Prospect Info: Samkow Memorial HFCBJ 2024 Summer Prospect Rankings: #10

[CBJWerenski8]

Vote for the best prospect from the above poll (listed alphabetically) and post who you think should be added from the full (remaining) list below. Criteria is that they are under 25 and haven't spent the majority of a season in the NHL.

There are no set guidelines to determine how you vote. Peak potential, likelihood of NHL career, pathway to playing time, expectations based on draft status -- any/all of these can be used at your discretion. There is no right/wrong way to vote.

The list so far:
1. Cayden Lindstrom (C)
2. Denton Mateychuk (LD)
3. David Jiricek (RD)
4. Gavin Brindley (C/RW)
5. Charlie Elick (RD)
6. Jordan Dumais (RW)
7. Jet Greaves (G)
8. Stanislav Svozil (LD)
9. Sergei Ivanov (G)

Select your add from the list below:
Luke Ashton (LD)
Ole Julian Bjorgvik-Holm (LD)
Cameron Butler (RW)
Cole Clayton (RD)
Kirill Dolzhenkov (RW)
James Fisher (RW/MOD)
Tanner Henricks (RD)
Aidan Hreschuk (LD)
Oiva Keskinen (C)
Samuel Knazko (LD)
Nolan Lalonde (G)
Nikolai Makarov (LD)
Luca Marrelli (RD)
Max McCue (C)
Hunter McKown (C)
Tyler Peddle (C)
Luca Pinelli (C)
Mikael Pyyhtia (LW)
Guillaume Richard (LD)
Martin Rysavy (LW)
Melvin Strahl (G)
Andrew Strathman (LD)

Added: Evan Gardner (G)

Add votes so far (as of 18136):
Marrelli - 4
Keskinen - 4
Fisher - 3
Pinelli - 3
Richard - 2
McKown - 1
Dolzhenkov - 1
Knazko - 1

Click to read more...

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Malatesta, add McKown

Malatesta comes up from juniors, has a respectable first year pro (including making his nhl debut and putting up 4 points in 11 NHL games), plays a hard game, and may only move up 1 or 2 spots in the rankings from last year. I’m heated

Also, not one vote yet for McKown when there was a lot of hype for him last year. I know his first full year pro was mediocre but he’s got lots of interesting tools. I like his chances of playing pro at some point this year with call ups.

 

[Aaaarrgghh]

Malatesta, add Keskinen.

 

[koteka]

Luca Marrelli, not Luca Pinelli

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

We gonna really have three goalies in the top 15-ish or so of the prospect rankings? Without going back and looking, that seems different.

With Gardner safely added (tell that to James Malatesta), I'm back to adding Fisher.

 

[Viqsi]

Malatesta, add Pinelli,

 

[squashmaple]

LDBB, add Pinelli. I like the little bulldog.

 

[EspenK]

We gonna really have three goalies in the top 15-ish or so of the prospect rankings? Without going back and looking, that seems different.

With Gardner safely added (tell that to James Malatesta), I'm back to adding Fisher.

Three goalies could be a result of any of the following or any combination thereof:

Current goalies are not universally liked or believed in
How many smurfish F's can the CBJ have on the roster
The general lack of enthusiasm in remaining prospects
We (the posters) aren't too good at projecting the future

Add DSL

 

[GoJackets1]

Add Marrelli.

Voted Gardner. Potential starting goalie > potential 3rd (likely 4th) line forward for me

 

[CBJx614]

LDBB, add Dolzy

 

[cbjthrowaway]

was between whitelaw and LDBB, voted whitelaw. add marrelli.

Malatesta comes up from juniors, has a respectable first year pro (including making his nhl debut and putting up 4 points in 11 NHL games), plays a hard game, and may only move up 1 or 2 spots in the rankings from last year. I’m heated

not denying that his stock has risen, but him staying in the same area of this specific ranking has a lot to do with the guys ahead of him (adding lindstrom/elick + strong years from greaves and ivanov).

that said… assuming malatesta wins this vote, i'd argue he's too highly ranked. he wasn't overly impressive in the AHL (and took a ton of penalties), doesn't have projectable NHL scoring tools, is physically maxed out and plays a game that tends to yield a short shelf life for guys his size.

he's a fun player and a sparkplug, but to me he's just a high-probability fourth liner. if you have a really good team already, those guys can provide value in pockets (think ryan lomberg) but i just don't see much beyond that.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Add Pinelli

 

[CBJWerenski8]

was between whitelaw and LDBB, voted whitelaw. add marrelli.


not denying that his stock has risen, but him staying in the same area of this specific ranking has a lot to do with the guys ahead of him (adding lindstrom/elick + strong years from greaves and ivanov).

that said… assuming malatesta wins this vote, i'd argue he's too highly ranked. he wasn't overly impressive in the AHL (and took a ton of penalties), doesn't have projectable NHL scoring tools, is physically maxed out and plays a game that tends to yield a short shelf life for guys his size.

he's a fun player and a sparkplug, but to me he's just a high-probability fourth liner. if you have a really good team already, those guys can provide value in pockets (think ryan lomberg) but i just don't see much beyond that.

Knocking malatesta for not having nhl scoring tools and being maxed out physically when Ivanov just got voted at #9 (and having no problem with it) for almost having similar issues is odd to me. Not saying that it’s wrong to say Malatesta has fourth line upside, I see third, but I won’t fight it. But there is far far more likelihood that Malatesta plays in the NHL rather than Ivanov imo. Regardless of how well he’s played over there.

 

[cslebn]

Add fisher

 

[majormajor]

Del Bel add Richard

 

[MissADD]

Malatesta. Add Dolzhenkov

 

[AndBoomGoesTheCannon]

Add Keskinen

 

[Xoggz22]

Add Richard

 

[CBJx614]

Knocking malatesta for not having nhl scoring tools and being maxed out physically when Ivanov just got voted at #9 (and having no problem with it) for almost having similar issues is odd to me. Not saying that it’s wrong to say Malatesta has fourth line upside, I see third, but I won’t fight it. But there is far far more likelihood that Malatesta plays in the NHL rather than Ivanov imo. Regardless of how well he’s played over there.

Therein lies the catch, imo.

If Ivanov makes it, his potential is greater than that of Malatesta. And I don't think Ivanov has that much less of a chance to make the NHL compared to Malatesta.

Why do you think the chances of Ivanov are less than Malatesta? Just because he's in the KHL?


A year ago at this time we thought Michkov was years away from playing in the NHL. And we have far more Russian players on the roster and in the system than Philly.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Knocking malatesta for not having nhl scoring tools and being maxed out physically when Ivanov just got voted at #9 (and having no problem with it) for almost having similar issues is odd to me.

well, i didn't vote for ivanov, and your comment wasn't about ivanov. i'd also argue that physical projection (filling out your frame) isn't a concern for goalies like it is for skaters.

jusse saros is listed at 180, and sergei bobrovsky's playing weight is probably around 175 or so. flexibility and quickness are more important than muscle for goalies. the same can't be said for a winger whose game is built on hitting guys and battling for pucks.

Not saying that it’s wrong to say Malatesta has fourth line upside, I see third, but I won’t fight it. But there is far far more likelihood that Malatesta plays in the NHL rather than Ivanov imo. Regardless of how well he’s played over there.

goalies inherently are harder to evaluate and have a wider range of outcomes. i'm actually opposed to ranking them alongside skaters on these types of lists.

if i had to rank both on the same list, they'd be in the same neighborhood, along with gardner and greaves (who i like, but think the fans are a bit too high on).

malatesta, to me, is clearly in a fourth 'tier' among skater prospects:

• potential top line/pair: lindstrom, jiricek, mateychuk, dumais
• potential 2nd line/pair: brindley, elick
• potential 3rd line/pair: svozil, del bel belluz, whitelaw, pinelli, marrelli, keskinen
• bottom lineup potential: malatesta, mccue, mckown, knazko, strathmann
• fringe potential: ashton, ceulemans, pyyhtia, richard
• ahl projection: butler, henricks, hreshuck, fisher, bjorkvik-holm
• not ranked (lack of info): makarov, dolzhenkov

elick is fringe tier 2/3 for me and some of the tier 3 guys (pinelli and keskinen in particular) could fizzle out in the pro ranks.

malatesta is clearly the best of the tier 4 guys for me, but the added NHL certainty, to me, doesn't outweigh the skill/upside of the guys above him, it just means he's further along in his development.

a high-probability fourth liner is still a fourth liner, and fourth liners are super replaceable.

 

[MoeBartoli]

well, i didn't vote for ivanov, and your comment wasn't about ivanov. i'd also argue that physical projection (filling out your frame) isn't a concern for goalies like it is for skaters.

jusse saros is listed at 180, and sergei bobrovsky's playing weight is probably around 175 or so. flexibility and quickness are more important than muscle for goalies. the same can't be said for a winger whose game is built on hitting guys and battling for pucks.

goalies inherently are harder to evaluate and have a wider range of outcomes. i'm actually opposed to ranking them alongside skaters on these types of lists.

if i had to rank both on the same list, they'd be in the same neighborhood, along with gardner and greaves (who i like, but think the fans are a bit too high on).

malatesta, to me, is clearly in a fourth 'tier' among skater prospects:

• potential top line/pair: lindstrom, jiricek, mateychuk, dumais
• potential 2nd line/pair: brindley, elick
• potential 3rd line/pair: svozil, del bel belluz, whitelaw, pinelli, marrelli, keskinen
• bottom lineup potential: malatesta, mccue, mckown, knazko, strathmann
• fringe potential: ashton, ceulemans, pyyhtia, richard
• ahl projection: butler, henricks, hreshuck, fisher, bjorkvik-holm
• not ranked (lack of info): makarov, dolzhenkov

elick is fringe tier 2/3 for me and some of the tier 3 guys (pinelli and keskinen in particular) could fizzle out in the pro ranks.

malatesta is clearly the best of the tier 4 guys for me, but the added NHL certainty, to me, doesn't outweigh the skill/upside of the guys above him, it just means he's further along in his development.

a high-probability fourth liner is still a fourth liner, and fourth liners are super replaceable.

While I’ll not debate your tiering regarding upside/potential, I think Malatesta will log more career NHL games than any of the players not in your top two tiers.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

While I’ll not debate your tiering regarding upside/potential, I think Malatesta will log more career NHL games than any of the players not in your top two tiers.

it's certainly possible. he's going to be in the NHL very soon, no doubt, but I'd pump the brakes on the "more career games" thing because:

1. he has a lower barrier to entry as a fourth line, 10-minute-a-night energy guy (i.e. a skilled scoring winger will need to be ready to score in the NHL before being an NHL player)
2. his profile carries higher injury risk (physical undersized fourth liner) – which could limit his availability, effectiveness and longevity
3. more NHL games ≠ more NHL impact
4. four of the six tier three guys haven't even played in the AHL yet; the two who have done so (svozil, DBB) have been more productive in the AHL than malatesta

not to mention that "number of NHL games played" ≠ "amount of NHL impact" which is what I'm basing my rankings on.

to specifically compare him to pinelli, another small forward who isn't getting any love in these rankings:

• malatesta didn't surpass point-per-game status in junior until his D+2 season
  • that season, he scored 66p in 55gp (1.2 p/gp)
  • he was fourth on his loaded QMJHL team in scoring
  • that team included a 106p scorer (rochette) and a 110p scorer (bolduc)
• luca pinelli scored at the same 1.2p/gp rate this year, but:
  • it was his D+1 year
  • he did that in the OHL, not the QMJHL
  • he led his team in scoring by 21 points
  • he scored an astounding 19% of his team's goal total (48 of 252)

in context, pinelli is far ahead of malatesta at the same age, and is playing a far bigger role. he's essentially the entire offense for the 67s. malatesta, in junior, as a 20-year-old, was a very good supporting piece for his team.

 

[majormajor]

to specifically compare him to pinelli, another small forward who isn't getting any love in these rankings:

• malatesta didn't surpass point-per-game status in junior until his D+2 season
  • that season, he scored 66p in 55gp (1.2 p/gp)
  • he was fourth on his loaded QMJHL team in scoring
  • that team included a 106p scorer (rochette) and a 110p scorer (bolduc)
• luca pinelli scored at the same 1.2p/gp rate this year, but:
  • it was his D+1 year
  • he did that in the OHL, not the QMJHL
  • he led his team in scoring by 21 points
  • he scored an astounding 19% of his team's goal total (48 of 252)

in context, pinelli is far ahead of malatesta at the same age, and is playing a far bigger role. he's essentially the entire offense for the 67s. malatesta, in junior, as a 20-year-old, was a very good supporting piece for his team.

I'm not huge on Malatesta, who I doubt we'll see play a big role, but the Pinelli comparison makes me like Malatesta more.

When I've watched Pinelli he is a feisty little player but not a particularly strong one like Malatesta is. Malatesta can battle NHLers, I don't think Pinelli will ever be able to do that. In general I think Pinelli lacks projectable traits. And you mention injury risk with Malatesta's size and playstyle, that's all true but I think it might be a bigger problem for Pinelli who doesn't have the physique to withstand it.

One minor note - the Q in general is not worse than the OHL in terms of quality or ease of scoring. Scoring is very elevated in the OHL these days. The one difference is the Maritime Division (that Dumais plays in) is garbage. The Remparts team that Malatesta won the Memorial Cup with (and playoff MVP) didn't have any easy teams in their division.

 

[SavesEmNot]

Add Keskinen.

 

[CannonFire1]

Malatesta, add Keskinen.