RW Matvei Michkov (2023, 7th, PHI) Part 4

[FlyguyOX]

All of this character stuff is bullshift. I don't care about Bobrov. I don't care about noise MCs from mtl media, guy is competitive and wants to win. This is what you will see from any high talented player. In any interview he is very nice guy and he is big fan of hockey who works a lot and works hard.

But yeah, we can believe in character issues until some Whitney trash can level person will say that he didn't like to play with him in his tenure.

Exact same thing as Mackinnon. Been saying it for a while.

Athletic article spells that out from Flyers sources, too. It also states Flyers had him as 2nd best player on their board and tried to trade up for him, even having Gauthier on the table. Pretty crazy habs and others didn't take that trade.

 

[FlyguyOX]

I wasn't quoting HP. I mentioned them and then later discussed some issues that scouts have brought up at various points.

But you don't think they think he's small? Is him being small in dispute?

It's utterly weird that we can debate why NHL teams have a tendency to pass on smaller players, it's a huge topic on these boards every year. But when teams pass on Michkov there is a huge resistance from Michkov stans to the idea that teams may have factored in that he was small. Like to even factor it in along with everything else good and bad is just an impossibility to you.

Yeah and Bedard will be a failure because he's small, too.

I spoke with someone very high up in SKA last summer and he specifically cited Michkov's size and skating as reasons why they're not so high on him over on the team. Nothing about attitude or whatever.

(I won't say who it was, so don't ask)

Ah, sure, sure. I'm sure they just watched him be their best player in preseason and said "nah, still too slow and small, he won't help us".

 

[ReHabs]

Ah, sure, sure. I'm sure they just watched him be their best player on preseason and said "nah, still too slow and small, he won't help us".

Well, I'm a die-hard Habs fan and I asked him if the Habs messed up and he said (paraphrasing) "I'm not so sure. He's not big enough to play in the NHL I think. And he's not fast enough" I brought up his shot and vision and my counterpart said (paraphrasing) that for sure he's very skilled but getting to the right places will be tough for him unless he improves his skating and power. (I also asked about Slafkovsky, he said he didn't know much about him -- hah!)

The off-ice stuff was little more than smears, that's the point I was trying to make.

I still prefer Michkov's upside to Reinbacher's and I'm a big big fan of Michkov ever since I've heard of him but I think it's a legitimate hockey consideration and since it came from the horse's mouth (so to speak) I feel more sanguine about the situation. I'm rooting for Michkov and posted as much multiple times over the past few months.

 

[ybnvs]

Your expectations are way too high. Personally, I'm just happy to watch him play in the NHL. We'll see about the rest. Especially knowing about his history of healthy scratches I think we have to be patient. Torts isn't gonna be more forgiving than Michkov's KHL coaches. If Michkov manages to play a full season without getting healthy scratched I'll consider it a success regardless of his offensive contributions.

Healthy scratched?

By Rotenberg on SKA? That comes with a caveat, a coach with a seeming vendetta against Michkov.

In Sochi? He had pneumonia, twice. "Healthy" scratch is an oxymoron.

 

[FlyguyOX]

Healthy scratched?

By Rotenberg on SKA? That comes with a caveat, a coach with a seeming vendetta against Michkov.

In Sochi? He had pneumonia, twice. "Healthy" scratch is an oxymoron.

Roternberg did the same stuff with every other NHL player that was drafted and played for his team. He simply doesn't want to play players drafted by the NHL.

 

[ybnvs]

Roternberg did the same stuff with every other NHL player that was drafted and played for his team. He simply doesn't want to play players drafted by the NHL.

He's part of the oligarch royalty. Bow to him, or else!

 

[JRichard]

Exact same thing as Mackinnon. Been saying it for a while.

Athletic article spells that out from Flyers sources, too. It also states Flyers had him as 2nd best player on their board and tried to trade up for him, even having Gauthier on the table. Pretty crazy habs and others didn't take that trade.

Didnt take Gauthier and 7th for 5th bc it was never on table.

Same for Foerster and 7th.

—-

Fans from team with Cole Caufield and Lane Hutson talking about size…

 

[ValeriKamensky]

You guys mentioned Bedard in this thread so often, as if you really think Michkov is on the same level. You don’t think so, right? Right?

 

[majormajor]

Well, I'm a die-hard Habs fan and I asked him if the Habs messed up and he said (paraphrasing) "I'm not so sure. He's not big enough to play in the NHL I think. And he's not fast enough" I brought up his shot and vision and my counterpart said (paraphrasing) that for sure he's very skilled but getting to the right places will be tough for him unless he improves his skating and power.

I think that coach/manager overstates the case, but it's another example that yes, hockey people do think about size and skating issues with Michkov.

Here's a whole set of examples, from a group of scouts that Pronman interviewed, that I think covers the range of opinion on Michkov well. It's from a recent article comparing Demidov and Michkov.

“I’d be concerned on Demidov for the same reason I was concerned on Michkov. He’s a small, slow Russian winger who we didn’t get to scout live all season. We all see the skill, he’s stupid talented, but in the top five you need to be sure, and I don’t see how teams can be that sure.”

“Demidov’s game is way more direct. His habits are much better than Michkov’s. Mickov is extremely talented and a heck of a hockey player, but I know who my coach is going to prefer to lean on come playoff time and it’s Demidov.”

“Michkov was in the conversation with Connor Bedard for us. That should tell you how highly we think of the player. It’s not even a conversation. His hockey sense and skill are off the charts.”

“Demidov is an excellent player, but he’s only played against junior players and I don’t love the quality of competition of that league. Michkov did it versus men in his draft year. He was great at the U20 level, the U18 level, even with the senior Russian team. He displayed consistency across high levels of competition.”

“I think with Michkov you always know he’s going to score, but his game can give you some headaches. He lacks pace, he doesn’t play very hard. Demidov has less of those issues even if he’s not an amazing skater. He also seems to have less drama around him. I’d feel more comfortable picking Demidov.”

It really says something about the way many scouts think, that there was concern that Demidov was small and slow. He's much bigger and faster than Michkov, so of course there is a lot of concern about Michkov's size and speed.

Here's Pronman in that article, in the course of explaining why he prefers Michkov to Demidov:

My lean is to Michkov. I respect that the way Demidov plays looks like a more translatable pro style. He works a lot harder, and generates much more offense around the net front. I do think Michkov’s puck play, as I thought in his draft season, is just too special. It’s a freakish combination of skill and hockey sense that despite severe limitations in other areas of his game, has led to massive levels of success at various levels.

"Severe limitations" is of course not a phrase that you hear everyday about a top pick.

Each and every experts ONLY issue was contract. He was up there with Bedard otherwise, to pretend any different is ignorant

I'll just reply to this here so you can do a little reading.

Why is it that Michkov fans seem exceptionally delusional?

 

[ReHabs]

Why is it that Michkov fans seem exceptionally delusional?

Have you seen the anti-Michkov smears? Come on, it's just crazy. Some of us who want to get it right are stuck in the middle.

I still believe in his upside but it's clear scouts like to lean on physicality and athleticism a lot more than fans do.

 

[FlyguyOX]

Didnt take Gauthier and 7th for 5th bc it was never on table.

Same for Foerster and 7th.

—-

Fans from team with Cole Caufield and Lane Hutson talking about size…

It was reported in the Athletic that the flyers were trying to move up and had Gauthier on the table.

 

[majormajor]

Have you seen the anti-Michkov smears? Come on, it's just crazy. Some of us who want to get it right are stuck in the middle.

I still believe in his upside but it's clear scouts like to lean on physicality and athleticism a lot more than fans do.

The issue is that some here consider it a smear to call him small or slow, or to bring up work rate or any number of other issues in his on ice game. You can't talk about pluses and minuses with Michkov like you can with a normal prospect.

Defending him from actual smears is great though. Keep doing it.

 

[ReHabs]

The issue is that some here consider it a smear to call him small or slow, or to bring up work rate or any number of other issues in his on ice game. You can't talk about pluses and minuses with Michkov like you can with a normal prospect.

Defending him from actual smears is great though. Keep doing it.

The smears like "his father was murdered" (David Amber of TSN Sportsnet said it on live TV), "he's a bad person and teammate", "he's connected to organised crime", etc.

 

[Fatass]

The smears like "his father was murdered" (David Amber of TSN said it on live TV), "he's a bad person and teammate", "he's connected to organised crime", etc.

Amber said that? You have a link? He’s often on local radio and he appears to be someone who chooses his words more carefully.

 

[ReHabs]

Amber said that? You have a link? He’s often on local radio and he appears to be someone who chooses his words more carefully.

I watched the draft live and he sure as hell said that. Maybe you can find a clip of the draft.

 

[Fatass]

I watched the draft live and he sure as hell said that. Maybe you can find a clip of the draft.

You’re the one posting those comments as quotes from a respected hockey reporter. You need to post the link to your source. Those are very inflammatory quotes, and IMO not things Amber would say.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Hope this kid tears it up

 

[Hinterland]

The smears like "his father was murdered" (David Amber of TSN said it on live TV), "he's a bad person and teammate", "he's connected to organised crime", etc.

There are definitely some red flags that make me wonder if Michkov is gonna get along with Torts. His unwillingness to follow the process in his draft year which frustrated even long tenured Russian born NHL scouts, him getting repeatedly healthy scratched, his lack of intensity, his lackluster play against the puck. If Michkov manages to get along with Torts and not get scratched then I'll consider that a huge success.

The stuff you posted is wrong though. There's no proof of any of this. It's fake news. Also, David Amber left TSN years ago so I'm calling bs on that one.

 

[Kshahdoo]

There are definitely some red flags that make me wonder if Michkov is gonna get along with Torts. His unwillingness to follow the process in his draft year which frustrated even long tenured Russian born NHL scouts, him getting repeatedly healthy scratched, his lack of intensity, his lackluster play against the puck. If Michkov manages to get along with Torts and not get scratched then I'll consider that a huge success.

The stuff you posted is wrong though. There's no proof of any of this. It's fake news. Also, David Amber left TSN years ago so I'm calling bs on that one.

Do you copy/paste your posts?

 

[Redpath]

If there is any team would might worry about archaic interview formalities, "red flags", and character issues of an undersized Russian, it'd probably be the Flyers.

It should speak volumes that they didn't see any issue with these supposed concerns.

 

[Hinterland]

If there is any team would might worry about archaic interview formalities, "red flags", and character issues of an undersized Russian, it'd probably be the Flyers.

It should speak volumes that they didn't see any issue with these supposed concerns.

The good thing is that because it's Torts coaching the Flyers we're gonna find out shortly whether Michkov is the real deal or Dubois 2.0/Johansen 2.0.

 

[FlyguyOX]

There are definitely some red flags that make me wonder if Michkov is gonna get along with Torts. His unwillingness to follow the process in his draft year which frustrated even long tenured Russian born NHL scouts, him getting repeatedly healthy scratched, his lack of intensity, his lackluster play against the puck. If Michkov manages to get along with Torts and not get scratched then I'll consider that a huge success.

The stuff you posted is wrong though. There's no proof of any of this. It's fake news. Also, David Amber left TSN years ago so I'm calling bs on that one.

"Why did some of the Flyers’ scouts have reservations? Along with the lengthy KHL contract likely delaying his arrival — if he was to come at all — there had been some rumblings about Michkov’s character, that perhaps he wasn’t a great teammate or felt a bit too entitled to big minutes and playing in key situations.

The scouts questioned Michkov’s “want, and will, and character,” according to one person in the room at the time.

They got the answers they wanted to hear. Michkov admitted, according to the source, that he needed to learn that not everyone was at his level. That his teammates’ inability to do certain things on the ice didn’t stem from a lack of commitment or dedication to hockey. If there were ever feelings of frustration from Michkov, they were simply born from his competitiveness. That was reinforced to the Flyers through interviews with some of Michkov’s teammates, too, that the club also spoke with in the days leading up to the draft."

From The Athletic article this morning. His character concerns are no more worrisome than Mackinnon's. And what does Torts hate more than anything? Losing. They'll get along just fine. Torts loves the fire.

 

[Fyodorov]

You guys mentioned Bedard in this thread so often, as if you really think Michkov is on the same level. You don’t think so, right? Right?

Obviously a lot of people do. Bedard's rookie year didn't really dispel any of those thoughts.

 

[thebestnic]

Interested how much of a bump to the Flyers pp ranking he's gonna bring. They were easily a playoff team with a middle of the road pp. My fellow Habs fan need to go watch Frozen though !

 

[57special]

They can't. My understanding is they can structure his ELC in a way that provides him with cash/bonuses that he can then use to pay SKA to buy himself out of his contract.

But that would involve him signing a contract with a NHL club while already being under contract to SKA. That can't be legal, can it?