Sidney Crosby becomes the 10th player in NHL history to reach 1600 points

[Plastic Joseph]

Does he really need the awards though when it’s clear just how dominant and amazing of a player he was and still is?

If award counting is all we’re doing here it diminishes his true impact.

that's why I said the resume was *somewhat* underwhelming considering the expectations, but the level of play absolutely lived up to the hype.

I don't think we can truly say he exceeded his draft day expectations with 2 hart trophies, but he certainly didn't fail to live up either. He is somewhere in the middle.

Now were the expectations fair or realistic? That is another conversation. But given just how sky high they were, he would need like 5 mvps for me to truly say he exceeded the expectations placed on him. Fair or not.

 

[authentic]

130 in 2011-2013 scoring level is not a safe bet, Malkin 109 was an incredible season, there was only 2 100 points season (him and Sedin) those whole 3 years. We are talking ~68-70% more points than the 10 best players, that better than 1991 Gretzky type of separation, that Hart winning Gretzky in 1989 type of performance.

and there is only 2 full season to reach it, one was 48 games.

One way to look how hard 130 pts was, after the first 82 games he played after the start of the 2011 season (so 2010-2011+2012+frist 19 games of 2013), he only had 131 pts, look at his shooting percentage and on-ice shooting percentage, that really with the puck rolling for him. That a 82 games, perfect not missing a single game constructed season.

It also show that it would have been possible, but we remember also how well when he played it was going, more a perfect case max scenario than a safe bet for that to happen.

No I don’t think he would’ve reached 130 either, which is why I said between 120-30, 130 being the absolute best case scenario unless he had another level we was never able to attain. Malkin missing 7 games that year could’ve topped 120 in a full season for instance.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Does he really need the awards though when it’s clear just how dominant and amazing of a player he was and still is?

If award counting is all we’re doing here it diminishes his true impact.

Individual awards are results. People love pointing towards results because it's insanely easy. You don't have to provide any analysis or pay attention to the process (which is the only thing that actually matters) when the results are right there. This obviously isn't exclusive to hockey, it applies to sports across the board, from players to coaches.

Still makes me wonder what he would’ve done in full seasons back then. I think somewhere between 120-30 is a safe bet he would’ve hit in a few of those seasons, but we will never really know. He may have even had another level he was never able to tap into after all the concussions.

Bum wrist from around 2014 to 2020 as well.

 

[Toby91ca]

I want to participate too. If Gretzky would have played all possible games with his 215 points in 80 games pace until he is as old as Gordie Howe when he retired, he would have approximately 7500 points.

To be fair, no one has tried taking Crosby's best pace and applying it to a full/lengthy career....people just filling in missing games each year at the pce that year....which has already been noted as a waste of time though.

Also, Gretzky's 215 pt year is not the year you should use in your scenario

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Truly the greatest player of the century. Let’s hope for another 400 ! (398 now)

 

[authentic]

Individual awards are results. People love pointing towards results because it's insanely easy. You don't have to provide any analysis or pay attention to the process (which is the only thing that actually matters) when the results are right there. This obviously isn't exclusive to hockey, it applies to sports across the board, from players to coaches.


Bum wrist from around 2014 to 2020 as well.

That’s exactly why he only had those 80 point seasons after 2013-14. I knew something was off with his stickhandling and shooting after that season. I feel like he got even better at deflections though as a result.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I want to participate too. If Gretzky would have played all possible games with his 215 points in 80 games pace until he is as old as Gordie Howe when he retired, he would have approximately 7500 points.

Do they not have hyperbole in Finland or something?

 

[TheLegend27]

Crosby was the most hyped prospect since Lindros....and he has been the best player since Lindros. So I would say he met expectations.

I think the general consensus will have Crosby in the top 5 players of all time when he hangs them up.

The best Career since Lindros for sure. 97 is the best player since Lemieux in terms of ability.

 

[Empoleon8771]

We should not exaggerate it either, he played some shift with Lemieux:

Jagr won the Pearson and played 768 games in Crosby NHL, the league was not that different to be alien and impossible to compare too most previous generational talents, going back to Eddy Shore and Morenz it gets complicated sure, but say modern post ww2 original six to now.

Yeah this is why I roll my eyes when people get pedantic about the "best of his generation" claims by bringing up McDavid. I don't consider McDavid and Crosby to be the same "generation", just like I don't consider Gretzky and Lemieux to be the same "generation".

I think it makes more sense to compare peak to peak, so the guys in Crosby's generation were guys like Ovi, Malkin and Kane. McDavid is in his own generation with guys like Matthews, MacKinnon and Draisaitl. I also think Kucherov falls more in that McDavid generation than the Crosby generation.

 

[MadLuke]

Yeah this is why I roll my eyes when people get pedantic about the "best of his generation" claims by bringing up McDavid. I don't consider McDavid and Crosby to be the same "generation", just like I don't consider Gretzky and Lemieux to be the same "generation".

I too have an hockey player generation to be significantly different that general society talk for generation, hockey player good prime tend to be what 7-10 years for those with a long one (player born just 8 years a part can fall in different gen sometime). And when they did hit their prime can change in what generation we put them, Hasek is a bit older than Roy, he was not part of the late 80s-early 90s nhl goaltenders generation.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I’ve never been swayed by the old stand by argument, where Crosby is forever locked in an untouchable era, where he was claimed to be better than everyone who came before because it was “the modern day”, and where no one who comes after can ever be considered greater.

The guy seems like he’s going to end up playing 1500 games. That’s more than Orr and Lemieux post first retirement played combined. When does the poor Crosby act end?

He missed about 3 seasons in his early mid twenties. It’s an understandable and reasonable concession to make. Dont pretend like this is anything other than you being stubborn

 

[Neil Racki]

Congrats to the Kid!

 

[Video Nasty]

He missed about 3 seasons in his early mid twenties. It’s an understandable and reasonable concession to make. Dont pretend like this is anything other than you being stubborn

Stubborn? I rolled with it by giving him the most generous outcome possible for each season having him play all the games during seasons he missed a significant amount of games through age 25, while going with his pace, which I hate doing. He’d be at 1824, which is a far cry from 1990-2000, or even 1900+.

Go back to where this all started and you’ll see I did what I normally do. I pushed back on someone saying something insane about Crosby, like he would be at or 10 points shy of 2000 points right now, if he didn’t miss a bunch of games during his “peak.”

For whatever reason, combating embellishment is being a hater.

For whatever reason, not twisting myself into a pretzel by pretending that Crosby played an entire career without missing a game and not having lockouts, to reach 2000 points as of 2024, even though it’s pointless because you could do the same for a bunch of others is being a hater.

For whatever reason, creating a thread myself two years ago speculating if Crosby could still reach 2000 points if he hangs around is being a hater.

Or just plain stubborn.

 

[Frosty415]

I can see him hitting 1800+ if he stays healthy and has a few big years

He's still a fantastic player

 

[the valiant effort]

Sid is the prototype.

 

[Beesfan]

The best Career since Lindros for sure. 97 is the best player since Lemieux in terms of ability.

Until 97 gets a ring, I cannot quite say that if I was a coach I take prime McDavid over prime Crosby in a 7 game series. Reasonable minds can differ.

McDavid is more talented, I agree.

 

[KevinRedkey]

I remember saying he'd finish his career somewhere between Sakic (1641) and Yzermam (1755), when he was drafted.

Looks like he'll surpass Sakic this year, and Yzermam the following year.

The guy is a gem.

 

[BenningHurtsMySoul]

I remember my Dad telling me in Sid's rookie year "you're gonna blink and he'll be retiring, same as me with Gretzky"

Welp

 

[authentic]

I remember my Dad telling me in Sid's rookie year "you're gonna blink and he'll be retiring, same as me with Gretzky"

Welp

I’m born the same month and year as Crosby and it’s flat out mystifying how quick our 30s have gone by.

 

[Shrimper]

123 until he ties Lemieux.

He has an outside chance of 2000 as well