Rumor: Rumours & Proposals - (Chia discussion will be met with a threadban)

[belair]

This only happens when it's a rumour that makes Edmonton look bad/whats don't want.

If it was the opposite fans would be burning their keyboards talking about it. He's reliable.

Num, num, num, num, num....eat up the bullshit.

Dreger hasn't been a reliable pundit since Nonis and his big yap left the Maple Leafs organization.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Of course waiting was an option. It is literally the GMs job to make the unpopular decisions and do what is best for the team no matter what. He used that argument himself to justify the move in the first place.

this team needed to show competitiveness immediately....not take the MacT philosophy of "doing nothing and hoping everything turns out"
we saw what doing nothing led to..

The Sakic comparison is apt because he got torn apart by pretty much everyone for waiting as long as he did, myself included, and who is laughing now?

Nashville

 

[Del Preston]

Chiarelli specifically wanted a young RHD on a team-friendly contract for Hall. That quote from the anonymous executive doesn't mean much (and I question if it's even real considering who tweeted it).

 

[oobga]

If we trade Nuge for a winger without even trying Nuge on the wing, that might finally be it for me with this team.

That Nuge for Patches rumour scares the heck out of me. That's basically the lite version of the Seguin deal.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

So instead we sacrificed the future of this team for one playoff run.

Hall is older than Larsson

what "future" are you talking about?

 

[Mr Positive]

NHL GMs straight up said they had NO idea that Hall was available. He wasn't even shopped around, there wasn't even a bidding war, there was nothing but Chia quietly talking to a few gms and took a deal from the first guy to say sure.

any GM who wasn't contacted was probably one that didn't have what we wanted. I recall that quote and to me it sounded like there could have GMs who would give us a bunch of picks or prospects. Kessel trade 2.0, and no thanks to that. At any rate, that isn't even confirmed, and it is silly to think that Chia didn't explore options.

The Oilers organization (right or wrong... I believe right) wanted to get rid of Hall no matter what. From what I believe they were NOT going to have him back in the dressing room the following year at any cost. Did they rush a deal? Sure maybe. But it shows you how much they did not what him back in the fold. Plus it really shows you how low Hall's value was around the league and shows how very much overrated Hall was to some fans here.

Imo it mostly shows the disconnect with how fans rate players vs how GMs rate players. Fans value flashy wingers more than GMs do. GMs value consistent, solid Dmen signed at low cost more than fans do. Larsson had a breakout season for the Devils, but in a way that fans don't notice unless they look closely.

 

[StevenF1919]

Hall is older than Larsson

what "future" are you talking about?

Making a bad trade for a quick fix at the back instead of waiting for an opportunity to acquire an actual top pairing dman.

If Hall was going to be traded, it needed to be for a #1, not a second pairing guy who puts up 10 points a year and can't make a breakout pass.

 

[LMFAO]

Tkachuk-McDavid-Puljujarvi

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Making a bad trade for a quick fix at the back instead of waiting for an opportunity to acquire an actual top pairing dman.

because top pairing d-men simply aren't traded...unless it's for another top-pairing D (Weber-Subban)

If Hall was going to be traded, it needed to be for a #1, not a second pairing guy who puts up 10 points a year and can't make a breakout pass.

wingers are rarely traded for #1 d-man...it doesn't happen
GMs value wingers the least...why do you think so many more go to UFA?

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

I don't believe Dreger, I agree with the sentiment that his sources seemed to have dried up after Nonis was fired, Nonis was clearly feeding him information regularly. While it was certainly good for him at the time it is quite understandable that sources might be scared off thinking the information flowed two-ways between him and his cousin.

Just for safety's sake if I was Katz, I'd check if there is any truth to that rumor and if he said he was contemplating Hall for Ceci for even one second I'd fire him on the spot. There is no circumstance where considering that was in the least bit reasonable or defensible.

 

[Little Fury]

Chiarelli's philosophy is to build from the goaltender out like in Boston...have a strong goaltender, strong defense and loaded up the middle

Doesn't mean it's the right one. This is another thing: rather than working with what he had, he decided to reshape the team into the image of the 2011 Bruins. But it's not 2011 anymore and there's no Chara on this team.

pretty small sample size to be calling Klefbom a top-pairing defenseman

Not a reach though. He was trending that way.

the Hall-Larsson trade was more about addressing a dire need and weakness from a position of strength (abundance of wingers)

And now we have no wingers to speak of.

the exact definition of Taylor Hall's game (hence the great corsi stats yet historically low shooting %)

LOL ok man.

 

[belair]

Making a bad trade for a quick fix at the back instead of waiting for an opportunity to acquire an actual top pairing dman.

If Hall was going to be traded, it needed to be for a #1, not a second pairing guy who puts up 10 points a year and can't make a breakout pass.

This team had waited for a decade to acquire a 'top pairing defenseman'. It's one of the reasons why his predecessors were canned. It wasn't a quick fix--it's a long-term solution. This is where I fail to see the logic in the alternate argument. You essentially wanted to stay the course with the MacT/Lowe vision and build the 80s replica. It was never going to work.

 

[Little Fury]

This team had waited for a decade to acquire a 'top pairing defenseman'. It's one of the reasons why his predecessors were canned.

So why are we still waiting?

It wasn't a quick fix--it's a long-term solution. This is where I fail to see the logic in the alternate argument. You essentially wanted to stay the course with the MacT/Lowe vision and build the 80s replica. It was never going to work.

Strawman nonsense.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

This team had waited for a decade to acquire a 'top pairing defenseman'. It's one of the reasons why his predecessors were canned. It wasn't a quick fix--it's a long-term solution. This is where I fail to see the logic in the alternate argument. You essentially wanted to stay the course with the MacT/Lowe vision and build the 80s replica. It was never going to work.

No no, you missed the part where they find gems in late picks who just turn into stars, then you can do the 80s replica.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Doesn't mean it's the right one. This is another thing: rather than working with what he had, he decided to reshape the team into the image of the 2011 Bruins.

and it worked to a tee last year by having the best record against Pacific
think Anaheim, SJ and LA are that different this year?

But it's not 2011 anymore and there's no Chara on this team.

only a McDavid...the reigning MVP

Not a reach though. He was trending that way.

and this year he isn't...progression isn't linear

And now we have no wingers to speak of.

luckily, they're the easiest to acquire
unless you disagree that centers and defensemen are the hardest to acquire and wingers are the easiest?

LOL ok man.

solid retort

 

[StevenF1919]

because top pairing d-men simply aren't traded...unless it's for another top-pairing D (Weber-Subban)


wingers are rarely traded for #1 d-man...it doesn't happen
GMs value wingers the least...why do you think so many more go to UFA?

Dougie Hamilton was traded for draft picks.

Wingers may be valued less but Hall is an elite winger and players like him rarely hit free agency or are dealt. Players like Larsson grow on trees and are traded or hit free agency all the time.

This team had waited for a decade to acquire a 'top pairing defenseman'. It's one of the reasons why his predecessors were canned. It wasn't a quick fix--it's a long-term solution. This is where I fail to see the logic in the alternate argument. You essentially wanted to stay the course with the MacT/Lowe vision and build the 80s replica. It was never going to work.

Panic trading Hall for a good but not great defensive dman was not the answer. Chia should have stayed the course until trades were available that made sense, instead he dealt Hall and Eberle for peanuts.

It's baffling how we've got the same holes we had before he was hired despite him trading away so many valuable assets. Now we're running out of players to trade away and our prospect cupboards are bare.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Dougie Hamilton was traded for draft picks.

And Chia tried to acquire him and Boston took a worse deal from Calgary for reasons unknown

Wingers may be valued less but Hall is an elite winger and players like him rarely hit free agency or are dealt. Players like Larsson grow on trees and are traded or hit free agency all the time.

Phil Kessel, a better winger... got traded for scraps

 

[Little Fury]

and it worked to a tee last year by having the best record against Pacific
think Anaheim, SJ and LA are that different this year?

Worked to a tee when the team had perfect health, Vezina-calibre goaltending and everything break right. And they still only won one round. Now that there's a little adversity in the mix, it's not going so hot.

only a McDavid...the reigning MVP

Who can only do so much dragging around deadweight wingers.

and this year he isn't...progression isn't linear

Odd how whenever he gets hurt, the team tanks.

luckily, they're the easiest to acquire
unless you disagree that centers and defensemen are the hardest to acquire and wingers are the easiest?

Generally, sure. But specifically, I think D men like Larsson or close are easier to acquire than wingers like Hall. Unless of course you're aGM trading for Chiarelli.

solid retort

Your reply had abso-frigging-lutely nothing to do with the comment it followed.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

It's baffling how we've got the same holes we had before he was hired despite him trading away so many valuable assets. Now we're running out of players to trade away and our prospect cupboards are bare.

no we don't...we have winger holes

we are strong at center and a competent D

 

[Little Fury]

Phil Kessel, a better winger... got traded for scraps

Is this Groundhog Day because I demolished this yesterday.

Kessel was a cap dump by a rebuilding team.

 

[iCanada]

I can't help but wonder if Karlsson is actually available.

I'd do Klef + RNH + lottery protected first + sweetener for Karlsson + Duchene or Pageau+capdump.

I wonder if that gets it done.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Is this Groundhog Day because I demolished this yesterday.

"demolished" lol....let me know when Hall scores 30+ goals 5 times...or 80 points more than once
than he'll be in the conversation

Kessel was a cap dump by a rebuilding team.

but Shanny should of made him wait! clearly if he waited like Sakic did, the return would've been better

 

[belair]

So why are we still waiting?

Because it's never going to happen. We weren't going to get Petro for Hall. OEL for Hall. Weber. Karlsson. Doughty. Subban. Josi. McDonagh. They'll never be Oilers. Maybe an upgrade on Benning, but this is the Oilers' defense.

Strawman nonsense.

I call it as I see it. What did you expect was going to happen if we continued waiting?

The alternate plan was to send a lottery team back into the next season as the same bloody lottery team. Don't address the defense, don't address the personnel who clearly were incapable of executing in McLellan's system. The big signing that summer would've been Jason Demers. We should wait for that perfect deal. The MacTavish plan.

 

[McKappa]

If Chiarelli trades RNH for Patches I'm gonna go find where he lives.

 

[StevenF1919]

And Chia tried to acquire him and Boston took a worse deal from Calgary for reasons unknown


Phil Kessel, a better winger... got traded for scraps

If we had hired a different GM we'd have Hamilton.

Kessel was traded for 2 1st round picks + twice. That's hardly scraps. He was also much older than Hall when he was traded from Toronto.

no we don't...we have winger holes

we are strong at center and a competent D

Still need a top 4 offensive RHD, still need competent players in the bottom 6, and now we need help on the wings, which we didn't need before.

Our strength at C had absolutely nothing to do with Chia and our current D is far from competent. We've got like 2 players at the back who can make a breakout pass and only 2 RHD, one who should be spending most nights in the press box.