi.

Kasperi Kotkaniemi - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

So, not a bad guess, eh?
With Andersen aging he might be worth a thought…

 

[NotOpie]

I know 3-way trades are pie-in-the sky, but I wonder if McGroarty might add to the mix for a Car-CBJ trade scenario. Also, it's a Sunday afternoon in the NHL dead zone....

McGroarty likely has appeal for the Blue Jackets as a big LW prospect who played at Michigan with two top CBJ prospects (Fantilli and Brindley).

Cap space is a big consideration if Laine is involved.

To CAR: Laine at 5M
To CBJ: McGroarty, Kotkaniemi, Iafallo at 2M
To WPG: Nadeau (or Blake) + 2025 1st (CAR) + 3rd (CAR)

Salary retention:
CBJ 2 x 2M (Laine),
WPG 2 x 1.7M (Laine) and 1 x 2M (Iafallo)

Cap changes (2024-25):
CBJ +120K
CAR +180K
WPG +3.7M

Hit that crack pipe again dude. Carolina won't give up 2 top prospects, a 1st, and a 3rd for what is really a lottery ticket in Laine. Injury, mental health issues, etc., etc., etc.

I'm not even sure that Laine can function in Rod's system; he certainly hasn't proven the defensive chops required to play "the right way" (according to Rod Brind'Amour).