Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Dermott on a PTO, Will We See More PTO's? Can We Get Some Toughness Too Please?

[Soundwave]

Report on Ristolanien from last year

Flyers 2023-24 Player Grades: Rasmus Ristolainen - The Hockey Writers Philadelphia Flyers Latest News, Analysis & More

In this edition of our Philadelphia Flyers 2023-24 player grading series, we look at defenseman Rasmus Ristolainen.

thehockeywriters.com

This was interesting:

With him in the lineup, the Flyers had an elite 17-9-5 record. Without him, they were just 21-24-6.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

I didn't say anything about offer sheets. I said that they didnt lowball Holloway. Some fans were upset that we didn't offer him like 1.5-1.8M.

If anything the fact that Nashville moved glass after the offer sheet just reinforces what I'm saying. The preds didn't have the cap room and could have been targeted.

Gotcha. Sorry my bad for conflating a few things floating around in discussion. GM Trotz has been a fun watch and listen through his short time in his role. After some big financial deals and buy-outs he's carving out some savings lower end of the roster. Helped with Tomasino's situation whether it was the primary reason or not. Timing is interesting though.

 

[Soundwave]

I think Artem Zub is still the guy, Ottawa has a very uphill climb to get into the playoffs in that division, but Ullmark could change a lot.

Staois is probably very high on Beau Akey.

 

[McDoused]

I think Artem Zub is still the guy, Ottawa has a very uphill climb to get into the playoffs in that division, but Ullmark could change a lot.

Staois is probably very high on Beau Akey.

Why would Ottawa trade Zub?

 

[Soundwave]

Why would Ottawa trade Zub?

If they miss the post-season again, probably some bigger changes are happening there.

 

[McDoused]

Report on Ristolanien from last year

Flyers 2023-24 Player Grades: Rasmus Ristolainen - The Hockey Writers Philadelphia Flyers Latest News, Analysis & More

In this edition of our Philadelphia Flyers 2023-24 player grading series, we look at defenseman Rasmus Ristolainen.

thehockeywriters.com

This was interesting:

With him in the lineup, the Flyers had an elite 17-9-5 record. Without him, they were just 21-24-6.

Hmm maybe Torts fixed him. Posts like this don't invoke confidence.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1605391677870538752

If they miss the post-season again, probably some bigger changes are happening there.

Trading Zub doesn't help them make the playoffs this year or next year. Only way they move Zub is to bring in help not picks and prospects. Zub is signed for another 3 years and is a big part of that team. I just don't see why they trade their best RHD to the Oilers.

 

[Mr Positive]

I think Artem Zub is still the guy, Ottawa has a very uphill climb to get into the playoffs in that division, but Ullmark could change a lot.

Staois is probably very high on Beau Akey.

They are one of many non playoff teams who believe they are going to make the playoffs. Maybe Zub for sale at the deadline

 

[Broberg Speed]

Why would Ottawa trade Zub?

Maybe they need the cap to sign Ullmark.

 

[belair]

Maybe they need the cap to sign Ullmark.

Ullmark would have to want to sign there first. Trading away their best defensive player wouldn't help the cause.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Ullmark would have to want to sign there first. Trading away their best defensive player wouldn't help the cause.

I hope you realize Zub is getting extremely overrated here. He's an above average defender.

 

[McShogun99]

In theory the Oilers would have around 5M in accrued cap space and 5M in LTIR for 10M total use. With double retention we could acquire guys at $0.25 on the dollar and have 40M or half a roster.

I don't think cap space will be the issue, it will be the assets.

2026 1st is guaranteed to get traded.

 

[Louis Cypher]

Nurse already makes more than Makar. Makar messed up His contract is meaningless now. And in 2 years Makar can sign for 14M x 8.

Dahlin and his 59 points and -3 is unfortunately an easy one to grab onto for Bouch. If we want to try to sign him early. Bouch can always take his chances and wait. Chance at another 80+ point season, a huge cap increase and offer sheet potential would be hard to pass up. He would also get to wait for McDavid to blow through the highest salary ceiling again with the new cap increase.

What an epic fail not signing Bouch long term last year.

Oh you mean last season when people on this board wanted him traded for anything just to get him off the ice?
When he did get on a heater why would he even consider signing anything?

 

[Tarus]

Hmm maybe Torts fixed him. Posts like this don't invoke confidence.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1605391677870538752

I don't think you can say Torts fixed him when he turned him into a 3rd pairing defensive D that plays less than 17 minutes a night, that's more an attempt to mitigate a major liability and lost cause considering the guy's age/size/contract.

High probability that the second he goes back to playing unsheltered 1st or 2nd pairing minutes, he goes back to being one of the worst defensemen in the league.

 

[Soundwave]

It is insane the kind of toolbox Risto has though







Buffalo sure did a number on him I guess.

 

[oobga]

Oh you mean last season when people on this board wanted him traded for anything just to get him off the ice?
When he did get on a heater why would he even consider signing anything?

Bouch? I can only speak for myself, I wanted him signed long term. Oilers fans are historically terrible judges of offensive D though and have a really hard time valuing puck moving ability, so for sure some people were ripping on Bouch and still do.

Fans aside, I expect the highest paid GM ever to do a better job understanding what he had. None of us had the power to ensure we kept some cap space free and to actually properly plan for such a valuable piece to be locked up. Someone was paid $25,000,000 over 5 years to have that long term vision in place. Signed a lame bridge deal cause he used all the money up already, needed someone else to fix the coaching for him and to get his goalie a mental health coach, and needed a once in 3 decade playoff performance from a forward and a D to still not be able to win a cup. Bummer.

I doubt he would have turned down ~7.5M x 8 a year ago. Compared to taking 3.9M for 2 years and risking injuries, performance issues before needing to get another deal, that would have been a responsible call to take the $60M in the bank, and still be in his prime for the next deal. Bouch + Brown's bonus would have basically been Bouch's long term cap hit this season. Of course there are countless other ways we could have managed our cap better as well. Really, we didn't even entertain a long term deal with Bouch last summer cause our GM only budgeted for a bridge. Didn't know what he had with the player. Maybe didn't even care cause it wouldn't be his problem.

 

[iCanada]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1836492406096544031

lol

It's wild - before the offer sheet I don't think I saw the guy not smiling once, and since he looks like he's in the middle of settling his divorce.

Just a total 180.

 

[BIeucheeseWithWings]

It's wild - before the offer sheet I don't think I saw the guy not smiling once, and since he looks like he's in the middle of settling his divorce.

Just a total 180.

There is virtually zero difference between the two.

 

[Davo Ikinzom]

It's wild - before the offer sheet I don't think I saw the guy not smiling once, and since he looks like he's in the middle of settling his divorce.

Just a total 180.

You guys sound exactly like the bitter Leafs fans after we won the McDavid lottery. "Look at his face!"

 

[Fourier]

I think you would be cutting yourself off from substantial roster building options if you operated under the assumption that you need to keep enough cap space to overpay unproven RFA’s by 2x-4x because another desperate gm might do something foolish.

We can talk about how these players were unhappy about their development and I think there is some merit to the fact it probably wasn’t handled flawlessly but individual player development doesn’t always line up with what’s best for a team trying to compete at the highest level. The fact is both players had ample opportunity over 2 seasons to make their mark and they never performed, it’s a results driven league and they weren’t delivering.

If an unproven player wants to prioritize getting paid substantially more then he’s worth, that’s his right but I don’t think that’s the type of character a Cup contending team wants in the room, which is likely why they chose not to match even on Holloway, who’s compensation was minimal and cap would of been manageable.

Prioritizing veterans with established track record of performance who are willing to take less to player here over entitled kids who haven’t proven anything and want to be paid like they have is a pretty easy decision for a team trying to win a Cup.

I absolutely agree with the bolded statement. In fact for a team contending for a cup its is not even 2 times. The first second and third priority has to be building the best team for the next two years. You need to pay these guys commensurate with their role. Otherwise, you risk cap consequences that would weaken your team more than the loss of these players.

 

[Fourier]

That's what teams did this summer with major RFA's and frankly even Toronto with a low likely mid-roster winger Robertson. The exception was Edmonton which as a Cup Finalist chose to finish its roster with veterans. We know the consequences of their choices.

With these players, the hard fact is one had an in-season trade request after being a press box player on a team that had a catastrophic start. There's more than enough grey area with development accountability on both players and team.

The character slings and arrows are pointless. Majority of people praised both players when stepping up into deep playoff competition. Holloway moving up to a 2W role and Broberg keeping his head above water despite not playing in a month. Performance situations reveal character and notably the head coach and captain praised the player. The issue stemmed from a lack of playing time within a mature phase organization that had to mitigate real blueline issue through trades across years for Keith, Kulak, Ekholm. It was also a team that went through 3 coaches in recent history with severe yo you performance extremes. Naturally as most coaches do they lean on veterans.

Obviously St. Louis is not in the same mature phase as Edmonton. They saw no character concerns with the players and the free market cap and need to take a run at poaching two young NHL ready players coming off solid support work on a Cup Final team.

Per your last point, the Oilers prioritized their choices, gambled on the youth, and the free market assigned new financial values that were beyond the Oilers choice to retain on. There's also a trend worth watching with young players opting for financial security and choices where to play. Most people in similar situations likely take the money. Professional sports careers are often short so not sure there's need to denigrate an easy decision financially that virtually anyone would make if extended the situation.

The bolded is just not the case. Take Thomas Harley for example. His comparable would be Brock Faber who the Wild just signed a year in advance for 8 years @ $8.5M. That is a contract that Dallas could have been forced to give Harley if they believed an OS was a real threat. Theoretically a team like Utah could have offered him two years at $9.1M and if Dallas matched they would have been sitting right now with $4.5M to shed on the cap. Moreover that would have put them in a major pickle for next year. Instead they used their leverage to get him to sign an extremely team friendly 2 year deal. And all of this played out after they re-signed Lindell, a much less important piece to a two year $5.2M deal that put extra pressure on Dallas to get Harley signed for a second year at a very low number.

Toronto dealt with Robertson in pretty much exactly the same way the Oilers dealt with Holloway. If say Chicago had offered him even $1.2M they probably would have just let him walk because it would have meant additional restrictions on the roster.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Hmm maybe Torts fixed him. Posts like this don't invoke confidence.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1605391677870538752

Trading Zub doesn't help them make the playoffs this year or next year. Only way they move Zub is to bring in help not picks and prospects. Zub is signed for another 3 years and is a big part of that team. I just don't see why they trade their best RHD to the Oilers.

Risto sucks, he's always sucks. If the Oilers some how get him and Nurse isn't going straight up the other way, the team is much worse off.

 

[Mcnofool6110]

Ristolainen would be a fantastic addition for Nurse in that Nurse would no longer be our most overpaid and hated d-man.

 

[CupofOil]

And people were begging Holland to trade him because he was a cancer in the room... And he was too old and not good anymore. Or-something.

Kind of irresponsible that he didn't just sit out for a while and heal but a healthy Evander Kane is an absolute beast playing on the wing with McDavid whether you like the guy or not.

To give an idea of how stacked this team is, they have their top 6 set, brought back their 3rd line which was arguably their best line in the finals and that's not including this potential nuclear weapon of this hopefully healthy and fully operational power forward ready to be used when available.

Further proof that the Oilers didn't lowball Holloway, or if they did that's the standard.

Predators Sign Philip Tomasino to One-Year, $825,000 Contract​

https://x.com/i/web/status/1836480394117759325

Teams squeeze their RFAs all the time which is why it baffles me that Jackson/Bowman are getting the blame for this. What else could they do really? The threat of an offer sheet is always looming for any team with high upside RFAs.

 

[CupofOil]

Man... I feel for Evander. You can tell he's sad and upset that he can't play for a long time now. I would be just like him if I found out I couldn't play. Hopefully he comes back with rage and fire in his eyes

Good god is Spec cringe to the max.
Kane literally gave the timeline of when he started to feel the injury and when it got worse and Spec kept prodding him to repeat exactly what he had literally just said, then after Kane said he had no idea if this means he's missing the season Spec again asked him to repeat himself and sounds condescending as hell when asking it. Kane did well not getting pissy with his ass.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Good god is Spec cringe to the max.
Kane literally gave the timeline of when he started to feel the injury and when it got worse and Spec kept prodding him to repeat exactly what he had literally just said, then after Kane said he had no idea if this means he's missing the season Spec again asked him to repeat himself and sounds condescending as hell when asking it. Kane did well not getting pissy with his ass.

His sense of entitlement questioning and speaking to these players and this team is absurd.

Sportsnet should just let him go already.