Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Where's The Beef?

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Ingram's numbers this year are poor in all respects, sure, but he's also still dealing with the loss of this mother. Before this season he had all the hallmarks of another Hill/Thompson/Daccord: a history of success at lower levels, good underlying metrics on bad teams, and in that 25-28 age range where goalies typically take another step.

Do I think Ingram is the best option? No, but he is an option, and we are at the point where any option other than Skinner/Pickard needs to be tried. We keep hearing that signings/waiver claims up front and on D are fine because if they don't work out we can just waive them, but yet that same attitude doesn't exist on the goalie front either for the media OR a very noisy portion of the fanbase.

A .780 isn't going to win us anything. We got a preview of a potential SCF matchup last night and it was clear our tender was far and away the second best on the ice. Go out and take a swing like Colorado, Washington and Vegas have all done... or piss away McDrai's prime. It's really that simple.

This is where my head it at with it, plus he's shown a good level of play previously and he's never played behind a team that's this good defensively. My point is he's not here to replace Skinner (to be determined, but you know what I mean) he's here to be an upgrade at the back up position which will make the team better, imo.

 

[foshizzle]

Bouchard's next contract scares me. I like the guy.. but he does not deserve to be one of the highest paid dmen in the league with how he defends and his inconsistency. f*** he has been frustrating this season.

Except his analytics show he is one of the best d men in the league. Defence isn’t just played in the defensive zone. He is excellent in the neutral zone and denying zone entries. He is excellent at transitional defence. He is excellent in zone exits. His in-zone defence took a bit of a hit this year- but the puck is rarely in the zone for long periods when Bouchard is on the ice. Without Bouchard- there is absolutely no way the Oilers are anywhere near the possession team they are now

 

[foshizzle]

Going back to goaltending- Sylvain Rodrigue, the goalie coach who saved Skinner from the ECHL- got poached by the Florida Panthers this off-season to coach in their farm system. I find it curious that he would jump ship. He left a team where he could coach his kid. He must have seen that there is no path for him to the big club with Schwartz firmly entrenched in Katz’ ass. That or Schwartz is giving unsolicited advice on how to coach. There must be a reason.

 

[Captain Controversy]

Bouchard's next contract scares me. I like the guy.. but he does not deserve to be one of the highest paid dmen in the league with how he defends and his inconsistency. f*** he has been frustrating this season.

He won't be. He's gonna fetch a Million though

 

[VeteranPresence]

Going back to goaltending- Sylvain Rodrigue, the goalie coach who saved Skinner from the ECHL- got poached by the Florida Panthers this off-season to coach in their farm system. I find it curious that he would jump ship. He left a team where he could coach his kid. He must have seen that there is no path for him to the big club with Schwartz firmly entrenched in Katz’ ass. That or Schwartz is giving unsolicited advice on how to coach. There must be a reason.

Yes this was sus to the highest degree. I even recall there being talk in the summer of Rodrigue being promoted to the NHL soon in some capacity just to keep him around since he was highly sought after and then... boom, gone.

This tells me that the Schwartz love goes to the highest levels of the org, which isn't good news for anyone who values competent goaltending. We're on Year 10 of getting suboptimal results internally and Year 10 of his own clients fading out of the league (Skinner, Jarry, Hart). How many more signs does Katz need to know this isn't the right person to do the job?

 

[soothsayer]

Except his analytics show he is one of the best d men in the league. Defence isn’t just played in the defensive zone. He is excellent in the neutral zone and denying zone entries. He is excellent at transitional defence. He is excellent in zone exits. His in-zone defence took a bit of a hit this year- but the puck is rarely in the zone for long periods when Bouchard is on the ice. Without Bouchard- there is absolutely no way the Oilers are anywhere near the possession team they are now

After last season, I thought he was getting $10M+, all day. That's how good he was in the playoffs. He has definitely taken a step back from the playoffs in terms of his performance, but he is still a $9M defenseman. If he crushes it in the playoffs again, he's back in that $10M category.

The biggest issue I see from him, aside from the odd 10-bell mistakes, is that he's not getting pucks through as easily, which was one of his bread-and-butter assets, and he's not skating or moving the puck in the offensive zone as crisply. He looks like he's lacking confidence at times rather than it being an issue with his abilities.

 

[Heavy Dee]

Trade Pickard, a 4th and Joel maatta for Connor Ingram right now

Ingram is the ideal target. Was outstanding with Arizona a couple years ago til injuries derailed him this year.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Ingram is the ideal target. Was outstanding with Arizona a couple years ago til injuries derailed him this year.

If he can bring that game at $1.95M on the cap, you're laughing if you're the Oilers. It's a easy fit and I think Utatotes would be willing to do that deal, because they can focus on re-upping Vejmelka and they have Staubber in there as well who's coming along it seems.

 

[McDNicks17]

Going back to goaltending- Sylvain Rodrigue, the goalie coach who saved Skinner from the ECHL- got poached by the Florida Panthers this off-season to coach in their farm system. I find it curious that he would jump ship. He left a team where he could coach his kid. He must have seen that there is no path for him to the big club with Schwartz firmly entrenched in Katz’ ass. That or Schwartz is giving unsolicited advice on how to coach. There must be a reason.

The goaltending department they have going in Florida is probably the best in the league. They clearly spend a bunch of time and money on it.

I could see why someone would want to go there pretty easily. Especially when coming from an organization that does the opposite.

 

[McHelpus]

Just trade for John Gibson already. We have Henrique and Perry to convince him to move here.

 

[McShogun99]

Bouchard's next contract scares me. I like the guy.. but he does not deserve to be one of the highest paid dmen in the league with how he defends and his inconsistency. f*** he has been frustrating this season.

He shouldn't be getting a penny over 8 million on his next contract.

 

[Fourier]

On the goaltending front the Oilers should try to sign Jackson Parsons. He won't help right away of course but this kid has really come into his own. He is one of the big reasons why the Rangers, a team that was suppose to be bad this year, are near the top of the OHL standings. Another excellent showing yesterday as the Rangers beat London 5-2. I think he is going the NCAA route next year but as an undrafted guy I think he could be worth a shot.

 

[belair]

They already struggle to get Skinner any looks and have Kane coming back too, so a top 9 forward really isn't a need.
And 1 through 6, I generally think the defence has performed well this year. (I'm also curious to see what Klingberg adds to the bottom of the group.)

It's been goaltending that has been their Achilles heel most often this year. So yes, that is where they should be upgrading over forward or defence.

Gibson, Vejmalka/Ingram, Varlamov, hell I'm nearing a point I would take a risk on Jarry at 50%.
Plus it's not like there are a lot of teams in the goalie market at the moment, so prices shouldn't be outrageous.

They struggle to get Skinner looks because he's an inconsistency on the active roster. He's a bad game away from being pressboxed. We also have no idea if or when Kane is returning or what quality of game he's bringing to the table.

The Oilers are going to add a bottom six forward at the deadline and it's not difficult to see that.

Gibson, Vejmelka or Jarry with retention are fantasies. And it's not difficult to see that either. Retention with term just doesn't happen. Rebuilding teams--or more specifically their team owners--have no reason to eat significant salary for little return.

 

[Fourier]

He shouldn't be getting a penny over 8 million on his next contract.

If it is 8 years it will certainly be over $8M. Seider, Power and Sanderson all signed for over $8M coming off their ECL's. It could possibly be $7.5-8M if the team gives him a short bridge or if he goes to arbitration. But even that is unlikely.

Players and agents know the cap is set to take off. A guy like Hughes for example is probably going to get $13M+ on his next deal two years from now. And Bouchard is one of the league's best offensive defensemen. They have always gotten paid.

 

[Soundwave]

The Oilers spent 10 million dollars to “upgrade” the forwards (Arvidsson, Skinner, and retaining Henrique) and not any one of these guys is on pace to hit 20 goals.

Now apparently we need to spend even moar! On top of the 4 mill total bill on Connor Brown this year.

They pissed away Broberg and Holloway for f*** all and now we are supposed to make OK with this Dollar Store budget goaltending tandem.

Send Henrique’s ass back to Anaheim or Arvidsson out if that’s what it takes to make Gibson’s salary work. They are not bringing nearly enough to the table.

 

[McShogun99]

If it is 8 years it will certainly be over $8M. Seider, Power and Sanderson all signed for over $8M coming off their ECL's. It could possibly be $7.5-8M if the team gives him a short bridge or if he goes to arbitration. But even that is unlikely.

Players and agents know the cap is set to take off. A guy like Hughes for example is probably going to get $13M+ on his next deal two years from now. And Bouchard is one of the league's best offensive defensemen. They have always gotten paid.

In New Jersey......

 

[soothsayer]

Just trade for John Gibson already. We have Henrique and Perry to convince him to move here.

He's got a .911 sv% on an awful Anaheim team. I am firmly in the camp that you take Gibson at $3.2M over Skinner 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

The Oilers spent 10 million dollars to “upgrade” the forwards (Arvidsson, Skinner, and retaining Henrique) and not any one of these guys is on pace to hit 20 goals.

Now apparently we need to spend even moar! On top of the 4 mill total bill on Connor Brown this year.

They pissed away Broberg and Holloway for f*** all and now we are supposed to make OK with this Dollar Store budget goaltending tandem.

Send Henrique’s ass back to Anaheim or Arvidsson out if that’s what it takes to make Gibson’s salary work. They are not bringing nearly enough to the table.

I didn't expect depth scoring to be as big a problem as it is, but it feels like we're back to the days of we're only winning when McDavid or Draisaitl will it to be so. RNH has stepped back, Hyman has stepped back, Skinner is banished to 12 minutes a night until he shaves his sideburns. Arvidsson is a little ball of chaos but I don't see ANY scoring touch there. Henrique shouldn't be a C, he's too slow. Janmark's only goal was on an empty net. Perry and Pod have been good but ideally they're bottom sixers.

The only guy after the big 2 that's pacing for 50 points is Evan Bouchard and half of people seemingly want to shove him onto an ice floe and push him out to sea.

They struggle to get Skinner looks because he's an inconsistency on the active roster. He's a bad game away from being pressboxed. We also have no idea if or when Kane is returning or what quality of game he's bringing to the table.

The Oilers are going to add a bottom six forward at the deadline and it's not difficult to see that.

Gibson, Vejmelka or Jarry with retention are fantasies. And it's not difficult to see that either. Retention with term just doesn't happen. Rebuilding teams--or more specifically their team owners--have no reason to eat significant salary for little return.

Jarry is every bit as inconsistent and poor as Skinner is, and probably significantly moreso. Dude is garbage. Pittsburgh tried to give him away for free and nobody wanted him.

Vejmelka or Gibson would certainly be upgrades but they are likely fantasies, as you say, but mostly because management doesn't see goaltending as a need.

 

[VeteranPresence]

He's got a .911 sv% on an awful Anaheim team. I am firmly in the camp that you take Gibson at $3.2M over Skinner 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

I am becoming more and more of a believer in Gibson as the year goes on. Doesn't hurt that Cam Fowler shook the stink off so quickly in St. Louis either.

But a big ticket like Gibson's- even at half price- is hard to fit in, so unless Stan is extremely motivated to try and fix the position (and he, or someone above him, doesn't seem to be) it's a pipedream.

Better to hope we go after a sub-$2M goalie who can be an upgrade on Pickard but also has either the upside or past performance of a starter as a fallback in case (cough when) Skinner continues to play like garbage. There are lots of possibilities here, it just requires our "brain" trust to admit there's an issue and spend something other than nothing to fix it. I am not optimistic but we'll see.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

He's got a .911 sv% on an awful Anaheim team. I am firmly in the camp that you take Gibson at $3.2M over Skinner 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

I would highly suggest looking at his stats from the previous 5 years.
2020: .904
2021: .903
2022: .904
2023: .899
2024: .888

Oh, and a GAA above 3 in 4 of those 5 years. In some cases very far above 3.

 

[soothsayer]

I am becoming more and more of a believer in Gibson as the year goes on. Doesn't hurt that Cam Fowler shook the stink off so quickly in St. Louis either.

But a big ticket like Gibson's- even at half price- is hard to fit in, so unless Stan is extremely motivated to try and fix the position (and he, or someone above him, doesn't seem to be) it's a pipedream.

Better to hope we go after a sub-$2M goalie who can be an upgrade on Pickard but also has either the upside or past performance of a starter as a fallback in case (cough when) Skinner continues to play like garbage. There are lots of possibilities here, it just requires our "brain" trust to admit there's an issue and spend something other than nothing to fix it. I am not optimistic but we'll see.

I honestly don't think they're going to bring in another goalie. I personally would trade Skinner for Gibson at 50% (Skinner makes 2.6 and Gibson would be 3.2, so not a huge difference). But I don't think a goalie is in the cards by TDL day.

I would highly suggest looking at his stats from the previous 5 years.
2020: .904
2021: .903
2022: .904
2023: .899
2024: .888

Oh, and a GAA above 3 in 4 of those 5 years. In some cases very far above 3.

I get it. But I think Gibson is on a whole different talent level than Skinner. Frankly, I think a healthy Gibson on his game his still a top-10 goaltender. That's just me. But I would also note that Skinner is a sub 900 goalie on one of the best defensive teams in the league. And Gibson is on maybe the worst defensive teams in the last decade. That matters.

Anyways, if Gibson ever gets traded, and he blows the doors of his next team, remember me as one of the guys who said, "I told you so."

 

[foshizzle]

Yes this was sus to the highest degree. I even recall there being talk in the summer of Rodrigue being promoted to the NHL soon in some capacity just to keep him around since he was highly sought after and then... boom, gone.

This tells me that the Schwartz love goes to the highest levels of the org, which isn't good news for anyone who values competent goaltending. We're on Year 10 of getting suboptimal results internally and Year 10 of his own clients fading out of the league (Skinner, Jarry, Hart). How many more signs does Katz need to know this isn't the right person to do the job?

You’re exactly right

 

[foshizzle]

He's got a .911 sv% on an awful Anaheim team. I am firmly in the camp that you take Gibson at $3.2M over Skinner 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

And a 12.1 goals saved above expected. I’d take him in a heartbeat. The oilers won’t though. Remember last year when the Oiler sent Campbell down- the talk about “this will help Skinner because he knows he’s the number 1 goalie now”. How fragile is this guy

 

[bucks_oil]

It's not "the solution" it's upgrading Pickard immediately and getting a guy who can likely give them more consistent starts.

Again, it's not going to fix everything, but it makes the team better.

Can you provide a 1000 foot scouting report? Just going by numbers (gasp! I said I would never do that!) he seems to have done with a rebuilding PHX team last year, but has really struggled with the mountain air... any ideas what gives?

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I honestly don't think they're going to bring in another goalie. I personally would trade Skinner for Gibson at 50% (Skinner makes 2.6 and Gibson would be 3.2, so not a huge difference). But I don't think a goalie is in the cards by TDL day.



I get it. But I think Gibson is on a whole different talent level than Skinner. Frankly, I think a healthy Gibson on his game his still a top-10 goaltender. That's just me. But I would also note that Skinner is a sub 900 goalie on one of the best defensive teams in the league. And Gibson is on maybe the worst defensive teams in the last decade. That matters.

Anyways, if Gibson ever gets traded, and he blows the doors of his next team, remember me as one of the guys who said, "I told you so."

Tell you what. There's an easy way to determine this. Go ask Dustin Schwartz if he thinks acquiring John Gibson is a good idea. If he says yes, then you know it's a bad idea.