Post-Game Talk: Sid is a Venomous Beast that You Can't Kill with a Broom

[mpp9]

Except that line was shut down against Boston. A team that plays a playoff style of hockey. They swarmed Sid and dared Kunitz and Duper to make plays.

 

[ColePens]

Stop, hold. 'We' are still doing this.

And with what we've seen in the last couple of games as regards breakouts and forechecking, you see indications of just how prudent the critcism has been.

Now if only 'we' could be heard about the PK and Tanner Glass, joy of joys .

Yeah I don't get too high or too low w/ wins and losses. I focus on the overall goal and that is the Cup. That's the only thing I care about every year.

In my opinion, Boston is the front runner in the East. Even though we made an amazing comeback, they still play the best system. The big thing they need to stop doing is going into a 1-4 once they get a lead. The rule will always live in the NHL that is you sit back you are going to find yourself blowing a lot of leads.

Pittsburgh has the most potential. When we play a 2-3... we are a whole different team. But our d-zone coverage was not great by any means last night. We left guys open a lot and luckily pucks didn't go their way. In fact, there were TWO Leafs in front of the net at one time and Fleury got lucky the puck bounced over their stick. Our d-zone and special teams right now is a huge question mark. Boston's question mark is why they sit back once they gain a lead. Both teams are beatable but lead the East at this point.

Then look at teams that could give us trouble - Montreal, Philly (if they find a way), New Jersey, and Toronto (if they hold a spot). We still have a long way to go schematically before I'm crowning anything. And just for fun - PLAY THE 2-3. IT WORKS. F3 high.

And last comment - a guy who thrives sitting in the F3 spot (high in the zone) is actually Sutter. He is great at reading the d pass and picking it off. I love him in that spot.

 

[Malkin4Top6Wingerz]

Except that line was shut down against Boston. A team that plays a playoff style of hockey. They swarmed Sid and dared Kunitz and Duper to make plays.

Boston wasn't doing anything different defensively than every other team, they just had Zdeno Chara and their backup was playing out of his mind. I seriously don't know what game you were watching if you think it was anything other than that.

Even had Boston shut their line down, which they really didn't, one game means absolutely nothing. Do you think with a better offensive player in Dupuis's spot that they aren't going to have pointless games?

 

[mpp9]

Boston wasn't doing anything different defensively than every other team, they just had Zdeno Chara and their backup was playing out of his mind. I seriously don't know what game you were watching if you think it was anything other than that.

Even had Boston shut their line down, which they really didn't, one game means absolutely nothing. Do you think with a better offensive player in Dupuis's spot that they aren't going to have pointless games?

Upgrading Sid's RW limits the chances they get shut down in postseason hockey, yes.

 

[NastyNick]

Normally i'd be worried about a game where the Pens were outplayed like this and still won.

But its Toronto. Can't remember how many times the Pens dominated them and still lost. That team has their number.. and its good to win

6 out of the 7 wins in this streak have been 1 goal games. That is a drastic departure from our winning streaks of recent memory.

 

[radapex]

Hmm... the Pens have as many ROW (18) as any other team in the East has total wins (Montreal - 18) and are tied for most ROW in the league with Chicago. Nice!

 

[Malkin4Top6Wingerz]

Upgrading Sid's RW limits the chances they get shut down in postseason hockey, yes.

That's not what I asked.

Every line no matter how good is going to have scoreless games on occasion, especially against strong defensive teams like the Bruins. IIRC the Sedins got shut down big time in the Finals. Should Vancouver break them up? Of course not. Exept here it's one game, in the regular season, and their line still scored the game tying goal. Excuse me for not getting all dramatic.

 

[IcedCapp]

That's not what I asked.

Every line no matter how good is going to have scoreless games on occasion, especially against strong defensive teams like the Bruins. IIRC the Sedins got shut down big time in the Finals. Should Vancouver break them up? Of course not. Exept here it's one game, in the regular season, and their line still scored the game tying goal. Excuse me for not getting all dramatic.

The Canucks are constantly trying to find the right compliment to the Sedins. No one is suggesting breaking up Kunitz and Crosby, which would be closer to breaking up the Sedins than removing Dupuis.

It's hard to have this argument when the line is working that well, because it's just so hard to ask people to ignore stats. I'm not going to drop my protests, but will just wait for the playoffs to say I told you so (or to be wrong, which I'd prefer).

 

[Killahpunk]

With the win last night Fleury becomes the 50th winningest goalie in NHL history.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Upgrading Sid's RW limits the chances they get shut down in postseason hockey, yes.

Don't waste your time arguing with people. Either they get it or they don't. Too many people turn a blind eye to the differences between the regular season and playoffs. When Crosby has to fight through the shadow coverage of Bergeron and Chara for seven games, the reality will settle in.

Having Rossi say Iggy wouldn't be a top six guy for the Pens and Cook writing Crosby doesn't need a winger, just shows ignorance. Iggy is so well beyond Dupuis in just about every area of the game that I can't believe how stupid people can be.

Crosby will never throw his guys under the bus, but when he is saying "our line isn't very good off the rush, but we do our damage cycling" that says all you need to know.

Crosby is creating for his linemates, but the time will come when he needs a guy that can create space for him and get him the puck at the right times.

 

[IcedCapp]

Jiggy, since you're here, I wanted to ask a question:

just watched the Bozak goal again. Both Orpik and Kunitz are really high/floating away from the net. Is Bozak Kunitz's guy there? Or should Orpik be closer to the net?

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Upgrading Sid's RW limits the chances they get shut down in postseason hockey, yes.

Not to mention that even if it does get shut down I like the chances of Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis scoring much more than Cooke - Sutter - Kennedy.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Jiggy, since you're here, I wanted to ask a question:

just watched the Bozak goal again. Both Orpik and Kunitz are really high/floating away from the net. Is Bozak Kunitz's guy there? Or should Orpik be closer to the net?

Orpik was so ****ing lost on that play it's not even funny

 

[SteelFish87*]

With the win last night Fleury becomes the 50th winningest goalie in NHL history.

wow, would have never guessed that

just checked his stats and surprisingly his GAA is identical for regular and post-season (2.68), also his Save% is really close (.909 and .904)

 

[Malkin4Top6Wingerz]

The Canucks are constantly trying to find the right compliment to the Sedins. No one is suggesting breaking up Kunitz and Crosby, which would be closer to breaking up the Sedins than removing Dupuis.

It's hard to have this argument when the line is working that well, because it's just so hard to ask people to ignore stats. I'm not going to drop my protests, but will just wait for the playoffs to say I told you so (or to be wrong, which I'd prefer).

It's not just about raw stats. Their line has had good zone entry, been dominant on the cycle, and very reliable defensively. The eye test alone tells me this is a fantastic line. The statistics - all of them, simply corroborate that view.

Nobody in their right mind would have suggested breaking up Malkin's line last year, or thought that they'd get shut down by a rookie, but it happened. Does that mean that it wasn't an amazing line, and they can't succeed in the playoffs if given another opportunity? No. But I'm sure there will be a ton of people claiming it was a mistake to keep Dupuis on the top unit if they don't produce up to par in a playoff series, despite the fact that it can happen to any line and does on a regular basis.

I simply don't buy into the theory that teams are just going to focus on Sid and that will somehow shut our offense down. It doesn't work that way. He's not a wide reciever in the NFL that you can double or triple team. If you overcommit defensively to stopping him individually, he'll find the open man with time and space and burn you that way. His game is suited to being extremely difficult to play against, and if teams continue to get shredded the way they are now in the regular season, there's no reason to expect that to change in the playoffs.

 

[Darth Vitale]

Having Rossi say Iggy wouldn't be a top six guy for the Pens

Did he actually write that??

What an absolute incompetent toolbag. I don't know what's worse, the ignorance of it or the trolling element of it. Even a moron like him knows that kind of statement will draw a lot of attention. The Trib is a farce. I can't believe their editorial people defend this guy. Just shows they don't have a clue how to do their own job, let alone evaluate his.

 

[Malkin4Top6Wingerz]

Crosby will never throw his guys under the bus, but when he is saying "our line isn't very good off the rush, but we do our damage cycling" that says all you need to know.

Are you paraphrasing or is that an exact quote? If it's the latter I find that to be a strange comment. They've scored quite a few of their goals off the rush this year.

On that note, I'd rather have a team or a line that generates the majority of their scoring through the cycle rather than on the rush, because it is much harder to effectively counter a good cycle. On the other hand, a team that attacks from transition will have a lot of trouble against a strategy that is predicated on getting the puck deep (to eliminate turnovers) and setting up in the neutral zone.

Crosby is creating for his linemates, but the time will come when he needs a guy that can create space for him and get him the puck at the right times.

We have that guy. Hint: he's second in scoring right now.

 

[IcedCapp]

It's not just about raw stats. Their line has had good zone entry, been dominant on the cycle, and very reliable defensively. The eye test alone tells me this is a fantastic line. The statistics - all of them, simply corroborate that view.

Nobody in their right mind would have suggested breaking up Malkin's line last year, or thought that they'd get shut down by a rookie, but it happened. Does that mean that it wasn't an amazing line, and they can't succeed in the playoffs if given another opportunity? No. But I'm sure there will be a ton of people claiming it was a mistake to keep Dupuis on the top unit if they don't produce up to par in a playoff series, despite the fact that it can happen to any line and does on a regular basis.

I simply don't buy into the theory that teams are just going to focus on Sid and that will somehow shut our offense down. It doesn't work that way. He's not a wide reciever in the NFL that you can double or triple team. If you overcommit defensively to stopping him individually, he'll find the open man with time and space and burn you that way. His game is suited to being extremely difficult to play against, and if teams continue to get shredded the way they are now in the regular season, there's no reason to expect that to change in the playoffs.

Yea, well that's just like, your opinion, man.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Jiggy, since you're here, I wanted to ask a question:

just watched the Bozak goal again. Both Orpik and Kunitz are really high/floating away from the net. Is Bozak Kunitz's guy there? Or should Orpik be closer to the net?

The goal happened in the middle of a line change and you are always taught to back check to the middle of the ice and take the most dangerous guy, when you are first man back like Kunitz. You should let your blueliner worry about the puck carrier in this instance.

Orpik correctly thought Kunitz had Bozak and moved to the puck. Unfortunately Kunitz peeled off Bozak to chase the puck and that left Bozak all alone.

I've ****ed up the same way, because you are switching assignments and things like this happen. You have to stay on Bozak there and go with him to the post. I'm sure DB reminded him when he got back to the bench.

 

[Shrimper]

Hmm... the Pens have as many ROW (18) as any other team in the East has total wins (Montreal - 18) and are tied for most ROW in the league with Chicago. Nice!

We're only 7 points behind Chicago as well. I see no reason why we couldn't potentially catch them. Not that I think we should hold out and go for that. Just get the Atlantic and East sowed up then think about it.

Crosby yesterday didn't have the best game, especially the first two periods but his play in the third was just proof that you can never count him out of the running and he's always got that ability to just produce something in a click. We play the Rangers and Bruins next and we seem to match-up well against the Rangers. Boston will be a tough game again but I see no reason why we can't win both of those two. Beating Rangers could put them further out as well as Winnipeg are playing Toronto and Devils are playing Philadelphia.

I'd very much like to see Winnipeg and Toronto get in the playoffs in place of Rangers and Philadelphia.

 

[roready]

Thanks, Jimbo. Now we're going to give up 20 over the weekend. GOSH.

We might give up 20, but we might just score 21.

 

[Malkin4Top6Wingerz]

Yea, well that's just like, your opinion, man.

Honestly though, this line is the last thing I'm worried about on this team. It's a superior line to the 09' Crosby line with Kunitz and Guerin and for the most part, they had very little trouble scoring. People can point to the Detroit series all they'd like, but they had tons of chances. A combination of posts, Osgood playing out of his mind, and miserable shooting luck contributed to their lack of production as much as anything else.

 

[IcedCapp]

The goal happened in the middle of a line change and you are always taught to back check to the middle of the ice and take the most dangerous guy, when you are first man back like Kunitz. You should let your blueliner worry about the puck carrier in this instance.

Orpik correctly thought Kunitz had Bozak and moved to the puck. Unfortunately Kunitz peeled off Bozak to chase the puck and that left Bozak all alone.

I've ****ed up the same way, because you are switching assignments and things like this happen. You have to stay on Bozak there and go with him to the post. I'm sure DB reminded him when he got back to the bench.

Thank you so much for that. Just watching the game, the easy/natural thing to do is blame Orpik. I did notice the change (Jeffrey had come on for Crosby), so it makes sense that that changes things.

Honestly though, this line is the last thing I'm worried about on this team. It's a superior line to the 09' Crosby line with Kunitz and Guerin and for the most part, they had very little trouble scoring. People can point to the Detroit series all they'd like, but they had tons of chances. A combination of posts, Osgood playing out of his mind, and miserable shooting luck contributed to their lack of production as much as anything else.

Yea, look, I agree with the idea that it's not a huge concern right now. I think the 3rd and 4th lines as well as the D-zone coverage are bigger concerns. I just think that upgrading the 1st line fixes the 3rd line. Acquiring a 4th-line "fix" shouldn't be that difficult, if Shero applies himself. And D-zone coverage isn't really an acquisition thing. I don't think we need to acquire another DMan, they just have to fix those issues internally.

So when I look at it from that point of view, I just feel like upgrading Dupuis fixes 2/3rds of their problems.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Thank you so much for that. Just watching the game, the easy/natural thing to do is blame Orpik. I did notice the change (Jeffrey had come on for Crosby), so it makes sense that that changes things.

I was always taught the most dangerous man in that situation doesn't have the puck. But things happen so fast that natural instincts have you trying to press the puck carrier. But the puck carrier wants you coming to him in that instance, trust me.

 

[Allie Kitsune]

At this point, I guess I'm OK with leaving Dupuis on L1 if some else came in and was put on L2, moving BB with Sutter. Of course this means that TK drops down to L4 (if he's not part of the trade) and Glass finds himself up in the press box (or shipped out of town) for the rest of the season.

14-87-9
(Trade)-71-18
24-16-19
(15/48)-46-27

Either that or bring in a solid 3rd liner and leave BB on L2, if it turns out that no Top 6 guys are available without having to give up the likes of Despres or Morrow.

Just whatever it takes to get Tanner Glass out of the lineup. Obviously not a 'perfect' fix, but what is?