milkbag
Registered User
- Jul 31, 2018
- 1,339
- 1,917
Was a light joke since (from my experience, and in my industry) that's when they break out the quality stuff.
Last edited:
OT: Sens Lounge -The four seasons edition
- Thread starter Beech
- Start date
- Status
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
- 56,704
- 34,502
Idk about italian xmas party home brews, but I've definitely had some good home brew wine and beers that I'd take over some store bought stuff,
I've also had some home brew that is not terribly good,
Like anything, it depends on the person making it. Just like a home cooked meal vs a restaurant meal, there are some very good home cooks out there that can compete with the best and then there are some that are just going through the motions....
Relapsing
Registered User
- Jul 3, 2018
- 2,493
- 2,349
What, and where?
I gave a number of examples. Least you can do is provide the same.
maclean
Registered User
- Jan 4, 2014
- 8,983
- 2,925
If anything got my panties in a twist then yes, it was the spurious assumptions. I said it wasn't my thing until I went to university. That was 25 years ago. Look, I'm not trying to be quarrelsome, your statement just struck me as completely trapped in a very reductive mindset. Just because you haven't had good homemade alcohol doesn't mean it doesn't exist. From the sound of it you maybe even haven't had any because of preconceived notions. There is a widespread misconception that anything not purchased in a clean and pristine package will make you sick. You call this "common knowledge" but it is very much a myth, one that commercial society is more than happy to propagate.
Of course, there is surely bad homemade stuff, just as there is bad commercial stuff. Others have mentioned they've had homemade things they'd choose over anything commercial. I've drank pretty much everything under the sun and let me also flip that around and say I've had some things from the LCBO I'd take prison hooch over...
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
/CNW/ - Summary Product: Illegal edible cannabis products Issue: Children have been hospitalized after accidentally ingesting illegal "copycat" edible cannabis...
www.newswire.ca
Cannabis poisonings in children - Canada.ca
Learn to recognize the signs of cannabis poisoning and what to do about it. Taking action quickly can help prevent serious harm.
Cannasweets - Google Search
YouGotAStuGoing
Registered User
Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
/CNW/ - Summary Product: Illegal edible cannabis products Issue: Children have been hospitalized after accidentally ingesting illegal "copycat" edible cannabis...
Cannabis poisonings in children - Canada.ca
Learn to recognize the signs of cannabis poisoning and what to do about it. Taking action quickly can help prevent serious harm.www.canada.ca
Cannasweets - Google Search
All the links you provide explicitly state that the types of candies you're rallying against are, in fact, illegal. We can talk about enforcement, sure, but not convinced there's any additional legislation needed here.
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
It’s about better legislation and enforcement.
It’s easy to buy candies that are marketed as kids candy.
Should be in packaging similar to cigarettes. Big warnings… nothing flashy. It’s ridiculous to think that this is not enforced.
Relapsing
Registered User
- Jul 3, 2018
- 2,493
- 2,349
I appreciate you for taking the time to gather some examples. Let's take a look!Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
/CNW/ - Summary Product: Illegal edible cannabis products Issue: Children have been hospitalized after accidentally ingesting illegal "copycat" edible cannabis...
Cannabis poisonings in children - Canada.ca
Learn to recognize the signs of cannabis poisoning and what to do about it. Taking action quickly can help prevent serious harm.
Cannasweets - Google Search
First link, from Newswire:
A few things to observe here:
- The title of this article is: Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
- As reiterated in the first bullet point, this is about Illegal edible cannabis products (highlighted).
- it also goes on to reference Health Canada's advisory against the consumption of illegal copycat edible cannabis products, and how dangerous they can be
Link #2!
- this is a Health Canada Advisory about cannabis poisoning in children. I thought you were going to provide us with examples of legal products that have the same style of packaging as the problematic US examples I provided. Oh well.
- This Advisory goes on to provide us with a link about how to tell the difference between legal and illegal cannabis. Here is is in case you need a refresher!
Link #3 - Canna Sweets On-line Store.
So, I was admittedly surprised to see a cannabis store in Canada listing these edibles. So, I decided to look under the hood.
Lets use the Health Canada link I provided above, specifically, their criteria for identifying illegal cannabis stores.
Identifying illegal cannabis retailers
You should only purchase cannabis from legal retailers in your province or territory. Common signs to help identify an illegal cannabis retailer are:- no age verification
- appealing packaging or products
- ships cannabis everywhere in Canada
- referral or sign up bonuses or other promotions
- requesting payment by e-transfer or cryptocurrency, credit cards are not accepted
1) Well, they have age verification, so that's a good start.
2) They have a LOT of appealing packaging on their website. This seems... shady
3) Look at that, they ship cannabis anywhere in Canada.
4) Huh, turns out they have a Referral program: My Account – Canna Sweets Mail Order Marijuana
5) And they take payment only by e-transfer!
So, out of 5 test criteria provided, CannaSweets, the example you provided, fails 4 of them.
That, my friends, is an illegal cannabis store!
If you have examples of legal cannabis stores that sell illegally packaged edibles, I'm all for entertaining a conversation about it. I'm just as happy to have a conversation about the illegal market in Canada and what the Fed and Provinces are doing or not doing to crack down on it.
All I ask that when we're discussing this, we're clear on what is and isn't illegal, and to not conflate the two, or position illegal products as being legally available.
I don't think you'll get much in the way of an argument when it comes to better enforcement of existing laws, although you may when it comes to introducing better legislation. A lack of enforcement doesn't necessarily equate to insufficient laws. It typically just points to a lack of enforcement.
It is not easy to buy candies that are marketed as kids candy on the legal market, as they simply do not exist.
Packaging laws in Canada are very stringent. Please feel free to reference Canada's Federal Packaging and Labelling laws for Cannabis Products if you wish to know more.
Therein, you'll find that packaging requirements specifically do not allow flashy packaging, imagery of any kind, require clear warnings and product information, and do not even permit seeing the product through the packaging. Kind of like cigarettes, no?
Edit: To build a bit on the whole enforcement thing, I won't unpack the difficulties law enforcement and governments have had in restricting black market physical and on-line stores, as it's a larger conversation, but I will point out that enforcement is happening, whether you hear about it or not:
Barrie shop one of seven stores busted for selling illegal cannabis
A provincial task force busted nine illegal cannabis establishments, including a Bayfield Street business.
Unlicensed Mississauga cannabis store raided, two men charged - Toronto | Globalnews.ca
According to police, "The premise has shown a blatant disregard for law enforcement as eight search warrants were executed between January 2019 and December 2022."
globalnews.ca
Illegal online cannabis sales targeted by B.C. government lawsuit
Those behind the websites, who held no licence to produce or sell cannabis, then laundered the cash through numbered companies and personal accounts.
vancouversun.com
N.B. peace officers raid suspected cannabis dispensary, man arrested - New Brunswick | Globalnews.ca
A 33-year-old man was arrested after police executed a search warrant at a suspected illegal cannabis dispensary in Saint John. Cash and a large quantity of cannabis were obtained.
globalnews.ca
ANALYSIS: $32M bust shows police shifting focus to illegal pot deliveries
Twenty-one people, including 14 Londoners, face charges following a 16-month investigation into a cannabis trafficking network in southern Ontario that led to the s…
lfpress.com
Last edited:
coladin
Registered User
- Sep 18, 2009
- 11,985
- 4,744
Generally, yes.
But Italians who make their own wine know what they are doing. I enjoy homemade Italian wine and will prefer it to many store bought wines.
At the Wine Station, you can make some quality wines that last incredibly long. I made Barolo, Brunello and Amarone wines that were damn delicious and they kept for 10 years...
I disagree with the bolded part. I don't drink often so when I have one drink I get a buzz however if I have one 5mg gummy I will feel nothing...tolerance matters.
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
I would agree with you about beers. Wine, it almost doesn't matter unless they have some professional production.
I've had plenty of home made wines made at specific locations, and though some taste pretty good, they tend to cause hangovers after having a couple bottles, whereas it's no problem getting through bottles if they're good stuff.
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
I've heard the term, Italian wedding, but not Christmas party lol thought it was funny.
Sure, but 99% of people who make wine don't know what they're doing.
Most people try it and give up on it because of that very reason. Or they make it as like the backup bottles, and wouldn't offer it when they have guests. Just because it's cheaper on the budget.
I'm not denying that good home made wine exists...I'm debating about the likeliness of any and all bottles of home made wine being good vs the likeliness of any and all bottles of LCBO wine being good.
There are litterally age old sayings and jokes about cheap home made wine. I didn't think this was so controversial.
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
If anything got my panties in a twist then yes, it was the spurious assumptions. I said it wasn't my thing until I went to university. That was 25 years ago. Look, I'm not trying to be quarrelsome, your statement just struck me as completely trapped in a very reductive mindset. Just because you haven't had good homemade alcohol doesn't mean it doesn't exist. From the sound of it you maybe even haven't had any because of preconceived notions. There is a widespread misconception that anything not purchased in a clean and pristine package will make you sick. You call this "common knowledge" but it is very much a myth, one that commercial society is more than happy to propagate.
Of course, there is surely bad homemade stuff, just as there is bad commercial stuff. Others have mentioned they've had homemade things they'd choose over anything commercial. I've drank pretty much everything under the sun and let me also flip that around and say I've had some things from the LCBO I'd take prison hooch over...
It wasn't based on just my experience but rather the collective experience of the 100s or thousands of people I've interact with regularly over adulthood. Sure, some have disagreed with me. There's evidence of that right here.
But most people Ive talked to would agree with me that they would rather go get a $16 bottle of wine from a company they like then to try some random persons home made wine.
I was just passing down my opinion and the overwhelming majority of the opinions that have been shared to me.
It has nothing to do with packaging or anything. My buddy makes an IPA and I love it. It comes in a labeless bottle or tall can...or straight from the keg. So it has nothing to do with that.
I agree there's good and bad of both...the argument I'm making is of the likeliness.
If I try 50 random people's homemade wine, or try 50 random bottles from the LCBO, which stack of 50 am I more likely to enjoy? The LCBO. Hands down. Not even close.
But you guys are free to disagree with me and choose to go with the random homemade wine over the random LCBO wine.
I'm surprised, but that's your choice. To each their own.
I would still think you guys are in the minority in society despite being in the majority in this thread, simply because you 2-3 people preferring homemade wine isn't enough to skew my experience and exposure to opinikns as a whole.
I would assume it depends on the Italian, no?
I've met plenty of Frenchman who like McDonald's poutine for example.
Just sharing ancestry doesn't make you an expert in one of their main industries.
But that being said, how much is the cost per bottle to make those decade old aged wines?
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
If you normally drink JT wine then you should hold back on your opinion of wine
I used to get their big boxes of Pinot Grigio to drink with ice when on the beach at the cottage in the sun for refreshments.
Never again lmao.
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
- 56,704
- 34,502
The thing about homebrew is you typically get out of it what you put into it, the 99% who make crap, are generally going to be the people doing it to get budget friendly wine and beer, as opposed to those investing in a good product by selecting quality ingredients.
I mean, if you're comparing the guy buying a wine kit and using tap water, sure, it's going to be on par with the Baby Duck level of store bought at best, and nobody would want either of those unless the primary consideration is price point.
I know people who are proud to share their home brew, because they are making it with quality in mind, not budget. But, there are certainly people who are looking for the cheapest buzz, and can see your point about not wanting to offer that to guests.
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
100%. My buddy who makes beer invests time and money into it.
But this goes back to the original argument, keep in mind.
Do we want to be able to drive 5 mins down the road to the store and choose the wine we want for dinner tonight, or do we make it illegal so that people have to invest time and money in hopes of perfecting some recipe so they can enjoy wine with their dinner?
Because remember, that was the whole argument. Is it better to have weed products available or should it be only legal to grow it but not buy or sell it.
Because that's the whole argument.
Same with weed. My buddy invested in lights, ventilation, and all the products...makes good weed. But it's basically his second job.
Not everyone wants to have to have a second job to enjoy wine or weed.
Also, in my experience, for every person that is passionate about creating a good home made wine, there are 10 people making homemade wine for the cheapest price point. So the odds are stacked against home made wine.
coladin
Registered User
- Sep 18, 2009
- 11,985
- 4,744
I am Italian, and haven't had a bad glass of homemade wine in my life...and I am talking of a generation of Italian winemakers that would be landrd immigrants
jbeck5
Registered User
- Jan 26, 2009
- 16,791
- 3,653
Heyyy brother, pour the wine!
You're a lucky fella. There's a shit ton of cheap home made wine so the fact you've NEVER come across any is definitely something worth bragging about.
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
- 56,704
- 34,502
Oh, I'm not against having dispensaries, though I do find they have become ubiquitous, I'm just saying don't paint all homebrew with the same brush. I also think that the reason you have that 10 to 1 ratio wrt homebrew is due to the taxation; we incentivize homebrewing with a lower pricepoint by taxing the store bought but not the homebrew. If you put a giant tax on brewers yeast or something the even out the price, only those passionate about the hobby would do so and you'd change that dynamic, alternatively, if you did away with taxation on alcohol and it became as cheap to buy as Pop, you'd again only get the passionate folks brewing.
BonHoonLayneCornell
Registered User
Interesting aside on the appealing to children. It happens with alcohol just the same.I appreciate you for taking the time to gather some examples. Let's take a look!
First link, from Newswire:
View attachment 839232
A few things to observe here:
- The title of this article is: Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
- As reiterated in the first bullet point, this is about Illegal edible cannabis products (highlighted).
- it also goes on to reference Health Canada's advisory against the consumption of illegal copycat edible cannabis products, and how dangerous they can be
Link #2!
- this is a Health Canada Advisory about cannabis poisoning in children. I thought you were going to provide us with examples of legal products that have the same style of packaging as the problematic US examples I provided. Oh well.
- This Advisory goes on to provide us with a link about how to tell the difference between legal and illegal cannabis. Here is is in case you need a refresher!
Link #3 - Canna Sweets On-line Store.
So, I was admittedly surprised to see a cannabis store in Canada listing these edibles. So, I decided to look under the hood.
Lets use the Health Canada link I provided above, specifically, their criteria for identifying illegal cannabis stores.
Identifying illegal cannabis retailers
You should only purchase cannabis from legal retailers in your province or territory. Common signs to help identify an illegal cannabis retailer are:
- no age verification
- appealing packaging or products
- ships cannabis everywhere in Canada
- referral or sign up bonuses or other promotions
- requesting payment by e-transfer or cryptocurrency, credit cards are not accepted
1) Well, they have age verification, so that's a good start.
2) They have a LOT of appealing packaging on their website. This seems... shady
3) Look at that, they ship cannabis anywhere in Canada.
4) Huh, turns out they have a Referral program: My Account – Canna Sweets Mail Order Marijuana
5) And they take payment only by e-transfer!
So, out of 5 test criteria provided, CannaSweets, the example you provided, fails 4 of them.
That, my friends, is an illegal cannabis store!
If you have examples of legal cannabis stores that sell illegally packaged edibles, I'm all for entertaining a conversation about it. I'm just as happy to have a conversation about the illegal market in Canada and what the Fed and Provinces are doing or not doing to crack down on it.
All I ask that when we're discussing this, we're clear on what is and isn't illegal, and to not conflate the two, or position illegal products as being legally available.
I don't think you'll get much in the way of an argument when it comes to better enforcement of existing laws, although you may when it comes to introducing better legislation. A lack of enforcement doesn't necessarily equate to insufficient laws. It typically just points to a lack of enforcement.
It is not easy to buy candies that are marketed as kids candy on the legal market, as they simply do not exist.
Packaging laws in Canada are very stringent. Please feel free to reference Canada's Federal Packaging and Labelling laws for Cannabis Products if you wish to know more.
Therein, you'll find that packaging requirements specifically do not allow flashy packaging, imagery of any kind, require clear warnings and product information, and do not even permit seeing the product through the packaging. Kind of like cigarettes, no?
Edit: To build a bit on the whole enforcement thing, I won't unpack the difficulties law enforcement and governments have had in restricting black market physical and on-line stores, as it's a larger conversation, but I will point out that enforcement is happening, whether you hear about it or not:
Barrie shop one of seven stores busted for selling illegal cannabis
A provincial task force busted nine illegal cannabis establishments, including a Bayfield Street business.barrie.ctvnews.ca
Unlicensed Mississauga cannabis store raided, two men charged - Toronto | Globalnews.ca
According to police, "The premise has shown a blatant disregard for law enforcement as eight search warrants were executed between January 2019 and December 2022."Illegal online cannabis sales targeted by B.C. government lawsuit
Those behind the websites, who held no licence to produce or sell cannabis, then laundered the cash through numbered companies and personal accounts.N.B. peace officers raid suspected cannabis dispensary, man arrested - New Brunswick | Globalnews.ca
A 33-year-old man was arrested after police executed a search warrant at a suspected illegal cannabis dispensary in Saint John. Cash and a large quantity of cannabis were obtained.ANALYSIS: $32M bust shows police shifting focus to illegal pot deliveries
Twenty-one people, including 14 Londoners, face charges following a 16-month investigation into a cannabis trafficking network in southern Ontario that led to the s…
I note that when I take my son and nephews to BP, a couple of the drinks on the kids drink menu are made to mimic adult alcohol cocktails. That's a pretty common practice. Or all the beer and other alcohol commercials made to make it seem like the cool thing to do, obviously targeting young people. Sponsoring event after event kids are interested in. Made sure to be made available almost everywhere adults go for entertainment as if it can't be lived without.
And the most important aspect of all imo. They see all the adults around them setting the example that it's all good, alcohol is the thing to do. It's a part of our daily lives for many people. You don't get that with Cannabis since it's mostly stashed away and consumed out of sight. That's a huge understated factor with the comparison imo. My son doesn't even know what weed is or that I use it, or my brother and his older kids cuz he only ever does edibles out of sight, but they sure as shit know what adult drinks are, are curious about them and asking to "try" them, and get mad at us when we have too many and don't feel good enough to do much the next day.
Lets be honest, when it comes to marketing, there is no shame. It is my responsibility to limit access and protect my child from it. Whether it's cannabis, alcohol, prescriptions, sex, etc. there is messaging in absolutely everything these days, with much of it targeted at children. I just don't see this as much different. It's up to me to keep it away from my son. He still sees way more liquor stores and places that serve alcohol than dispensaries, or all the sex messaging even in kids movies, etc. etc.
Last edited:
StoicSensFan
ᕕ(ᐛ)ᕗ
- Feb 6, 2014
- 4,383
- 5,090
I once had a strawberry rhubarb wine a friend made which was delicious and surprisingly high in alcohol content. It was the most dangerous wine ever made.
maclean
Registered User
- Jan 4, 2014
- 8,983
- 2,925
I mean I get it, that's a rather specific cultural viewpoint though. This is true if someone with no experience or cultural exposure whatsoever is just trying to make wine for the first time. Heck grapes barely even grow in Ontario. I'm talking about people with passed down cultural knowledge making wine out of the grapes they grow themselves with care. I'm not just talking about wine but about fruit spirits as well. I'm not talking about someone buying a kit and giving it a shot. I live in the Czech Republic. It's not exactly known for its wine production, but there's good wine country in South Moravia and lots of people just make it for their own enjoyment. Even the homemade wine I've had made near Prague was quite drinkable.
AchtzehnBaby
Global Matador
I appreciate you for taking the time to gather some examples. Let's take a look!
First link, from Newswire:
View attachment 839232
A few things to observe here:
- The title of this article is: Advisory - Accidental ingestion of illegal "copycat" edible cannabis products causing serious harm to children
- As reiterated in the first bullet point, this is about Illegal edible cannabis products (highlighted).
- it also goes on to reference Health Canada's advisory against the consumption of illegal copycat edible cannabis products, and how dangerous they can be
Link #2!
- this is a Health Canada Advisory about cannabis poisoning in children. I thought you were going to provide us with examples of legal products that have the same style of packaging as the problematic US examples I provided. Oh well.
- This Advisory goes on to provide us with a link about how to tell the difference between legal and illegal cannabis. Here is is in case you need a refresher!
Link #3 - Canna Sweets On-line Store.
So, I was admittedly surprised to see a cannabis store in Canada listing these edibles. So, I decided to look under the hood.
Lets use the Health Canada link I provided above, specifically, their criteria for identifying illegal cannabis stores.
Identifying illegal cannabis retailers
You should only purchase cannabis from legal retailers in your province or territory. Common signs to help identify an illegal cannabis retailer are:
- no age verification
- appealing packaging or products
- ships cannabis everywhere in Canada
- referral or sign up bonuses or other promotions
- requesting payment by e-transfer or cryptocurrency, credit cards are not accepted
1) Well, they have age verification, so that's a good start.
2) They have a LOT of appealing packaging on their website. This seems... shady
3) Look at that, they ship cannabis anywhere in Canada.
4) Huh, turns out they have a Referral program: My Account – Canna Sweets Mail Order Marijuana
5) And they take payment only by e-transfer!
So, out of 5 test criteria provided, CannaSweets, the example you provided, fails 4 of them.
That, my friends, is an illegal cannabis store!
If you have examples of legal cannabis stores that sell illegally packaged edibles, I'm all for entertaining a conversation about it. I'm just as happy to have a conversation about the illegal market in Canada and what the Fed and Provinces are doing or not doing to crack down on it.
All I ask that when we're discussing this, we're clear on what is and isn't illegal, and to not conflate the two, or position illegal products as being legally available.
I don't think you'll get much in the way of an argument when it comes to better enforcement of existing laws, although you may when it comes to introducing better legislation. A lack of enforcement doesn't necessarily equate to insufficient laws. It typically just points to a lack of enforcement.
It is not easy to buy candies that are marketed as kids candy on the legal market, as they simply do not exist.
Packaging laws in Canada are very stringent. Please feel free to reference Canada's Federal Packaging and Labelling laws for Cannabis Products if you wish to know more.
Therein, you'll find that packaging requirements specifically do not allow flashy packaging, imagery of any kind, require clear warnings and product information, and do not even permit seeing the product through the packaging. Kind of like cigarettes, no?
Edit: To build a bit on the whole enforcement thing, I won't unpack the difficulties law enforcement and governments have had in restricting black market physical and on-line stores, as it's a larger conversation, but I will point out that enforcement is happening, whether you hear about it or not:
Barrie shop one of seven stores busted for selling illegal cannabis
A provincial task force busted nine illegal cannabis establishments, including a Bayfield Street business.Unlicensed Mississauga cannabis store raided, two men charged - Toronto | Globalnews.ca
According to police, "The premise has shown a blatant disregard for law enforcement as eight search warrants were executed between January 2019 and December 2022."Illegal online cannabis sales targeted by B.C. government lawsuit
Those behind the websites, who held no licence to produce or sell cannabis, then laundered the cash through numbered companies and personal accounts.N.B. peace officers raid suspected cannabis dispensary, man arrested - New Brunswick | Globalnews.ca
A 33-year-old man was arrested after police executed a search warrant at a suspected illegal cannabis dispensary in Saint John. Cash and a large quantity of cannabis were obtained.ANALYSIS: $32M bust shows police shifting focus to illegal pot deliveries
Twenty-one people, including 14 Londoners, face charges following a 16-month investigation into a cannabis trafficking network in southern Ontario that led to the s…
Smattering of enforcement. That is my point. Not enough.
If we had proper enforcement and control, this would not still happen.
BonHoonLayneCornell
Registered User
You should see the traffic enforcement we have up north.
Completely non existent and everybody knows it. No radars, basically no cops to be found ever doing traffic enforcement. Can't even remember the last time I saw a stop check here trying to educate all the idiots that drive over the alcohol limit.
All the DUI's tossed on technicalities. All the underagers that make it in to the bars. Hard drugs easily available despite being illegal.
I could basically ask my doctor for any prescription within reason and I'll get it. There doesn't seem to be much for effective checks and balances on them.
1 thing does not equal the other, but examples are everywhere of lack of enforcement, for things far more dangerous. Do those bother you similarly or not so much?
Last edited:
- Status
Ad
Latest posts
-
F Trevor Connelly - Providence College, Hockey East (2024, 19th, VGK)- Latest: Pavel Buchnevich
-
-
