Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XVI (Playoffs or Retool?)

[Cmox]

what is up w this season? this is like, the 4th locker room drama I’ve seen. i’m used to nhl players being completely bland and milquetoast, when did they turn into NBA players?

I just saw the that Canucks whole team didn't realize a rookie ( I forget who it was) scored his first NHL goal last night. The ref was the only one to know and saved the puck.

 

[Guyute]

I think losing a guy who has been a part of your organization since 2008 and holds every single record, wore the C and, to steal a phrase from Larry Whistledown, sacrificed his body for the Lightning is something that is going to piss off a few people in that room, especially those who have been along for the ride with him for more than a decade.

This isn't Barclay Goodrow, Jacob Trouba or Ryan Lindgren. That was a guy who was highly respected while being the face of that franchise from basically the second he was drafted.

It's really ballsy of a FO to walk away from a player like that even if it was the right move.

It was the right move for the organization. The players also have a right to be upset given the circumstances you listed above. Totally understandable. However, the players do not have a right to throw a fit and disappear for two months like the Rangers did.

 

[Mike in Houston]

It was the right move for the organization. The players also have a right to be upset given the circumstances you listed above. Totally understandable. However, the players do not have a right to throw a fit and disappear for two months like the Rangers did.

And sabotage their own quest to win the ultimate prize to prove some point.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

It was the right move for the organization. The players also have a right to be upset given the circumstances you listed above. Totally understandable. However, the players do not have a right to throw a fit and disappear for two months like the Rangers did.

Yeah 100%

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Retool?

It's tabula rasa at this point. lol

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

And sabotage their own quest to win the ultimate prize to prove some point.

I don’t know why people just assume every single players cares about winning the cup more than everything. Some of these dudes just view this as a job. Some just do it because they love it. Sure, some of them want to win more than anything else, but there are plenty of exceptions. I’m not going to say Kreider IS one of those, just pointing out that this blanket “winning the cup is the only goal” shit that’s attributed to every player isn’t necessarily factual.

 

[Mike in Houston]

I don’t know why people just assume every single players cares about winning the cup more than everything. Some of these dudes just view this as a job. Some just do it because they love it. Sure, some of them want to win more than anything else, but there are plenty of exceptions. I’m not going to say Kreider IS one of those, just pointing out that this blanket “winning the cup is the only goal” shit that’s attributed to every player isn’t necessarily factual.

Well if we learned anything today it's that Cam Newton would rather keep his league MVP award than trade it for a Super Bowl win.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Kreider and many, MANY of our top players have had down seasons. No disputing that. Name one top player who has had a better season than last year?

Yes but none have been as useless as Kreider

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

i don’t see anyway this can be a “retool” unless you believe that two of Panarin, Kreider, and Zibanejad will go back to being as good as they were in past years. I think Panarin has the best chance of having another truly great year, but he also has by far the most value of these guys.

We have, like, two guys who can be considered “for sure” core pieces moving forward in Fox and Igor. Cuylle should be kept and will be a valuable player, but IMO he’s not a true core piece. Like, we’re not building AROUND him. He’s got potential to be a very good complimentary player. Anyway, outside of those two, the roster should be viewed as entirely interchangeable. And I would still consider trading those two for equal value swaps (like, completely hypothetical not even suggesting this, Fox for Hughes).

So, basically, you need to move at least two of those 3 guys I said before the start of next season. Just that will a monumental amount of work. Then you need to reshape the defense and find a way to add young game breaking talent. Yeah, this team is really, really far away from being a true threat. It’s, at least, a 2-3 year turnaround. And that’s if miracles happen.

 

[Fitzy]

Kreider's legacy here is literally the only reason he has any defenders this season at all.

If he hadn't been a Ranger for over 12 years, we'd be close to a consensus about trading him. So let's not pretend like he isn't getting deference. He is.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Yes but none have been as useless as Kreider

seriously even Mika has been playing better to the eye than kreider. dude looks like a shell of a shell

Kreider's legacy here is literally the only reason he has any defenders this season at all.

If he hadn't been a Ranger for over 12 years, we'd be close to a consensus about trading him. So let's not pretend like he isn't getting deference.

I’ve been like the biggest kreider fan for his whole career here. This year is utterly indefensible and i’m willing to call it like it is

 

[SA16]

What does Adam Boqvist on waivers mean for Zac Jones trade value?

 

[will1066]

I just saw the that Canucks whole team didn't realize a rookie ( I forget who it was) scored his first NHL goal last night. The ref was the only one to know and saved the puck.

Was it Pettersson?

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

What does Adam Boqvist on waivers mean for Zac Jones trade value?

bad

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Kreider's legacy here is literally the only reason he has any defenders this season at all.

If he hadn't been a Ranger for over 12 years, we'd be close to a consensus about trading him. So let's not pretend like he isn't getting deference. He is.

And he deserves whatever leeway he's getting from a very small group of posters. Obviously he's not 100%. You don't go from last year to this year without some kind of an injury, especially for a guy who works as hard as he does in the offseason. Yeah, it's fun to say he pouted, took his puck and went home, is sad about his buddies, and all the other deep insightful stuff floating around. But the math doesn't add up. He's been shit and he's still like 3rd on the team in goals. The assists are puzzling, but he's never been a big assist guy.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Kreider has 2 whole points than Carrick. Lets let that sink in. Carrick who plays no PP time and gets 9 minutes a game.

 

[Ruggs225]

Saw this on the main boards. Not sure if it was posted here. Its about Kakko. Really gives some light into what he was thinking while playing here.

I know it is beating a dead horse, but i found it an interesting read.

Valmentajan ensimmäinen ohje uudessa NHL-seurassa löi Kaapo Kakon ällikällä – muutti kaiken​

Kaapo Kakko on pelannut NHL:ssä jo kuusi ja puoli kautta. Ura New Yorkissa eteni tahmeasti, mutta hän on löytänyt peli-ilon Seattlesta. Kakko paljastaa nyt, mikä hänen mielestään meni pieleen New Yorkissa.

www.is.fi

In English:

A few days before Christmas, Kaapo Kakko, 23, received a relieving phone call: he had been traded from the New York Rangers to the Seattle Kraken.

While playing for the Rangers, Kakko couldn’t openly admit it, but this was the moment he had been waiting for. He was ready to leave New York, where his passion for the game had seemingly been lost somewhere in the depths of Madison Square Garden.

"Of course, I couldn’t say it out loud, but for quite some time, I had the feeling that I wouldn’t really mind a change of scenery," Kakko admits.

"At the same time, there are mixed emotions tied to the trade. The New York organization is amazing, and everything was familiar and safe, but I wanted to see something new."

Kakko arrived in Manhattan in the fall of 2019 with high expectations. The Rangers had drafted him second overall, but the Finnish forward’s game never clicked under the bright lights. He remained a supporting player.

"I was never one of the team’s top players, always stuck in the third line with fairly limited minutes. There were nights when I felt good on the ice and had the energy to push hard, but I just wasn’t given the trust. I felt I had much more to give," Kakko reflects.

"That’s why I often thought my career might take off in another organization."
Kakko’s departure sparked debate among Rangers fans. Some felt the Finn was mistreated, while others believed he had been given ample opportunity to prove himself.

Kakko isn’t entirely convinced he got enough chances to play in the top lines during his time in New York.

"Sure, if I had been good enough, I would’ve earned more ice time from the opportunities I was given," Kakko admits.

During his six and a half seasons with the Rangers, Kakko had brief stints in the top lines, but the reality wasn’t as rosy as it might have appeared on paper.

One example Kakko points to is the 2023–24 season, which ultimately became one of the toughest of his career, partly due to injuries.

"I had scored 40 points the previous season with fairly limited ice time, so expectations were high for the next season. The new coach, Peter Laviolette, told me, Alex Lafrenière, and Filip Chytil that his job was to help us develop further. I thought, ‘This is my chance to reach the next level,’" Kakko recounts.

Things initially looked promising. Kakko started the season on the top line with Mika Zibanejad and Chris Kreider.

"I got about 10 games there, but it didn’t take off at all."

In name, Kakko played on the top line, but in reality, he spent a lot of time on the bench. Zibanejad and Kreider also played penalty kill and were fixtures on the Rangers’ first power-play unit, where Kakko wasn’t included.

"My rhythm was completely disrupted because I’d sit on the bench for long stretches. Even Zibanejad and Kreider struggled at five-on-five, but they were putting up numbers on the power play."

After the 10-game trial, Kakko was demoted and spent the rest of the season in his usual spot on the third line.

"There were games where I only played about eight minutes."

One night during an away game in Anaheim, Kakko had had enough.

"I was sitting on the bench again for ages and thought, ‘How the hell did this happen again?’"
Kakko’s frustrating journey in New York illustrates that sometimes, the time and place simply aren’t right for a player.

The Finnish forward’s career under the Manhattan spotlight got off to a rocky start, and he never managed to break out of his shell. The blame for Kakko’s struggles lies partly with the team and partly with the player himself. The Rangers failed to get the best out of him, but Kakko also wasn’t good enough to force his way to the top.

"When I got a chance in the top lines, I thought, ‘I absolutely have to succeed now so my linemates are happy and things work out.’ And if I happened to lose the puck, I knew I’d be back in the third line in no time. That definitely showed in my play," Kakko reflects.

And it did. Kakko played reliable, basic hockey and was defensively responsible. Advanced stats loved his game, but the spark was missing. He avoided risks, and the points didn’t come.

"The things I now dare to do in Seattle, I didn’t really do at all in New York," Kakko says.

Wearing the Kraken jersey, Kakko looks reborn. He constantly demands the puck and drives the play for his line.

"It felt like a weight was lifted off my shoulders as soon as I got here. I’ve been playing consistently with big minutes. There are rough shifts here and there, but they’re quickly forgotten when you only sit on the bench for a short time before jumping back on the ice," Kakko says happily.

In Seattle, Kakko has seen ice times as high as 19–20 minutes per game, a stark contrast to his 13-minute average in New York.

His coach’s first instruction caught him off guard.

"As soon as I got here, they told me that losing the puck sometimes is just part of the game. I hadn’t thought about hockey that way in years," Kakko reveals.

"That’s probably why I’ve been able to play much more boldly now. I’m no longer focused on not losing the puck at the blue line but instead feel confident making cross-ice passes. They’ve started to work, and the results have come. This is the kind of player I was drafted to be."

In New York, hockey had started to feel like a chore.

"Especially last season, there were tough times. I’d get myself ready for game day, but too often, I’d leave the rink barely even breaking a sweat. Playing started to feel like going to work. Now, it’s amazing to head to the rink," Kakko says.

Kakko has quickly noticed changes in his body since moving to Seattle.

"I’ve been playing almost double the minutes here, but my legs feel fresher," he marvels.

"In New York, my legs often felt heavy after sitting on the bench for so long. I kept wondering if I was out of shape or what was wrong because even with only 10–11 minutes of ice time, I couldn’t get going. And I trained hard every summer."

It helps that Kakko’s line with Matthew Beniers and Jaden Schwartz is currently clicking beautifully. The initial excitement likely won’t last forever.

"This probably won’t last like this all the time. But I’m enjoying it now. I feel like everything depends on me. I don’t want to complain too much about my time in New York, but the trust in me here is on a completely different level. It makes everything easier," Kakko says.

Kaapo Kakko has rediscovered his love for the game and his lost confidence in Seattle.
As a team, Seattle still has areas to improve.

"I’ve noticed that the downside of our bold, puck-heavy style is that sometimes we’re a bit too daring. There are moments when we need to play smarter. That’s something I learned during my time with the disciplined Rangers," Kakko concludes.

 

[will1066]

Saw this on the main boards. Not sure if it was posted here. Its about Kakko. Really gives some light into what he was thinking while playing here.

I know it is beating a dead horse, but i found it an interesting read.

Valmentajan ensimmäinen ohje uudessa NHL-seurassa löi Kaapo Kakon ällikällä – muutti kaiken​

Kaapo Kakko on pelannut NHL:ssä jo kuusi ja puoli kautta. Ura New Yorkissa eteni tahmeasti, mutta hän on löytänyt peli-ilon Seattlesta. Kakko paljastaa nyt, mikä hänen mielestään meni pieleen New Yorkissa.

www.is.fi

In English:

A few days before Christmas, Kaapo Kakko, 23, received a relieving phone call: he had been traded from the New York Rangers to the Seattle Kraken.

While playing for the Rangers, Kakko couldn’t openly admit it, but this was the moment he had been waiting for. He was ready to leave New York, where his passion for the game had seemingly been lost somewhere in the depths of Madison Square Garden.

"Of course, I couldn’t say it out loud, but for quite some time, I had the feeling that I wouldn’t really mind a change of scenery," Kakko admits.

"At the same time, there are mixed emotions tied to the trade. The New York organization is amazing, and everything was familiar and safe, but I wanted to see something new."

Kakko arrived in Manhattan in the fall of 2019 with high expectations. The Rangers had drafted him second overall, but the Finnish forward’s game never clicked under the bright lights. He remained a supporting player.

"I was never one of the team’s top players, always stuck in the third line with fairly limited minutes. There were nights when I felt good on the ice and had the energy to push hard, but I just wasn’t given the trust. I felt I had much more to give," Kakko reflects.

"That’s why I often thought my career might take off in another organization."
Kakko’s departure sparked debate among Rangers fans. Some felt the Finn was mistreated, while others believed he had been given ample opportunity to prove himself.

Kakko isn’t entirely convinced he got enough chances to play in the top lines during his time in New York.

"Sure, if I had been good enough, I would’ve earned more ice time from the opportunities I was given," Kakko admits.

During his six and a half seasons with the Rangers, Kakko had brief stints in the top lines, but the reality wasn’t as rosy as it might have appeared on paper.

One example Kakko points to is the 2023–24 season, which ultimately became one of the toughest of his career, partly due to injuries.

"I had scored 40 points the previous season with fairly limited ice time, so expectations were high for the next season. The new coach, Peter Laviolette, told me, Alex Lafrenière, and Filip Chytil that his job was to help us develop further. I thought, ‘This is my chance to reach the next level,’" Kakko recounts.

Things initially looked promising. Kakko started the season on the top line with Mika Zibanejad and Chris Kreider.

"I got about 10 games there, but it didn’t take off at all."

In name, Kakko played on the top line, but in reality, he spent a lot of time on the bench. Zibanejad and Kreider also played penalty kill and were fixtures on the Rangers’ first power-play unit, where Kakko wasn’t included.

"My rhythm was completely disrupted because I’d sit on the bench for long stretches. Even Zibanejad and Kreider struggled at five-on-five, but they were putting up numbers on the power play."

After the 10-game trial, Kakko was demoted and spent the rest of the season in his usual spot on the third line.

"There were games where I only played about eight minutes."

One night during an away game in Anaheim, Kakko had had enough.

"I was sitting on the bench again for ages and thought, ‘How the hell did this happen again?’"
Kakko’s frustrating journey in New York illustrates that sometimes, the time and place simply aren’t right for a player.

The Finnish forward’s career under the Manhattan spotlight got off to a rocky start, and he never managed to break out of his shell. The blame for Kakko’s struggles lies partly with the team and partly with the player himself. The Rangers failed to get the best out of him, but Kakko also wasn’t good enough to force his way to the top.

"When I got a chance in the top lines, I thought, ‘I absolutely have to succeed now so my linemates are happy and things work out.’ And if I happened to lose the puck, I knew I’d be back in the third line in no time. That definitely showed in my play," Kakko reflects.

And it did. Kakko played reliable, basic hockey and was defensively responsible. Advanced stats loved his game, but the spark was missing. He avoided risks, and the points didn’t come.

"The things I now dare to do in Seattle, I didn’t really do at all in New York," Kakko says.

Wearing the Kraken jersey, Kakko looks reborn. He constantly demands the puck and drives the play for his line.

"It felt like a weight was lifted off my shoulders as soon as I got here. I’ve been playing consistently with big minutes. There are rough shifts here and there, but they’re quickly forgotten when you only sit on the bench for a short time before jumping back on the ice," Kakko says happily.

In Seattle, Kakko has seen ice times as high as 19–20 minutes per game, a stark contrast to his 13-minute average in New York.

His coach’s first instruction caught him off guard.

"As soon as I got here, they told me that losing the puck sometimes is just part of the game. I hadn’t thought about hockey that way in years," Kakko reveals.

"That’s probably why I’ve been able to play much more boldly now. I’m no longer focused on not losing the puck at the blue line but instead feel confident making cross-ice passes. They’ve started to work, and the results have come. This is the kind of player I was drafted to be."

In New York, hockey had started to feel like a chore.

"Especially last season, there were tough times. I’d get myself ready for game day, but too often, I’d leave the rink barely even breaking a sweat. Playing started to feel like going to work. Now, it’s amazing to head to the rink," Kakko says.

Kakko has quickly noticed changes in his body since moving to Seattle.

"I’ve been playing almost double the minutes here, but my legs feel fresher," he marvels.

"In New York, my legs often felt heavy after sitting on the bench for so long. I kept wondering if I was out of shape or what was wrong because even with only 10–11 minutes of ice time, I couldn’t get going. And I trained hard every summer."

It helps that Kakko’s line with Matthew Beniers and Jaden Schwartz is currently clicking beautifully. The initial excitement likely won’t last forever.

"This probably won’t last like this all the time. But I’m enjoying it now. I feel like everything depends on me. I don’t want to complain too much about my time in New York, but the trust in me here is on a completely different level. It makes everything easier," Kakko says.

Kaapo Kakko has rediscovered his love for the game and his lost confidence in Seattle.
As a team, Seattle still has areas to improve.

"I’ve noticed that the downside of our bold, puck-heavy style is that sometimes we’re a bit too daring. There are moments when we need to play smarter. That’s something I learned during my time with the disciplined Rangers," Kakko concludes.

Oh god another Kakko expose to the Finnish media.

Yes, all of what he said is what went down. And the blame should be shared. But give it a rest. We all know that this franchise doesn't its trust much less its organizational keys to youngsters, and when it comes to

"As soon as I got here, they told me that losing the puck sometimes is just part of the game. I hadn’t thought about hockey that way in years," Kakko reveals.


it's a f***ing double-standard with the vets in NY, for sure.

 

[Ruggs225]

Oh god another Kakko expose to the Finnish media.

Yeah, but it really makes sense. I think Laf and to a lesser extent chytil go through the same things.


Just makes me want the vets gone even more. With high draft picks like laf and kakko u need to force feed them ice time. Laf is still here, there is time to save him and frankly we gave him 7 years so might as well play him as much as possible.

The whole lets win now while developing too picks was not feasible in hindsight.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Yeah, but it really makes sense. I think Laf and to a lesser extent chytil go through the same things.


Just makes me want the vets gone even more. With high draft picks like laf and kakko u need to force feed them ice time. Laf is still here, there is time to save him and frankly we gave him 7 years so might as well play him as much as possible.

The whole lets win now while developing too picks was not feasible in hindsight.

File this under reason 129012901209120912 why signing Panarin was a f***ing stupid idea.

 

[will1066]

Yeah, but it really makes sense. I think Laf and to a lesser extent chytil go through the same things.


Just makes me want the vets gone even more. With high draft picks like laf and kakko u need to force feed them ice time. Laf is still here, there is time to save him and frankly we gave him 7 years so might as well play him as much as possible.

The whole lets win now while developing too picks was not feasible in hindsight.

Yeah, I went back into my post and expanded on it more. Totally agree. And maybe Lavi had the best intentions initially to bring the three kids along, but win-now got in the way, the priority boarding and seating for the vets got in the way.

File this under reason 129012901209120912 why signing Panarin was a f***ing stupid idea.

I've been saying this since 2023-24.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Yeah, I went back into my post and expanded on it more. Totally agree. And maybe Lavi had the best intentions initially to bring the three kids along, but win-now got in the way, the priority boarding and seating for the vets got in the way.


I've been saying this since 2023-24.

Some of us have been saying this since 2019-20.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I was rooting for Kakko but enough with this kid. He was put in the top 6 to start every season and flopped. He just sounds like another entitled millennium brat at this point.

 

[Fitzy]

We've all sunk 8 years down this rebuild. We can talk about what has gone wrong but that's a lot of years of our lives gone, I'd rather hear how we've learned and are going to do better with youth next time, because otherwise what's the damn point?

I blink and it's another 10 years the Rangers haven't won a cup.

 

[Ruggs225]

File this under reason 129012901209120912 why signing Panarin was a f***ing stupid idea.

So was giving Kreider an extension when they did. We were rebuilding there was no need to keep him, especially since he has no leadership skills.