Speculation: Roster Building thread: Part XIX (Thanks, Sam)

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It seems to me you defend Mika like Bern defends Kreider. There's almost this desperation to keep the player on the team. They've both had shit years and whether they'll rebound next year or not they are both closing in on their mid-30's fast. Also I don't look at Mika as 1st line material in any way at all anymore. He had a good playoffs last year until we ran into the Panthers and he was completely dominated in that series by Barkov. Even if you still regard him as a 1C he is not on a par with the best centers in the league and in some cases it's not even close. JT fits that bill as well as anyone we have.

One of my biggest concerns with Mika is the fall off in his defensive play. He's almost always been a + player. This year he's a -25. It might not be the greatest stat for analyzing a player but the closest one on the team to him is Lafreniere and he's a -13 and then much of the rest of the team including almost all of our D are + players. Maybe it can be explained in that it seemed that there was some psychological turmoil going on with him prior to the 4 nations tournament.

As far as Trocheck he is a very good 2C. Nice cap hit. He's a Swiss Army knife type player. Not great at everything but good everything. He's also a leader type guy.
I never said that I see him as a 1C right now. I think there is a posibility he gets back there tho as I dont think his issues this season was related to anything physical.

Whether you see him as 1st line material is irrelevant. He is second in points on the team behind Panarin since January 1st.

The last part about Trocheck is just laughable.
 
I'd think they would be 1 of maybe 2 teams that may want both Kreider and Z. They need help on the PP and PK and those are probably the only 2 guys they could get at the same time that play their best hockey on both.


I thought you wanted all the #6 guys? If you have 3 3rd pairs, then you have the best 3rd pair in the league.

Kreider-Mika-Zucc line was the OG Line. Feels like a lifetime ago.
 
I’m don’t want to see Mika, Kreider, or honestly even Trocheck play for this team anymore.
I can respect this. If we are getting rid of all the stink then remove all the shit stains.

Just dont come at me with nonsense stating Trocheck is this great leader on the team when he was saying the exact same thing Mika got bashed for in post game scrums.
 
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I can respect this. If we are getting rid of all the stink then remove all the shit stains.

Just dont come at me with nonsense stating Trocheck is this great leader on the team when he was saying the exact same things Mika got bashed for in post game scrums.
Tbh I don't know why people pay any attention at all to the post game stuff. What do you want them to say?

Are we looking for a Jim Mora rant?

Ok, that sounds like fun, but the Saints team he ranted about finished 3-13 and the Colts team he ranted about finished 6-10 and he got fired. It doesn't make anything any better.
 
I don't think we're getting Rossi or Necas out of Zibanejad/Panarin. Avs have Landeskog cap to worry about, they surely keep the cheaper player right now. Necas has been near a point per game and it wouldn't make sense for them to swap him out, even if we're retaining. Too much uncertainty going on and right now they don't have the luxury of Landeskog's cap not being used.

Brock Boeser doesn't help our skating in any way. It should be a crime to sign him.
 
Tbh I don't know why people pay any attention at all to the post game stuff. What do you want them to say?

Are we looking for a Jim Mora rant?

Ok, that sounds like fun, but the Saints team he ranted about finished 3-13 and the Colts team he ranted about finished 6-10 and he got fired. It doesn't make anything any better.
Your guess is as good as mine but these are the same people who want JT to be named captain so he can go all Gunnery Sergeant Hartman at these quitters when he himself quit on his last team.
 
Since "this is a bad team" still meets resistance, perhaps I should go through every spot.

Fox is slotted where he's supposed to be. Pats for Patrick. I hate Igor's contract and I hate goalies, but as a roster piece, he's obviously in the role he should be in. Cuylle is fine. There are better top six forwards, let's be honest, and I would rather him be with more talented linemates, but that's not his fault and he's fine.

Here are the rest of the forwards:

Miller, Zibanejad, and Trocheck are not real first line centers. This is massive, almost Stanley Cup-excluding hole right off the bat. I'm counting all of them because somebody has to play that role, and I'm not sending any of these guys out to match up with Barkov or McDavid. Also, "I have three Dalmatians, and that weighs as much as a German shepherd" is not how center depth works. The German shepherds on Florida and Tampa are going to eat all three of your Dalmatians.

Lafreniere sucks. Hard period. If I'm building a team to go out and win the Stanley Cup, I'm really not interested in any role for him tbh. He doesn't score enough to be a scorer, and he doesn't do...god damn anything to be a role player.

Kreider sucks. For however many years before this one, the Rangers scored like 60% of the goals when he was on the ice. He was a massive play-driver and now we can barely put him on the ice. Because anti-Kreider sentiment has existed for years, I think it's overlooked what a loss this was. A legit, slam dunk top six forward became a 4th liner. And given his age and injury history, I think he's probably cooked. It's another gaping hole.

Berard is great and arguably the sole player on the roster we're not playing high enough in the lineup, which is its own problem.

Othmann -I'm gonna be dragged for telling the truth here- is not a guy I'm penciling into an NHL top 9 right now. Absolutely, should get the opportunity, but it's a hole until somebody fills it.

Brodzinski certainly exists.

Parssinen is not an NHL player.

Rempe and Carrick are great but definitely 4th liners.

Oh man, now we get to talk about the defense!

Soucy should not be in the top six of a contending team. Full ass stop.

I don't know what Miller is. We've talked about the system and his partners. Maybe there's something there. It's a hole until I know it's filled. That's how this should work.

Borgen is fine but like, he should firmly be your 6th best defenseman and he's not.

Schneider, I'm sorry, kinda sucks. Maybe he improves but that's not the discussion I'm having right now. Hole until it's filled.

Urho is...I guess fine? He and Schneider as the third pair is probably not great, but it's the third pair, so Idk, but the problem is we have like five of these guys so you can't even say "well, it's the third pair" because it's bleeding into the top 4 like, a lot.

Jones is alive. The body is still warm.

So yeah, not counting the backup goalie and the 4th line, the Rangers have ONE defenseman, and ONE forward that are in the roles they should be.

This team is still worse than you probably think they are. It is really bad.
This is not a bad team. I agree we have no 1C, and we can’t win the SC without one, and I’m probably wrong but I can’t think of a team who has any 2c’s as good as our 3. Also you forgot Panarin.

You are correct, our D is terrible. The players are close to league worst, and whoever is coaching these guys is league worst. OK, the more I think about it, maybe we are a bad team, but obtaining a D minded coach and 2 or 3 average or better Dmen, and we probably make the playoffs next year.

You are right about Kreider being a big play driver on previous teams, especially on the power play. Of course I don’t think Mika gets enough credit for Kreider’s offensive improvement. It seems it was his sworn mission to turn Kreider into an offensive force, and he was successful. They both deserve credit. Not having that net front presence is the reason for our main guys having much fewer points this season. They will need to figure out how to adapt next year, barring a miracle.
 
I can respect this. If we are getting rid of all the stink then remove all the shit stains.

Just dont come at me with nonsense stating Trocheck is this great leader on the team when he was saying the exact same thing Mika got bashed for in post game scrums.
Trocheck was crap 2 out 3 seasons he's been here, Zib had higher highs but lower lows and has been nosediving the past 3 years. Z and Kreider need to be gone not just for dwindling performance but for culture reasons. Which means we're probably rebuilding, in which case having Trocheck on the team is pointless as well and we should try to get some assets for him.
 
Since "this is a bad team" still meets resistance, perhaps I should go through every spot.

Fox is slotted where he's supposed to be. Pats for Patrick. I hate Igor's contract and I hate goalies, but as a roster piece, he's obviously in the role he should be in. Cuylle is fine. There are better top six forwards, let's be honest, and I would rather him be with more talented linemates, but that's not his fault and he's fine.

Here are the rest of the forwards:

Miller, Zibanejad, and Trocheck are not real first line centers. This is massive, almost Stanley Cup-excluding hole right off the bat. I'm counting all of them because somebody has to play that role, and I'm not sending any of these guys out to match up with Barkov or McDavid. Also, "I have three Dalmatians, and that weighs as much as a German shepherd" is not how center depth works. The German shepherds on Florida and Tampa are going to eat all three of your Dalmatians.

Lafreniere sucks. Hard period. If I'm building a team to go out and win the Stanley Cup, I'm really not interested in any role for him tbh. He doesn't score enough to be a scorer, and he doesn't do...god damn anything to be a role player.

Kreider sucks. For however many years before this one, the Rangers scored like 60% of the goals when he was on the ice. He was a massive play-driver and now we can barely put him on the ice. Because anti-Kreider sentiment has existed for years, I think it's overlooked what a loss this was. A legit, slam dunk top six forward became a 4th liner. And given his age and injury history, I think he's probably cooked. It's another gaping hole.

Berard is great and arguably the sole player on the roster we're not playing high enough in the lineup, which is its own problem.

Othmann -I'm gonna be dragged for telling the truth here- is not a guy I'm penciling into an NHL top 9 right now. Absolutely, should get the opportunity, but it's a hole until somebody fills it.

Brodzinski certainly exists.

Parssinen is not an NHL player.

Rempe and Carrick are great but definitely 4th liners.

Oh man, now we get to talk about the defense!

Soucy should not be in the top six of a contending team. Full ass stop.

I don't know what Miller is. We've talked about the system and his partners. Maybe there's something there. It's a hole until I know it's filled. That's how this should work.

Borgen is fine but like, he should firmly be your 6th best defenseman and he's not.

Schneider, I'm sorry, kinda sucks. Maybe he improves but that's not the discussion I'm having right now. Hole until it's filled.

Urho is...I guess fine? He and Schneider as the third pair is probably not great, but it's the third pair, so Idk, but the problem is we have like five of these guys so you can't even say "well, it's the third pair" because it's bleeding into the top 4 like, a lot.

Jones is alive. The body is still warm.

So yeah, not counting the backup goalie and the 4th line, the Rangers have ONE defenseman, and ONE forward that are in the roles they should be.

This team is still worse than you probably think they are. It is really bad.


I know you hate JT because someone called him an alpha once, but this guy scored 100 points just a year ago, that is a bona fide #1C. And it was just last year, not ages ago like the last time Zibanejad was any good.

Is he a 1C for the future, no of course not hes 32. But don't just dismiss him outright.
 
Trocheck was crap 2 out 3 seasons he's been here, Zib had higher highs but lower lows and has been nosediving the past 3 years. Z and Kreider need to be gone not just for dwindling performance but for culture reasons. Which means we're probably rebuilding, in which case having Trocheck on the team is pointless as well and we should try to get some assets for him.
I dont agree with that. 3 seasons ago he put up 90+ points. The real shift in his play came last season where I feel like management started to play him as a shutdown center and he began being tentative in the o-zone. He needs a coach who will tell him to just go out and play offence balls to the walls. I think that is the way we will get the old Zib back.
 
Trocheck was crap 2 out 3 seasons he's been here, Zib had higher highs but lower lows and has been nosediving the past 3 years. Z and Kreider need to be gone not just for dwindling performance but for culture reasons. Which means we're probably rebuilding, in which case having Trocheck on the team is pointless as well and we should try to get some assets for him.
Guy makes peanuts for the production he gives. He's one of the least of our problems.
 
I know you hate JT because someone called him an alpha once, but this guy scored 100 points just a year ago, that is a bona fide #1C. And it was just last year, not ages ago like the last time Zibanejad was any good.

Is he a 1C for the future, no of course not hes 32. But don't just dismiss him outright.
And just the year before that Mika put up 90+ point but you were argiung with me that points doesnt make you a 1C. What are the rules here?
 
And just the year before that Mika put up 90+ point but you were argiung with me that points doesnt make you a 1C. What are the rules here?

and then the next year he put up 70 which was awful considering his usage, and this year 60 points which is pathetic. And one of the worst defensive centers around for much of the year. Combined with being one of the softest players in the league.

JT still put up more than a PPG on this mess of a team in his time here. He gets more benefit of the doubt.
 
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He's also been playing with a busted hand for months now.
he's not the problem but again, don't need him. And don't need him farting up the PP and playing more minutes than anyone else on the team. Maybe with a new coach that will change but, i think this team needs a retool at the very least and if he can bring back some nice picks/prospects from a contender that wants him as their 2C, i won't miss him.
 
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he's not the problem but again, don't need him. And don't need him farting up the PP and playing more minutes than anyone else on the team. Maybe with a new coach that will change but, i think this team needs a retool at the very least and if he can bring back some nice picks/prospects from a contender that wants him as their 2C, i won't miss him.
Trocheck keeps Miller mentally stable
 
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