SHL - Team Sweden vs Liiga - Team Finland
- Thread starter Artorius Horus T
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
Eye of Ra
Grandmaster General of the International boards
hmmm with non-swedes and non-finns?
Team Liiga:
Ville Leskinen - Jaarko Immonen - Malte Strömvall
Teemu Turunen - Aleksi Heponiemi - Jesse Saarinen
Erik Thorell - Oula Palve - Hynek Zohora
Kristian Kuusela - Justin Danforth - Sakari Salminen
Oliwer Kaski - Jani Hakanpää
Ilkka Heikkinen - Atte Ohtamaa
Temmu Eronen - Mikko Kousa
Veini Vehiläninen
Team SHL:
Oscar Möller - Derek Roy - Joakim Lindström
Roman Horak - Niklas Olausson - Ryan Lasch
Janne Pesonen - Jacob Josefson - Spencer Abbot
Brendan Shinimin - Konstantin Komarek - Aaron Palushaj
Jessi Virtanen - Erik Gustafsson
Ryan Gunderson - Simon Bertilsson
Kristian Näkyva - Joel Persson
Joel Lassinanti
I think team SHL is a little bit stronger but not by much.
Team Liiga:
Ville Leskinen - Jaarko Immonen - Malte Strömvall
Teemu Turunen - Aleksi Heponiemi - Jesse Saarinen
Erik Thorell - Oula Palve - Hynek Zohora
Kristian Kuusela - Justin Danforth - Sakari Salminen
Oliwer Kaski - Jani Hakanpää
Ilkka Heikkinen - Atte Ohtamaa
Temmu Eronen - Mikko Kousa
Veini Vehiläninen
Team SHL:
Oscar Möller - Derek Roy - Joakim Lindström
Roman Horak - Niklas Olausson - Ryan Lasch
Janne Pesonen - Jacob Josefson - Spencer Abbot
Brendan Shinimin - Konstantin Komarek - Aaron Palushaj
Jessi Virtanen - Erik Gustafsson
Ryan Gunderson - Simon Bertilsson
Kristian Näkyva - Joel Persson
Joel Lassinanti
I think team SHL is a little bit stronger but not by much.
Artorius Horus T
sincerety
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
SHL:
Lassinanti - Reideborn
Persson - Wikstrand
Bengtsson - Bertilsson
Djuse - Tom Nilsson
Moller - Kellman - Lindstrom
Nygard - Oskar Steen - Lindqvist
Lilja - Josefson - Davidsson
Hjalmarsson - Lundqvist - Sorensen
Liiga:
Vehvilainen - Laurikainen
Ohtamaa - Hakenpaa
Eronen - Kivihalme
Jurgens - Kaski
Jokinen - Heponiemi - Leskinen
Turunen - Immonen - Kuusela
Kangasniemi - Filppula - Aaltonen
Osala - Palve - Salminen
Those teams are not too far away but SHL definitely has an edge, I mean Aaltonen couldn't do anything for Skelleftea and he is dominating back home (as are Jokinen, Immonen, guys who really could hardly cut it in the SHL). So Swedes would take series in 6-7 games, I'd say. Having said that, this is a pretty bad year for SHL.. Imagine their team last year based on that dominant Vaxjo - with Pettersson, Rosen, Rasmussen - how much better would they look at center. Or those Skelleftea teams back in the day with Norman, Sundqvist, Arvidsson, Zacrisson etc. Also the obvious thing is obvious, Liiga is much more based around the local players at the moment.
Lassinanti - Reideborn
Persson - Wikstrand
Bengtsson - Bertilsson
Djuse - Tom Nilsson
Moller - Kellman - Lindstrom
Nygard - Oskar Steen - Lindqvist
Lilja - Josefson - Davidsson
Hjalmarsson - Lundqvist - Sorensen
Liiga:
Vehvilainen - Laurikainen
Ohtamaa - Hakenpaa
Eronen - Kivihalme
Jurgens - Kaski
Jokinen - Heponiemi - Leskinen
Turunen - Immonen - Kuusela
Kangasniemi - Filppula - Aaltonen
Osala - Palve - Salminen
Those teams are not too far away but SHL definitely has an edge, I mean Aaltonen couldn't do anything for Skelleftea and he is dominating back home (as are Jokinen, Immonen, guys who really could hardly cut it in the SHL). So Swedes would take series in 6-7 games, I'd say. Having said that, this is a pretty bad year for SHL.. Imagine their team last year based on that dominant Vaxjo - with Pettersson, Rosen, Rasmussen - how much better would they look at center. Or those Skelleftea teams back in the day with Norman, Sundqvist, Arvidsson, Zacrisson etc. Also the obvious thing is obvious, Liiga is much more based around the local players at the moment.
Last edited:
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
He would make the team for sure. The kid is a real candidate for WC Team Finland.
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
I mean he is a candidate, sure, but saying he is a shoo-in seems close to the people who were advocating for CHLers on the Olympic teams.
Well Laine did great in the WC and I’d say Kakko is a way better player than he was at that age.
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
Well, Laine did that after becoming Liiga PO MVP. I will swiftly kick someone off my team in his favor if Kakko comes close to that but until then, I'd say that's the matter of opinion and not some plentiful evidence.
For example, Salminen has no place on that team, Kakko is way more dominant in Liiga.
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
He had 47 points in 50 games on garbage team after his return to Liiga prior to the trade to HIFK.
In any case, do you know what an opinion is? I wrote my team, you can write yours. Why are you so stuck up about 1 player who is largely irrelevant in this context?
Although the SHL is clearly the better league that's definitely overvaluing it massively, Jokinen would be an excellent addition for most European top teams including in the KHL and Immonen too would still help SHL teams despite his age. Aaltonen is a really special case that could succeed at the highest level or flop at the lowest.
McClelland
Registered User
K.Curran-J.Persson
E.Gustafsson-L.Hultstrom
J.Virtanen -I .Melart(Lefty)
J.Lindstrom-D.Roy-R.Lasch
J.Pesonen-N.Olausson-O.Steen
D.Brodin-K.Komarek-O.Moller
M.Tedenby-Lundys Twin-D.Brodin
O.Alsenfeldt(A.Reideborn)
Havent seen Liiga enough! Shl are a better leuage though(Deeper and better Salary overall). Liiga has more garbage team!
E.Gustafsson-L.Hultstrom
J.Virtanen -I .Melart(Lefty)
J.Lindstrom-D.Roy-R.Lasch
J.Pesonen-N.Olausson-O.Steen
D.Brodin-K.Komarek-O.Moller
M.Tedenby-Lundys Twin-D.Brodin
O.Alsenfeldt(A.Reideborn)
Havent seen Liiga enough! Shl are a better leuage though(Deeper and better Salary overall). Liiga has more garbage team!
Sorry the SHL is better but not clearly better! LIIGA is strong enough! More and more Player from LIIGA can gain a foothold in the NHL. This is a an indication of qualitiy.
The salary is in Europe not very important. When you produce top talents and they stay 1-2 years in their domestic league,before they go to NHL. This is cheap!
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
Surely I didn't mean they would be playing in the Allsvenskan but they wouldn't fit in the same role in the SHL. I mean Jokinen is an offensive dynamo in Liiga with 15 points in 10 games, I just don't see something like that happening in the SHL. It applies to Immonen as well, he came back to Finland after having 0.5 PPG season in the NLA (albeit on a really good, stacked team) but I think that's closer to the indication how he would perform in the SHL than his ~1 PPG in Liiga.
That's an indication of the league having a pretty high skill at the very top. It does little to determine it's overall strength. Guys like Pastrnak and Raffl made the NHL straight out of Allsvenskan, for example. And yes, it does indicate something but at the same time, SHL had teams like 13/14 Skelleftea where half of the team got to play in the NHL later with varying successes.
Yes the development in LIIGA is much better than in past. And much players from LIIGA they go to KHL,adapt well to the level of performance. LIIGA exports to NHL and KHL are going better and better. This scale shows that the LIIGA does not have to hide from the SHL either.
Last edited:
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
Again, some Finns do succeed but a lot of them don't. Look what kind of dumpster fire Sibir turned into by relying on Liiga imports to start this season. Neftekhimik went the same route, and even though in my opinion their Finns did a good job, better than expected even, they still ended up not being even close to PO. Meanwhile, SHL imports are rock solid, almost all of them have 1 to 1 conversion ratio between KHL and SHL as far as offensive production goes, this year's Torpedo is a good example.
I don't mean to poop on Liiga which is really good at the top but you have to take the good with the bad. Things like the fact that Mestis legend Nick Lucenius is currently top-10 in PPG in your league. Or the fact that someone like Justin Danforth, who is doing great, is essentially an ECHL import. This used to never happen. ECHL guys used to go to EBEL and DEL maybe, not to the top-5 of Liiga scoring.
Any league will look pretty damn impressive if you only look at the bright spots but you have to look at the overall picture.
Last edited:
Artorius Horus T
sincerety
Okay.... it was supposed to be Sweden vs Finland, didn't anyone read the title????.
Everybody keeps bringing up that the SHL is supposedly better, but most of its better players are foreign players,
where as Liiga's most of its better players are Finnish born players, so the vote is easy, Finland would have
better team and would beat Sweden, especially now when Elias Pettersson left to the NHL.
Sweden's best players play in the NHL and in the KHL, where as SHL is loaded with top foreign players
top 30 scorers in the SHL, 13 foreign players
top 30 scorers in the Liiga, 6 foreign players
top 50 scorers in the SHL, 22 foreign players
top 50 scorers in the Liiga, 9 foreign players
top 100 scorers in the SHL, 36 foreign players
top 100 scorers in the Liiga, 18 foreign players
Everybody keeps bringing up that the SHL is supposedly better, but most of its better players are foreign players,
where as Liiga's most of its better players are Finnish born players, so the vote is easy, Finland would have
better team and would beat Sweden, especially now when Elias Pettersson left to the NHL.
Sweden's best players play in the NHL and in the KHL, where as SHL is loaded with top foreign players
top 30 scorers in the SHL, 13 foreign players
top 30 scorers in the Liiga, 6 foreign players
top 50 scorers in the SHL, 22 foreign players
top 50 scorers in the Liiga, 9 foreign players
top 100 scorers in the SHL, 36 foreign players
top 100 scorers in the Liiga, 18 foreign players
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
So you posted a question but not only you have an answer you think "the vote is easy"
Nice. So why create a thread in the first place?Yes Liiga is much more based around the local guys, how exactly does it reflect anything or even more so, make it good? Who are those world beaters who play in the Liiga you speak of? Way more Finns play in the KHL because Liiga teams can't afford them. They also can't afford quality imports so they are sticking with local talent.
Out of 54 players called up to play on the Finnish EHT teams barely 25 play in Liiga (46%) while that number is at 31/39 for Sweden (79%). So the argument that "Sweden's best players play in the NHL and in the KHL" doesn't carry any weight at all in this discussion because same applies to Finland only to way larger extent. It's also worth mentioning some of the best Finns in Europe play in the SHL while Swedes playing in Finland were basically written off in their country. Thorell, Stromwall, Danforth - these guys are Liiga stars - they were Allsvenskan/ECHL players.
Finns lately seem pretty delusional about the strength of their local league which is fueled by their success on the international scene and player development which has next to no correlation to the actual strength of their league which is probably at all time low with the expansion and Jokerit's move to the KHL.
Last edited:
Why would Aaltonen be in the Liiga team anyway? This is a player who runs hot and cold. Now he stepped into good situation with Pelicans and is part of a high scoring team. Last time he was in Liiga he scored 2 goals in his last 33 games. For example Antti Tyrväinen also has 5+4 in the games Aaltonen has played and no one says he should be included in this team.
Also, do you refer to Jussi Jokinen there? If that's the case, I think the statement that he could hardly cut it in the SHL is absolutely ridiculous.
I don't have any problem with someone says SHL team has an edge, but it should be based on something reasonable.
SoundAndFury
Registered User
- May 28, 2012
- 12,284
- 6,274
Well Aaltonen still was on the Finnish WC team that season he scored 2 goals in his last 33 games so much as I do, I guess the coaches liked something about him. That's why he is on the Liiga team. To me, anyway.
Regarding Jokinen, I explained myself earlier. Sorry I was clumsy at expressing myself, what I mean was he would not be as offensively dominant as he is in Liiga.
If you watch soccer I think the former Real Madrid star Guti would be a decent comparison, a magician dominating any opposition when he wants to but that's only every so often. The Finnish Kovalev of sorts, but there are differences too.
