Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XX (WTF are we going to do this Off-Season edition)

[Kendo]

My issues with Miller is the passing to the opponent on multiple occasions.

Terrible decisions and or execution.

Maybe this was a bad year for him, I don't know, but the giveaways were very egregious.

We all know he makes mistakes.

He's also one of the best D partners Fox has ever had. If not THE best.

Miller with Borgen is fine. Miller with Fox is better. Anyone could play with Borgen, Arguably the same with Schneider.

 

[JohnC]

Miller’s just the same deal as Laf. Two guys that had bad seasons on a team full of guys that did.

It’s just wanting to move on from young players for the sake of moving on from them.

Miller, Laf, Schneider, etc. all 25 and under players that people want moved and will wonder why they’re having better careers on other teams just like JT Miller, Buch, Howden before them.

 

[Siddi]

Could Vegas be a spot for Chris Kreider? He isn't that far removed from scoring nearly 40 goals two seasons ago. Kreider may not have that skating burst from his BC days but he should still be able to contribute 30 goals next season. He had 22 goals this season. He can play in all of the special teams. Net front presence on the PP.

If you believe Kreider is good for 30 goals next season then why would you want to trade him?

 

[Savant]

Just have Connor McDavid or be in state that has no income tax so you can cheat the salary cap. Duh

 

[RangerBoy]

If you believe Kreider is good for 30 goals next season then why would you want to trade him?

His time here is up. Too many grievances with Chris. Jim Ramsey. The PR guy. Goodrow. Trouba. Time to change the culture of the team.

 

[RangerBoy]

I don't want to trade Kreider for nothing, but having Hanifin instead of Soucy (Soucy goes for less than nothing in a separate deal) would be a gigantic upgrade however it shakes out.

I don't think there's a deal there because I like it too much. And I'm someone that wants Kreider to own that PPG record.

Hanifin struggled this season for Vegas. He was awful at the 4 Nations playing with Fox.

 

[RangersFan1994]

Could something be worked on based on Cole Sillinger to Rangers for K’Andre Miller?

 

[Vitto79]

Long shot but If the Leafs lose tonight and they change it up what about Tavares back to NY?

 

[Vitto79]

Scott Laughton good option as a 3rd line center?

Leafs have him at 50 off and even then he’s not that good

Definitely need a 3C though . Has to be ufa options. Suter ?

Guys like Faska are more of a 4C and Carrick was good

 

[Vitto79]

Parsinnen with a GWG
Zibanejad 0 points again.

Parsinnen playing C or wing ?

 

[Shesterkybomb]

More Canadians please.

 

[lakeshirts37]

Sign Bennett 5 years
Zibs for Bertuzzi
Kreider for a pick
Soucy + mid/late pick for McDonagh
sign Orlov

Panarin JTM Laffy
Cuylle Bennett Gabe
Berard Trocheck Bertuzzi
Edstrom Carrick Rempe
Brodz Parsinnen Othmann

McDonagh Fox
KAM Borgen
Orlov Schneider
Vaak

If that team can actually execute, play defense and forecheck, we win.

The reality is, this team still has a window open with a re-tool. Keep the pick this season or use it to get a better Center than Bennett.

Mika has more value than that

 

[TGWL]

I have not watched Marner enough to give an honest opinion on him. I cant just judge a guy solely on stats. I do know some posters are down on him. Sometimes guys are bad playoff performers until something clicks and then they have a good playoff years. Arod (baseball) had some bad playoffs for the Yankees and then in 2009 it finally clicked for him.

I thought Barkov was very difficult to play against in our playoff series. I went in to that series judging him more on stats. He was a horse against us. We seemed powerless to get the puck off his stick at times. He was breaking up a lot of our neutral zone plays. Many of my positive takeaways about Barkov vs us might not always show up in point production.

I'm not saying your belief is wrong. I do not watch some of these guys play enough. I'm largely going by last season for Barkov because that is when I watched him play the most.

Playoffs are just different. Some players don't have that intensity. Marner is a smooth skater who can buy space for himself and his teammates with his great edgework and hands. He can thread highlight passes and score pretty goals of the rush.

But the rink shrinks during playoffs. Garbage goals matter. You have to battle. You have to be willing to take a hit to get a shot off. Take a hit to get a pass off. You have to be first to loose pucks, rebounds, and get free from players holding your stick down. Fans will rip on those players from not leading the team to a win, but that's when you need the rest of your team to buy your skilled player some space so they can make plays.

I see a lot of goals scored with forwards skating to the net, basically into defensemen, and just creating havoc for loose pucks or rebounds. Marner isn't that. Panarin isn't that. But somebody needs to be that.

 

[NYRKing]

Maybe Sullivan will push to keep Kreider:

Panarin Miller Cuylle
Laff Trochek Gabe
Kreider Zibby Berard
Edstrom Carrick Parsinnen/Othman

 

[TGWL]

Maybe Sullivan will push to keep Kreider:

Panarin Miller Cuylle
Laff Trochek Gabe
Kreider Zibby Berard
Edstrom Carrick Parsinnen/Othman

Sullivan didn't really favor Kreider during the tournament. I don't know if he's going to push to keep him. I think he'll be vocal on removing or keep Kreider.

I don't think Parsley is a 4th line player. I think he's going to have to find his game at 3rd line level, or he won't be playing a lot. With Othmann, hes got some jam for the 4th line, but again, I feel like if he's a 4th line player, we missed the boat on trading him. Rempe might not find a lot of love from Sullivan, but I think he's still the best option on a 4th line role.

 

[Vitto79]

Maybe Sullivan will push to keep Kreider:

Panarin Miller Cuylle
Laff Trochek Gabe
Kreider Zibby Berard
Edstrom Carrick Parsinnen/Othman

Maybe but I can’t see them running it back so some change happens and Kreider seems like the easiest move

Boston for Zacha makes some sense

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I'm middle of the road on Kreider and I'm torn about his future here. I'd really like to know how much was being a sook and how much was injury related last year because selling low on him and having him go somewhere else and put up 35-40 goals while we struggle to score would be McDonagh all over again. The biggest problem to this rebuild was the win now at all cost mentality, Dallas did the same thing for years until it finally came to a head and they dropped Benn and Seguin down the lineup and played their youth. If Kreider and Zib can be slotted where they belong I'm fine with them staying. If they are hanging around to block the Othmann, Berard, Sykora Perrault's like they did with Laf, Chytil and Kakko then they need to leave.

 

[NickyFotiu]

Playoffs are just different. Some players don't have that intensity. Marner is a smooth skater who can buy space for himself and his teammates with his great edgework and hands. He can thread highlight passes and score pretty goals of the rush.

But the rink shrinks during playoffs. Garbage goals matter. You have to battle. You have to be willing to take a hit to get a shot off. Take a hit to get a pass off. You have to be first to loose pucks, rebounds, and get free from players holding your stick down. Fans will rip on those players from not leading the team to a win, but that's when you need the rest of your team to buy your skilled player some space so they can make plays.

I see a lot of goals scored with forwards skating to the net, basically into defensemen, and just creating havoc for loose pucks or rebounds. Marner isn't that. Panarin isn't that. But somebody needs to be that.

I agree. Time and space are taken away much more in the playoffs. The guys that can create it for themselves with speed or power are worth a premium.

 

[Kendo]

Hanifin struggled this season for Vegas. He was awful at the 4 Nations playing with Fox.

I wouldn't say he struggled this season. The team "struggled" to get out of the second round, but I don't think HE struggled. He wasn't on the ice for a GA the last 4 games, fwiw.

Fox looked worse than Hanifin at the 4N. If I'm comfortable calling it a blip on the radar for Fox, then I'm not crucifying his partner that didn't look quite as bad.

 

[SA16]

Playoffs are just different. Some players don't have that intensity. Marner is a smooth skater who can buy space for himself and his teammates with his great edgework and hands. He can thread highlight passes and score pretty goals of the rush.

But the rink shrinks during playoffs. Garbage goals matter. You have to battle. You have to be willing to take a hit to get a shot off. Take a hit to get a pass off. You have to be first to loose pucks, rebounds, and get free from players holding your stick down. Fans will rip on those players from not leading the team to a win, but that's when you need the rest of your team to buy your skilled player some space so they can make plays.

I see a lot of goals scored with forwards skating to the net, basically into defensemen, and just creating havoc for loose pucks or rebounds. Marner isn't that. Panarin isn't that. But somebody needs to be that.

It's just a made up toughness type of narrative. 65% of the goals scored with Marner on the ice the last 3 (and 5) years have been for the Leafs. Where's the problem? People may not like his playstyle but that does not mean it has not been extremely effective.

If you want to strip out defense and just look at goals scored, the Leafs have scored more goals per minute with Marner on the ice than the teams have with Point, Kopitar, Hintz, Nichushkin, Bennett, Kucherov, Aho, Barkov, Guentzel, Hischier, ROR, Robertson, Pastrnak, Reinhart, etc.

 

[Fitzy]

I wouldn't say he struggled this season. The team "struggled" to get out of the second round, but I don't think HE struggled. He wasn't on the ice for a GA the last 4 games, fwiw.

Fox looked worse than Hanifin at the 4N. If I'm comfortable calling it a blip on the radar for Fox, then I'm not crucifying his partner that didn't look quite as bad.

Fox really did have a horrendous four nations. Would have been a little embarassing given how that was a lot of western team's most visible exposure to him if I gave a shit what fans of other teams thought.

 

[bernmeister]

Maybe Sullivan will push to keep Kreider:

Panarin Miller Cuylle
Laff Trochek Gabe
Kreider Zibby Berard
Edstrom Carrick Parsinnen/Othman

moving CK w/low value due to injury = epic fail
need to move Zib, addition by subtraction

need to sell high bread/Fox/Shesty depending on the returns
bc
we did no draft well
incl in part b'c we did not listen to bern
and instead did stupid win now

the piper now gets paid
learn w/da bern now, or regret it later

 

[Kendo]

moving CK w/low value due to injury = epic fail
need to move Zib, addition by subtraction

need to sell high bread/Fox/Shesty depending on the returns
bc
we did no draft well
incl in part b'c we did not listen to bern
and instead did stupid win now

the piper now gets paid
learn w/da bern now, or regret it later

We all win some and lose some on making calls. I'm not sure you have such a stellar track record to get all uppity about.

I'm sure you have some good calls in your history, but you've also had some laughers. We all do.

EDIT: I was fuming over Lindbom instead of Jack Drury. Yay me.

I still have hope for Othmann, but I was convinced Chaz Lucius was THE GUY. That would NOT have worked out.

 

[Alluckks]

Interesting we haven't heard any of our beat writers say much more either way about Drury keeping the pick or giving it away.

Might mean that they are still mulling options.

If they were the keep the pick I have to imagine it is for trade purposes.

 

[bernmeister]

We all win some and lose some on making calls. I'm not sure you have such a stellar track record to get all uppity about.

I'm sure you have some good calls in your history, but you've also had some laughers. We all do.

EDIT: I was fuming over Lindbom instead of Jack Drury. Yay me.

I still have hope for Othmann, but I was convinced Chaz Lucius was THE GUY. That would NOT have worked out.

Sure we all have indiv hits + misses, but my track record is sufficiently high enuf that I can say more often than not I was correct, and same can't be said for Rs mgmt

This cannot be said for many who followed herd mentality, which often emphasized immediate gain regardless of consequences

just 3 (besides obv trade Lindgren, etc)
I said not to trade Kreider 10 yrs ago
I said deal vets, keep youth
I said no to stupid win now cannibalizing of draft picks

there are plenty more and I'm too busy to make a list
The entire board knows me.
And again, Boo Nieves as a test at pivot betw Kreider + Zib is also correct, b'c as I said, there was zero reason to at least not try as an experiment. Even then there was reason to ? if Meeka not more effective a a W