Roster Building/Team Building/Future Trade/Drafting thread.

[Marlow88]

Krebs is faster, better defensively, more physical, lower cap hit. Krebs would be cheaper to obtain.

I doubt Buffalo will want to make a deal with Toronto. If so, there is going to be a premium attached.

 

[Fogelhund]

Seravalli and Kypreos have said he's available. The fit hasn't worked apparently.

Ya, I found that after I posted... should have looked it up first.

I'm not sure what we have to offer them, as he cost them quite a bit.

 

[Fogelhund]

I doubt Buffalo will want to make a deal with Toronto. If so, there is going to be a premium attached.

Why?

 

[Marlow88]

Why?

I would really love the Leafs to grab Krebs. I have been following him since his draft year. It is just that making deals within the division is expensive. Look at what Boston was able to extract from Toronto with the Carlo deal. Toronto does not have much draft capital and what players the Leafs have, I am not sure Buffalo would be interested.

 

[mydnyte]

It comes down to providing value for the contact. He's the best C on the market this year. But, he's aging, a bit slower, and our hope is to push him down the lineup. If you can sign him to a 6 x $3.5 million, there is absolutely no way of signing someone to a better value contract. If he wants $8 million, well it's not going to provide much in the way of extra value at all.

Hopefully we find a way to keep the AAV low, to pick up a 2C, and better the team down the middle.

we hear this all the time, but, it simply isnt an exact science

He doesnt have straight away speed, and that has always been true, but, in bursts, he's right up there near the top (top 5 usually) for the Leafs every season

his top speed last season was 22.05mph which is down from the 22.25 2 years ago, but, he still ranks near the top for the Leafs ...we are unfortunately a slow team overall

​

 

[Americanadian]

Ya, I found that after I posted... should have looked it up first.

I'm not sure what we have to offer them, as he cost them quite a bit.

Depends how Mittelstadt was valued at the deadline. Was he a positive asset? If so what was his draft pick value?

I was the one who proposed Coyle in the first place and I proposed Benoit+Holmberg for Coyle.

Colorado saves ~2.75M and fill their 3LD spot and 4RW/LW. Benoit is now the “best 6D in hockey”, Holmberg has built in chemistry with Drury.

I’m not sure if that gets it done but that would be an offer that keeps Colorado competitive and clears cap space. They probably just want enough room to bring back Drouin.

 

[TMLAM34]

Krebs vs. Sillinger

Sillinger is younger, and bigger, better draft stock, has been more productive.

Krebs is faster, better defensively, more physical, lower cap hit. Krebs would be cheaper to obtain.

Sillinger 1.77 Points/60
Krebs 1.49 Points/60

Not a fan of moving Woll, but either would be nice pickups.

It wouldn't shock me, if both were about equal, with the same teammates... love to have both somehow.

I think Sillinger has more to give offensively than Krebs and can be a solid second line center in the right situation. I can definitely get behind a second line that consists of Sillinger and Nylander. But like you said, having either of those players would be good.

 

[ULF_55]

I’d be curious to know how far back your Leaf watching days go back to, because this era of regular season success and playoff failure is simply not that good. Yeah better than Bozak and Grabovski…

I started watching in ‘93 and ‘94. You take either one of those runs and that’s the same number of playoff series wins as we’ve had in 9 years with this crew. It’s abhorrent.

I think part of it is expectation.

Watched the Cup at age 12, I watched prior to that but those memories are not as intact.

Over the years there have been worse teams that took us on more exciting journeys.

Sittlers Leafs during the Montreal dynasty in the 70's.
Beating the nascent Islanders.
Vaive's team made the 2nd. round twice.
Doug Gimour lead them to the 3rd. round.
Gary Roberts 3rd. round, with Sundin being Matthews, injured.
Sundin 3rd. round.

But the disappointments were usually expected, or wait until next year.
Today it seems inevitable that next year, with this same team, will be no different. That "DNA has to change" pronouncement by Treliving indicates he feels the same.

How do you change the DNA when you've locked much of your team into a returning roster? With limited money, in a Hard Cap league, "there will be pain." Babcock was correct, perhaps for the wrong reason. The rebuild didn't have a lot of pain, but rebuilt team seems to have caused fans pain, but mostly disappointment.

When Vaive's team was coming up short like this version it wasn't underachievement, it was thanks for the effort. We knew they were outmatched and outgunned.

We expected better, obviously we overrated the players.

 

[mydnyte]

People want change for the wrong reasons with just no logical reasons. I dunno why JT is an issue at any sort of discount. He works hard, he loves being here and while he's shown regression, still producing at a high level and people still don't want him at any price... it's crazy.

There's a lot to do and with Marner likely walking alone is a lot of change to the lineup, for better or worse.

yea... some folks are too young and didnt need to live through the Ballard years where they traded McDonald just to spite Sittler, or didnt draft Federov (who the scouts wanted) but Ballard wouldnt let a player from USSR play on his team
then Stavros 'stole' the team, and tore up the Gretzky contract, because he was losing $$ in his business and he was 'too expensive'
We have ownership that spends ever penny available, and fans want to run players that are breaking 50year old records for a 'change' if only we were that lucky back then.

this Core lost because Dubas never addressed our biggest weakness, a BAD defense, not because our 3rd liners didnt score. when the bad defense creates goals against every game its very deflating.

Our defense is better, but, in reality, its still bad, or average at best. In our division alone, every other team has at least 1 or 2 defenders better than all of ours.

I think i got a bit off topic and turned into an aged vent

 

[Fogelhund]

I think Sillinger has more to give offensively than Krebs and can be a solid second line center in the right situation. I can definitely get behind a second line that consists of Sillinger and Nylander. But like you said, having either of those players would be good.

For sure Sillinger might have 2C upside, and Krebs 3C upside...

 

[Clark4Ever]

Lots of interesting rumblings from credible media sources the last few days...

- The Panthers are gearing up for a sign and trade offer to the Leafs for Marner
- The Leafs are going to be a frontrunner for Marchand
- Pacioretty leaning towards returning to the Leafs

 

[mydnyte]

I found this on a reddit thread... quite an interesting list of 'slow' players and some surprising names, and some not so surprising names that many/some Leafs fans want

Players Leafs 'fans' have shown interest in:
Marchment was considered a fringe NHLer because of his poor skating, and that seems to be correct.
Pius Suter
Kuzmenko (who I would take a flyer on)
Marchessault
Faksa
Boeser
Perry
Bertuzzi (buyout candidate? I wouldnt want regardless, but lots have mentioned him)

other notables
Tkachuck top 3 in slowness across the board
Bedard
Jason Robertson
Ovechkin
Marner (fewest bursts list, not surprising, isnt his style)

 

[rumman]

I think part of it is expectation.

Watched the Cup at age 12, I watched prior to that but those memories are not as intact.

Over the years there have been worse teams that took us on more exciting journeys.

Sittlers Leafs during the Montreal dynasty in the 70's.
Beating the nascent Islanders.
Vaive's team made the 2nd. round twice.
Doug Gimour lead them to the 3rd. round.
Gary Roberts 3rd. round, with Sundin being Matthews, injured.
Sundin 3rd. round.

But the disappointments were usually expected, or wait until next year.
Today it seems inevitable that next year, with this same team, will be no different. That "DNA has to change" pronouncement by Treliving indicates he feels the same.

How do you change the DNA when you've locked much of your team into a returning roster? With limited money, in a Hard Cap league, "there will be pain." Babcock was correct, perhaps for the wrong reason. The rebuild didn't have a lot of pain, but rebuilt team seems to have caused fans pain, but mostly disappointment.

When Vaive's team was coming up short like this version it wasn't underachievement, it was thanks for the effort. We knew they were outmatched and outgunned.

We expected better, obviously we overrated the players.

the younger posters here have no idea, that's not their fault, but they lack the depth of perspective decades of following the team. I equate it with a prisoner who's done a couple of years of hard time compared to a lifer with almost sixty years under their belt, sad fact is eventually they'll know what were talking about, it's only a metter of time.........

 

[rumman]

yea... some folks are too young and didnt need to live through the Ballard years where they traded McDonald just to spite Sittler, or didnt draft Federov (who the scouts wanted) but Ballard wouldnt let a player from USSR play on his team
then Stavros 'stole' the team, and tore up the Gretzky contract, because he was losing $$ in his business and he was 'too expensive'
We have ownership that spends ever penny available, and fans want to run players that are breaking 50year old records for a 'change' if only we were that lucky back then.

this Core lost because Dubas never addressed our biggest weakness, a BAD defense, not because our 3rd liners didnt score. when the bad defense creates goals against every game its very deflating.

Our defense is better, but, in reality, its still bad, or average at best. In our division alone, every other team has at least 1 or 2 defenders better than all of ours.

I think i got a bit off topic and turned into an aged vent

any of the younger fanbase can learn a ton by reading Dick Beddos' biography of Harold Ballard and Darryl Sittler's biography. Between those two books they'll know most of the pertinent info on the Leafs from when Conn Smythe sold the team to the Ballard years...........

 

[Americanadian]

McMann+Kampf+2025 2nd for Sissons+Barron

Benoit+Holmberg for Coyle

Robertson+Jarnkrok+2025 3rd for Eberle 50% retained

UFA:
Marchand 7.5Mx2
Bastian 1.15Mx7
Pacioretty 775kx1
Jeannot 2.5Mx4
Tavares 4Mx(?)

RFA:
Knies 6.5Mx3

Knies-Matthews-Domi
Marchand-Coyle-Nylander
Laughton-Tavares-Eberle
Jeannot-Sissons-Bastian
Pacioretty

McCabe-Tanev
Rielly-Carlo
OEL-Barron
Myers

Stolarz
Woll

With the carryover cap hit this 22 man roster is $1800 under the cap.

 

[rumman]

McMann+Kampf+2025 2nd for Sissons+Barron

Benoit+Holmberg for Coyle

Robertson+Jarnkrok+2025 3rd for Eberle 50% retained

UFA:
Marchand 7.5Mx2
Bastian 1.15Mx7
Pacioretty 775kx1
Jeannot 2.5Mx4
Tavares 4Mx(?)

RFA:
Knies 6.5Mx3

Knies-Matthews-Domi
Marchand-Coyle-Nylander
Laughton-Tavares-Eberle
Jeannot-Sissons-Bastian
Pacioretty

McCabe-Tanev
Rielly-Carlo
OEL-Barron
Myers

Stolarz
Woll

With the carryover cap hit this 22 man roster is $1800 under the cap.

finally get a cost effective D man that's physical and people want to trade him..........

 

[Americanadian]

finally get a cost effective D man that's physical and people want to trade him..........

View attachment 1048676

I didn’t realize he was untouchable.

In all seriousness, this conversation has been fleshed out in this thread. Tre wants another puck mover, Benoit is the most logical odd man out.

 

[rumman]

I didn’t realize he was untouchable.

In all seriousness, this conversation has been fleshed out in this thread. Tre wants another puck mover, Benoit is the most logical odd man out.

Mo is the most logical man out because he can't defend and costs a fortune, whether Bubbles has the stones to do what's necessary is the only question..............

 

[Brobust]

Leafs perfect offseason

• Trade Anthony Stolarz, Simon Benoit and Bobby McMann (I don't think Berube likes him that much anyway)
• Sign Aaron Ekblad
• Target young forwards instead of vets like Marchand - Mavrik Bourque, Jack McBain, Morgan Frost etc.

 

[Brobust]

Mo is the most logical man out because he can't defend and costs a fortune, whether Bubbles has the stones to do what's necessary is the only question..............

We're at a point where Neal Pionk is getting Morgan Rielly money. I don't think he's overly expensive and I also think he's earned enough leeway that one mid season is enough to want him dumped.

 

[Americanadian]

Mo is the most logical man out because he can't defend and costs a fortune, whether Bubbles has the stones to do what's necessary is the only question..............

Again - using logic, Rielly likely isn’t moving. I’d move off him in a heartbeat and even take bad money back if he was open to it. As of today he is putting the message out into the media that he is not open to it.

Even if he was moved and replaced with a puck mover, you don’t have 1 more puck moving D, you just replaced one with another.

 

[SprDaVE]

Leafs perfect offseason

• Trade Anthony Stolarz, Simon Benoit and Bobby McMann (I don't think Berube likes him that much anyway)
• Sign Aaron Ekblad
• Target young forwards instead of vets like Marchand - Mavrik Bourque, Jack McBain, Morgan Frost etc.

Stolarz was a top 5 goaltender in the league this season, injuries aside. McMann is a 1.35M 20 goal scorer. Benoit is whatever but cheap as well.

Why is that a "perfect" off-season? The returns of those players will largely depend on what perfect entails.

 

[rumman]

Again - using logic, Rielly likely isn’t moving. I’d move off him in a heartbeat and even take bad money back if he was open to it. As of today he is putting the message out into the media that he is not open to it.

Even if he was moved and replaced with a puck mover, you don’t have 1 more puck moving D, you just replaced one with another.

moving OEL to his natural side would fix this imo..........

 

[rumman]

Again - using logic, Rielly likely isn’t moving. I’d move off him in a heartbeat and even take bad money back if he was open to it. As of today he is putting the message out into the media that he is not open to it.

Even if he was moved and replaced with a puck mover, you don’t have 1 more puck moving D, you just replaced one with another.

if you have cancer in say your right leg, amputating your left leg does nothing to fix the problem, there's no way around it, Mo's gotta go............

 

[Fogelhund]

Leafs perfect offseason

• Trade Anthony Stolarz, Simon Benoit and Bobby McMann (I don't think Berube likes him that much anyway)
• Sign Aaron Ekblad
• Target young forwards instead of vets like Marchand - Mavrik Bourque, Jack McBain, Morgan Frost etc.

I like the guys you've targeted, but I don't see Ekblad making free agency, and I don't see any of the young forwards you've listed being available. I've been on the McBain train since before he was traded.. but that just isn't happening.. unfortunately.

Moving Stolarz would be a mistake for us at this point.