Prospect Info: Rutger McGroarty, 2022 NHL Draft, #14 Overall

[WolfHouse]

It doesn't hurt Chevy at all to leave mcgro in the ncaa for a year... the reality is that there's no space for him anyway

 

[hockeyarena]

I am hopeful that Cheveldayoff is able to sign McGroarty AND brings back Patrik Laine! I would be on cloud 9!

And imagine Laine comes in after quitting video games and taking the captain America syrum fahgetaboutit that'd be lit

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Perfetti saucing passes to Laine? Yes please. Just let Laine be Laine. Don’t try to reinvent him.

He is not the same player he was 8 years ago. And he was flawed then. And now he carries a cap hit of 8.7 mil.

 

[surixon]

If we got him back, you have to reinvent him to some extent. There isn't much place in today's NHL, for a player who just takes saucer passes and doesn't do much else. Did you see even a single player in the playoffs play that role? He would no doubt help our PP, but I would hope as his career goes on and he gets himself mentally healthy, that he works on becoming a much more complete player, including the dedication to the off ice work needed. Saying that, I'm probably more open to bringing Laine back than most posters around here.

I think Laine's game is more rounded then it was. His metrics are a decent amount better now then they were with us. He actually does most of his scoring at 5 on 5 these days and is a positive goal differential player even on Columbus. His pp numbers have actually fallen off a lot. He may not be the solution there as I think his shot has taken a hit.

I definitely think he could fit in well with Cole but I think they'd need a speedy puck pursuit player as the third on their line.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

If we got him back, you have to reinvent him to some extent. There isn't much place in today's NHL, for a player who just takes saucer passes and doesn't do much else. Did you see even a single player in the playoffs play that role? He would no doubt help our PP, but I would hope as his career goes on and he gets himself mentally healthy, that he works on becoming a much more complete player, including the dedication to the off ice work needed. Saying that, I'm probably more open to bringing Laine back than most posters around here.

I'm open to having him back too. Under the right circumstances, as a project. But I'm not about to openly call for getting him back.

 

[ps241]

He is not the same player he was 8 years ago. And he was flawed then. And now he carries a cap hit of 8.7 mil.

Given his injury history and other more recent challenges Winnipeg only does this with retention and even then I don’t see that as a road TNSE would want to go down again.

 

[surixon]

He is not the same player he was 8 years ago. And he was flawed then. And now he carries a cap hit of 8.7 mil.

He's worse in some ways and better in others from what I've seen. He's not a big liability 5 on 5 but doesn't have the same shot and isn't near as impactful on the pp.

 

[KingBogo]

The GMs job is to put fans in the seats.
The first GM of Tampa ... Phil Esposito after signing the first female to an NHL contract stated: "I don't care what anybody thinks, I'd be a liar if I said I wasn't using it for the publicity. The fact is, if I could put a horse in goal ...." if it bring people to the game.

I think hockey markets have evolved since then. The Florida markets now know what winning hockey looks like and no longer need gimmicks to put fans in the seats. But lets try to put a real value on Rutger. By all reports, the best offer Chevy had going into the draft was #13 O/A from Minny depending if a player they wanted wasn't there. As it turned out a player they really wanted was still available at #12 and they traded up using a 3rd round pick to move up. So for the GM that had the best offer on the table, #13 was worth more than Rutger and a 3rd round pick. And this was considered to be a weak draft. So realistically Rutger is at best worth a 15-20 O/A pick going forward, or some combination of players that a GM sees as approximately worth that.

 

[surixon]

Given his injury history and other more recent challenges there is zero chance Winnipeg takes him without serious retention and even then I don’t see that as a road TNSE would want to go down again.

Not even if it would give a boost to ticket sales :p. He defitely was a very popular player here.

 

[KingBogo]

I'm open to having him back too. Under the right circumstances, as a project. But I'm not about to openly call for getting him back.

I'm pretty much in the same boat.

 

[ps241]

Not even if it would give a boost to ticket sales :p. He defitely was a very popular player here.

That might motivate Mark if true but I’m not sure it would translate to ticket sales unless it lead to winning.

 

[KingBogo]

That might motivate Mark if true but I’m not sure it would translate to ticket sales unless it lead to winning.

The one thing with Laine is the dream still lives. What if his stint in the player assistance program allowed him to find himself and refocus his life? And now at age 26 he starts working towards the player he can be? If you got him for a song and retention it could turn out to be one hell of a move. He probably is 100% loyal to the organization going forward and just maybe we get the player we drafted 2nd O/A in 2016 after all. Or maybe I'm just grasping at straws?

 

[surixon]

That might motivate Mark if true but I’m not sure it would translate to ticket sales unless it lead to winning.

Clearly winning would also be a requirement for that.

But if this where to happen i think the org and Laine would have to have a lengthy conversation about expectations and buy in.

We were at our best with a young electric albiwt flawed Laine in the fold. Maybe we can capture some of that magic again if he came back.

Do I expect it to happen, no as life isn't a fairy tale lol, but I'm with you in that what does this org actually have to lose at this point. Chevy has done his best to mitigate the talent drain with useful vets but as we've seen that only gets you so far. If a high end talent wants back in and is willing to play ball then I don't think we can afford to say no.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think Chevy really needs to take care of the Rutger issue. Apparently he was close at the draft with Minny, but that ship has sailed. I'm not sure he is going to get a premium prospect back? While Rutger is a good prospect, he is still is only likely to be a middle 6 winger in the NHL. And his so called leadership qualities have taken a pretty significant hit. I think Chevy needs to take the best deal possible over the next few days and move on. There seems to be enough interest to get pretty good value back. Maybe something like Barron and Beck from the Habs. 2 good prospects/young players, a center and a RHD, a notch below blue chip, but both likely to be NHLers in some capacity.

I still hope for a better return, but we might need to accept less. Not sure either of those is a good prospect. I hope we don't have to go that low. I agree it should be done soon.

I expect more from him than you apparently do. But time will tell.

 

[Scheifele55]

I find it sad that we were 4th best in the NHL and we still had issues selling tickets...

 

[KingBogo]

I still hope for a better return, but we might need to accept less. Not sure either of those is a good prospect. I hope we don't have to go that low. I agree it should be done soon.

I expect more from him than you apparently do. But time will tell.

Barron is still only 22 and was a 1st round pick and is a RHD. Still lots of promise there, and probably more then we should have for Heinola. Beck is only 20 and a center who was picked #33, 2 years ago and had a really nice junior season with 81 points in 57 games. Also played on the world junior team and had a nice playoffs and Memorial cup with with 4 goals in 5 games. He is far from a nothing prospect.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

NCAA guys don’t “have to wait 4 years”

it’s 100% their own choice.

they could enter a jr draft if they want.
they choose the NCAA And delaying their. careers

more I honestly believe they hinder their development because they play so few games against amature boys when if they went the typical pro route they would already be playing against professional men.

I’ve seen as many college players flop as I’ve seen hit … and more than a few Hobbey Baker award finalists.

Yes, it is their choice, or choices. They don't have to wait 4 years. They can choose to sign with the team that drafted them, or not. Like CHL players.

Most of the best prospects in NCAA sign after their D+2 season if not sooner. Same as a CHL player finishing his jr career. They are generally pretty well prepared. Fewer games, more practice and coaching.

Of course a lot flop. Don't a lot of Euro players and CHL players flop? Hobey baker nominees tend to more often be 3rd and 4th year players. So a lot of the better players are not even considered.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

It doesn't hurt Chevy at all to leave mcgro in the ncaa for a year... the reality is that there's no space for him anyway

I don't agree with that. 2 years away is a long time to a 20 YO. 1 year away to a 21 YO is not nearly as long. It is just too close to UFA at that point. Or maybe he narrows the field to just 1 team he will sign with, like Fox did.

The sooner it gets done, the better.

 

[tbcwpg]

I find it sad that we were 4th best in the NHL and we still had issues selling tickets...

We stopped having issues selling tickets once the playoffs were coming up and the team had something to play for. Winning sells, rebuilds don't.

 

[blues10]

NCAA guys don’t “have to wait 4 years”

it’s 100% their own choice.

they could enter a jr draft if they want.
they choose the NCAA And delaying their. careers

more I honestly believe they hinder their development because they play so few games against amature boys when if they went the typical pro route they would already be playing against professional men.

I’ve seen as many college players flop as I’ve seen hit … and more than a few Hobbey Baker award finalists.

There was only two 17 year olds in all of Div 1 hockey that I was aware. Cellebrini and Buim.

Yes, NCAA play less games but more of a pro experience at the big schools like UND and Denver. Top notch training facilities. UND may be better than the Jets with their altitude training on campus. Fly charter, top hotels etc…..
There is also a transfer portal where teams like Central Michigan stock up on players 20+ years old.

NCAA May not play a lot of games but the league is pretty damn good. Wait till CHL players start moving to the NCAA once the rule change is official.

 

[KingBogo]

There was only two 17 year olds in all of Div 1 hockey that I was aware. Cellebrini and Buim.

Yes, NCAA play less games but more of a pro experience at the big schools like UND and Denver. Top notch training facilities. UND may be better than the Jets with their altitude training on campus. Fly charter, top hotels etc…..
There is also a transfer portal where teams like Central Michigan stock up on players 20+ years old.

NCAA May not play a lot of games but the league is pretty damn good. Wait till CHL players start moving to the NCAA once the rule change is official.

Hopefully they change player signing rules at some point.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Given his injury history and other more recent challenges Winnipeg only does this with retention and even then I don’t see that as a road TNSE would want to go down again.

Retention and a favourable price. Like a good return on Mcg and/or Ehlers.

He's worse in some ways and better in others from what I've seen. He's not a big liability 5 on 5 but doesn't have the same shot and isn't near as impactful on the pp.

Over his last several years. The last year maybe not that either, though he didn't play much.

He could be a good player, but he would be a big risk.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think hockey markets have evolved since then. The Florida markets now know what winning hockey looks like and no longer need gimmicks to put fans in the seats. But lets try to put a real value on Rutger. By all reports, the best offer Chevy had going into the draft was #13 O/A from Minny depending if a player they wanted wasn't there. As it turned out a player they really wanted was still available at #12 and they traded up using a 3rd round pick to move up. So for the GM that had the best offer on the table, #13 was worth more than Rutger and a 3rd round pick. And this was considered to be a weak draft. So realistically Rutger is at best worth a 15-20 O/A pick going forward, or some combination of players that a GM sees as approximately worth that.

But the statement that a GM's real job is to put bums in the seats is correct. The method chosen to do that is to build a winning, or at least exciting team.

 

[surixon]

Retention and a favourable price. Like a good return on Mcg and/or Ehlers.



Over his last several years. The last year maybe not that either, though he didn't play much.

He could be a good player, but he would be a big risk.

Agreed that it would be a risk but I think this org needs to start taking more of them if they actually want to win it all.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Barron is still only 22 and was a 1st round pick and is a RHD. Still lots of promise there, and probably more then we should have for Heinola. Beck is only 20 and a center who was picked #33, 2 years ago and had a really nice junior season with 81 points in 57 games. Also played on the world junior team and had a nice playoffs and Memorial cup with with 4 goals in 5 games. He is far from a nothing prospect.

I didn't say they were nothing.

Beck made the WJC team and scored 1 pt in 5 games, a goal. His OHL numbers would have looked good in his draft year. 2 years on, not so much. Not bad, not great.

Barron has completed D+4 and hasn't been able to establish himself on a weak D corps. He seems to have come close, but not quite. So looks like projecting as a 3rd pair man in the NHL.

Better than getting a 2nd in a couple of years, but pretty poor value for McGroarty. I'm prepared to be disappointed by the return. Not that disappointed, I hope.