Value of: Simon Nemec to SJ

[Xirik]

What about Cowan, 2 2nds and one of Robertson/Maccelli?

Or

Knies, Avs first, one of Maccelli/Robertson for Nemec, Silayev and the 12th overall

Or

McKenna for Nemec, Silayev, the 12th overall?

2. hurts but I think the devils would do it, Think Leafs fans would say that they should pay less.

3. would cause Leafs fans to crucify their new GM even if on paper it's not totally terrible for the leafs.

 

[dgibb10]

2. hurts but I think the devils would do it, Think Leafs fans would say that they should pay less.

3. would cause Leafs fans to crucify their new GM even if on paper it's not totally terrible for the leafs.

I do not think NJD would do that 2nd trade

12th overall, Silayev, and Nemec are 3 premium assets.

I'd do MAYBE 2 of them for Knies and have to think long and hard about it.


But even if I'd do that the 3rd premium asset for pick 30 and Maccelli/Robertson

 

[NVious]

2. hurts but I think the devils would do it, Think Leafs fans would say that they should pay less.

3. would cause Leafs fans to crucify their new GM even if on paper it's not totally terrible for the leafs.

Give to get for both of us, we both have different strengths:

It looks like you guys are going to get Hughes in 1-3 years, at that point you guys are stacked defensively but need more offense, specifically wings, doesn't get much better than a prime Knies
We are stacked on the wings and horrendous on D, both those guys (+ the 12) have amazing upside and give us a chance to build a very well rounded team

////

Probably, we'd rather run and gun, beat up on the bottom 15, get rekt in the playoffs in the first round but sell a ton of jerseys than build an excellent all around team or even dare to.

I do not think NJD would do that 2nd trade

12th overall, Silayev, and Nemec are 3 premium assets.

I'd do MAYBE 2 of them for Knies and have to think long and hard about it.


But even if I'd do that the 3rd premium asset for pick 30 and Maccelli/Robertson

It's very risky for both of us and honestly it would never get done because of the risk for both of us to look bad and how much both fan bases would hate it, but it plays into our two strengths: ours at the wings and yours at D with the other Hughes coming back soon and it addresses our weaknesses, ours on D and yours on

 

[dgibb10]

Give to get for both of us, we both have different strengths:

It looks like you guys are going to get Hughes in 1-3 years, at that point you guys are stacked defensively but need more offense, specifically wings, doesn't get much better than a prime Knies
We are stacked on the wings and horrendous on D, both those guys (+ the 12) have amazing upside and give us a chance to build a very well rounded team

////

Probably, we'd rather run and gun, beat up on the bottom 15, get rekt in the playoffs in the first round but sell a ton of jerseys than build an excellent all around team or even dare to.


It's very risky for both of us and honestly it would never get done because of the risk for both of us to look bad and how much both fan bases would hate it, but it plays into our two strengths: ours at the wings and yours at D with the other Hughes coming back soon and it addresses our weaknesses, ours on D and yours on

It's just simply too many centerpiece type pieces from NJD, with the fluff coming back from Tor to try and justify it

Pick 1 of the 3 major pieces and build around that with secondary pieces. That's what trades look like in real life.

on very rare occasions, like the Quinn hughes trade you would see 2 pieces like that (rossi+buium to equate to 2 of the 3 of Nemec/12th overall/Silayev)

MAYBE, MAYBE a pair of them could be justified.

But even then I don't have a ton of interest in Nemec+12th overall for Knies when a trade could likely be made with 12th overall+smaller sweeteners for Kyrou.


for example if its 12th overall+Casey for Kyrou, and then something like Bystedt or some similar forward prospect for Hamilton

I'd much much rather have Nemec+Kyrou+Silayev+Bystedt than Hamilton+Knies+late 1st+Casey

 

[NVious]

It's just simply too many centerpiece type pieces from NJD, with the fluff coming back from Tor to try and justify it

Pick 1 of the 3 major pieces and build around that with secondary pieces. That's what trades look like in real life.

on very rare occasions, like the Quinn hughes trade you would see 2 pieces like that (rossi+buium to equate to 2 of the 3 of Nemec/12th overall/Silayev)

MAYBE, MAYBE a pair of them could be justified.

But even then I don't have a ton of interest in Nemec+12th overall for Knies when a trade could likely be made with 12th overall+smaller sweeteners for Kyrou.


for example if its 12th overall+Casey for Kyrou, and then something like Bystedt or some similar forward prospect for Hamilton

I'd much much rather have Nemec+Kyrou+Silayev+Bystedt than Hamilton+Knies+late 1st+Casey

The problem is we don't know what Nemec is and what he's going to be and whether he can reach that in New Jersey, so it makes pricing him impossible, NJ will want more than what other fans want to give. On the flip side, there is more of a guarantee in Knies or if you wanted McKenna, the most upside of any player in the trade which is why I think most Leafs fans would say no.

I guess that's what makes it interesting, it addresses team needs for both teams at a steep price, New Jersey has the higher floor in the Knies trade, but Leafs long term get the higher ceiling which can work in both teams favor as I said due to New Jersey's need for offense/wingers and the Leafs fossilized d core needing and wanting talented youth to play.

Also Quinn is a massive factor here, but I am assuming within 1-3 years he'll be there as well which makes D more expendable, specifically puck movers (Nemec) or LHD (Silayev) who may both be hamstrung by the log jam as we saw with Nemec last year.

 

[dgibb10]

The problem is we don't know what Nemec is and what he's going to be and whether he can reach that in New Jersey, so it makes pricing him impossible, NJ will want more than what other fans want to give. On the flip side, there is more of a guarantee in Knies or if you wanted McKenna, the most upside of any player in the trade which is why I think most Leafs fans would say no.

I guess that's what makes it interesting, it addresses team needs for both teams at a steep price, New Jersey has the higher floor in the Knies trade, but Leafs long term get the higher ceiling which can work in both teams favor as I said due to New Jersey's need for offense/wingers and the Leafs fossilized d core needing and wanting talented youth to play.

Also Quinn is a massive factor here, but I am assuming within 1-3 years he'll be there as well which makes D more expendable, specifically puck movers (Nemec) or LHD (Silayev) who may both be hamstrung by the log jam as we saw with Nemec last year.

If you are concerned about Nemec as an asset then we can switch to a different centerpiece, and build around either 12th overall or Silayev.

It doesn't mean NJD adds 2 more trade centerpieces.

In terms of Quinn, he doesn't really make SIlayev or Nemec expendable at all. Nemec would actually pair pretty perfectly with Quinn, and then Silayev would be the exact type of D you'd want to back Quinn up.


Quinn-Nemec
Luke-Pesce
Silayev-Kovacevic

Is probably the exact perfect ideal dcore I'd want.

If NJD moves Nemec out and Quinn comes in it's actually a big issue. Casey and Hamilton have a lot of their value wasted if Luke and Quinn run both PP units, so then NJD likely has to ship them out. And if you ship out nemec, now you need to go find a top pairing partner for Quinn

PPQBs like Casey and Hamilton become expendable, not Silayev and Nemec

 

[My3Sons]

If you are concerned about Nemec as an asset then we can switch to a different centerpiece, and build around either 12th overall or Silayev.

It doesn't mean NJD adds 2 more trade centerpieces.

In terms of Quinn, he doesn't really make SIlayev or Nemec expendable at all. Nemec would actually pair pretty perfectly with Quinn, and then Silayev would be the exact type of D you'd want to back Quinn up.


Quinn-Nemec
Luke-Pesce
Silayev-Kovacevic

Is probably the exact perfect ideal dcore I'd want.

If NJD moves Nemec out and Quinn comes in it's actually a big issue. Casey and Hamilton have a lot of their value wasted if Luke and Quinn run both PP units, so then NJD likely has to ship them out. And if you ship out nemec, now you need to go find a top pairing partner for Quinn

PPQBs like Casey and Hamilton become expendable, not Silayev and Nemec

Easy there cowboy. The thread is supposed to focus on Nemec to SJ. Your points are salient but a separate discussion.

 

[dgibb10]

Easy there cowboy. The thread is supposed to focus on Nemec to SJ. Your points are salient but a separate discussion.

He brought up Quinn as making Nemec and Silayev expendable as a reason why NJD should include them both in a trade away

I simply corrected that line of thinking.

 

[My3Sons]

He brought up Quinn as making Nemec and Silayev expendable as a reason why NJD should include them both in a trade away

I simply corrected that line of thinking.

Fair enough. I guess my thinking is it's one thing or the other. If Quinn goes to NJ I think Nemec is included. If not, then Nemec can be traded elsewhere like SJ. I'm skeptical there is a universe where Quinn and Nemec end up on NJ together next season.

 

[TheBeard]

I

Fair enough. I guess my thinking is it's one thing or the other. If Quinn goes to NJ I think Nemec is included. If not, then Nemec can be traded elsewhere like SJ. I'm skeptical there is a universe where Quinn and Nemec end up on NJ together next season.

t would be financially irresponsible considering Luke ks already making a lot unless Nemec magically comes off his egregious contract demands.

 

[dgibb10]

Fair enough. I guess my thinking is it's one thing or the other. If Quinn goes to NJ I think Nemec is included. If not, then Nemec can be traded elsewhere like SJ. I'm skeptical there is a universe where Quinn and Nemec end up on NJ together next season.

I don't want to go too deep into this in this thread, but for a variety of reasons I think a trade this offseason would be centered around 12th overall, Hamilton (retention involved), Siegenthaler. Immediate win now veterans to help a guerin team that's going to want to continue to try and compete through Kaps prime.

The reason I think Hamilton is simply the PP. Minnesota has spent the last half decade trying to find a QB. Eventually they drafted Buium, then that didn't work so shipped him out for Quinn.

Nemec as a PPQB is not a sure thing. Hamilton is.

It also makes a lot more sense from NJDs perspective to build their trade around something like that so we can end up with that ideal long term dcore like I mentioned in this thread to the other guy.

 

[My3Sons]

I

t would be financially irresponsible considering Luke ks already making a lot unless Nemec magically comes off his egregious contract demands.

At this point we don't know what the demands are for Nemec. He changed agents and NJ changed GMs and apparently for now the two sides are playing nice. We will see.

 

[Vegaspunk]

I'm sure the team will be trying to convince Celebrini to sign an 8 year contract. It's in both their best interests to do so. Just because the Sharks have holes in their lineup before entering year three of it being Celebrini's team doesn't mean they have an AHL group back there. The offseason hasn't even started yet. If Celebrini wants to go the Matthews route, that's his call. He's the franchise and he basically will write his own contract but as Matthews has been finding out, that setup doesn't help you or the team win. The idea that the Sharks aren't about winning because they've yet to fill some holes on their roster before the offseason has even started before year three is just you being upset that I said that they'd be interested in a cheap deal for one of your players.

Feels like Celebrini is already ingrained more with the Sharks organization/fanbase than Matthews ever was with the Leafs so I could see him going for the max

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Feels like Celebrini is already ingrained more with the Sharks organization/fanbase than Matthews ever was with the Leafs so I could see him going for the max

Maybe. I’d do max term and max salary if that’s what it took to get it done but I think he knows he has to give a little so that the team can stay competitive during its peak whenever that might be for a little longer than otherwise. However, he isn’t under any obligation to do so and they’ll try to make it work regardless.

 

[RyGuy]

I would not be surprised if Nemo turns into a solid, 2-way 2nd line D consistently hitting 45 points. His D should round off and he's already very solid producing EV points with little PP time. Im ok with him turning into that in NJ, but given the uncertainty of the future of the D on this team, I think he will be gone by the start of the season.

 

[PizzaAndPucks]

I would not be surprised if Nemo turns into a solid, 2-way 2nd line D consistently hitting 45 points. His D should round off and he's already very solid producing EV points with little PP time. Im ok with him turning into that in NJ, but given the uncertainty of the future of the D on this team, I think he will be gone by the start of the season.

If the defense is "uncertain" than it makes no sense to trade Nemec if the Devils sign him to a reasonable deal.

The only way he is worth moving is management wants to add a top 6 forward with term to help the tram compete now while holding on to Hamilton. Also giving them the flexibility to draft a player with our 12th overall pick to either take a defensman to replace Nemec in a few years or draft a forward for the future.

 

[Veaktore Vitto]

Sharks have so many young assets that they can do alot of things

 

[67 others]

At this point we don't know what the demands are for Nemec. He changed agents and NJ changed GMs and apparently for now the two sides are playing nice. We will see.

He changed agents's to the Agent who represents Fitzgerald's son strangely. Then Fitz got fired

 

[My3Sons]

He changed GM's to the GM who represents Fitzgerald's son strangely. Then Fitz got fired

You mean agents?

 

[67 others]

You mean agents?

Yes my bad. Early morning hangover lol