Rumor: Shane Doan to Tampa

[Sky04]

But Morrow was already bad, Kunitz and Doan are still solid players.

??

Seasons prior to joining:

Morrow: 13G-12A-25P
Kunitz:9G-20A-29P
Doan:6G-21A-27P

Old guys who aren't good at skating with fall-off seasons. Kunitz is especially worrisome because he played with a top-2 center all year.

 

[Five Alarm Fire]

How are Kunitz and Doan going to produce with Paquette and each other? This is another Morrow in the making and Morrow had Drouin/Boyle.

What kind of direction are we heading? Leadership doesn't produce on ice results, take the 1st half of the last 2 seasons and slow them down even more is what we'll be likely seeing. That team from the last 20 games of the season featuring young, hungry kids who could skate? Forget about that.

It's funny because everyone was on board with the Morrow signing at the beginning of the year too, by seasons end the entire board couldn't wait to get rid of him.

You have a good point here. Cooper does love playing his vets. A one-year deal would be low-risk if there wasn't the strong possibility that we would give him consistent minutes regardless of performance.

Morrow before signing here:
71 GP, 13 G, 12 A, 25 P

Doan last season:
74 GP, 6 G, 21 A, 27 P

Pretty much identical, and Doan is 5 years older than Morrow was (although Morrow's injury history was far worse). I'm conflicted. I don't want to see Brown on our team any longer, but at least Brown can skate. Doan brings leadership and experience, which management clearly feels is a weakness, but at what cost?

 

[Sky04]

You have a good point here. Cooper does love playing his vets. A one-year deal would be low-risk if there wasn't the strong possibility that we would give him consistent minutes regardless of performance.

Morrow before signing here:
71 GP, 13 G, 12 A, 25 P

Doan last season:
74 GP, 6 G, 21 A, 27 P

Pretty much identical, and Doan is 5 years older than Morrow was (although Morrow's injury history was far worse). I'm conflicted. I don't want to see Brown on our team any longer, but at least Brown can skate. Doan brings leadership and experience, which management clearly feels is a weakness, but at what cost?

Stamkos, Hedman, Callahan, Kunitz, Girardi, Stralman, Coburn, we have solid contributing vets, we aren't lacking in that department. If they need more leadership than that, hire a consultant not take up a roster spot.

JT Brown on a good year is a 20~ point scorer who PKS, provides offensive pressure and the occasional zone exit-breakaway, Shane Doan will pick up a couple points by being there and not much else. At least Brown has upside, Doan is likely trending downwards, these guys fall off a cliff fast.

 

[Todd1a]

Na let some kids battle for the bottom 6 spots

 

[Felonious Python]

If we were going to dump Brown, it's not going to be through buy-out. During the first buy-out period this offseason he was 26 years old, and would get 1/3rd his contract. He's 27 now so he gets 2/3rds.

 

[Rschmitz]

I called this before July 1st and absolutely see this happening. Yzerman has reportedly gone after Doan several times in the past and if Doan wasn't so loyal he would have signed here.

Just like Vanek, I don't understand the move on paper now. It's redundant with the Kunitz signing and with the current roster depth.

 

[TampaJay]

How are Kunitz and Doan going to produce with Paquette and each other? This is another Morrow in the making and Morrow had Drouin/Boyle.

What kind of direction are we heading? Leadership doesn't produce on ice results, take the 1st half of the last 2 seasons and slow them down even more is what we'll be likely seeing. That team from the last 20 games of the season featuring young, hungry kids who could skate? Forget about that.

It's funny because everyone was on board with the Morrow signing at the beginning of the year too, by seasons end the fanbase couldn't wait to get rid of him and this is a guy who stripped Mike Modano of captaincy.

This is a key point and it should reveal an important lesson learned as to why the team underperformed last season (besides stretches of poor goaltending and some injuries). People seem to look at that ~ .700 pace after the TDL as some weird fluke. I say the real lesson learned from it is that a bunch of young and hungry guys came up and changed the dynamic that was causing the problem… that is, a group of established, comfortable, unchanged, players that believed the pundits telling them they were a lock, and they got complacent. You need a group of young and hungry players pushing for jobs and bringing in aging vets just blocks them and sends a negative message to prospects. Two vets is enough for one summer. Plus, it shows a denial of the real problem last year.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

If we were going to dump Brown, it's not going to be through buy-out. During the first buy-out period this offseason he was 26 years old, and would get 1/3rd his contract. He's 27 now so he gets 2/3rds.

hes put in minors we get relief of pretty much entire contract just like condra

First instinct I dont want doan he lost it last year. I am hoping kunitz can play fourth line bring energy and leadership and girardi can at least stay out of the way. I am always 100% for vets getting the cup.

We need to keep bringing up the hungry kids though they need the time it is their time.

I always try to be fair though so lets look at stats why the drop off.

after reviewing deep stats im ok with a year. I think he has at least as much as kuntiz in tank for a one year deal. He will be hungry. His shooting percentage went down but his offensive zone starts was in girardi territory and he was still getting shots a lot of them almost 2 per game. So he played 15 mins and got 2 shots a game thats not bad for a guy with his skill set and size.

 

[Callum]

I think I'm one of the few that like the idea of Doan signing on a one-year deal.

 

[These Are The Days]

this is a key point and it should reveal an important lesson learned as to why the team underperformed last season (besides stretches of poor goaltending and some injuries). People seem to look at that ~ .700 pace after the tdl as some weird fluke. I say the real lesson learned from it is that a bunch of young and hungry guys came up and changed the dynamic that was causing the problem… that is, a group of established, comfortable, unchanged, players that believed the pundits telling them they were a lock, and they got complacent. you need a group of young and hungry players pushing for jobs and bringing in aging vets just blocks them and sends a negative message to prospects. Two vets is enough for one summer. Plus, it shows a denial of the real problem last year.

fire cooper!!

 

[TampaBoltz]

Can the Bolts afford not to have JT Brown in the lineup? How do you replace that 6 points in 64 games from last year. That's a whopping .094 points per game.

 

[LightningStrikes]

For $1M or something why not. But is he better than Conacher or Erne? I don't think so.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Girardi, Kunitz, and now this? Knock this **** off.

 

[TampaJay]

For $1M or something why not. But is he better than Conacher or Erne? I don't think so.

You hit on the flawed logic but asked the bigger question. The flawed logic is, hey, we have this extra short-term cap space so why not use it? The bigger question when the only way to spend it is on old guys, is, does it help or could it actually harm? By the numbers, the team was much improved the last third of the season. You have to ask how the hell that is possible when none of the young guys that came up are future allstars? When you answer that question you come to the conclusion that bringing in old vets not only doesn’t help, it exacerbates the problem.

 

[Hoek]

Ugh. What are we an expansion team? We don't need any more has beens.

 

[Todd1a]

Can the Bolts afford not to have JT Brown in the lineup? How do you replace that 6 points in 64 games from last year. That's a whopping .094 points per game.

Well brown still can skate better then doan but never score

 

[TampaBoltz]

Well brown still can skate better then doan but never score

I agree. Brown is good at not scoring.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

i want to be clear on something.

I dont like gourde and think all of you are drinking something if think he is a top six player.

Next I wish had not picked up girardi or kunitz if had my two cents lol so Nope dont want doan either

will say think doan has more game at this point and would contribute more then kunitz though so is stevies team. Dont want it will accept it

Me im ready for the kids erne is hasnt impressed yet on lower lines maybe disappointed in his lack of scoring myself. Yet maybe just needs time to get comfort. I am very ready to see the other kids peca who is probably just another gourde

but stephens raddysh joseph etc.. along with masin cernak etc..

Imho its time to turn it over give guys more coffee and aint talking about dumonts bournivals etc.. who do not have a shot at being here long term imo

lets give some shots to some guys whom have a shot at making an impact in the next few years

 

[Sky04]

i want to be clear on something.

I dont like gourde and think all of you are drinking something if think he is a top six player.

Next I wish had not picked up girardi or kunitz if had my two cents lol so Nope dont want doan either

will say think doan has more game at this point and would contribute more then kunitz though so is stevies team. Dont want it will accept it

Me im ready for the kids erne is hasnt impressed yet on lower lines maybe disappointed in his lack of scoring myself. Yet maybe just needs time to get comfort. I am very ready to see the other kids peca who is probably just another gourde

but stephens raddysh joseph etc.. along with masin cernak etc..

Imho its time to turn it over give guys more coffee and aint talking about dumonts bournivals etc.. who do not have a shot at being here long term imo

lets give some shots to some guys whom have a shot at making an impact in the next few years

Huh? your plan is to rush some mid level prospects instead of established AHL talent? I'm really not sure you understand the gap between the CHL and the AHL.

Your post makes no sense, you talk like Stephens, Raddysh and Joseph have been in the farm for years, what do you mean "it's time", these guys are all drafted within the past 2 years. Raddysh wasn't even AHL eligible last year, Stephens isn't even a PPG player in the OHL compared to Gourde who can put up PPG in the AHL.

Show me where anyone has Gourde in the top 6.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

Huh? your plan is to rush some mid level prospects instead of established AHL talent? I'm really not sure you understand the gap between the CHL and the AHL.

Your post makes no sense, you talk like Stephens, Raddysh and Joseph have been in the farm for years, what do you mean "it's time", these guys are all drafted within the past 2 years. Raddysh wasn't even AHL eligible last year, Stephens isn't even a PPG player in the OHL compared to Gourde who can put up PPG in the AHL.

Show me where anyone has Gourde in the top 6.

I have seen a ton of people put line ups up with us and have gourde in top six. Its a peeve not impressed by his play. I think we have DONE A **** job terrible JOB with prospects for most part on how to bring along !!!! I do not like how detroit does it either and now look at detroit?

To be fair gourde has been almost what could be called outstanding for syracuse and his stint with us even both stints the 2 games at 24 and the 20 games last year. He put in 9 points in 22 games thats awesome. Plus minus think is even so that is a solid 20 % shooting percentage scares me as being unatteniable but we could do much worse. Just dont want him in top lines getting ate up defensively Till he proves he can play top lines adequately and I figure he might not be able to myself.

I dont mean to give them what they cant earn but we are talking fourth line minutes? We are talking giving paquette and brown time off here and there? How is that a bad thing?

Those three you brought up should get a minimum 10 games on bench and 4-6 games played this season MIN....

if they do ok give them a little bigger carrot? Where is the harm and how the hell is that not better then guys that will not be in the NHL in 2-3 years? Maybe 5 but they shouldnt be lol.

I dont mind conacher getting some time either like gourde yet would like our kids to get some of he carrot plain and simple the bigger kids that raddysh is 19 the rest are all 20 your words on their ages for one guy was to shoot him down vs nico if you remember cause of the age etc...

we are going to see plenty of bournival and dumont again probably just will be injuries give the kids some time see what they have some might surprise us from the get

 

[LightningStrikes]

Girardi, Kunitz, and now this? Knock this **** off.

Guess they blame lack of experience more than anything for last season. Not injuries, key players not performing, coaching.

 

[Bolt32]

I love Gourde but i have to agree to Robert. Hes not a top six guy, he's a bottom six guy that can be a threat to score from time too time. If we have him on the top six were going to end up hating him because we are expecting him to be something he's not.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

i want to be clear on something.

I dont like gourde and think all of you are drinking something if think he is a top six player.

Next I wish had not picked up girardi or kunitz if had my two cents lol so Nope dont want doan either

will say think doan has more game at this point and would contribute more then kunitz though so is stevies team. Dont want it will accept it

Me im ready for the kids erne is hasnt impressed yet on lower lines maybe disappointed in his lack of scoring myself. Yet maybe just needs time to get comfort. I am very ready to see the other kids peca who is probably just another gourde

but stephens raddysh joseph etc.. along with masin cernak etc..

Imho its time to turn it over give guys more coffee and aint talking about dumonts bournivals etc.. who do not have a shot at being here long term imo

lets give some shots to some guys whom have a shot at making an impact in the next few years

Gourde is a cool 3rd liner but we need someone to push him out of the top-6. It's that or play Gourde at 3c (Point at 2RW) and he is terrible at faceoffs.

What we need is a Parenteau, Vanek, or Jagr to play 2rw and then hav e a killorn-point-gourde 3rd line.

 

[RegularSznAllStars]

I love Gourde but i have to agree to Robert. Hes not a top six guy, he's a bottom six guy that can be a threat to score from time too time. If we have him on the top six were going to end up hating him because we are expecting him to be something he's not.

Gourde would be fine in the top 6. Kid can play.

 

[HoseEmDown]

Gourde is a cool 3rd liner but we need someone to push him out of the top-6. It's that or play Gourde at 3c (Point at 2RW) and he is terrible at faceoffs.

What we need is a Parenteau, Vanek, or Jagr to play 2rw and then hav e a killorn-point-gourde 3rd line.

Those guys are terrible top 6 options. Jagr and Vanek put up under 50 points, take away their PP time, mid 30's. Paranteau didn't even break 30. These guys can't skate like they used to so would slow down Palat and Johnson. They won't be getting anymore than spot PP duty so their production would be on Killorns level and we don't want him in the top 6. Gourde might not put up more than mid 30 points if in the top 6 but his speed complements the other two better so we can play the style we want.

Hell I'd rather give Yan a shot on the 2nd line, he's got a great left handed shot, the last player who was a left shot playing RW with Palat and Johnson did pretty well with them. We don't need any slow veteran bums, besides on the 4th line like Kunitz. We need speed in the top 6 which none of them possess any longer.