Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2024-25: Re-Tool, Re-Group, Re-Mix, Re-Build

[periferal]

I wasn't advocating any approach - just saying Lou trading "productive" players for futures is unlikely if there's a possibility that the team could make the playoffs. Having said that, I've been in the "a tear-down rebuild isn't necessary because we have enough good assets that an intelligent retool can work" camp. Of course, the retool vs. rebuild vs rewhatever is a separate question from who should be doing it. I still think there's enough good pieces that a smart/proactive GM could turn things around. But Lou moves too slowly (or not at all) for a Cap/UFA-driven league and doesn't seem to have a cohesive plan for how to build a successful roster in the league today.

The point I was making was that I totally agree that we shouldn't count on Lou trading away any veterans for futures before the deadline because...We've literally never seen him do that before.

And it actually does sound like you are advocating for an approach - That being something different than just continuing the clearly failed approach that Lou's been doing for years that led us to this point.

 

[Tres Peleches]

Roy has this team playing hard

They just lack true goal scorers. And I don’t mean people with good shots, I mean guys who know when/where to be to get loose pucks and get into good scoring position before they have the puck and then the ability to quickly rip it

I’ve never seen a team so allergic to one-timing the puck, it’s like they think they’ll explode if they don’t dust the puck off at least once before shooting

 

[Throttle]

I wasn't advocating any approach - just saying Lou trading "productive" players for futures is unlikely if there's a possibility that the team could make the playoffs. Having said that, I've been in the "a tear-down rebuild isn't necessary because we have enough good assets that an intelligent retool can work" camp. Of course, the retool vs. rebuild vs rewhatever is a separate question from who should be doing it. I still think there's enough good pieces that a smart/proactive GM could turn things around. But Lou moves too slowly (or not at all) for a Cap/UFA-driven league and doesn't seem to have a cohesive plan for how to build a successful roster in the league today.

Needs to be a more Vegas-like position. Move overpaid guys out (Barzal) while they have value, declining or limited use players making too much (Pelech/Pulock), and flip the Nelson/Palms of the world and backfill with those assets.

Now, nobody is lining up to play for NYI like Vegas, but just like Horvat, sometimes players have limited options and the Isles can strike.

Vegas has held onto Karlsson despite his contract bc he can play multiple roles and still be effective, so he has value in how the team plays its style. The isles have NO style.

 

[Lek]

The transition to the way Roy wants this team to play does not happen in 6 months....I truly did not figure on us improving this year but more, taking steps to change the way this team plays and thusly bringing in the players to do so...which will take a year or two yet.

 

[periferal]

The transition to the way Roy wants this team to play does not happen in 6 months....I truly did not figure on us improving this year but more, taking steps to change the way this team plays and thusly bringing in the players to do so...which will take a year or two yet.

Wow...I've seen people playing devil's advocate before, but are you the devil himself?

The roster is the lowest scoring team in the league in terms of goals/game. That means that either...

1. Roy is a worse coach than we think.
2. This roster is worse than we think.

In either case, there is a serious lack of talent (and youth) here and it's going to take WAAAAY longer than "a year or two" for even a good GM to fix it. And...You should have no faith in Lou to create a championship roster. Let's remember that was basically Snows team that Trotz took to the semifinals.

And speaking of Trotz....Somehow he managed to come in and have success from day 1 with a team he didn't ask for.

A whole bunch of ignoring the reality of what's really going on here.

 

[Chardo]

Wow...I've seen people playing devil's advocate before, but are you the devil himself?

The roster is the lowest scoring team in the league in terms of goals/game. That means that either...

1. Roy is a worse coach than we think.
2. This roster is worse than we think.

In either case, there is a serious lack of talent (and youth) here and it's going to take WAAAAY longer than "a year or two" for even a good GM to fix it. And...You should have no faith in Lou to create a championship roster. Let's remember that was basically Snows team that Trotz took to the semifinals.

And speaking of Trotz....Somehow he managed to come in and have success from day 1 with a team he didn't ask for.

A whole bunch of ignoring the reality of what's really going on here.

True, but Trotz doesn't even take that job if he didn't think he could have success with those players.

 

[seabass45]

IDK. All I was saying in my post was, assuming Lou is still GM at the TDL is there anything in his history that makes us think there's a snowball's chance in hades that he'd trade away a top 6 forward for futures unless the team is pretty much mathematically eliminated from the playoffs? IMO, the answer is no.

I’m admittedly playing optimist here and I might regret it. They need to show a lot to get them to the point where you’re not thinking about selling.

 

[seabass45]

True, but Trotz doesn't even take that job if he didn't think he could have success with those players.

Yep, he got a lot of confused questions about why he would take on this team but he was clear about thinking it was a group he could succeed with, in part bc it was a prototypical Trotz team. Really strong and balanced top four D, great goaltending, offense could have been better.

Could have easily sat out and waited on a Cup contender to falter and fire their coach.

 

[JRD76]

Pens and Philly wins tonight officially make the Isles the worst team in the east. Let's bring Hagens home

 

[Lek]

Wow...I've seen people playing devil's advocate before, but are you the devil himself?

The roster is the lowest scoring team in the league in terms of goals/game. That means that either...

1. Roy is a worse coach than we think.
2. This roster is worse than we think.

In either case, there is a serious lack of talent (and youth) here and it's going to take WAAAAY longer than "a year or two" for even a good GM to fix it. And...You should have no faith in Lou to create a championship roster. Let's remember that was basically Snows team that Trotz took to the semifinals.

And speaking of Trotz....Somehow he managed to come in and have success from day 1 with a team he didn't ask for.

A whole bunch of ignoring the reality of what's really going on here.

Hmmm... i have been called many things; Jesus, THE Devil, and even Britney, though never hospital.....depends on ones level of intoxication more times than not.

1 - Roy is a better coach than you may think....he actually has these guys playing well (for the most part)..and as most have pointed out, we do not have much scoring talent on this team. It is not his fault they can not score. But they have been in all these games and should have a better scoring percentage despite the lack of true goal scorers. (i can not believe i am somewhat defending them lol).

B - I think we all think the roster is rather flawed (and i would be so bold to assure you that Roy knows this as well), so not sure we can be worse than we think as we think we are pretty worse.

3 - The special teams are "special" (which is not part of this actual conversation depsite the non-fact that it kinda is) and more and more it is a players issue. I am not sure these guys can do any better, Period. I am not sure a bunch of us would do to much worse, Really!. I am amazed at how a bunch of professional hockey players can be this bad....how they do not understand to play a position or SHOOT!.....Maybe we just put out our worst guys out there and see what happens....certainly can not be worser, can it?

e - I do think that in a year or two from now (more likely 2 for more tangible results maybe) we can see an improved club. I do think you saw this year a step to changing the profile of the team with "Duck"lair and Tsippy. Whether or not that step works or not is another matter i have not the time to address as my coffee cup is about empty....and as we have a game on tonight, i need to start working on a few cocktails....

7 - In conclusion....reality sucks....dreaming is better.....and if you are a Giants fan along with this team, mushrooms are even betterer. Bring on Sunday!!!!

 

[Glory Days]

Great, we have Dippin' Dots again.

I have no idea what dippin dots is but there is no reason to attack another poster because you don’t agree with their post.

 

[Lame Lambert]

I have no idea what dippin dots is but there is no reason to attack another poster because you don’t agree with their post.

I’m not attacking you. Further, I suggest you review rule 8 of the forum regarding claims of insider information.

 

[MJF]

Pens and Philly wins tonight officially make the Isles the worst team in the east. Let's bring Hagens home

Welcome to Lotto Land. And the team didn't have to announce a rebuild to get here.

 

[Zeeker]

Welcome to Lotto Land. And the team didn't have to announce a rebuild to get here.

Lou is actually playing 4D Chess

 

[SI]

I think we may see changes sooner rather than later

Buffalo tonight and Rangers this weekend - if we see similar results we may see a trade and/or Bridgeport call-up.

 

[mm11]

pretty low self esteam this team has. Everyone skating is at fault. Let's see what happens

 

[MJF]

I think we may see changes sooner rather than later

Buffalo tonight and Rangers this weekend - if we see similar results we may see a trade and/or Bridgeport call-up.

Don’t do anything this time. Just let the freefall happen on its own.

 

[impaaaaaact]

Barzal out. They could easily lose the next two. Heads gotta fly after that

 

[MJF]

Barzal out. They could easily lose the next two. Heads gotta fly after that

Bring Hagens home

 

[Lame Lambert]

Barzal out. They could easily lose the next two. Heads gotta fly after that

More like the perfect excuse to keep Lou around longer.

 

[Throttle]

When Barzal was out for 20 games, the team went on a heater and made the playoffs.

They probably win while he is out since they will play a simpler game.

More like the perfect excuse to keep Lou around longer.

Malkin is not dumping Lou - he brought him in for stability.

 

[periferal]

True, but Trotz doesn't even take that job if he didn't think he could have success with those players.

Let's remember that Trotz was fired/let go/not resigned by the Caps AFTER they won a Cup so there was literally 1 team with an open job - The Islanders. We can sit here and say that only Lou could've gotten him here, that he wouldn't have taken the job if he didn't think he could win immediately, he only took the job because it was the only open one, or any number of other theories, but that's just what they are - Theories. We'll never be able to prove them for sure.

What we can say for certain is that Trotz is an exceptional coach, and that bears out in the results he got (and the lack of results we've got since he left). I think we can also say with confidence that if Trotz came back today that we would get better results than we've been getting - Even if this isn't the exact roster Trotz would want.

The bottom line is that this team is a mess and getting worse. We can blame Roy or the roster, but all of it is on Lou. His #1 responsibility is to build a winner and he's been failing for years. It's ok when you have Trotz who is so good at his job he can mask other deficiencies in the organization, but now the mask has been removed and we can see how poor of a job Lou has been doing in terms of team building and cap management. And it's mind-bending to so many of us fans that there are still a path of Isles fans who want the guy who put us in this position to continue to be in control.

 

[Lame Lambert]

When Barzal was out for 20 games, the team went on a heater and made the playoffs.

They probably win while he is out since they will play a simpler game.


Malkin is not dumping Lou - he brought him in for stability.

Yes, employing a guy 7 years older than the average male life expectancy of the US is the epitome of stability.

 

[Throttle]

Yes, employing a guy 7 years older than the average male life expectancy of the US is the epitome of stability.

Plenty of companies much larger than Malkin and Isles are run by old dudes.

Malkin wants a sure thing to run the organization, someone that knows the ins/outs of the NHL - Malkin is hands off, he lets the management team run the business. Whether you like that as a fan is different than what he’s doing as an owner with vested interests outside the Isles.

 

[MJF]

Yes, employing a guy 7 years older than the average male life expectancy of the US is the epitome of stability.

Stability is not supposed to be a jobs program.