Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XX (WTF are we going to do this Off-Season edition)

[deathb4disco]

I think K'andre has a big bounce back with the new coaching staff. He was trending skyward under Gallant & the talent is still there.

Stop playing man to man d would solve alot of our D issues

 

[RangersFan1994]

Would 8 years at 6.0 per season get it done for Will Cuylle???

 

[RangersFan1994]

If we move Kreider for picks or prospects, could we sign Boeser? Familiar with Miller, shoot first player. I'm always in the "no asset" acquisition is better than making a deal club

I like Boeser but his injury history concerns me. Good player though but big risk. I’d give him no more than 3 years.

 

[bleedblue94]

Mika for Rossi makes more sense for both team imo. Mika goes to Minny who needs a top 6 C and has a bunch of Swedes and Zuccarello who he is familiar with. Rossi strikes me as the same type of player as Brassard and Zibanejad were before. Unwanted player by his team who could use a change. Continue the cycle.

Kreider to Boston already seems to be gaining steam in some social media circle. I think both sides fanbases are thinking it. Zacha would be a good fit. Solid 2 way 3C. I think both trades are doable if both the player and management are upfront about it.

Just asking what about Minnesota speaks to the lifestyle Mika has? Virtually nothing. Not saying it can't happen but for a guy that loves city life and other "fun" away from the team/rink Minnesota and it's lifestyle doesn't really speak to that.

 

[bleedblue94]

Once larkin gets dealt I really wonder/hope nyr is in on him but the issue is Detroit is going to be taking a step back when they make that trade (on purpose) and nyr doesn't really have the assets for Larkin unless they trade someone like Gabe.

 

[Machinehead]

Just asking what about Minnesota speaks to the lifestyle Mika has? Virtually nothing. Not saying it can't happen but for a guy that loves city life and other "fun" away from the team/rink Minnesota and it's lifestyle doesn't really speak to that.

He might think they have a chance to win and he would get a chance to play consistently.

We treat the guy like Liberace.

 

[bleedblue94]

He might think they have a chance to win and he would get a chance to play consistently.

We treat the guy like Liberace.

He's going to play consistently wherever he is playing, whether it's NYC or Siberia. Playing time isn't going to be a consideration. If you know anything about Mika it's that his life away from the rink is just as if not more important than his career. People might not like that but it doesn't change the fact.

 

[Machinehead]

He's going to play consistently wherever he is playing, whether it's NYC or Siberia. Playing time isn't going to be a consideration. If you know anything about Mika it's that his life away from the rink is just as if not more important than his career. People might not like that but it doesn't change the fact.

Everyone's life away from the rink is just as important.

 

[bleedblue94]

Everyone's life away from the rink is just as important.

Not all players value it the same way. Many make the life away from the rink work based on wherever they are playing, they don't have the type of particulars Mika does, and they also don't own nmc's that people think they are just going to waive bc fans are pissy.

 

[Machinehead]

Not all players value it the same way. Many make the life away from the rink work based on wherever they are playing, they don't have the type of particulars Mika does, and they also don't own nmc's that people think they are just going to waive bc fans are pissy.

If he was going to waive, it would have to be made clear he isn't in the plans, which is where playing time inherently becomes a concern in this conversation.

 

[bleedblue94]

If he was going to waive, it would have to be made clear he isn't in the plans, which is where playing time inherently becomes a concern in this conversation.

Haha you think if he won't waive then nyr is going to slot him as a 3rd liner with no pp time and rank their own season again after the circus of last season? Come on. This org wants as little drama as possible. If Mika won't waive then they are going to have to make it work around him unfortunately. Kreider will go more quietly at this point. Mike literally stood up to the NYC media and said I know what my contract says, we both signed it, and I'm only leaving if I decide I want to. You think nyr is going to do trouba 2.0 in the 2026 season? Get real

 

[McRanger92]

Just asking what about Minnesota speaks to the lifestyle Mika has? Virtually nothing. Not saying it can't happen but for a guy that loves city life and other "fun" away from the team/rink Minnesota and it's lifestyle doesn't really speak to that.

Maybe trying to settle down with his family?

 

[bleedblue94]

Maybe trying to settle down with his family?

He already did in a place he loves.

I'm genuinely asking what about Minnesota fits his life and would be a place he would waive his nmc for? There is basically no reason other than a teammate from half a decade ago? There's a bunch of those everywhere for Mika.

 

[eco's bones]

Just asking what about Minnesota speaks to the lifestyle Mika has? Virtually nothing. Not saying it can't happen but for a guy that loves city life and other "fun" away from the team/rink Minnesota and it's lifestyle doesn't really speak to that.

One thing about the Minneapolis/St Paul area is there is a very strong Scandinavian presence in that part of the United States. Not saying whether or not that would matter a lot to Mika but maybe.....that culture is deeply rooted there. Parts of the state of Washington as well.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Haha you think if he won't waive then nyr is going to slot him as a 3rd liner with no pp time and rank their own season again after the circus of last season? Come on. This org wants as little drama as possible. If Mika won't waive then they are going to have to make it work around him unfortunately. Kreider will go more quietly at this point. Mike literally stood up to the NYC media and said I know what my contract says, we both signed it, and I'm only leaving if I decide I want to. You think nyr is going to do trouba 2.0 in the 2026 season? Get real

yeah the rangers will either get a couple teams or they won’t. I think panarin is more likely to waive than Mika.

 

[Tawnos]

I agree they are real people. I often say hockey is a great game but the NHL is a tough business. A player has a right to be unhappy but not a right to give less than his all or a right to try to bring down the rest of the team. That is not fair to the fans nor the players teammates. For me it is not about the amount of money. It is that they are paid to do a job. If an employee in any job is not giving a legitimate effort sooner or later they will often be asked to leave. Nobody is not saying you can not speak to the employee to try to improve things but at the end of the day the players are paid to give their all. If they do not give their best efforts they should be replaced by somebody that would love to have that job imo.

This touches on something that was being discussed earlier, but from the other side.

Nothing that you wrote is contractually obligated from any player. @Machinehead is right. The only thing they’re required to do is show up. But there’s a bigger question to consider. Is there something that a players owes to the organization and its fans that goes beyond contractual obligation? What’s the *human* obligation, rather than the transactional one?

The discussion earlier was about what kind of communication Drury owed to the two guys when this whole thing started. By the letter of the rules, all he owed them was informing them that this is what he was doing. But is there a bigger obligation there too, that goes beyond the transaction?

To me, these are two sides of the same coin. If the fans and organization were owed more than we got from Zibanejad and others, the players being shopped and shipped out were also owed more from Drury than they got.

On the show The Good Place, which is a comedy that asks a lot of philosophical questions, they often refer to a book called What We Owe To Each Other. The premise is exactly this. There’s more to human interaction than the transactional. And while the book itself had some questionable conclusions on the topic, thinking about the title makes me sometimes ask “what *do* we owe to each other?” This piece of this discussion is ultimately about that exact question. People are going to have different answers to it, of course, and that’s fine. It’s what makes a good discussion.

 

[bleedblue94]

Every critique of Panarin you see in marner.

Marner costing himself some potential money with this series against the cats

 

[NickyFotiu]

This touches on something that was being discussed earlier, but from the other side.

Nothing that you wrote is contractually obligated from any player. @Machinehead is right. The only thing they’re required to do is show up. But there’s a bigger question to consider. Is there something that a players owes to the organization and its fans that goes beyond contractual obligation? What’s the *human* obligation, rather than the transactional one?

The discussion earlier was about what kind of communication Drury owed to the two guys when this whole thing started. By the letter of the rules, all he owed them was informing them that this is what he was doing. But is there a bigger obligation there too, that goes beyond the transaction?

To me, these are two sides of the same coin. If the fans and organization were owed more than we got from Zibanejad and others, the players being shopped and shipped out were also owed more from Drury than they got.

On the show The Good Place, which is a comedy that asks a lot of philosophical questions, they often refer to a book called What We Owe To Each Other. The premise is exactly this. There’s more to human interaction than the transactional. And while the book itself had some questionable conclusions on the topic, thinking about the title makes me sometimes ask “what *do* we owe to each other?” This piece of this discussion is ultimately about that exact question. People are going to have different answers to it, of course, and that’s fine. It’s what makes a good discussion.

I think I see where you are going but I do not agree just showing up is what is agreed to in a contract. Guys in pro sports have even been suspended for giving half efforts.

As far as Drury goes I would like our teams mamanagement always treat our players as well as possible but at what point do we draw the line? Almost every team have trades most seasons. Zooks took below market contracts twice because he wanted to be a NYR and he was still traded. That is part of very tough business. I think most professionals handle things better than some of our guys did last season. Hank cried when Zooks was traded but Hank still gave 100%. I think the notion that a player thinks he is entitled to give a half effort because a GM traded his buddy is crazy. Hate the GM if you want but to quit on your fans and teammates while accepting your pay checks is too much imo. Now I'm not saying that actually happened. Other people have said that is what happened. Im not sure. I predicted our top 6 would decline right after last season ended. I felt some (Bread and Vince) just had career years while others (CK and Zibs) were already showing the effects of age.

 

[SA16]

I think I see where you are going but I do not agree just showing up is what is agreed to in a contract. Guys in pro sports have even been suspended for giving half efforts.

As far as Drury goes I would like our teams mamanagement always treat our players as well as possible but at what point do we draw the line? Almost every team have trades most seasons. Zooks took below market contracts twice because he wanted to be a NYR and he was still traded. That is part of very tough business. I think most professionals handle things better than some of our guys did last season. Hank cried when Zooks was traded but Hank still gave 100%. I think the notion that a player thinks he is entitled to give a half effort because a GM traded his buddy is crazy. Hate the GM if you want but to quit on your fans and teammates while accepting your pay checks is too much imo. Now I'm not saying that actually happened. Other people have said that is what happened. Im not sure. I predicted our top 6 would decline right after last season ended. I felt some (Bread and Vince) just had career years while others (CK and Zibs) were already showing the effects of age.

They are required to do more than show up. Jake Dotchin had his contract terminated for showing up out of shape. I think there was another one too.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Every critique of Panarin you see in marner.

Marner costing himself some potential money with this series against the cats

marner is like a worse version tbh. panarin has his issues but he’s pretty much been the #1 guy on his team since his 3rd year. Marner has been the third dude for his entire career, and hes gonna get paid like THE dude. At least panarin had been that.

 

[Tawnos]

They are required to do more than show up. Jake Dotchin had his contract terminated for showing up out of shape. I think there was another one too.

The technical reason for that was a material breach. Specifically a violation of the clause in the SPC that reads “fail, refuse or neglect to obey the Club’s rules governing training and conduct of Players.” It also wasn’t a singular incident, but multiples with documentations. And really, this is just a variation on showing up.

The point is that there’s nothing about a player’s contract that has anything to do with quality of play, nor what’s fair to… well, anyone.

 

[Tawnos]

I think I see where you are going but I do not agree just showing up is what is agreed to in a contract. Guys in pro sports have even been suspended for giving half efforts.

As far as Drury goes I would like our teams mamanagement always treat our players as well as possible but at what point do we draw the line? Almost every team have trades most seasons. Zooks took below market contracts twice because he wanted to be a NYR and he was still traded. That is part of very tough business. I think most professionals handle things better than some of our guys did last season. Hank cried when Zooks was traded but Hank still gave 100%. I think the notion that a player thinks he is entitled to give a half effort because a GM traded his buddy is crazy. Hate the GM if you want but to quit on your fans and teammates while accepting your pay checks is too much imo. Now I'm not saying that actually happened. Other people have said that is what happened. Im not sure. I predicted our top 6 would decline right after last season ended. I felt some (Bread and Vince) just had career years while others (CK and Zibs) were already showing the effects of age.

The NHL standard player’s contract stipulates nothing about player effort. It says that you play for the team and are required to follow team and league rules and standards of conduct. At least in the cap era, no player has ever been suspended for lack of effort. Violating those rules and standards of conduct, yes… but that’s a different thing and effort levels are not involved. What you want from players goes beyond the letter of their contract.

Zuccarello certainly didn’t give 100% when he knew he was going to be traded. He sulked for 40 games before snapping in.

And now we’re back to “the players were mad because their buddies got traded.” That’s the transactional view that you don’t take with Zibanejad’s contract, and isn’t an accurate picture of what happened. Guys understand that it’s a business, but they believed there was an obligation on Drury’s part that went beyond the execution of the transaction, just like you believe players have an obligation beyond fulfilling the letter of their contract.

 

[NickyFotiu]

The NHL standard player’s contract stipulates nothing about player effort. It says that you play for the team and are required to follow team and league rules and standards of conduct. At least in the cap era, no player has ever been suspended for lack of effort. Violating those rules and standards of conduct, yes… but that’s a different thing and effort levels are not involved. What you want from players goes beyond the letter of their contract.

Zuccarello certainly didn’t give 100% when he knew he was going to be traded. He sulked for 40 games before snapping in.

And now we’re back to “the players were mad because their buddies got traded.” That’s the transactional view that you don’t take with Zibanejad’s contract, and isn’t an accurate picture of what happened. Guys understand that it’s a business, but they believed there was an obligation on Drury’s part that went beyond the execution of the transaction, just like you believe players have an obligation beyond fulfilling the letter of their contract.

I don't know how NHL contracts handle not trying which again I'm not even saying that was the case. Others have said that.

2. Lack of Effort During a Game:

• NFL:
  A player might be penalized or even suspended if they are consistently failing to make plays or show the necessary commitment on the field. This is less clear-cut than refusing to play, but it can still be grounds for team discipline.
  
  
• MLB:
  In baseball, players can be penalized for behavior that is considered detrimental to the team, such as not making an effort to catch a ball or not running hard to first base.
  

3. Conduct Detrimental to the Team:

• NFL & MLB: Players can be suspended for conduct that is seen as detrimental to the team, even if it doesn't directly involve on-field performance. This could include disrespectful behavior, disrespecting coaches, or disrupting team dynamics.
  

In essence, while "not enough effort" might not be the formal term, a player's lack of commitment, refusal to play, or disrespectful behavior can lead to suspensions or other disciplinary actions.

 

[Tawnos]

I don't know how NHL contracts handle not trying which again I'm not even saying that was the case. Others have said that.

2. Lack of Effort During a Game:

• NFL:
  A player might be penalized or even suspended if they are consistently failing to make plays or show the necessary commitment on the field. This is less clear-cut than refusing to play, but it can still be grounds for team discipline.
  
  
• MLB:
  In baseball, players can be penalized for behavior that is considered detrimental to the team, such as not making an effort to catch a ball or not running hard to first base.

3. Conduct Detrimental to the Team:

• NFL & MLB: Players can be suspended for conduct that is seen as detrimental to the team, even if it doesn't directly involve on-field performance. This could include disrespectful behavior, disrespecting coaches, or disrupting team dynamics.

In essence, while "not enough effort" might not be the formal term, a player's lack of commitment, refusal to play, or disrespectful behavior can lead to suspensions or other disciplinary actions.

Not sure where you’re pulling that information from, but if there’s language in their contract or the agreement which governs those league’s contracts (aka the CBA), then you’re talking about something that’s a contractual obligation. It doesn’t exist in the NHL.

I find it’s best not to try to compare anything that goes on with contracts in the NHL to the NFL, simply because of the big difference in guarantees.

There is language in the SPC that can be read to mean some of what you say. A player is agreeing to “provide their best services” and “refraining from conduct detrimental to the best interest of the club”… but what that means isn’t defined, is overly subjective and open to interpretation, which makes them fairly meaningless in the context of what we’re talking about here. The current SPC actually does say that players are required to show up in good physical condition.

 

[bhamill]

Yeah. There’s a difference between doing the legal minimum to get your paycheck, and living up to a contract. If McDavid gets paid 15mil per in a couple of years and just stops trying, scores 20 points in 80 games, is anyone REALLY going to argue that he lives up to his contract… because he did the bare minimum to not legally break the contract? That’s literally saying that every player in history that has avoided getting terminated has lived up to their contract. Sorry, but it’s a ridiculous take.