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Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2024-25: Re-Tool, Re-Group, Re-Mix, Re-Build

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PK Cronin said:
The part that is missing is the why.

Did the PK change something or did Sorokin? Just a hot streak or is this a permanent fix?
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This is the point. When Sorokin is on, he's a top 3 goalie in the NHL. When he's off he's totally average...And our roster isn't nearly good enough to overcome average goaltending.

But again we don't know why Sorokin, who began his career like gangbusters, is now way more Jekyll & Hyde. My only theory is that it has something to do with his contract extension, because his issues started once he got it. Maybe now he's starting to believe he deserves it, or maybe relaxed a bit on his training once he got the big deal. Not sure, but something is going on as he's way too talented to not be a perennial all-star and true difference-maker in this league.
 
Throttle said:
If the Isles bring back Palms on a 2 year deal, it’s not the end of the world.

Remember, the cap goes up and the Isles aren’t some UFA magnet to fill holes. You still need players.

If the Isles have Barzal’s cap hit on LTIR, then Lou can swing a trade for today, but really tomorrow to acquire a higher paid signed forward since the cap will open up to offset that. Find some silver lining in Barzal’s cap hit…
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Yeah, bringing back Palmieri isn’t the end of the world - he's not going to return much anyway. But it’s probably more important as a signal of an organizational shift rather than the specific assets he’d return.

Bringing back Nelson is much more egregious.
 
periferal said:
This is the point. When Sorokin is on, he's a top 3 goalie in the NHL. When he's off he's totally average...And our roster isn't nearly good enough to overcome average goaltending.

But again we don't know why Sorokin, who began his career like gangbusters, is now way more Jekyll & Hyde. My only theory is that it has something to do with his contract extension, because his issues started once he got it. Maybe now he's starting to believe he deserves it, or maybe relaxed a bit on his training once he got the big deal. Not sure, but something is going on as he's way too talented to not be a perennial all-star and true difference-maker in this league.
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I think part of Sorokin's "problem" might have just been the quality/quantity of shots he was facing, especially on the PP. But if there was a problem, and it was a mental thing, I'd trace it back to a couple of bad angle goals he gave up in the playoffs (one of which ended a season).
 
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MJF said:
Is this your signal to cut Lou a break and do it again next year with the same core, another year older? No thanks. It didn’t work in 2022 and it will be worse of we try it again.
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Me? No, absolutely not. I was just taking the usual bait.

As far as I’m concerned, right now you explore dealing two of the core defensemen - any of Dobson, Pelech, Pulock, or Mayfield - my personal preference would be Pelech and Pulock even though Pelech was playing great lately before last night's game.

You deal those 2 guys in the offseason and deal Nelson and Palmieri at the deadline. You add a first and a third from Nelson and Palmieri at the very least - Pulock and Pelech deals can be more like hockey trades if you can find them - I would deal either of them to Trotz for ROR. You send Varlamov anywhere he'd like to go - Casey too. Sign Shabanov from the KHL. Go hard after Chychrun if he’s available

Lee (7M) - Horvat (8.5M) - Barzal (9.15M)
Tsyplakov (3M) - O'Reilly (4.5M) - Holmstrom (5M)
Duclair (3.5M) - Pageau (5M) - Shabanov (1.5M)
Engvall (3M) - Maclean (.775M) - (Gatcomb .775M)

Chychrun (8.5M) - Dobson (8M)
Romanov (6M) - Deangelo (1.5M)
Perunovich (1.5M) - Mayfield (3.5M)

Sorokin (8.5)
Hogberg (.775)

This is less than 90M, so could add an extra forward and extra D and still have some cap space going into the year. This is 7 starters that weren’t here last year, and another 3 that weren’t here two years ago - that would be a 50% roster turnover in 2 seasons.
 
gordie43 said:
No matter how the rest of the season plays out the only way you trade Nelson is if he has told management he will explore free agency. Just like you posted replacing his goals the next few years will not be easy.

Palmeri I can’t decide on. He’s another guy you can pencil in for 20+ goals. I guess if you get the right package, you deal him. Nelson I would want to keep. I think he stays productive longer than Palmari does.
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What's worse...?

  1. Letting Nelson walk for nothing.
  2. Resigning him and his already declining play until his late 30's?

Both choices stink and yet they pale in comparison to letting a valuable asset walk without trading them when you have no realistic chance of winning the Cup that very year.

Have we learned nothing from the Tavares situation? The assets we could've gotten from him in a deal back in 2018 could've put us over the top vs Tampa, but Malkin did nothing and that very much hurt us in the long run.

Same thing with Nelson now. Doing nothing again at the trade deadline and leaving him on his going nowhere roster is the insane move - Especially in the face of the other two options above.



leeroggy said:
My fault, going off last year's memory. An extended Boeser fits this team like a glove.
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My friend...

This team is so average and devoid of scoring that any decent top-6 forward would "fit this team like a glove."

This is not a good thing.
 
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Selling Brock, Palmieri, and one of Pulock or Mayfield (RD's are more valuable in a trade than LD's) should be items 1, 2, and 3 by the TDL. If you can move Pageau as well to a contender, great. 3/4 of those moves should set the Isles up nicely.

Idk how long Pulock is supposed to be out for but hopefully it's not post TDL. I don't think he is but someone can fact check me on that.
 
Listen, I jumped on the bandwagon a bit; reality was always in the rear view mirror.

The real detriment, and I mean franchise impact from this, is a pick likely in the 8-13 range rather than the 1-7 range.
 
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Staple: on Lamoriello not wanting to sell: “You talk to other people around the league who have called on Pageau, Nelson, Palmieri and maybe other guys and the only thing those executives are hearing is ‘I wanna sign Brock Nelson, I’m not interested in hearing what your offer is’”(1:05:00)

Lol, copied from a Reddit post so font is all messed up
 
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Arsenalogist24 said:


Staple: on Lamoriello not wanting to sell: “You talk to other people around the league who have called on Pageau, Nelson, Palmieri and maybe other guys and the only thing those executives are hearing is ‘I wanna sign Brock Nelson, I’m not interested in hearing what your offer is’”(1:05:00)

Lol, copied from a Reddit post so font is all messed up
Click to expand...

Unless it’s all a smokescreen (lol), this is franchise malpractice
 
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Arsenalogist24 said:


Staple: on Lamoriello not wanting to sell: “You talk to other people around the league who have called on Pageau, Nelson, Palmieri and maybe other guys and the only thing those executives are hearing is ‘I wanna sign Brock Nelson, I’m not interested in hearing what your offer is’”(1:05:00)

Lol, copied from a Reddit post so font is all messed up
Click to expand...

Saw that too but just looked at Staples’ Twitter account and nothing is there on this topic.

If the quote you referenced is real then all the gloom and doom regarding Lou’s mindset is unfortunately true.

I’m gonna be sick if it’s verified.
 
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The Real JT said:
Saw that too but just looked at Staples’ Twitter account and nothing is there on this topic.

If that’s true then all the gloom and doom regarding Lou’s mindset is unfortunately true.

I’m gonna be sick if it’s verified.
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What do you mean by nothing being on Staple’s twitter account - this video has him saying the quote outright.
 
periferal said:
This is the point. When Sorokin is on, he's a top 3 goalie in the NHL. When he's off he's totally average...And our roster isn't nearly good enough to overcome average goaltending.

But again we don't know why Sorokin, who began his career like gangbusters, is now way more Jekyll & Hyde. My only theory is that it has something to do with his contract extension, because his issues started once he got it. Maybe now he's starting to believe he deserves it, or maybe relaxed a bit on his training once he got the big deal. Not sure, but something is going on as he's way too talented to not be a perennial all-star and true difference-maker in this league.
Click to expand...

Once he gets over used he becomes average, whether it's mental or just physical it's real thing....

Arsenalogist24 said:


Staple: on Lamoriello not wanting to sell: “You talk to other people around the league who have called on Pageau, Nelson, Palmieri and maybe other guys and the only thing those executives are hearing is ‘I wanna sign Brock Nelson, I’m not interested in hearing what your offer is’”(1:05:00)

Lol, copied from a Reddit post so font is all messed up
Click to expand...


This is nothing but "Fools Gold".
Not saying rip it to studs, but Sheeeesh trade the UFA's YOU IDIOT!
You can always try to bring them back in the summer if they really wanna be here Mr. Magoo!!!!
 
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MJF said:
How about the not so preposterous notion that we can fix a lot of holes by trading Barzal?
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Sober today, so I'm dealing in realities.

Zeeker said:
How about the insinuation that those who want to sell are the crazy ones, not the people who want to run it back for the umpteenth time with the same decaying roster?
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Weird, it's like you don't know who the GM is, lol. Again, dealing in realities here.
 
SI90 said:
Barzal out indefinitely with a LBI. Pulock and Dobson.

Even if we win 90% of the remaining games, any GM should do right and still sell off UFAs.

If we by some miracle make the playoffs, are we really expecting a run with this team who even when healthy can’t score a PP goal and has been historically bad special teams?

I know we’re playing real hockey now and don’t look pathetic but the reality is we’re not a Stanley cup contender right now and don’t stack up.

The best interest of the franchise is to sell UFAs and possibly Pageau and Lee(unlikely) for as many assets as we can get to build going forward.
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I don't really get these comments. If the team wins 90% of their games from here on out, with the players expecting to miss time, that means they are playing hockey that's good enough to compete for the Stanley Cup. I suppose Lou will go to his old, "if you have time you use it mantra" but how can going on a streak where you win 90% of your games not instill confidence that you are playing hockey good enough to win a Stanley Cup?

I'm not personally saying this roster is good enough to win a Stanley Cup, but I also don't fall into the insane category that a playoff team doesn't have the chance to win it. It's a clean slate once playoffs start. That's why you have surprise teams every year. I'll even double down on it if teams like Ottawa or CBJ sneak in with very little playoff experience, leaves the door even wider open for a more experienced core.
 
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periferal said:
What's worse...?

  1. Letting Nelson walk for nothing.
  2. Resigning him and his already declining play until his late 30's?

Both choices stink and yet they pale in comparison to letting a valuable asset walk without trading them when you have no realistic chance of winning the Cup that very year.

Have we learned nothing from the Tavares situation? The assets we could've gotten from him in a deal back in 2018 could've put us over the top vs Tampa, but Malkin did nothing and that very much hurt us in the long run.

Same thing with Nelson now. Doing nothing again at the trade deadline and leaving him on his going nowhere roster is the insane move - Especially in the face of the other two options above.
Click to expand...
Context is everything. If Nelson really doesn't care about chasing a big payday, and is willing to take a salary similar to what he is now, him playing as a 2C and aging into a 3C under a salary like that with the cap projections is really not a terrible situation. He takes Cizikas or Pageau's spot when they are gone and suddenly that's some pretty nice depth. Brock's been part of the turn around in the PK. Precap numbers I was totally with you, but these new projections, all depends on what Brock wants for a salary...context.
 
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The win streak was nice and to see the team play well and get some nice results.
Not sure that level of play is sustainable, especially with injuries.

IMO, I would trade Nelson and Palmieri before they are injured.

It is always tough to attract free agents and there are not many desirable ones out there.
So, there is an argument to be made to sign both those players, because how are you replacing that production, however, the roster is not cutting it, so changes need to be made.

With Detroit's surge - they could be a good fit... Kasper, A 1st, & Nygaard are all nice potential returns. Maybe even expanding the deal and grabbing a player who is dropped out of favour like Copp or Compher.

And I still believe Palmieri back to NJ is a good fit too... Arseny Gritsyuk could be an excellent fit - his contract in the KHL is up this season... Tsyplakov on the LW and Gritsyuk on the RW, just need a strong and capable C.
 
Either Lou signs Nelson by the deadline or trades him.....i prefer trade, but depending on the signing numbers and term, i could live with a signing. No trade or no signing....Lou needs to be go, his time will be up.
 
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There is no one that can replace Nelson in our system or in free agency. If he signs, I'm ok but I need other guys shipped out. Trade Palms and Pageau then. You can get a Kerfoot or Frederic to replace Pageau until Danny Nelson is ready and he's probably 2 years away.
 
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