Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Post Draft, Pre Free Agent Frenzy

[Shizuka]

When has it been indicated his conditioning is poor? I always got impression he was a bit of a rink rat. His development kind of baffles me though.

Sorry, I don't have the quote directly on hand but it was something that came up.. not sure if I heard it from a pod cast or something? Maybe I shouldn't have said it like it was gospel truth but I do remember it was brought up.

 

[Slats432]

Well, they just graduated their top two guys so when you look at it as Broberg, Holloway, Savoie, O'Reilly, Akey, Wanner, Rodrigue, it looks a lot better. Still not a top half of the league prospect pool but which legit contender is?

Bottom 10 for sure.

 

[VainGretzky]

Nuge McDavid Hyman
Skinner Draisaitl Arvidsson
Kane Henrique Savoie
Janmark Holloway Brown
Perry

 

[ThePhoenixx]

How is Matheson still around? The game and the players have long passed by this dinosaur. Boomers man.. always finding a way to stick around when they're not wanted. As usual too, in the scrum with Savoie, asked the stupidest questions around.

To which tribe do you belong?

 

[PositiveCashFlow]

The Lavoie thread on the mains mutated into a discussion about ninja turtles

 

[McDoused]

Can we get a new thread yet?

 

[Slats432]

There are actually not a lot of loopholes for pro athletes and the argument that being paid in US dollars while living in Canada is a 30% raise doesn’t hold water when you consider everything is a lot more expensive here than the US.

LOL, depending on where. I just got back from the draft in Las Vegas.

Bought a Pepsi in the CIRCA for $6.99 US. (11 CDN)

Crossed the border back to Canada. Stopped at Tim's. Bought a Sausage sandwich, Bagel, Muffin, Large Double Double, Small Double Double. $10.85 CDN.

 

[Cloned]

Can we get a new thread yet?

Yes, but only once you scroll through all 204 pages of posts in this thread and like them.

 

[Slats432]

I thought threads die at 1000 posts?

 

[Kirby]

I didn't really find him impressive at all unfortunately. His NHL stint was not memorable and he looked way too slow.

Not targeted at you specifically, but just wanted to remind everyone of Broberg. Just 2-months ago this was a very common sentiment until it wasn't with his playoff performance. Not everyone develops at the same pace, and not everyone grabs hold of the opportunity at the time we expect them too or want them too.

I am hopeful he will use his experiences to push harder and finally make that impression

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

At 14M per, he'd be making about 15% of the Cap in 2025-2026.

Connor McDavid made 15% of the cap this year on a deal that underpays him by 3M or more based on value per point, based on a deal he signed in 2016. Draisaitl is #5 in all-time playoff PPG.

You want to pretend we're not a disadvantaged market because a few midrange players took discounts short-term for a chance at the Cup? Great. But a guy who has a chance to be one of the best European players ever in the NHL isn't going to look off his last decade of earning potential for Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.

Your perspective, if shared by the Oilers, could cost them the next 10 years. For what? A chance at a million dollars in cap savings?

I don’t really get what this has to do with him getting more money because he outperformed his previous contract.

Anyways I do disagree about the market. 5 players signed here for cheaper. All the current players ranted about how much they like it. They have glowing reviews about the fans, team dynamic and it sounds like the owner really really takes care of them. It’s a privilege to play for this team. I know 2 guys currently in the NHL who absolutely believe Edmonton is one of the places players want to go. The word is out. As long as McDavid is here and we are contenders this team will be a hot spot for NHL players. Guaranteed.

I’m also not saying don’t pay him 14. If he wants to really push it we should bite the bullet and pay him but that has nothing to do with his previous contract or it being Edmonton.

 

[Paralyzer]

Can we get a new thread yet?

No. It would be bad luck to shut it down. Otherwise JJ can't hear all our praise.

 

[Oilhawks]

The Lavoie thread on the mains mutated into a discussion about ninja turtles

Mbappe is a soccer player though

 

[nabob]

LOL, depending on where. I just got back from the draft in Las Vegas.

Bought a Pepsi in the CIRCA for $6.99 US. (11 CDN)

Crossed the border back to Canada. Stopped at Tim's. Bought a Sausage sandwich, Bagel, Muffin, Large Double Double, Small Double Double. $10.85 CDN.

Yes and on the strip you can get a beer for $2 and then pay $20 for a beer at Rogers. Doesn’t prove me right or you wrong.

compare apples to apples and they’re a lot cheaper in the US

This isn't true on everything. I guarantee buying a house in NY, LA and other big American city is much more than buying a house in Edmonton. Housing is your biggest purchase. Gas and every day things may be more but housing cost more than makes up for the difference.

Ok compare a house in LA to a house in Cancouver. Compare apples to apples.

I know I can buy a house cheaper in Kansas than what I could buy in Toronto. But that’s not comparing apples to apples. A house is your largest purchase but your marriage payment shouldnt make up a majority of your monthly income.

 

[Louis Cypher]

You are correct. Players are incorporated entities in Canada so they pay less taxes (like a ridiculous amount). They also have other provisions and tax deferral methodology. Being paid bonus money upfront is also beneficial (hence why McDavid’s contract is set up the way it is). When Stauffer yaps on and on about taxes- he really has no clue what he is talking about.

If they are set up as a Corp the new Capital Gains bullshit will apply to assets.

 

[Kirby]

Leon Draisaitl has been one of the most critically underpaid players in the history of the NHL. He's been a top-5 player for the last 6 years of his contract with a takehome UNDER 4M per season before agents. He keeps homes in Germany and Alberta. He's been 3-4M under his actual value and lost a cumulative ~20+ million in career earnings based on his value per point.

He needs to get paid. He has maybe an 8 year window at his highest earning potential moving forward. This is a 50% income tax market.

Get good with the idea that his number is going to be 14 or more, depending on term. Remember that he's literally one of the best individual playoff performers in history. Remember that the cap may be as high as 100M in two years.

Be cool.

Sorry I just need to get this off my chest (I quoted you, but I am not necessarily directing this at you specifically).

First the minor quibble - taxes for professional NHL athletes is not simply 50% in this market. That is simply not how the tax structure works, because his place of work is not solely Edmonton, AB. The tax is significantly more complicated than that as it needs to factor earnings earned in both Canada & the US in their respective provinces and states for an employee who may or may not be a permanent resident of either Canada or the US which complicates matters even further. It also completely ignores available tax strategies in the associated Countries and States/Provinces. At the end of the day, his tax exposure is definitely less than 50%.

Now the main item that's been getting under my skin - with Draisaitl coming up for extension, a lot of the talk is about him being underpaid (yes, based on his performance over the past 7 years we can say he is currently underpaid). However, a lot of the time this has been and is being framed in a way that suggests that Draisaitl did the Oilers a solid for signing that deal for that low of a value for 8 years when he signed it. That is just not accurate, and completely ignores the risk at the time of contract signing, which was the potential of busting after coming off of a heater over a small sample. I would argue that at the time the deal was signed, the risk was higher for him not being able to live up the the full amount of the contract. Luckily for the Oiler's Leon Draisaitl became what he is, which is something no one at the time of the signing could have rationally predicted (becoming in my opinion the second best player in hockey today).

Draisaitl - solely based on his performance - has earned the right to be paid on his next contract, whatever that number might be. However, Draisaitl does not deserve to get paid because his current contract does not match his market value today. If he wants to take $14M, that is his right and I would understand (I would pay him this as well). But I would hope that he comes in somewhere between $11-$13M, because that 'discount' will be useful in providing the Oilers the opportunity & ability to keep the team hyper competitive over the next 5-6 years (maximizing his and Connor's remaining prime years).

Can we please stop suggesting Draisaitl knowingly took a discount, and as a result deserves to be compensated to taking said discount? It's just a silly, untrue narrative that takes away from the actual reason he deserves a raise - his performance.

 

[Louis Cypher]

Yes and on the strip you can get a beer for $2 and then pay $20 for a beer at Rogers. Doesn’t prove me right or you wrong.

compare apples to apples and they’re a lot cheaper in the US


Ok compare a house in LA to a house in Cancouver. Compare apples to apples.

I know I can buy a house cheaper in Kansas than what I could buy in Toronto. But that’s not comparing apples to apples. A house is your largest purchase but your marriage payment shouldnt make up a majority of your monthly income.

When was the last time you were on the Strip? No way you are paying $2 unless you are sitting at the tables losing money and tipping the waitress $2.00
Walgreens on the strip were selling tall cans for $8.50 each USD last time I was there. In the hotels same can was $10 USD. Vegas is insanely priced now.

 

[Louis Cypher]

Sorry I just need to get this off my chest (I quoted you, but I am not necessarily directing this at you specifically).

First the minor quibble - taxes for professional NHL athletes is not simply 50% in this market. That is simply not how the tax structure works, because his place of work is not solely Edmonton, AB. The tax is significantly more complicated than that as it needs to factor earnings earned in both Canada & the US in their respective provinces and states for an employee who may or may not be a permanent resident of either Canada or the US which complicates matters even further. It also completely ignores available tax strategies in the associated Countries and States/Provinces. At the end of the day, his tax exposure is definitely less than 50%.

Now the main item that's been getting under my skin - with Draisaitl coming up for extension, a lot of the talk is about him being underpaid (yes, based on his performance over the past 7 years we can say he is currently underpaid). However, a lot of the time this has been and is being framed in a way that suggests that Draisaitl did the Oilers a solid for signing that deal for that low of a value for 8 years when he signed it. That is just not accurate, and completely ignores the risk at the time of contract signing, which was the potential of busting after coming off of a heater over a small sample. I would argue that at the time the deal was signed, the risk was higher for him not being able to live up the the full amount of the contract. Luckily for the Oiler's Leon Draisaitl became what he is, which is something no one at the time of the signing could have rationally predicted (becoming in my opinion the second best player in hockey today).

Draisaitl - solely based on his performance - has earned the right to be paid on his next contract, whatever that number might be. However, Draisaitl does not deserve to get paid because his current contract does not match his market value today. If he wants to take $14M, that is his right and I would understand (I would pay him this as well). But I would hope that he comes in somewhere between $11-$13M, because that 'discount' will be useful in providing the Oilers the opportunity & ability to keep the team hyper competitive over the next 5-6 years (maximizing his and Connor's remaining prime years).

Can we please stop suggesting Draisaitl knowingly took a discount, and as a result deserves to be compensated to taking said discount? It's just a silly, untrue narrative that takes away from the actual reason he deserves a raise - his performance.

People on this board were losing their minds when Chia signed him for that dollar amount. They quickly shut up and were off losing their minds on some other Oiler issue but at the time yes it was a player friendly number and no team discount was offered from Drai.

 

[Soundwave]

Isn't there some thing because Leon is German and not technically Canadian that he gets tax benefits in Canada?

 

[nabob]

When was the last time you were on the Strip? No way you are paying $2 unless you are sitting at the tables losing money and tipping the waitress $2.00
Walgreens on the strip were selling tall cans for $8.50 each USD last time I was there. In the hotels same can was $10 USD. Vegas is insanely priced now.

That’s true I guess no long a super cheep $500 trip lol.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

That’s true I guess no long a super cheep $500 trip lol.

$500 to do Las Vegas in Las Vegas New Mexico maybe and yes I’ve been there.

 

[Senor Catface]

To which tribe do you belong?

Probably Greatest Generation. They're always riding the Boomers asses to get a job.

 

[Shizuka]

Some sensitive boomers here I guess. Matheson is one of the worst still around, don't know why you're taking offense when he gets called out but that's on you.

 

[Senor Catface]

Some sensitive boomers here I guess. Matheson is one of the worst still around, don't know why you're taking offense when he gets called out but that's on you.

As a fellow Greatest Generation individual, it's time we just let the boomers have their day.

 

[Thomas Tatar]

So my Flames fan friend (we all have one of them right? RIGHT!?) texts me claiming he has a source close to the Flames (so he doesn’t and if he does that source is not legitimate) that suggests the Flames are seriously contemplating offer-sheeting BOTH Holloway and Broberg.