Roster Building XXII: Too Many Forwards, Hopefully One Cup

[chaz4hockey]

I figured the cost of living would balance out the taxes but I was way wrong. The cost of living in Tampa is actually a little lower than Raleigh. That kinda surprised me.

Re cost of living- . No state taxes but…

Home costs are very expensive for type of home he will buy plus home and car insurance are through the roof. Triangle schools are also much better.

I was always willing to take less money in my career when I liked my boss, my job and who I worked with. Made coming to work a pleasure. When I didn’t, I bolted.

For an athlete on track to make a $100m what’s a million or so less?

To each their own though.

 

[cptjeff]

If Guentzel truly wanted to stay, he would have signed. I don’t get why that’s such a sticking point.

Even if we only offered him league minimum?

There's "I like it here and want to stay" and then there's "I can't play anywhere else and will take whatever shit sandwich of a deal they give me in order to stay".

Wanting to stay and wanting what you understand to be your fair value are not mutually exclusive. Every want is subject to limits. Some preferences are firm, some preferences are soft. And for most players in the NHL, any preference for staying with a team is a soft preference out of necessity. Sure, you might want something, but if they're not willing to give you what you need to make it happen, oh well, there are 31 other options and they're mostly interchangeable. Absolutely no established player in the NHL is going to take the shit sandwich in desperation to stay with any given team. Just won't happen. Wipe that expectation out of your mind entirely, it's absurd bullcrap.

And wants are subject to change. If the Canes were jerking Guentzel around for months, as we ultimately were, offering him lowball deals, he very fairly may have concluded that we didn't really want him, and if we didn't want him, he didn't want to be part of an organization where he wasn't valued.

At some point, he made the mental break and moved on. That point very clearly came well before we raised our offer to him.

We f***ed around and found out. We had a guy who wanted to stay but we played hardball and lost him.

 

[Chrispy]

Guentzel also said he wanted to re-sign in Pittsburgh after the trade despite all reports and behavior contradicting that.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Guentzel also said he wanted to re-sign in Pittsburgh after the trade despite all reports and behavior contradicting that.

I don't think I recall him ever saying that. There was even a post game interview after a game versus Pittsburgh that made it clear it probably wasn't in the cards.

My intention was to stay, but they just thought there was a better direction to go a different way. It’s out of my hands. It’s not my choice,” Guentzel said after his team’s 4-1 loss in Pittsburgh on Tuesday night.

What Guentzel could have added to that quote is that, as a pending free agent, it was his intention to stay at his chosen price and his desired length of contract. Neither of which the Penguins were willing to grant. It will also be “his choice” if would like to re-sign here as a free agent after the season ends. But based on Guentzel’s clipped response when asked about that prospect, it doesn’t sound like there’s much hope in that regard.

“I don’t know. That’s … I don’t know,” Guentzel responded. “We’ll just see how this year goes. And I really like it in Carolina.”

 

[Chrispy]

Yes, but the reports out of Pittsburgh were that he was planning to hit the market all along despite saying that after being traded.

Guentzel has a history of talking out both sides of his mouth.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Yes, but the reports out of Pittsburgh were that he was planning to hit the market all along despite saying that after being traded.

Guentzel has a history of talking out both sides of his mouth.

Wait, so you claim Guenztal said he wanted to re-sign in Pittsburgh, even after being traded to Carolina. When questioned, you now say Guenztal said he was planning on hitting the market all along. It sounds like you’re talking out of both sides of your mouth, not Guenztal.

Guenztal likely wanted to stay in Pittsburgh before the trade. He grew up in the organization, he’s friends with Crosby, etc. But he also wanted a long-term, high value contract, and Pittsburgh certainly wasn’t going to give it to him. It simply didn’t make sense for their organization to do so.

So he’s traded to Carolina, finds success here, and seems very open to re-signing here. Every indication is that he was willing to do so. The Canes organization certainly felt it was almost a sure thing, considering they invested time and effort to getting him to re-sign, even at the cost of losing the chance to sign other departing UFAs (according to RBA). But in an effort to get the best deal for the organization, the Canes waited too long to close the deal, allowing other suitors to enter Guenztal’s view. Hence why the Vancouver and Tampa Bay rumors started appearing in mid-June.

 

[chaz4hockey]

Yes, but the reports out of Pittsburgh were that he was planning to hit the market all along despite saying that after being traded.

Guentzel has a history of talking out both sides of his mouth.

To be fair, that’s what agents and athletes have to do. Never close a door when a contract is up for signing/renewal.

 

[Tryamw]

I believe that Guentzel gave us a chance but by the time we said yes he had heard other rumors so

 

[Chrispy]

Wait, so you claim Guenztal said he wanted to re-sign in Pittsburgh, even after being traded to Carolina. When questioned, you now say Guenztal said he was planning on hitting the market all along. It sounds like you’re talking out of both sides of your mouth, not Guenztal.

Guenztal likely wanted to stay in Pittsburgh before the trade. He grew up in the organization, he’s friends with Crosby, etc. But he also wanted a long-term, high value contract, and Pittsburgh certainly wasn’t going to give it to him. It simply didn’t make sense for their organization to do so.

So he’s traded to Carolina, finds success here, and seems very open to re-signing here. Every indication is that he was willing to do so. The Canes organization certainly felt it was almost a sure thing, considering they invested time and effort to getting him to re-sign, even at the cost of losing the chance to sign other departing UFAs (according to RBA). But in an effort to get the best deal for the organization, the Canes waited too long to close the deal, allowing other suitors to enter Guenztal’s view. Hence why the Vancouver and Tampa Bay rumors started appearing in mid-June.

He said he was willing to re-sign both places, but the media in Pittsburgh was reporting he was always planning to go UFA.

My point is he was always planning on hitting the market. As soon as Guentzel had Carolina’s offer in hand, Tampa started making moves to match that offer.

It’s absolutely his right to go to market as a UFA. Doesn’t mean I believe him when he says he would have signed ahead of July 1 in Pittsburgh or Carolina.

 

[yrttijorma]

KK: Fresh start. Fresh start for everybody. Great year last year, so what, bad year, so what. Still really young.

What's held KK back: Level he has to get to where not just every game but every shift has to be the same. He can get there.

This is a bit off-topic question, but is Kotkaniemi abbreviated as KK because there are two K's in his name?

As the name is Finnish, for Finns that abbreviation doesn't make any sense because his name is two words. "Kotka" and "niemi".

kotka = eagle
niemi = cape / ness (geographical term)



It's just funny how these go sometimes.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

This is a bit off-topic question, but is Kotkaniemi abbreviated as KK because there are two K's in his name?

As the name is Finnish, for Finns that abbreviation doesn't make any sense because his name is two words. "Kotka" and "niemi".

kotka = eagle
niemi = cape / ness (geographical term)



It's just funny how these go sometimes.

It’s what his teammates, including Aho, call him. I don’t know for sure how it came about other than what you suggested, that it’s because of 2 Ks in his name.

 

[AD Skinner]

It’s an homage to the incomparable anthem singer of years gone by KK Fritsch

 

[Lempo]

It’s what his teammates, including Aho, call him. I don’t know for sure how it came about other than what you suggested, that it’s because of 2 Ks in his name.

Legacy nickname from Montréal, I believe.

 

[tarheelhockey]

He said he was willing to re-sign both places, but the media in Pittsburgh was reporting he was always planning to go UFA.

My point is he was always planning on hitting the market. As soon as Guentzel had Carolina’s offer in hand, Tampa started making moves to match that offer.

It’s absolutely his right to go to market as a UFA. Doesn’t mean I believe him when he says he would have signed ahead of July 1 in Pittsburgh or Carolina.

Yeah I’m not too inclined to believe a guy would play here for 2 months, then completely forego his career-defining UFA period in order to commit here ASAP. That would be a pretty ill advised way to approach free agency, especially when a GM change is happening at the same time.

That sounds like a guy saying he could see himself having married that girl he dated for 8 weeks, but she let him get away. Yeah, ok buddy. I’m sure you had already gone ring shopping and everything.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

It’s an homage to the incomparable anthem singer of years gone by KK Fritsch

There's only one KK singer that matter:

 

[chaz4hockey]

Nice article on Ghost-Walker combination:

Gostisbehere, Walker Building Chemistry On The Blue Line | Carolina Hurricanes

The duo hit the ice for training camp this week after signing with the Canes as free agents in July

www.nhl.com

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Nice article on Ghost-Walker

Is Ghost Walker a new show on AMC that is a mashup of Ghostbusters and Walker Texas Ranger?

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Maybe Guentzel 1) intended to test Free agency 2) wanted to keep Carolina as a backup plan 3) knew about Carolina's take it or leave it style of what some have referred to as negotiating, so when asked he threw out a number he thought they weren't willing to do, and by the time the Canes "met his price" he had already moved on

Or maybe he never intended to sign and was stringing them along bc don't burn a bridge until you're sure, who knows

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

Damn y’all. I wouldn’t want to sign here either if I knew you guys would still be talking about this.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Damn y’all. I wouldn’t want to sign here either if I knew you guys would still be talking about this.

Imagine what Chad LaRose thinks.

 

[AD Skinner]

Is Ghost Walker a new show on AMC that is a mashup of Ghostbusters and Walker Texas Ranger?

I think it has Patricia Arquette in it

 

[Bub]

Is Ghost Walker a new show on AMC that is a mashup of Ghostbusters and Walker Texas Ranger?

This is Ghost Who Walks erasure.

 

[Svechhammer]

We lost our on Guentzel because we weren't willing to take a good deal when we thought we could get a great one.

We sometimes paralyze ourselves into inaction because we cannot get every single star to align to get the absolute perfect deal. It just is what it is, no sense in losing sleep over it now

 

[Lempo]

Maybe Jake Guentzel didn't like us because we're clingy.

 

[chaz4hockey]

Interesting that there is virtually no informtation coming out re: the C2 squad and how they have looked. Of course line positioning probably doesn't matter in training camp but it is surprising to see Suzuki as a 3C in camp. Will he ever make the big squad here in Raleigh???

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838201845249901009