Should Carey Price’s number be retired?

[ReHabs]

I get it. You look up at the rafters and there's a direct correlation between those retired numbers and the Cups they've won. But consider all the other retired names played with other retired names or Hall of Famers, which is why they won Cups. A lot of those guys weren't better players than Price, they just had the good fortune to play together on the same team. Price had Markov and Subban for a short time, both of whom were very good, but the rest of the roster was a revolving door of mid-tier talent. Patrick Roy's 1993 roster looks like an all-star team compared to Price's rosters from 2011 to 2021.

Price was the best in class for about eight years, he was our de facto leader and brought us close a couple of times. The teams he played with certainly don't deserve to be honoured, but he does. IMO, #31 should forever be his.

I understand it fully and I don't think fans have quite reckoned with how much of a wasted opportunity/career this was but when we win, the shine of the winning era will make the crap era look even more crap in contrast.

To get your number retired by the Montreal Canadiens you need to bring a victory parade to St Catherine's Street. As far as I'm concerned that's the end of story. It's a reward and recognition for bringing to us that joy.

The debate is whether he should be penalized because his teams never did.

Not getting your number retired by the organization is not a penalty! And it should never be seen as a snub or a penalty.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Carey Price:
Most wins by a Canadiens goaltender in a single season.
3rd most shutouts in Franchise history.
Most games played by a Canadiens goaltender.
Most wins by a Canadiens goaltender in franchise history.
6th longest winning streak by a Canadiens goaltender.
4th best save percentage in Franchise history (two goalies ahead only played ~100 games, he played 712)
8th best goals against average in Franchise history (3 goalies ahead had less than 300 games played for the franchise)
Most saves in franchise history

NHL Rookie of the month 2008
NHL All-Rookie Team 2008
NHL Youngstars game 2009
7x NHL All-Star
Hart Memorial Trophy
Ted Lindsay Trophy
Vezina Trophy
William Jennings Trophy
NHL First Team Allstar 2015
Bill Masterton Trophy

Molson Cup recipient 2009, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2019, 2020

Calder Cup Champion
Jack Butterfield Trophy

2007 WJC Best Goalie
2007 WJC Media Allstar Team
2007 WJC MVP
2007 WJC Gold Medallist

2014 Winter Olympics Best Goaltender
2014 Winter Olympics Gold Medallist

2016 World Cup

2015 Lou Marsh Trophy

 

[le_sean]

It was realistic for the franchise - it's not anymore. It's a situation where you may not ever retire another number and that's just silly. The game has changed, the amount of teams has changed, in some circumstances, the number of rounds has changed.

You don't have to retire Koivu and you don't have to retire Suzuki either.

Price has a Hart.
He has a Lindsay.
He has a Vezina.

He has multiple records as goaltender for the Montreal Canadiens franchise.

Koivu doesn't have any best of hardware. He doesn't have any Montreal Canadiens records.
Suzuki will unlikely have any of that either.

Price is a first ballot hall of famer. He is the best player over a 30 year stretch and legitimately has things to prove he's an all-time goalie in Montreal Canadiens history.

Just because we don’t have the same success as before doesn’t mean our expectations for greatness and excellence should change. That number still goes beside all of the others that have had continued success.

Theodore has a Vezina and Hart too. Heck the Vezina is named after our own goalie whose jersey isnt even in the rafters.

 

[Lshap]

I understand it fully and I don't think fans have quite reckoned with how much of a wasted opportunity/career this was but when we win, the shine of the winning era will make the crap era look even more crap in contrast.

To get your number retired by the Montreal Canadiens you need to bring a victory parade to St Catherine's Street. As far as I'm concerned that's the end of story. It's a reward and recognition for bringing to us that joy.


Not getting your number retired by the organization is not a penalty! And it should never be seen as a snub or a penalty.

If the only way to prove your point is to win a Cup, I'm in.

The reality is we've never had to debate the standard for retiring numbers. Up until now the org has followed the same formula: Great player + Cup(s). With so many more teams, so little cap flexibility, and much smaller odds of winning a Cup, we have to re-think the math. Are the rafters still restricted to great players on great teams, or are we ready to settle for mere great players?

 

[StCaufield]

I really thought the poll would be overwhelmingly yes. He was the only reason why Montreal was relevant and leads goalies in wins for the Habs. He was an absolute unit and 31 will be retired. Cups don’t matter at all in this case because he never had any scoring at all. He shouldn’t be punished for that

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

HOFer. At one point was arguably the best player in the world. Clutch in the playoffs. Took a bad team to the finals. Did everything but win a cup.

Yes, his number should be retired.

 

[Bombshell11]

I really thought the poll would be overwhelmingly yes. He was the only reason why Montreal was relevant and leads goalies in wins for the Habs. He was an absolute unit and 31 will be retired. Cups don’t matter at all in this case because he never had any scoring at all. He shouldn’t be punished for that

Great players dont stay on bad teams, they ask to play with other greats.

 

[StCaufield]

Great players dont stay on bad teams, they ask to play with other greats.

Maybe L take of the year. He was committed to Montreal and for a few years they had really good teams mainly solely because of him. His family was also in Montreal and it was their home. “Hey hunny we are moving to X city because I want to win”. He’s no sellout

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Great players dont stay on bad teams, they ask to play with other greats.

Nah.

And there’s no way Price could’ve known when he signed that deal that his GM would be a bumbling idiot going forward.

We should’ve come out of that era with at least one cup. It’s been done to death so I won’t go into it here. But Price was among the league’s very best players and won everything but the cup. His play in the playoffs was superb and nobody comes close to him from Roy onward.

I understand those who say you have to win a cup to make it but it’s a completely different league now. I see zero reason to punish him for the shortcomings of bad management.

 

[ReHabs]

Are the rafters still restricted to great players on great teams, or are we ready to settle for mere great players?

The restriction is what makes the Habs the Habs, imo. The rafters are more prestigious than the HHOF. It would be a shame to sully that.

As the Price era fades we will rightly remember him as a titan who carried the torch through the darkest period in Habs history. But I hope to be looking back from a bright spot.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

No, absolutely not.

Jersey retirements should be reserved for only the most extreme scenarios and we’ve already retired too many.

 

[Tyson]

No he didn't win a cup but he was the best goalie of his generation and won the Hart Trophy.
The retired numbers that hang in the rafters are from generations when the game had 6 teams in many instances.
Price is the most talented and best pure goalie in Habs history. That says alot when you have Bill Durnan, Jacques Plante, Ken Dryden and Patrick Roy.
Price for the most part was a man alone on an island.
He is deserving.

 

[StCaufield]

No, absolutely not.

Jersey retirements should be reserved for only the most extreme scenarios and we’ve already retired too many.

Hall of famers shouldn’t get their number retired?

 

[WeThreeKings]

Just because we don’t have the same success as before doesn’t mean our expectations for greatness and excellence should change. That number still goes beside all of the others that have had continued success.

Theodore has a Vezina and Hart too. Heck the Vezina is named after our own goalie whose jersey isnt even in the rafters.

Our expectations for greatness and excellence hasn't changed.

He did everything and more for this franchise. Not winning a cup has never and will never be on him.

Theodore had one miracle season and doesn't appear anywhere close to any Canadiens records because he had no longevity. Price is the winningest goalie in franchise history. In every metric you look at, he's one of the best to ever do it in a Canadiens jersey.

Not retiring the number of a franchise great because of the incompetence of the management isn't a good case to make.

Holding a team trophy against an individual is gatekeeping. Price was excellent and he was great. He was an ascendant talent that brought teams well above their talent level every full and healthy season he played once an established starter.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

Hall of famers shouldn’t get their number retired?

Honour the numbers , do not retire them.

Only players with massive impact should be truly “retired”.

The Rocket’s and Beliveau’s of the hockey world.

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Guaranteed 1st ballot Hall of Famer, 1st one we have had in a long time (apologies to Weber but he didn’t get in based on his years in Montreal). Give this generation something to celebrate

 

[Bombshell11]

The price talk always gets so toxic.

The price homers just dont want to hear anything negative and make no concessions in regards to price.

 

[le_sean]

Our expectations for greatness and excellence hasn't changed.

He did everything and more for this franchise. Not winning a cup has never and will never be on him.

Theodore had one miracle season and doesn't appear anywhere close to any Canadiens records because he had no longevity. Price is the winningest goalie in franchise history. In every metric you look at, he's one of the best to ever do it in a Canadiens jersey.

Not retiring the number of a franchise great because of the incompetence of the management isn't a good case to make.

Holding a team trophy against an individual is gatekeeping. Price was excellent and he was great. He was an ascendant talent that brought teams well above their talent level every full and healthy season he played once an established starter.

I mean you say we can’t hold team accomplishments against him, but we are ignoring he has a wins record because

a) he played in 82 game seasons and
b) there were no ties in his career.

If you want to put things into context, for Habs goalies with 150+ games played, he’s 10th in winning percentage. That’s good considering he had some mediocre teams in front of him, but you can’t point to his wins record as meaning much.

I’d argue Koivu did more for this franchise if we are counting what he did on even worse teams and his contribution to the community.

 

[Whitesnake]

No. But he was a great player. He's actually a victim if inept managing. But while it's not his fault, this retirement numbers madness had been a mistake. To me, it,s always about who should never be associated with a number that could always be associated to a certain person, no matter the team or even the sport.

Guy Lafleur, Jean Béliveau, Maurice Richard, Henri Richard and Patrick Roy. Frankly, if it was for me, those would have been the sole guys. Then you can make a case for Robinson, Plante, Harvey and Morenz if the goal is to tough to almonst every era of your existence that is known with a winning one. That would have been it.

This Habs team because they fail to be great in the present time decided to make a show of their past. They tried to sell the brand that way because there was no other way. And we diluted the significance of retiring a jersey.....

 

[CanadienShark]

I'd say not.

 

[le_sean]

No. But he was a great player. He's actually a victim if inept managing. But while it's not his fault, this retirement numbers madness had been a mistake. To me, it,s always about who should never be associated with a number that could always be associated to a certain person, no matter the team or even the sport.

Guy Lafleur, Jean Béliveau, Maurice Richard, Henri Richard and Patrick Roy. Frankly, if it was for me, those would have been the sole guys. Then you can make a case for Robinson, Plante, Harvey and Morenz if the goal is to tough to almonst every era of your existence that is known with a winning one. That would have been it.

This Habs team because they fail to be great in the present time decided to make a show of their past. They tried to sell the brand that way because there was no other way. And we diluted the significance of retiring a jersey.....

I agree with you. It should have been a lot stricter and reserved for the best player on the Habs from their respective eras. There’s some great players up in the rafters but when you start awarding it to the 3rd or 4th best player on the team, it gets a little diluted.

 

[StCaufield]

Honour the numbers , do not retire them.

Only players with massive impact should be truly “retired”.

The Rocket’s and Beliveau’s of the hockey world.

And that’s Carey price. It’s not just about cups and stats. He had a similar impact on the city as any player ever for the Canadiens. It’s not his fault that management is stupid. Sorry but it’s 100% going to be retired

 

[McGuires Corndog]

And that’s Carey price. It’s not just about cups and stats. He had a similar impact on the city as any player ever for the Canadiens. It’s not his fault that management is stupid. Sorry but it’s 100% going to be retired

Maybe so, but it doesn’t deserve to be.

The organization will retire it because he was a god to the participation trophy generation, quite fitting actually.

 

[le_sean]

And that’s Carey price. It’s not just about cups and stats. He had a similar impact on the city as any player ever for the Canadiens. It’s not his fault that management is stupid. Sorry but it’s 100% going to be retired

I liked the guy, but no he didn’t. You might think he did because he was the best player on the team for several years, but even Subban had more of an impact on the city than him.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Honour the numbers , do not retire them.

Only players with massive impact should be truly “retired”.

The Rocket’s and Beliveau’s of the hockey world.

OK but they've retired guys who are not the Rockets or Beliveau's of the world.

I mean you say we can’t hold team accomplishments against him, but we are ignoring he has a wins record because

a) he played in 82 game seasons and
b) there were no ties in his career.

If you want to put things into context, for Habs goalies with 150+ games played, he’s 10th in winning percentage. That’s good considering he had some mediocre teams in front of him, but you can’t point to his wins record as meaning much.

I’d argue Koivu did more for this franchise if we are counting what he did on even worse teams and his contribution to the community.

But then we are saying he can't get his number retired, but we are ignoring that

a) some of the cup winning number retirees played in leagues of 6 or less than 32 teams.
b) some played in eras where the gulf in talent between good teams and bad teams was massive.
c) some only had to win 8 games to win a Stanley Cup. A number Price managed multiple times but did not lead to a cup.
d) some won cups in eras where you were playing trash expansion teams a la St Louis Blues in the cup finals.

We can argue Koivu did more for the franchise but he has no records and no hardware. I'd love to see him retired from a sentimental point of view, but from a practical standpoint, there's nothing we can actually point to as a metric to say he deserves to have his number retired.

I take great issue with the fact that someone has to win a cup to have their number retired here. Are we saying that in bizarro world, Sidney Crosby has the same career in Montreal but never wins a cup, that we wouldn't retire the number of Crosby because he has no cups?

It's an arbitrary sticking point - I'd accept the era differences argument way more than the cup argument. But even if you adjust for eras, the numbers are going to tell you that Price was as dominant a goalie over his career that there ever is, in any era. He's not the Hasek/Roy/Brodeur tier, but the next tier below that, he's got an absolute claim.

Plus for context you put the absolute absence of talent and managerial savvy that he had to deal with; what he did was remarkable.