RW Matvei Michkov (2023, 7th, PHI) Part 6

[Kshahdoo]

Ok, so Michkov tried to play like a top player, flying out of the zone before his team had puck possession. And in that way he scored 3 goals in last 26 games, while having by far the worst plus-minus amongst Flyers forwards in that span. If that doesn't work well for him maybe he should change something in his approach?

Michkov played his hockey and was almost a PPG player, but then Tortorella decided Matvei played it wrong, and look where he is now. Btw it's exactly the same situation that happened to Kuzmenko on Vancouver in his 2nd season. Kuzmenko started that season great, was almost PPG, but Tocchet thought Kuzmenko played it wrong and tried to force him to play it right. And then what?

Pretty typical situation for "systematic coaches" in the NHL. Good coaches build their systems based on players they have. Coaches like Tocchet and Tortorella try to squeeze players into their miraculous systems because they think their systems are good for any players, and if it doesn't work, it's the player's fault not system's. And then sooner or later the system stops working, and teams fire them. It's always like this. Every f***ing time.

 

[Kshahdoo]

I don't think blowing the zone in this sort of situation is where Michkov will pick up enough points to justify the cost. I've seen him do it many many times, and score some points that way, but it's not worth it. He has to wait until his team has the puck. He'll still score a ton of points in other ways so I don't get why he should be stubborn about it.



Nah. It immediately puts Couturier in a position where he has to cover two guys, and Seeler sees that and so he slides over and that opens up yet another free attacker in the slot. The far side Islanders D man has a Flyers winger assigned to him, so it's really a 4 v 3 in the zone after Michkov leaves the area.

First, Richard was pretty close to Holmstrom but somehow decided to cover Pageau who should be covered by Seeler. Second, Drysdale failed to push Cizikas away from the net so they both screened the goalie. Third, Michkov basically neutralized NYI defenseman who could play in the attack as well and give the opponents more options.

To me Matvei did it right, but others played it terrible, especially Drysdale.

 

[PenguinSuitedUp]

That's usually what top players do. I mean Michkov scored tons of goals this way in different leagues, and Flyers scored 1, 1, 4, 0, 0 goals in their 5 last games. If the system doesn't work it should be changed.

The system would work if Michkov played his position there.

 

[ViD]

Imagine if the Hawks were benching Bedard for his defensive plays and inability to win face offs

 

[Kshahdoo]

The system would work if Michkov played his position there.

What way would it work? Even if the Flyers could take away the puck, NYI would have got back and ready to protect their zone. We know now how it worked offensively. Zero goals in the last 2 games...

 

[Sam de Mtl]

People make so many excuses for Michkov

As if Torts should build a system around this guy but wanting to play D instead of asking him to buy in, as his teammates are doing.

 

[FlyguyOX]

Michkov vs Torts... Michkov was benched after this and played just 8:30 overall.

Two competitors. I love it.

The Flyers don't need to trade their best asset. They need to figure out why they have a coach who doesn't win and rubs people the wrong way.

The coach wins more than he should

Imagine if the Hawks were benching Bedard for his defensive plays and inability to win face offs

He'd be better off for it in the long run. Imagine letting your young rookie star get away with whatever he wants for marketing purposes. What a great locker room that makes

 

[FourQuarters]

I don't think it's about "if it's Michkov's fault", every young player has their flaws and needs to fix them. But benching them may not be the best way to develop them.

 

[kanersen]

I'm a big Michkov fan but every young player needs to overcome diversity to succeed, Michkov is no exception.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I'm a big Michkov fan but every young player needs to overcome diversity to succeed, Michkov is no exception.

And adversity

What way would it work? Even if the Flyers could take away the puck, NYI would have got back and ready to protect their zone. We know now how it worked offensively. Zero goals in the last 2 games...

By preventing the other team from scoring. A goal prevented counts the same as a goal scored.

 

[GlassesJacketShirt]

I'm a big Michkov fan but every young player needs to overcome diversity to succeed, Michkov is no exception.

Agreed, those darn DEI policies keep getting in the way.

In the end, Michkov either didn't understand his assignment or made a selfish play and he got benched, not my favorite tactic but at least it's something the team is trying to address for longer term success. The idea that they should design their entire system around a good but not world beating 20 year old rookie is ridiculous.

And if people bring up Bedard's name as a way to deflect, then my response is that's Chicago's problem to deal with. If they are unsatisfied with his effort defensively but refuse to address it, then it's a weak organization that will suck for the next decade to come.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Michkov played his hockey and was almost a PPG player, but then Tortorella decided Matvei played it wrong, and look where he is now. Btw it's exactly the same situation that happened to Kuzmenko on Vancouver in his 2nd season. Kuzmenko started that season great, was almost PPG, but Tocchet thought Kuzmenko played it wrong and tried to force him to play it right. And then what?

Pretty typical situation for "systematic coaches" in the NHL. Good coaches build their systems based on players they have. Coaches like Tocchet and Tortorella try to squeeze players into their miraculous systems because they think their systems are good for any players, and if it doesn't work, it's the player's fault not system's. And then sooner or later the system stops working, and teams fire them. It's always like this. Every f***ing time.

He stopped being a PPG player because he stopped benefiting from unsustainable puck luck. Since then, his puck luck has been unsustainably bad. He's experiencing regression to the mean.

 

[Zine]

He'd be better off for it in the long run. Imagine letting your young rookie star get away with whatever he wants for marketing purposes. What a great locker room that makes

Marketing? Bedard is given free reign because the Hawks are rebuilding, which gives them a perfect opportunity to developing Bedard's strengths. Weaknesses can always be shored up slowly, over time. He's only 19.

The same should be done with Michkov considering the Flyers aren't making the playoffs. Unfortunately Torts is too stubborn for this. He'd rather adhere to his rigid system, which means coaching the creativity out of Michkov.

 

[Sombastate]

I mean anyone who has watched the flyers this year can agree that Michkov looks exhausted. Anyone who is watching the flyers this year should also be able to agree that it “appears” as though Torts is deliberately sabotaging him

 

[FlyguyOX]

Take a look at Kucherov's career progression in terms of on-ice usage.

 

[PenguinSuitedUp]

What way would it work? Even if the Flyers could take away the puck, NYI would have got back and ready to protect their zone. We know now how it worked offensively. Zero goals in the last 2 games...

He would have prevented a goal. That’s the point of playing defense.

 

[Frank Drebin]

I don't think it's about "if it's Michkov's fault", every young player has their flaws and needs to fix them. But benching them may not be the best way to develop them.

I see this as game 50. Its probably not the first time they've had this chat, during a game or in practice. Some pretty ingrained bad habits. But not impossible to fix.

The same should be done with Michkov considering the Flyers aren't making the playoffs. Unfortunately Torts is too stubborn for this. He'd rather adhere to his rigid system, which means coaching the creativity out of Michkov.

he wasn't benched for an offensive play like attempting the michigan or a drop pass that didn't work out.
He was benched because of a lazy play in his own end where he was cheating out of the zone, in a 0-0 game, in the second period. No place for that type of cheating in that type of game.

 

[kp61c]

in the khl he looked entitled and didn't give a damn about defense. that's why he played in sochi and was allowed to terminate his contract with ska. some progress is obvious in that regard. alas, it was made at the cost of offense. a couple of points in the last 30 games or so is impressive.

 

[rielledup]

It's an interesting argument how many more goals does your team score than they allow if you let a highly skilled player cheat in their own end vs if you never allow them to do that?

 

[JoeThorntonsRooster]

Michkov played his hockey and was almost a PPG player, but then Tortorella decided Matvei played it wrong, and look where he is now. Btw it's exactly the same situation that happened to Kuzmenko on Vancouver in his 2nd season. Kuzmenko started that season great, was almost PPG, but Tocchet thought Kuzmenko played it wrong and tried to force him to play it right. And then what?

Pretty typical situation for "systematic coaches" in the NHL. Good coaches build their systems based on players they have. Coaches like Tocchet and Tortorella try to squeeze players into their miraculous systems because they think their systems are good for any players, and if it doesn't work, it's the player's fault not system's. And then sooner or later the system stops working, and teams fire them. It's always like this. Every f***ing time.

Michkov in his first 27 games had 27 points with 14.12% on-ice shooting.

In his last 24 games he has 7 points with 5.38% on-ice shooting.

Torts may or may have changed some things but it’s not his fault that Michkov and his linemates are suddenly scoring on their shots at barely 1/3 the rate they used to, and that is by far the biggest driver in the drop in scoring.

 

[Frank Drebin]

It's an interesting argument how many more goals does your team score than they allow if you let a highly skilled player cheat in their own end vs if you never allow them to do that?

I think there is a time to cheat and a time not to cheat. But you cannot play like that all the time.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don’t know why people think that other coaches don’t try to get players to learn from their mistakes. No one is even arguing against that.

No one goes about it and stifles young talent like Torts.

 

[MoneyManny]

That's usually what top players do. I mean Michkov scored tons of goals this way in different leagues, and Flyers scored 1, 1, 4, 0, 0 goals in their 5 last games. If the system doesn't work it should be changed.

Michkov is a rookie, not a "top player". And whether the system works or not isn't really his business, and it's an entirely new discussion. If the coach doesn't do his job well the GM should fire him. Insubordination and ignoring assigments is never gonna make the team any better.

 

[MoneyManny]

I don't think it's about "if it's Michkov's fault", every young player has their flaws and needs to fix them. But benching them may not be the best way to develop them.

If said player talks back to his coach and resists fixing his game or fails to acknowledge his need to, that's usually when the benching happens.

Is Torts supposed to send a bouquet of roses to Matvei's hotel room with a card that asks him with sweet words to pretty please stop abandoning his teammates?

How do you suggest a coach discipline his players?

 

[Frank Drebin]

If said player talks back to his coach and resists fixing his game or fails to acknowledge his need to, that's usually when the benching happens.

Is Torts supposed to send a bouquet of roses to Matvei's hotel room with a card that asks him with sweet words to pretty please stop abandoning his teammates?

How do you suggest a coach discipline his players?

Like I said earlier. This is game 50 of his first season not game 5. Torts and Matvei have seen eachother daily for over 4 months. I am positive that this isn't the first time they've had this conversation. When the player can't or won't listen, there is only one option.