Speculation: Roster Building thread: Part XIX (Thanks, Sam)

How did this Ranger squad, single handedly, make me lose complete interest in the sport, after 50+ years of obsessive watching?

This season was like watching your 20 year old cat slowly pass from natural causes.

My cat is 15 and sitting on my chest as i type this, so no emoji hugs from you weirdos necessary haha.

See you at the draft, or if my boy Rempe wins a fight.

So I guess I'll see you at the draft.

Peace all.
 
You're definitely not a Monday Night Q on this take but Panarin is not an issue per se, or at least not the hinge pin that you make it up to be of what went wrong. The issue is that Lafreniere, Kakko and Kravtsov (and Andersson) all failed relative to expectations based on their draft positions. Drafting is not an exact science but this is some horrible bad luck (and while I fully acknowledge that drafting Lias and Vitali wasn't objectively a given, Alex and Kaapo were universal choices).

The other issue with your argument about alternative vets signings in place of Panarin - it would be far from guaranteeing that this plan would work out as in after 3-5 years of rebuilding the team will come out on the other side and make playoffs. I'm not going to list all the examples again, you know their story.

The last piece of mismanagement was organizational decision on McD. I can't help but look at how LA kept Doughty through their rebuild. With hindsight re. how McD held up physically this was probable the biggest "outgoing" blunder.

I'm not even saying that the alternative would have worked, but they sent out a letter saying that they were going to set out in a new direction and basically took the exit ramp before the trip even got started.

What we do know is what they did failed and the decision to sign Panarin is one of the bigger reasons why.

I don't know that Laf or Kakko would be game changers even if they had been given the opportunities and usage that most 1 and 2 OA's get early in their careers, but I do know that you don't get better at doing things by not doing them. At the very least, It would have been nice to see both of them not get passed over for PP time in lieu of Ryan Strome and Colin Blackwell.

Lias and Kravtsov were f***ing failures. They were able to make up for Lias somewhat (he was traded for the pick that turned into Cuylle who is a good player) but yeah, Kravtsov was a miss and a half and a total f*** wad. Kind of blending this convo into one thats already existing, but the 2017 draft was seen as a super weak one outside of the top 5 or so, Rangers picked 7th.

There are like 5 or 6 guys chosen in the following 10 picks who have all turned out to be very good or great players.

2018 was considered to be a better draft. Almost all of the forwards (and players really) post Kravtsov also kind of suck.

Anyway, a lot of good players have been traded since the summer of 2019. It would have been nice to have the surplus assets (and cap space) to use to land a few of those guys.

Instead we got Panarin and kept most of what was already here. Don't need to rehash what Panarin has been in the playoffs as a Ranger, we've all seen the games.
 
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So you're in the keep the current year 1st round pick?

It would make sense to me assuming that this was an aberration year and next year's team will be back to playoffs. But two things make me pause:

1. This year's draft class is reported to be on a weak side
2. Front office typically wants a certainty meaning - let's finish at 13 or better and eliminate uncertainty
3. There's no guarantee that next year's team will be better (albeit it's a reasonable take) including impact of something unexpected (injury bug that hits all the key (pun not intended) areas). I mean with 100% guarantee there's not a single person last summer who'd argue that the Rangers won't make playoffs
Hell yea, keep the pick. Worry about making the team much better in the offseason. We will have the money and trade chips.
 
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This is actually a decent opportunity to do it. This team will have next to no expectations next season. We're all disgusted after how these 77 games have gone, so I'd say the fan base is ready for a big change.

We talk about the contracts, but I feel like there are still ways forward. Mika had success on the wing, I think a team that is close may go for it. Teams will have more space this summer than the last half decade and may not want to give an inflated deal to an UFA.

I really think Panarin asks out. He's frustrated. Is he part of the issue? I'd say yes, he can't drive a line anymore. This is a move that would be the kickstart because whoever gets him won't ask him to do that.

You still need veterans and nobody else will get a worthwhile return, so keep them. In these moves they need to identify a young center with high end talent that could even be their #2C next season.

All I'll say is this, if any of these guys are legit in not wanting to lose Trouba and Goodrow, you better not see Anaheim or San Jose on their no trade lists.
to a large extent, no, we do not
youth is cheaper, has upside potential

vets are in 2 camps:
sell high to mitigate past mistakes, reshuffle this deck: Fox, Shesty, bread
tro took a step back but great FO% = possible here, but not seeing worthwhile return
underperforming losers: Zib
Soucy + Vaak like tro, not seeing return and don't want to pay to move
try to rehab their value

Kreider of course, ltir, hope he does recover at some pt reassess then.
No stupid irrational hate + idiotic suggestions we pay to move him

continue w/da kids
youth for youth may be considered but no youth for vets

This is all Kreiders fault
irrational
zib is WAY more culpable than ck
meeka put out 2ish really good months, w/no excuse for taking off rest of the time

:thumbd: :thumbd: :thumbd: :thumbd: :thumbd: :thumbd: :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::madfire::arr::arr::arr::arr::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::loony::loony::loony::loony::loony::nono::nono::nono::nono::nono::razz::razz::razz::noway::noway::noway::noway::deadhorse:deadhorse:eviltongu:eviltongu:dunce::dunce::rant::rant:


:soap: learn w/da bern :faq::faq:
 
I wonder what this team would look like if they had held on to McDonagh and Buch (or even Zuk). Maybe the aren't bad enough to land Laff or Kakko. Maybe they pick 10th or whatever in 2019 and end up with Boldy or Harlely or Lundell or Holloway in 2020 instead. It's a lot to unravel and who knows where they end up, maybe there's no Gabe here currently. Maybe it's better to keep a productive player even if they're older.
 
imo:

If pick is in the top 7, you keep it.
If it's out side of that, you take your chances and give it to Pittsburgh.

This team is not improving that much next season.
you keep it if a decent/+ prospect is there at 11-12,
but tanking now to optimize it was better even before this last series of debacles
 
imo:

If pick is in the top 7, you keep it.
If it's out side of that, you take your chances and give it to Pittsburgh.

This team is not improving that much next season.
We are keeping the pick because teams always keep the pick.

Drury isn’t going to defer the pick so he can’t use it, but the next GM can.

It will be a shock if the pick is deferred; and it has nothing to do with draft day scenarios.
 
imo:

If pick is in the top 7, you keep it.
If it's out side of that, you take your chances and give it to Pittsburgh.

This team is not improving that much next season.
Outside the top 5 and the pick isn’t playing in the nhl next year.
If it’s that high now, give it up otherwise we will give up a top 3…
Especially if we’re gonna do the right thing and move 10/20/93
 
I wonder what this team would look like if they had held on to McDonagh and Buch (or even Zuk). Maybe the aren't bad enough to land Laff or Kakko. Maybe they pick 10th or whatever in 2019 and end up with Boldy or Harlely or Lundell or Holloway in 2020 instead. It's a lot to unravel and who knows where they end up, maybe there's no Gabe here currently. Maybe it's better to keep a productive player even if they're older.

The rebuild was a huge mistake. They committed to it before even firing Vigneault. Gorton just wanted to buy himself time. Then he went and acquired Panarin and Trouba less than 2 years later. Idiocy. They had a good roster and the McD/Miller panic trade got us nothing. Same with the Zucc trade. Couldve just traded Nash, Grabner and Holden and retooled in the offseason with a new coach.
 
The rebuild was a huge mistake. They committed to it before even firing Vigneault. Gorton just wanted to buy himself time. Then he went and acquired Panarin and Trouba less than 2 years later. Idiocy. They had a good roster and the McD/Miller panic trade got us nothing. Same with the Zucc trade. Couldve just traded Nash, Grabner and Holden and retooled in the offseason with a new coach.
The rebuild wasn't a mistake.The fact he abandoned it before it ever really got started was
 
The rebuild wasn't a mistake.The fact he abandoned it before it ever really got started was

Teams that rebuild dont ever come out of it unless they draft a future Hall of Fame forward, which is a complete crapshoot even at the top of the draft as we've painfully found out.
 
Teams that rebuild dont ever come out of it unless they draft a future Hall of Fame forward, which is a complete crapshoot even at the top of the draft as we've painfully found out.
That's the oddest thing I've read on here in awhile.So you just keep spinning your wheels in quicksand and mediocrity because other teams rebuilds have failed?Odd reasoning
 
That's the oddest thing I've read on here in awhile.So you just keep spinning your wheels in quicksand and mediocrity because other teams rebuilds have failed?Odd reasoning

Is rebuilding the only option to improve a team? When did the Lightning and Panther rebuild? When did Colorado or Vegas rebuild? Not any time recently.
 
The rebuild failed because Anderson, Kravtsov, Laff, Chytl, Kakko, even Miller all failed to varying degrees. If Laff and Kakko are anywhere near their draft status, this team is a juggernaut because all Drury (or Gorton) would have had to do was upgrade the D instead trying to patch holes in the forward lineup every offseason.
 
We need a new scouting department too.I look at what we have in Hartford and I see nothing but bottom 6 players/talent and bottom pairing dmen.Why can't we ever hit on top talent in later/any rounds like other teams do?this organization needs a complete enema in the worst way
 
I wonder what this team would look like if they had held on to McDonagh and Buch (or even Zuk). Maybe the aren't bad enough to land Laff or Kakko. Maybe they pick 10th or whatever in 2019 and end up with Boldy or Harlely or Lundell or Holloway in 2020 instead. It's a lot to unravel and who knows where they end up, maybe there's no Gabe here currently. Maybe it's better to keep a productive player even if they're older.


They did keep a productive Kreider and Mika and they just gotten older and worse. Zucc would suck here. Although Zucc next to Panarin maybe would have been fun to watch. Other than that this team cant identify real talent.
 
They did keep a productive Kreider and Mika and they just gotten older and worse. Zucc would suck here. Although Zucc next to Panarin maybe would have been fun to watch. Other than that this team cant identify real talent.
It was more about the domino effect and where they end up drafting in 2019 and 2020. In retrospect, they would have been much better off not picking where they did.
 
The rebuild failed because Anderson, Kravtsov, Laff, Chytl, Kakko, even Miller all failed to varying degrees. If Laff and Kakko are anywhere near their draft status, this team is a juggernaut because all Drury (or Gorton) would have had to do was upgrade the D instead trying to patch holes in the forward lineup every offseason.

That's a lot of top-10 players who have busted. Maybe the issue lies with the development...
 
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I love people up in arms over Lavs comments post game. He’s as disgusted with and over this group as we are.

I’ve never related to a coach more.

Late stage Vigneault energy. Pretty obvious Laviolette checked out when the players did. But the locker room issues are "fan-fiction" ive been told.
 

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