Confirmed with Link: Scott Laughton (50% Retention), 2025 4th, 2027 6th to the Leafs for Nikita Grebenkin, conditional 2027 1st

[Roo]

I mean.. he really can't get much worse... so,

Games get simplified in the playoffs. That should help a player like him. Everyone can look at his historical numbers and understand there is more to him than we’ve seen (or not seen) so far.

Even Jake McCabe didn’t look good his first couple months with us, and look at him now. Laughton will find his form again, just a question of when.

 

[Da Mash]

So many excuses

Now the game gets simple in the playoffs ? Like Berube system is so complicated. It’s probably the most friendly, simple system in the game. These players have played the game for so long that you don’t need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Sure there is time needed to adapt to new surroundings etc but let’s just accept the fact that Laughton is just a 3rd or 4th liner that can’t play center. We could plug a AHLer in right now and not miss a beat.

I’m sorry he is a leaf fan and is an ontario boy but he is what he is.

Tre made a terrible trade here. One of the worst made by a toronto GM in years.

Over and done with. Philly stole a 1st rd pick from us.

 

[mikeyz]

So many excuses

Now the game gets simple in the playoffs ? Like Berube system is so complicated. It’s probably the most friendly, simple system in the game. These players have played the game for so long that you don’t need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Sure there is time needed to adapt to new surroundings etc but let’s just accept the fact that Laughton is just a 3rd or 4th liner that can’t play center. We could plug a AHLer in right now and not miss a beat.

I’m sorry he is a leaf fan and is an ontario boy but he is what he is.

Tre made a terrible trade here. One of the worst made by a toronto GM in years.

Over and done with. Philly stole a 1st rd pick from us.

You obviously just became a Leaf fan a year and a half ago. Either that, or, you don’t remember the Dubas era.

The Laughton trade, while it may not have been good, is absolutely nowhere near as bad as some of the trades Dubas made.

 

[leafsfan2point0]

It’s looking rough right now. The good news is it’s still very early days. If he can turn it around in the playoffs it will definitely help everyone’s view of this trade change.

 

[notbias]

You obviously just became a Leaf fan a year and a half ago. Either that, or, you don’t remember the Dubas era.

The Laughton trade, while it may not have been good, is absolutely nowhere near as bad as some of the trades Dubas made.

Which trade is worse?

It's not Treliving's worst trade (there were some bad ones in Calgary), but I think this is the worst trade from the Leafs' side in a while.

Laughton can always turn it around, but right now it is a 1st and one of our top prospects for a cap dump.

 

[mikeyz]

Which trade is worse?

It's not Treliving's worst trade (there were some bad ones in Calgary), but I think this is the worst trade from the Leafs' side in a while.

Laughton can always turn it around, but right now it is a 1st and one of our top prospects for a cap dump.

The Kadri trade for Kerfoot and Barrie?

The Foligno trade for a 1st round pick? (Foligno didn’t even score a goal for us)

The Marchment trade for Malgin? (Marchment is now 1 of the better players on Dallas)

And those 3 are just off the top of my head. All 3 of those trades alone were infinitely worse than the Laughton one.

 

[notbias]

The Kadri trade?

The Foligno trade?

And those 2 are just off the top of my head. Both of those trades alone were infinitely worse than the Laughton one.

You are delusional if you think either has been worse so far.

Less for Foligno, better player, not a cap dump.

Kadri got useful players coming back and Kadri was a liability and terrible during the playoffs.

Try again.

 

[mikeyz]

You are delusional if you think either has been worse so far.

Less for Foligno, better player, not a cap dump.

Kadri got useful players coming back and Kadri was a liability and terrible during the playoffs.

Try again.

……… Did you just say Kerfoot and Barrie were useful to us? And Kadri was terrible in the playoffs? The same Kadri who averaged a PPG the year Colorado won the cup?

And I am the delusional one???

 

[notbias]

……… Did you just say Kerfoot and Barrie were useful to us? And Kadri was terrible in the playoffs? The same Kadri who averaged a PPG the year Colorado won the cup?

And I am the delusional one???

Was Kadri good here? I don't care if he succeeded after being moved, was he good here?

It helps if you improve your reading comprehension before replying.

 

[mikeyz]

Was Kadri good here? I don't care if he succeeded after being moved, was he good here?

It helps if you improve your reading comprehension before replying.

Kadri wasn’t given a chance to be good here, he was the only player at the time who showed balls in the playoffs and he got traded just because he got suspended.

He would have been good here if dumbass Dubas kept him.

Are you seriously telling me that outside of McKinnon, Colorado has forwards who are better than Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander and who would have made Kadri look better there then here?

Ohhh, and by the way, what about the Malgin for Marchment trade? There’s another trade that was worse than Laughton.

 

[Roo]

So many excuses

Now the game gets simple in the playoffs ? Like Berube system is so complicated. It’s probably the most friendly, simple system in the game. These players have played the game for so long that you don’t need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Sure there is time needed to adapt to new surroundings etc but let’s just accept the fact that Laughton is just a 3rd or 4th liner that can’t play center. We could plug a AHLer in right now and not miss a beat.

I’m sorry he is a leaf fan and is an ontario boy but he is what he is.

Tre made a terrible trade here. One of the worst made by a toronto GM in years.

Over and done with. Philly stole a 1st rd pick from us.

14 games is still early days dude… unless you are in the ‘future of this team is bleak’ camp. Sometimes it takes time. This is just how hockey goes. Doubt he just became an AHLer overnight.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

So many excuses

Now the game gets simple in the playoffs ? Like Berube system is so complicated. It’s probably the most friendly, simple system in the game. These players have played the game for so long that you don’t need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Sure there is time needed to adapt to new surroundings etc but let’s just accept the fact that Laughton is just a 3rd or 4th liner that can’t play center. We could plug a AHLer in right now and not miss a beat.

I’m sorry he is a leaf fan and is an ontario boy but he is what he is.

Tre made a terrible trade here. One of the worst made by a toronto GM in years.

Over and done with. Philly stole a 1st rd pick from us.

I wish I could downvote this so hard...

 

[notbias]

Kadri wasn’t given a chance to be good here, he was the only player at the time who showed balls in the playoffs and he got traded just because he got suspended.

He would have been good here if dumbass Dubas kept him.

Are you seriously telling me that outside of McKinnon, Colorado has forwards who are better than Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander and who would have made Kadri look better there then here?

Kadri was given a chance, he got suspended multiple years and produced terribly, sorry if you don't like the facts.

Colorado wins with or without Kadri, infact, they won lots without him that year.

Ohhh, and by the way, what about the Malgin for Marchment trade? There’s another trade that was worse than Laughton.

Marchment was so good that after he got traded he played in the AHL.

Also, go check his playoff stats, another playoff dud.

 

[Jmo89]

The Kadri trade for Kerfoot and Barrie?

The Foligno trade for a 1st round pick? (Foligno didn’t even score a goal for us)

The Marchment trade for Malgin? (Marchment is now 1 of the better players on Dallas)

And those 3 are just off the top of my head. All 3 of those trades alone were infinitely worse than the Laughton one.

Let's not forget the first he gave to Carolina so that he could keep AJ and Kapanen only to trade them both a year later.

 

[notbias]

Let's not forget the first he gave to Carolina so that he could keep AJ and Kapanen only to trade them both a year later.

He traded a 1st for a year of both and the got more back than the first he traded.

Marleau was traded to be bought out... teams were not lining up for him.

It isn't like it was someone like Monahan who was traded with a first as a dump and then ended up being a positive asset...

 

[PanniniClaus]

So many excuses

Now the game gets simple in the playoffs ? Like Berube system is so complicated. It’s probably the most friendly, simple system in the game. These players have played the game for so long that you don’t need to be a rocket scientist to figure it out.
Sure there is time needed to adapt to new surroundings etc but let’s just accept the fact that Laughton is just a 3rd or 4th liner that can’t play center. We could plug a AHLer in right now and not miss a beat.

I’m sorry he is a leaf fan and is an ontario boy but he is what he is.

Tre made a terrible trade here. One of the worst made by a toronto GM in years.

Over and done with. Philly stole a 1st rd pick from us.

You are right - it is some of the most dumbed down, safe hockey you will find at any competitive level, let alone the NHL.

Box and 1 in the d zone and we hardly even go man to man high. So he's responsible for the right D man area. We get ourselves in trouble because we are so passive but it's a simple zone.

Strong side exits. Either on the tape or into an area for a bypass/battle. Sometimes glass on the strong side.

If he does get a clean pass, he can headman to the busting forward and sometimes hit the net front D tiptoeing through the middle.
We don't break to the middle at all via the center and sometimes we will sometimes weakside ring. Nothing complex at all.

We go North with the puck.. carry in with no pressure but usually a chip or ring, then forecheck. Not his bread and butter as he's slow and lacks force in his body checks. Better than him trying to make plays as he can't really pass, shoot or stickhandle.

NZ is a 1-2-2 basic box in the NZ. Don't allow big plays, no real tight gap.

The PK is the one area you need to get used to something different .. We play a passive Wedge and he seems to be struggling to anticipate where the danger is coming from. The hallmark of a great PK guy.

So the system excuse is just hollow.

 

[Jmo89]

He traded a 1st for a year of both and the got more back than the first he traded.

Marleau was traded to be bought out... teams were not lining up for him.

It isn't like it was someone like Monahan who was traded with a first as a dump and then ended up being a positive asset...

He traded a 13th overall pick to unload Marleau. He got decent value for Kapanen when he traded him a year later. He could have gotten the same value or close for Kapanen a year earlier and kept the pick he gave up to dump Marleau. The Kapanen trade is not dependant on the Marleau trade so don't try to wrap up their returns together.

He waited for Johnsson to lose all value before trading him when his value was much higher the year prior.

It would have ended up being the Leafs 13th overall PLUS whatever he got for Kapanen and AJ, before AJ butchered his value.

You can argue hindsight which is fair, but the moves were another one of Dubas's failures in the end.

I don't really care about Treliving. I don't think he's a very good gm and don't care about moves he made that didnt affect the Leafs. My criticism of Dubas isn't dependant on my praise for Treliving.

Dubas likely ruined the best cup window this team had in decades.

 

[Roo]

You obviously just became a Leaf fan a year and a half ago. Either that, or, you don’t remember the Dubas era.

The Laughton trade, while it may not have been good, is absolutely nowhere near as bad as some of the trades Dubas made.

Lots of rookies here nowadays.

 

[notbias]

He traded a 13th overall pick to unload Marleau. He got decent value for Kapanen when he traded him a year later. He could have gotten the same value or close for Kapanen a year earlier and kept the pick he gave up to dump Marleau. The Kapanen trade is not dependant on the Marleau trade so don't try to wrap up their returns together.

That is wasting a year, but ya, he could have.

Marleau was making 6.25 as a 4th liner, and even Lou knew this was going to happen, he probably just thought he'd be gone by then, so didn't care.

He waited for Johnsson to lose all value before trading him when his value was much higher the year prior.

Probably could have, and then they could have spent the assets on an upgrade at the deadline, someone like Johnsson.

It would have ended up being the Leafs 13th overall PLUS whatever he got for Kapanen and AJ, before AJ butchered his value.

You can argue hindsight which is fair, but the moves were another one of Dubas's failures in the end.

Sure, if you are fine waiting out contracts to compete at 100%, then he should have.

I don't think we should, but that's just me.

I don't really care about Treliving. I don't think he's a very good gm and don't care about moves he made that didnt affect the Leafs. My criticism of Dubas isn't dependant on my praise for Treliving.

Dubas likely ruined the best cup window this team had in decades.

Lou did, the ELCs we had were the best window and our big add was a 35+ year old playoff loser.

Weird to bring up that being our best cup window but also not wanting to spend the assets to move on from Marleau and also wanting to move players that helped us during that time for picks, can't have it both ways.

 

[Roo]

You are right - it is some of the most dumbed down, safe hockey you will find at any competitive level, let alone the NHL.

Box and 1 in the d zone and we hardly even go man to man high. So he's responsible for the right D man area. We get ourselves in trouble because we are so passive but it's a simple zone.

Strong side exits. Either on the tape or into an area for a bypass/battle. Sometimes glass on the strong side.

If he does get a clean pass, he can headman to the busting forward and sometimes hit the net front D tiptoeing through the middle.
We don't break to the middle at all via the center and sometimes we will sometimes weakside ring. Nothing complex at all.

We go North with the puck.. carry in with no pressure but usually a chip or ring, then forecheck. Not his bread and butter as he's slow and lacks force in his body checks. Better than him trying to make plays as he can't really pass, shoot or stickhandle.

NZ is a 1-2-2 basic box in the NZ. Don't allow big plays, no real tight gap.

The PK is the one area you need to get used to something different .. We play a passive Wedge and he seems to be struggling to anticipate where the danger is coming from. The hallmark of a great PK guy.

So the system excuse is just hollow.

lol

I said the games get simplified, I didn’t say anything about the system.

 

[PanniniClaus]

lol

I said the games get simpler, I didn’t say anything about the system. It’s the same reason why guys Luke Schenn become more effective come playoff time.

K - What attribute does he have that will see him raise his game? With Schenn.. very clear.. play his game. Tough around the net and walls and make simple plays. No risks for offense.

 

[Roo]

K - What attribute does he have that will see him raise his game? With Schenn.. very clear.. play his game. Tough around the net and walls and make simple plays. No risks for offense.

We will see. All I’m saying is we got him for the playoffs, clearly, which is a different brand of hockey. Let’s evaluate him on they as opposed to 14 regular season games.

If you don’t think he has any attributes that will translate, that is fine. But to me has speed, some offensive ability, and a bit of grit. All things that should translate well. So let’s give him a chance and see how he does. If you think this is the actual Scott Laughton that we acquired, how did he put up any production in Philly?

 

[PanniniClaus]

We will see. All I’m saying is we got him for the playoffs, clearly, which is a different brand of hockey. Let’s evaluate him on they as opposed to 14 regular season games.

If you don’t think he has any attributes that will translate, that is fine. But to me has speed, some offensive ability, and a bit of grit. All things that should translate well. So let’s give him a chance and see how he does. If you think this is the actual Scott Laughton that we acquired, how did he put up any production in Philly?

I don't know. I never paid much attention to him.. reputation only.

At the time of the deal I didn't argue with it as I figured the organization would do their due diligence. From from the moment it was determined he couldn't be the third line center... all hope was basically lost. It has been worse than I ever could have imagined.. way worse. He's a poor mans Connor Dewar, a guy that was merely taking up space but at least gave the impression he enjoyed playing hockey and was thrilled to wear a Leaf jersey.

 

[notbias]

We will see. All I’m saying is we got him for the playoffs, clearly, which is a different brand of hockey. Let’s evaluate him on they as opposed to 14 regular season games.

If you don’t think he has any attributes that will translate, that is fine. But to me has speed, some offensive ability, and a bit of grit. All things that should translate well. So let’s give him a chance and see how he does. If you think this is the actual Scott Laughton that we acquired, how did he put up any production in Philly?

I thought we were playing playoff-style hockey already?

The things you listed, ironically, Greb was better at all of them.

Laughton should be relied upon defensively if anything.

 

[Jmo89]

That is wasting a year, but ya, he could have.

Marleau was making 6.25 as a 4th liner, and even Lou knew this was going to happen, he probably just thought he'd be gone by then, so didn't care.



Probably could have, and then they could have spent the assets on an upgrade at the deadline, someone like Johnsson.



Sure, if you are fine waiting out contracts to compete at 100%, then he should have.

I don't think we should, but that's just me.



Lou did, the ELCs we had were the best window and our big add was a 35+ year old playoff loser.

Weird to bring up that being our best cup window but also not wanting to spend the assets to move on from Marleau and also wanting to move players that helped us during that time for picks, can't have it both ways.

You always have so much blame for everyone else yet none for Dubas. There's really no point in discussing it with you because you act like Dubas's single series victory is a success story. He was a complete failure here and its reflected by a number of moves he made.

Unlike you with Dubas, I don't care to defend Lou or Treliving of their failures. Tre has won nothing and I don't think he has made it past round 2.

Lou was stupid for signing a playoff loser like Marleau as well as not signing Nylander the summer before passing the reigns.

Dubas continued that failure by making himself look like the weakest possible negotiator when he let Nylander sit for half a season only to sign him for close to what the original ask was. He then continued to fail upward when he didn't sign Matthews before Tavares, and chose to sign Marner after Matthews - both at overpays relative to other RFAs and both for less than max term. He handled the RFA signings probably as bad as they possibly could be handled. I'm pretty sure Dubas even admitted this according to his quote where he said all three should have been signed prior to Tavares.

That is why I say he's primarily the reason for ruining their window. As for giving up a year of Kap and AJ, Sometimes teams take a step back for a year during a competitive window. Tampa and Colorado both did during their windows and both won. Toronto would have survived the year and been stronger after.

Also, the teams window is still open, it's just much shorter now and has a whole other set of problems.