Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | With Klingberg in the Mix Who Are Our 7D After the Deadline?

[Ritchie Valens]

He will do fine because of our defensive system and buy in. Skinner will likely gift the opposition some easy wins but he will have great games mixed in.

And this is a major problem. In a 7-game series, your goalie should be consistent enough and good enough to gift the other team zero wins.

He gifted Vancouver at least two wins and the team needed a career tweener/backup goalie to pull their asses out of the fire. Skinner will get credit for winning game 7 but don’t forget Vancouver lost some key players for that game. The Oilers were extremely lucky to get out of round 2.

 

[McJadeddog]

on what planet does Skinner deserve 6+ mil? there's no chance

There is a very low chance that anybody gives Skinner $6+ million, although with the cap rising a lot, I suppose it could happen on the low end. The Oilers should not be one of those teams offering such a deal though (they should be trading Skinner as fast as possible actually, but that is maybe a different post). He is a roughly 50th percentile goalie in the league over the past 2 years (when he has been the primary starter). In the past year he is 38th of 73 goalies (min 1000 mins played) for GSAA/60 at all strengths from naturalstattrick. So slightly worse than league average in the regular season. He is 12th of 21 for the same time frame (min 100 mins played) in the playoffs, so again, slightly worse than average. These stats match the eye test as well. Skinner is a below average goalie who has hot streaks and cold streaks in his game.

He is a bad starter, or a very good backup, or a prototypical "1B type" goalie. Those guys don't make $6 M/year, and more like $4 M or so, although there are some making more and some making less.

There are 42 goaltenders currently signed in the NHL that were UFAs when they signed their deals. The median deal was $2.5 M. Even if you scope those deals to only the highest 20 paid goalies, the median is $5 M. Guys like Ullmark, Lehner, Hill, Mrazek and Korpisalo are all around that 10th overall in signing. Skinner is worse than most of them.

 

[Fourier]

There isn't even a reason to stand "pat" for 2.6 million. That's still doesn't make any sense, the next 2 years are extremely valuable years we will never get back again in terms of McDavid and Draisaitl's prime.

There is no luxury here of standing pat, if McDavid and Draisaitl were 21 and 23 respectively, alright, even then it would be kind of stupid to do that, but they're not.

I don't disagree, but the rightly or wrongly team may well feel that at $2.6M they can live with what he brings.

My major concern is using up all their assets and cap on what might well be a lateral move. As I have said before two guys who are each a coin flip may not be any better. I think they really need to get someone who is much more likely a full step up in terms of consistency. I just don't know who that guy is.

 

[Soundwave]

I don't disagree, but the rightly or wrongly team may well feel that at $2.6M they can live with what he brings.

My major concern is using up all their assets and cap on what might well be a lateral move. As I have said before two guys who are each a coin flip may not be any better. I think they really need to get someone who is much more likely a full step up in terms of consistency. I just don't know who that guy is.

If this org is too chicken shit to take a risk on anyone in net, then they have really no business having a McDavid anyway.

You have to grow some balls at some point as an org, do your f***ing homework (what are our scouts paid for exactly?), and bring someone in.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

His current salary is very low for a starter. Tripling is arbitrary. Skinner is virtually guaranteed to get more than what Blackwood signed for, because Blackwood signed with almost no resume. That isn't even the floor. The Oilers starting offer probably starts with a 6, and Skinner's camp with an 8. I'm probably too conservative even

there's ZERO chance he's looking for Hellebuyck-range money....ZERO

Logan Thompson, a better goalie, just signed for 5.75 mil....again, unless he is great in the playoffs and leads the team to a Cup, I doubt he gets close to 6

 

[Mr Positive]

If Skinners value is so high you trade him..... no doubt about it

They won't, not unless it's for a proven goalie like Saros, and that's not happening.

Our only hope is to get an alternate starter so that the truth can come out. And maybe that competition makes Skinner look better.

But, Skinner has another year. So it's not extremely critical to address this now, although imo it is important because Skinner is eligible to re-sign this summer. The team and media don't see any issues with Skinner. Once he is re-signed then that will be it. We won't be to afford to try anyone else in a serious way

And this is a major problem. In a 7-game series, your goalie should be consistent enough and good enough to gift the other team zero wins.

He gifted Vancouver at least two wins and the team needed a career tweener/backup goalie to pull their asses out of the fire. Skinner will get credit for winning game 7 but don’t forget Vancouver lost some key players for that game. The Oilers were extremely lucky to get out of round 2.

It could have easily been like the year before where Skinner was awful but Woodcroft kept at in hoping Skinner would start streaking the right way

 

[Soundwave]

The funny thing about the "you have to get the PERFECT goalie to be better than Stu!" stuff is I don't think it would take all that much.

He's been better here than Jack Campbell who was likely dealing with a drinking issue that was so bad he had to go to rehab ... whoopity doo. He's barely statistically better than Calvin Pickard here and Picks has now played almost 50 games here so it's not like it's a nothing sample size. He should be head and shoulders better than a Calvin Pickard.

If the Oilers acquired even a goalie like Reimer who Buffalo would give away for a bag of popcorn, who here would be shocked to see Reimer outperform Skinner?

 

[McJadeddog]

I don't disagree, but the rightly or wrongly team may well feel that at $2.6M they can live with what he brings.

My major concern is using up all their assets and cap on what might well be a lateral move. As I have said before two guys who are each a coin flip may not be any better. I think they really need to get someone who is much more likely a full step up in terms of consistency. I just don't know who that guy is.

I don't know who the answer is either truthfully, I just know that the answer ISN'T Skinner. The Oilers management group is paid a lot of money to identify players and go get them. Anybody with a brain in their head can see Skinner isn't the answer, so doing nothing isn't really a choice. This management group needs to do something. Could they potentially make the wrong choice? Yeah, of course, goaltending is rather famously difficult to figure out. But we already know that doing nothing results in another year without a cup because Skinner just can't get it done. So you either stay the course and be assured of failure, or you take a shot and maybe have good results.

They won't, not unless it's for a proven goalie like Saros, and that's not happening.

Our only hope is to get an alternate starter so that the truth can come out. And maybe that competition makes Skinner look better.

But, Skinner has another year. So it's not extremely critical to address this now, although imo it is important because Skinner is eligible to re-sign this summer. The team and media don't see any issues with Skinner. Once he is re-signed then that will be it. We won't be to afford to try anyone else in a serious way


It could have easily been like the year before where Skinner was awful but Woodcroft kept at in hoping Skinner would start streaking the right way

Yes, it is critical. This team is built to win this year, and are already the oldest team in the league. Our chances of winning a cup go down next year, and Skinner is the main reason why we won't win a cup this year. They need to move on from him, or bring in a secondary starter (as you suggest) ASAP. We are wasting McDrai prime years, and our chances of winning the cup are worse every year from now on.

 

[Soundwave]

If Skinners value is so high you trade him..... no doubt about it

The issue is other teams aren't stupid, so his value isn't high. Shit like "yeah but he's from Edmonton!" has no value to any other team the way the media and the Oilers value it (ridiculous way to run a franchise).

Team Canada is thin on goalies and this guy should have been a lock at least for one of the three spots just by virtue of being the most recent Canadian goalie in a Cup Final and Team Canada said no thanks.

He's not respected in the broader NHL world.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

The issue is other teams aren't stupid, so his value isn't high. Shit like "yeah but he's from Edmonton!" has no value to any other team the way the media and the Oilers value it (ridiculous way to run a franchise).

Team Canada is thin on goalies and this guy should have been a lock at least for one of the three spots just by virtue of being the most recent Canadian goalie in a Cup Final and Team Canada said no thanks.

He's not respected in the broader NHL world.

Team Canada is a clown show. Nobody cares about that shitty tournament.

 

[McAsuno]

Trade for a f***ing 1B already.

 

[Soundwave]

Team Canada is a clown show. Nobody cares about that shitty tournament.

Still, he should have made that team easily. He is not respected in hockey circles outside the homer media in Edmonton. Everyone outside of the homer bubble knows he's a fraud.

 

[McJadeddog]

Still, he should have made that team easily. He is not respected in hockey circles outside the homer media in Edmonton. Everyone outside of the homer bubble knows he's a fraud.

Thats because if you have even one working eye and half a brain, you can watch the games, or look at the statistics, and see that he is a fraud. It's blatantly obvious if you investigate it for more than 2 seconds.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Thats because if you have even one working eye and half a brain, you can watch the games, or look at the statistics, and see that he is a fraud. It's blatantly obvious if you investigate it for more than 2 seconds.

Apparently they think the same of Bouchard and Hyman.

 

[Cloned]

We can be mad about the NHL but it pales in comparison to an actual rigged league like the NBA where shadowy forces engineer a lopsided trade of one of the league’s best players to their biggest market.

NHL is trying to get there though with Vegas lol.

 

[McAsuno]

We can be mad about the NHL but it pales in comparison to an actual rigged league like the NBA where shadowy forces engineer a lopsided trade of one of the league’s best players to their biggest market.

NHL is trying to get there though with Vegas lol.

I’d be amazed if we were ever able to pull off a fleecing to that extent of Doncic for AF.
The fact that our management is comfortably content with the current goalie duo is just inexcusable to see.

 

[Cloned]

I’d be amazed if we were ever able to pull off a fleecing to that extent of Doncic for AF.
The fact that our management is comfortably content with the current goalie duo is just inexcusable to see.

I doubt managements were even involved.

Mavs owners probably get some nice kickback money and the league gets to market Doncic in LA and turn the Lakers into a contender again.

 

[soothsayer]

I doubt managements were even involved.

Mavs owners probably get some nice kickback money and the league gets to market Doncic in LA and turn the Lakers into a contender again.

Management was 100% involved ...

 

[McDrai]

I feel like Skinner would be god awful on just about any other team. I’m not a huge stats guy but based on what I’ve seen our defense doesn’t give up too much in terms of high danger opportunities. The few opportunities we do give up usually end up in the back of the net. I don’t mind keeping Skinner in a back up/1B position as he does have moments of being solid but he’s not consistent enough to be the guy who can help us win a Stanley Cup. We can’t be winning in spite of him like we do most of the time.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

My Hierarchy of Needs continues to be a top 4 D upgrade and a a big body 3/4C. But I am increasing becoming concerned about support scoring, notably top 6 wingers. Oilers are league tops in shots on net but 24th in shooting % - the lowest of elite teams.

1st in shots 1691(followed by Carolina 1680, Florida 1670, Vegas 1580, Devils 1571, Avalanche 1560)

24th shooting 10.1% - lowest of deep contender teams. Colorado 11.2% 7th, Vegas 11% 10th, Dallas 10.7% 11th, Devils 10.4% - 17th.

Oilers top 6 winger shooting %:
Nugent Hopkins 14.2% 15 goals
Hyman 13.1% 18 goals
Podkolzen 7.4% 6 goals
Arvvy 6.9% 6 goals
J Skinner 9.1% 9 goals (though he's been deployed largely as a healthy scratch, 4th line winger)

I'd prefer a 1A goaltender tandem upgrade to compete for lead tender duties (likely Gibson). But I don't see this management group moving off Skinner. It comes down to Bowman's new organization eyes on the organization but he won Cups with Corey Crawford.

Therefore priority need is to fortify defense in front of their goaltending with another top 4 D man and a hard ice, goal suppression 3/4C imo. But I have growing concern with Oilers support scoring requirement to find the next goal in tight, hard ice playoff series hockey. Arvy & Skinner haven't delivered this need compounded with deep regression by Hyman and Nugent Hopkins.

Oil quite possibly have 1-2 trade deadline moves with assets and cap space. Shopping list is growing a bit imo.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

My Hierarchy of Needs continues to be a top 4 D upgrade and a a big body 3/4C. But I am increasing becoming concerned about support scoring, notably top 6 wingers. Oilers are league tops in shots on net but 24th in shooting % - the lowest of elite teams.

1st in shots 1691(followed by Carolina 1680, Florida 1670, Vegas 1580, Devils 1571, Avalanche 1560)

24th shooting 10.1% - lowest of deep contender teams. Colorado 11.2% 7th, Vegas 11% 10th, Dallas 10.7% 11th, Devils 10.4% - 17th.

Oilers top 6 winger shooting %:
Nugent Hopkins 14.2% 15 goals
Hyman 13.1% 18 goals
Podkolzen 7.4% 6 goals
Arvvy 6.9% 6 goals
J Skinner 9.1% 9 goals (though he's been deployed largely as a healthy scratch, 4th line winger)

I'd prefer a 1A goaltender tandem upgrade to compete for lead tender duties (likely Gibson). But I don't see this management group moving off Skinner. It comes down to Bowman's new organization eyes on the organization but he won Cups with Corey Crawford.

Therefore priority need is to fortify defense in front of their goaltending with another top 4 D man and a hard ice, goal suppression 3/4C imo. But I have growing concern with Oilers support scoring requirement to find the next goal in tight, hard ice playoff series hockey. Arvy & Skinner haven't delivered this need compounded with deep regression by Hyman and Nugent Hopkins.

Oil quite possibly have 1-2 trade deadline moves with assets and cap space. Shopping list is growing a bit imo.

Then your hierarchy is wrong, they just don't desperately need that spot, it's an impact forward and a better option than Pickard as the other goalie

 

[Heavy Dee]

Is there any player who fits with Nurse?
Nurse Klingberg feels like a disaster.


Emberson is physichal and given in the lineup, question is wherso with Nurse or Kulak. I feel he matches Kulak, and make a very strong 3rd pair with Kulak.

So Nurse and Klingberg. But whatever, I like 7-5 games more than 3-1. Nurse and Klingberg helps the incrasing scoring in NHL. Kudos to them.

Why are you and so many others so dumb to expect peak Klingberg after two games?

 

[jlockhart89]

Aside from the 2 names (Gibson, Vejmelka) I see frequently mentioned the 2 other targets that I’m intrigued by are Quick and UPL out of Buffalo.

Quick I feel like could at least stabilize the group with the possibility of getting hot with one more crack at a cup and buy us time to come up with a long term solution this summer

UPL is the one that intrigues me the most, I feel his long term upside is as high or higher than Vejmelka at only 25 years old. He’s got a massive frame and has looked good at times for an abysmal Buffalo squad and one would assume that they are still grooming Devon Levi for their long term starter. This could be a case of buying low on a guy who could blossom outside of Buffalo similar to Ullmark when he signed in Boston.

 

[Soundwave]

I’d be amazed if we were ever able to pull off a fleecing to that extent of Doncic for AF.
The fact that our management is comfortably content with the current goalie duo is just inexcusable to see.

In the long term it's a dumb trade for Dallas but in the short term I'm not sure it's the fleecing people think it is.

Anthony Davis is still a top 10 player in the league and probably top 5 defensively on top of that.

The Lakers are gonna be a mess on defense, Luka is terrible defensively and LeBron is 40 and stopped playing D like five years ago. The Mavs are still dumb for making that trade, but it's not like Luka is 2x better than AD or something.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Then your hierarchy is wrong, they just don't desperately need that spot, it's an impact forward and a better option than Pickard as the other goalie

Or maybe it is different than yours. Notable is your continual reactive thinking they should trade for everyone and everything that shakes out.

Cup Champion teams can have rare elite franchise goaltenders or from a large swath of interchangeable goaltenders who unpredictably can get hot and on a playoff heater in front of excellent, big, deep and diverse blue lines and airtight team defending and goal suppression work. Playoff series hockey is hard, grind style of play often won in the margins and very different than one-off regular season play.

A mature way to have conversation and dialogue is to express disagreement and state one's own opinion.