Speculation: Roster Building thread: Part XIX (Thanks, Sam)

[Siddi]

Mika Zibanejad is literally a 65.035 point per 82 game player and will be 32 in 4 days. Vincent Trochek is literally a 59.114 point per 82 game player and will be 32 in July. You are talking a whole lot of smack about a 6 point difference in guys who have VAST sample sizes to base this comparison upon. Not to mention 1/3 of Mika’s career points have come on the PP and 1/4 of Trochek’s have. And Trochek has been a superior penalty killer, physical player, face off man, etc.

One of them is on track to crack top 5 in production all time for an O6 franchise while the other is a decent role player. Let me repeat myself, Mika, in the worst season of his career is still outproducing Vinny despite playing 3 min less/game and being a vagabond up and down the line-up.

I dont know what you are trying to prove with the PPP breakdown? Yes, good players get PP time...

Superior penalty killer? Mika has Vinny more than doubled in SHP over their careers.

I am sorry but you are delusional if you believe they have had similar careers. But hey, you got their age right and, yes, Vinny is better at the dot.

 

[RangerBoy]

Colorado was interested in Panarin in 2019. The Avs didn't like the 7 year term. Panarin is still a productive player six years later.

First round matchup with Dallas. Toss up. The Stars are not playing well. Heiskenen won't play in the first round.

If the Avs don't reach the WCF, would they be interested in Panarin? The Rangers and Colorado have made trades. Georgiev. Lindgren. Panarin has another 2-3 good years left in the tank. Definitely two more quality seasons. The Avs would need to re-sign Panarin to an extension. Would Colorado swap Necas for Panarin? There is $5M gap in their cap hits for next season. Maybe the Rangers retain. Maybe the Avs include another player. Josh Manson's $4.5M expiring contract? Manson has had a tough season in Colorado.

The Avs want to win another Cup with MacKinnon. He turns 30 this September. Are the Avs a better team with Panarin or Necas in the next 3 seasons? How do the Avs maximize the MacKinnon years? Panarin will most likely be a shorter extension. 2 years. 3 years. Panarin still has another season remaining on his current contract. Necas probably wants a 6-7-8 year deal and a decent bump from his $6.5M. The playoffs will determine a lot of things.

Panarin gets to play with MacKinnon. The Avs give him an extension. July 1 trade or a draft day trade where they discuss the extension as part of the trade and officially sign it on July 1. Colorado has a large Russian population. I remember reading many years ago about Panarin liking the snow. Panarin waives his NMC. He gets to play for a Cup contender. Jared Bednar is a great coach.

Necas would give the Rangers a right handed shooting winger which they need and the Rangers extend him. He is in the right age group. Necas is 26 years old. I looked Natural Stat Trick. Trocheck and Necas played over 1,000 minutes together at 5v5 from the time Trocheck went to Carolina at the 2020 deadline. Trocheck played his most minutes in Carolina with Necas. The Rangers reunite them as seeing how Miller and Trocheck are the two team leaders now and next season. Trocheck and Necas were good together.

https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20192020&thruseason=20212022&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=n&v=t&playerid=8476389

Just give JT the C. He is already directing traffic. You line up here. You line up behind me for the one-timer when I win this face-off. Panarin, Fox and Mika are looking at each other and nodding their heads.

 

[McRanger92]

Colorado was interested in Panarin in 2019. The Avs didn't like the 7 year term. Panarin is still a productive player six years later.

First round matchup with Dallas. Toss up. The Stars are not playing well. Heiskenen won't play in the first round.

If the Avs don't reach the WCF, would they be interested in Panarin? The Rangers and Colorado have made trades. Georgiev. Lindgren. Panarin has another 2-3 good years left in the tank. Definitely two more quality seasons. The Avs would need to re-sign Panarin to an extension. Would Colorado swap Necas for Panarin? There is $5M gap in their cap hits for next season. Maybe the Rangers retain. Maybe the Avs include another player. Josh Manson's $4.5M expiring contract? Manson has had a tough season in Colorado.

The Avs want to win another Cup with MacKinnon. He turns 30 this September. Are the Avs a better team with Panarin or Necas in the next 3 seasons? How do the Avs maximize the MacKinnon years? Panarin will most likely be a shorter extension. 2 years. 3 years. Panarin still has another season remaining on his current contract. Necas probably wants a 6-7-8 year deal and a decent bump from his $6.5M. The playoffs will determine a lot of things.

Panarin gets to play with MacKinnon. The Avs give him an extension. July 1 trade or a draft day trade where they discuss the extension as part of the trade and officially sign it on July 1. Colorado has a large Russian population. I remember reading many years ago about Panarin liking the snow. Panarin waives his NMC. He gets to play for a Cup contender. Jared Bednar is a great coach.

Necas would give the Rangers a right handed shooting winger which they need and the Rangers extend him. He is in the right age group. Necas is 26 years old. I looked Natural Stat Trick. Trocheck and Necas played over 1,000 minutes together at 5v5 from the time Trocheck went to Carolina at the 2020 deadline. Trocheck played his most minutes in Carolina with Necas. The Rangers reunite them as seeing how Miller and Trocheck are the two team leaders now and next season. Trocheck and Necas were good together.

https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20192020&thruseason=20212022&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=n&v=t&playerid=8476389

Just give JT the C. He is already directing traffic. You line up here. You line up behind me for the one-timer when I win this face-off. Panarin, Fox and Mika are looking at each other and nodding their heads.

Id retain on Panarin for a year if it could get us Necas. Colorado is the type of place he could actually get a Cup because he wouldnt be the top option. Avs could use a replacement for Rantanen in their top 6 and on the PP. They cant expect Landeskog to come back and be an impact player at age 33 after missing 3 seasons.

 

[UnparalledPark]

Would very much like to see the Rangers acquire a young center this summer. Marco Rossi, Mason McTavish. Ryan McLeod. 3 guys who will need new contracts this summer. Kandre Miller is the man to trade to make it happen. Pushes Trocheck to line 3 where he belongs and the new guy can split the top 6 responsibilities with JT. Im sure there are other options. We've got plenty of youth on the wings.

Edstrom is a guy I would like to see played at center as well. We've missed him since the injury. I am intrigued by Dylan Roobreck and Noah Laba. I think they can move fast and make it to the NHL sooner than later.

I think we all have desired a homegrown quality top 6 center for forever, but right now I wouldn’t concentrate on anything other than improving the defense. I think Mika can still be an effective 2C. All he needs is a coach who will bench him every time he is in the slot with the puck, and he passes the puck to one of his wingers.

 

[UnparalledPark]

If that's people's only criticism of the roster, then they're wrong. This just isn't a good hockey team. I don't know how else to spell it out.

I disagree. Before the trades, with Tampa’s defense we have a similar record to Carolina. With the trades and a D as good as Tampas, we are comfortably 6-8 seed. Granted, the east is pretty bad this year, but it’s all relative. Personnel wise, I don’t know if there are 2 or 3 defenses worse than us, and I don’t remember any actually playing worse than us.

 

[Machinehead]

I disagree. Before the trades, with Tampa’s defense we have a similar record to Carolina. With the trades and a D as good as Tampas, we are comfortably 6-8 seed. Granted, the east is pretty bad this year, but it’s all relative. Personnel wise, I don’t know if there are 2 or 3 defenses worse than us, and I don’t remember any actually playing worse than us.

So you're saying if we just waved a magic wand to turn one of the worst defenses in the league into one of the best, we would be 6th to 8th in the conference which still isn't good?

Sounds like you think this is a bad roster.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

 

[Siddi]

Is Serj Tankian a Rangers fan?

 

[UnparalledPark]

You’re not fooling anyone Crypto. That’s not a country club, that’s a public golf course on Long Island.

 

[Machinehead]

Is Serj Tankian a Rangers fan?

He looks like Gary Neville there

 

[Mike in Houston]

You’re not fooling anyone Crypto. That’s not a country club, that’s a public golf course on Long Island.

It's going to be hilarious when all the so-called "country club" players have all moved on, and yet nothing changes. I guess the country club would be more a systemic thing and not a player thing.

 

[TheTakedown]

And why would they do that? Since the start of January Mika has 37 points in 44 games. Second on the team (Would be third if Miller was here that long). How does telling him to stay home but still paying him make the team better? He also has a 52 GF% and 53 xG% at 5v5. He hasn't been a problem.

That's the usual thing with this board though. He got off to a horrible start this year. Wasn't scoring, missing the net on the PP, mishandling pucks and turning it over. He hasn't been like that for months. But, since that was the first impression (and did last a while) people absolutely refuse to change their mind/reevaluate.

That's not to say he's a positive for his salary or that they shouldn't make a move if they find one, but he has not been a negative on this team for a very long time. He's been one of the better players. If there's no trade to be made for assets/cap space to bring in someone else, the team is much better with him in the lineup than it is with him just being dead cap space as a scratch.

The biggest fault with him is that it takes longer and longer each year for him to perform in this manner. I get my every guy is gunna be 100% full steam ahead on game one, but if it's taking you 40+ GAMES to play up to your potential, there is a problem.

 

[will1066]

How does the saucer stay under the teacup?

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

mika had a rough season but his second half makes me be a lot more forgiving towards him. He clearly wasn’t just dogging it, he was just struggling. Cant say the same for others. And he definitely played very well in the back half.

 

[eco's bones]

One of them is on track to crack top 5 in production all time for an O6 franchise while the other is a decent role player. Let me repeat myself, Mika, in the worst season of his career is still outproducing Vinny despite playing 3 min less/game and being a vagabond up and down the line-up.

I dont know what you are trying to prove with the PPP breakdown? Yes, good players get PP time...

Superior penalty killer? Mika has Vinny more than doubled in SHP over their careers.

I am sorry but you are delusional if you believe they have had similar careers. But hey, you got their age right and, yes, Vinny is better at the dot.

It seems to me you defend Mika like Bern defends Kreider. There's almost this desperation to keep the player on the team. They've both had shit years and whether they'll rebound next year or not they are both closing in on their mid-30's fast. Also I don't look at Mika as 1st line material in any way at all anymore. He had a good playoffs last year until we ran into the Panthers and he was completely dominated in that series by Barkov. Even if you still regard him as a 1C he is not on a par with the best centers in the league and in some cases it's not even close. JT fits that bill as well as anyone we have.

One of my biggest concerns with Mika is the fall off in his defensive play. He's almost always been a + player. This year he's a -25. It might not be the greatest stat for analyzing a player but the closest one on the team to him is Lafreniere and he's a -13 and then much of the rest of the team including almost all of our D are + players. Maybe it can be explained in that it seemed that there was some psychological turmoil going on with him prior to the 4 nations tournament.

As far as Trocheck he is a very good 2C. Nice cap hit. He's a Swiss Army knife type player. Not great at everything but good everything. He's also a leader type guy.

 

[Machinehead]

It's going to be hilarious when all the so-called "country club" players have all moved on, and yet nothing changes. I guess the country club would be more a systemic thing and not a player thing.

We'll just move onto the next excuse to avoid "the team just isn't very good" for some reason.

 

[HonestGabe]

Colorado was interested in Panarin in 2019. The Avs didn't like the 7 year term. Panarin is still a productive player six years later.

First round matchup with Dallas. Toss up. The Stars are not playing well. Heiskenen won't play in the first round.

If the Avs don't reach the WCF, would they be interested in Panarin? The Rangers and Colorado have made trades. Georgiev. Lindgren. Panarin has another 2-3 good years left in the tank. Definitely two more quality seasons. The Avs would need to re-sign Panarin to an extension. Would Colorado swap Necas for Panarin? There is $5M gap in their cap hits for next season. Maybe the Rangers retain. Maybe the Avs include another player. Josh Manson's $4.5M expiring contract? Manson has had a tough season in Colorado.

The Avs want to win another Cup with MacKinnon. He turns 30 this September. Are the Avs a better team with Panarin or Necas in the next 3 seasons? How do the Avs maximize the MacKinnon years? Panarin will most likely be a shorter extension. 2 years. 3 years. Panarin still has another season remaining on his current contract. Necas probably wants a 6-7-8 year deal and a decent bump from his $6.5M. The playoffs will determine a lot of things.

Panarin gets to play with MacKinnon. The Avs give him an extension. July 1 trade or a draft day trade where they discuss the extension as part of the trade and officially sign it on July 1. Colorado has a large Russian population. I remember reading many years ago about Panarin liking the snow. Panarin waives his NMC. He gets to play for a Cup contender. Jared Bednar is a great coach.

Necas would give the Rangers a right handed shooting winger which they need and the Rangers extend him. He is in the right age group. Necas is 26 years old. I looked Natural Stat Trick. Trocheck and Necas played over 1,000 minutes together at 5v5 from the time Trocheck went to Carolina at the 2020 deadline. Trocheck played his most minutes in Carolina with Necas. The Rangers reunite them as seeing how Miller and Trocheck are the two team leaders now and next season. Trocheck and Necas were good together.

https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20192020&thruseason=20212022&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=n&v=t&playerid=8476389

Just give JT the C. He is already directing traffic. You line up here. You line up behind me for the one-timer when I win this face-off. Panarin, Fox and Mika are looking at each other and nodding their heads.

would drive Panarin to Denver for Necas

 

[Fitzy]

One of them is on track to crack top 5 in production all time for an O6 franchise while the other is a decent role player. Let me repeat myself, Mika, in the worst season of his career is still outproducing Vinny despite playing 3 min less/game and being a vagabond up and down the line-up.

I dont know what you are trying to prove with the PPP breakdown? Yes, good players get PP time...

Superior penalty killer? Mika has Vinny more than doubled in SHP over their careers.

I am sorry but you are delusional if you believe they have had similar careers. But hey, you got their age right and, yes, Vinny is better at the dot.

Zibanejad was on the ice for many, many more goals against, to be fair.

But you're right- there's a reason why Trocheck is a second line center. Mika is supposed to score 70+, when he doesn't it's a big issue.

 

[Siddi]

He looks like Gary Neville there

I can see the resemblence. Nose is on point.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

We'll just move onto the next excuse to avoid "the team just isn't very good" for some reason.

i dont see why it can’t be both

i mean our 7th defenseman was just sounding off to the media about how he’s been treated, one of about 5+ times that’s happened this year. that doesn’t happen in functional organizations. the team definitely just got worse naturally due to aging/guys regressing/igor having a weird year but there are clearly other issues at play here

 

[Machinehead]

i dont see why it can’t be both

i mean our 7th defenseman was just sounding off to the media about how he’s been treated, one of about 5+ times that’s happened this year. that doesn’t happen in functional organizations. the team definitely just got worse naturally due to aging/guys regressing but there are clearly other issues at play here

It's never both. People want to trade a couple of guys and tell themselves that'll make the voodoo go away.

 

[MrAlmost]

Kreider and Z will be gone. I could see Rossi as the target. Maybe Z and Kreider go to Minnesota. They have a load of cap and not even sure adding Kreider and Z would stop them from being able to resign Kaprizov.

Kreider and Z for Rossi, Chisholm and Stramel.

Edit: Just checked. They'd still have like 4.5 million in cap space after that trade this year. Crazy.

 

[McRanger92]

Kreider and Z will be gone. I could see Rossi as the target. Maybe Z and Kreider go to Minnesota. They have a load of cap and not even sure adding Kreider and Z would stop them from being able to resign Kaprizov.

Kreider and Z for Rossi, Chisholm and Stramel.

Could definitely see Mika to Minnesota. reunite with Zucc. Wild could use another top 6 C. Trocheck I believe was on their radar earlier this season. Guerin chose him for the 4 Nations when their were others potentially more deserving.

 

[Machinehead]

Another Chisholm? Sign me up.

 

[MrAlmost]

Could definitely see Mika to Minnesota. reunite with Zucc. Wild could use another top 6 C. Trocheck I believe was on their radar earlier this season. Guerin chose him for the 4 Nations when their were others potentially more deserving.

I'd think they would be 1 of maybe 2 teams that may want both Kreider and Z. They need help on the PP and PK and those are probably the only 2 guys they could get at the same time that play their best hockey on both.

Another Chisholm? Sign me up.

I thought you wanted all the #6 guys? If you have 3 3rd pairs, then you have the best 3rd pair in the league.