Value of: Rossi to Flyers

[Spurgeon]

I mean, good luck on that one man.

Do you really think the value isn’t close on that?

It’s probably the most likely trade of all the ones out there. Both players have trade rumors, both have similar production, and both need a new contract.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It’s a completely reasonable ask and I have legitimately no idea what the f*** Guerin is doing.

This is why I think Wild fans are going to be wildly disappointed with what Rossi brings back. It's not because they're wrong about Rossi with their evaluation, but because Guerin seems to just not like and not value the guy for some reason. Guerin is a size queen and he really seems to not value Rossi because he's small.

If Guerin isn't willing to pay him a reasonable deal, has already lowballed him with that rumored $5x5 offer and has already been shopping him, why should you believe that he's going to get great value for the player? That doesn't make sense. This isn't a "we can just keep the guy" situation, Rossi can just refuse to sign unless Guerin offers him the deal he wants.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Okay, then prove me wrong. Provide a single example of a team trading RFA rights for win-now players under contract. Literally any example.

You can't because it hasn't happened.

Again, we don’t have to bend to what you think the trade should be. We can work a contract out with Rossi if there are no suitable offers.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Again, we don’t have to bend to what you think the trade should be. We can work a contract out with Rossi if there are no suitable offers.

And the report today was that Rossi's ask was way too much for what Guerin wants to pay. He already lowballed him with an offer earlier in the year when he offered that 5 year, $5 million AAV deal.

Your choices are:

1. Trade him for the best return, which is almost definitely going to be futures.
2. Give Rossi the 7 year, $7 million AAV deal he's asking for, which Guerin doesn't want to pay and was massively far off from in his last offer.
3. Have Rossi sit out.

You really don't have the leverage you think you do, mostly because of how Guerin seems to view Rossi.

 

[Gurglesons]

Do you really think the value isn’t close on that?

It’s probably the most likely trade of all the ones out there. Both players have trade rumors, both have similar production, and both need a new contract.

No, I don't think it is close at all.

Peterka has huge potential. Rossi is a complimentary player whose point totals were largely inflated by Kaprizov.

Not to say Rossi wouldn't find success with other wingers, just that he needs an insulation compared to Peterka who can do it on his own.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

This is why I think Wild fans are going to be wildly disappointed with what Rossi brings back. It's not because they're wrong about Rossi with their evaluation, but because Guerin seems to just not like and not value the guy for some reason. Guerin is a size queen and he really seems to not value Rossi because he's small.

If Guerin isn't willing to pay him a reasonable deal, has already lowballed him with that rumored $5x5 offer and has already been shopping him, why should you believe that he's going to get great value for the player? That doesn't make sense. This isn't a "we can just keep the guy" situation, Rossi can just refuse to sign unless Guerin offers him the deal he wants.

This is the key point.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

And the report today was that Rossi's ask was way too much for what Guerin wants to pay. He already lowballed him with an offer earlier in the year when he offered that 5 year, $5 million AAV deal.

We have his RFA rights. What are you gonna do, offersheet him? Go ahead. I look forward to your unprotected 2026 1st.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

No, I don't think it is close at all.

Peterka has huge potential. Rossi is a complimentary player whose point totals were largely inflated by Kaprizov.

Not to say Rossi wouldn't find success with other wingers, just that he needs an insulation compared to Peterka who can do it on his own.

I hate when people say stupid shit like this.

 

[Empoleon8771]

We have his RFA rights. What are you gonna do, offersheet him? Go ahead. I look forward to your unprotected 2026 1st.

So getting a 1st from an offersheet would be okay but futures via a trade are somehow unacceptable? What if it's someone like Carolina doing that offersheet? Are you happy with Carolina's late 1st and 3rd?

You seem to be making this about the Penguins when I'm talking about Rossi's value broadly. Minnesota doesn't have the leverage to be demanding good NHL players for Rossi's RFA rights. Teams don't trade those kind of pieces for RFAs who want big deals, it just doesn't happen. Now add on how Guerin doesn't seem to like him and doesn't want to pay him what he's asking for and Minnesota's leverage gets even worse.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

No, I don't think it is close at all.

Peterka has huge potential. Rossi is a complimentary player whose point totals were largely inflated by Kaprizov.

Not to say Rossi wouldn't find success with other wingers, just that he needs an insulation compared to Peterka who can do it on his own.

Rossi had as many points this season involving Kaprizov (19) as he did points that did not involve either Kaprizov or Boldy.

Peterka's top 2 TOI-withs are Thompson and Tuch. Neither are Kaprizov, but he's not doing it on his own.

 

[MrRuin]

No, I don't think it is close at all.

Peterka has huge potential. Rossi is a complimentary player whose point totals were largely inflated by Kaprizov.

Not to say Rossi wouldn't find success with other wingers, just that he needs an insulation compared to Peterka who can do it on his own.

Rossi played the majority of his time with other wingers than Kap. He produced on every line and with every combination of wingers put on his line. What you try to sell as truth simply isn’t true and has been debunked several times in various threads where other uninformed posters tried to sell the same incorrect nonsense.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

And the report today was that Rossi's ask was way too much for what Guerin wants to pay. He already lowballed him with an offer earlier in the year when he offered that 5 year, $5 million AAV deal.

Your choices are:

1. Trade him for the best return, which is almost definitely going to be futures.
2. Give Rossi the 7 year, $7 million AAV deal he's asking for, which Guerin doesn't want to pay and was massively far off from in his last offer.
3. Have Rossi sit out.

You really don't have the leverage you think you do, mostly because of how Guerin seems to view Rossi.

Secret option #4 would be Rossi buckling and signing for closer to that crappy 5 x $5M offer.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Secret option #4 would be Rossi buckling and signing for closer to that crappy 5 x $5M offer.

Yeah I should clarify, I think option 4 there would be a very short term deal at an AAV close to the AAV Guerin is offering. I think something like 2 years at $5 million AAV could get it done. But is Guerin going to do that? He should, but you could say he should just sign Rossi to the deal he's asking for too.

There's just no way Rossi gives up that much money to take Guerin's offer. That's the AAV of a bridge deal for Rossi, not a long-term deal.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Yeah I should clarify, I think option 4 there would be a very short term deal at an AAV close to the AAV Guerin is offering. I think something like 2 years at $5 million AAV could get it done. But is Guerin going to do that? He should, but you could say he should just sign Rossi to the deal he's asking for too.

There's just no way Rossi gives up that much money to take Guerin's offer. That's the AAV of a bridge deal for Rossi, not a long-term deal.

I think he's much more likely to do that than the long-term thing. He can trade Rossi every year of his bridge deal if he wants.

I agree that it's not a good deal for Rossi. But you never know what might happen when/if he's staring down $25M or $0M.

 

[57special]

Both AFP Analytics and Evolving Hockey have Rossi and Peterka with near identical value. Peterka's better production is offset by his his positional value compared to Rossi, as well as his awful defensive stats. Seems like some Pens fans on here don't know what they are talking about.

 

[Hockeyfan200]

And the report today was that Rossi's ask was way too much for what Guerin wants to pay. He already lowballed him with an offer earlier in the year when he offered that 5 year, $5 million AAV deal.

Your choices are:

1. Trade him for the best return, which is almost definitely going to be futures.
2. Give Rossi the 7 year, $7 million AAV deal he's asking for, which Guerin doesn't want to pay and was massively far off from in his last offer.
3. Have Rossi sit out.

You really don't have the leverage you think you do, mostly because of how Guerin seems to view Rossi.

a Philly fan / blogger whose lies and spout bs doesn't mean it's true. Even Philly fans, if you read their forum, say it's a lie

 

[Gurglesons]

Both AFP Analytics and Evolving Hockey have Rossi and Peterka with near identical value. Peterka's better production is offset by his his positional value compared to Rossi, as well as his awful defensive stats. Seems like some Pens fans on here don't know what they are talking about.

I guess we will just wait and see what Rossi returns if moved.

There's a reason there is legitimately not a single center his size in the league.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

So getting a 1st from an offersheet would be okay but futures via a trade are somehow unacceptable? What if it's someone like Carolina doing that offersheet? Are you happy with Carolina's late 1st and 3rd?

You seem to be making this about the Penguins when I'm talking about Rossi's value broadly. Minnesota doesn't have the leverage to be demanding good NHL players for Rossi's RFA rights. Teams don't trade those kind of pieces for RFAs who want big deals, it just doesn't happen. Now add on how Guerin doesn't seem to like him and doesn't want to pay him what he's asking for and Minnesota's leverage gets even worse.

I would much rather have an extra unprotected 2026 1st if my hand was forced via offersheet. The 2025 draft sucks. Btw, Carolina can’t do an offersheet in the 1st+3rd range. Most of the teams that can do the 1st+3rd offersheet would be risking a serious chance at McKenna.

You blabbing on and on about other teams trading RFAs for picks does not make the situation true for Minnesota.

You know what’s crazy? Thinking that the Wild’s 5x5 proposal and Rossi’s 7x7 proposal can’t just meet in the middle at 6x6 with everyone being happy.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I would much rather have an extra unprotected 2026 1st if my hand was forced via offersheet. The 2025 draft sucks. Btw, Carolina can’t do an offersheet in the 1st+3rd range. Most of the teams that can do the 1st+3rd offersheet would be risking a serious chance at McKenna.

You blabbing on and on about other teams trading RFAs for picks does not make the situation true for Minnesota.

You know what’s crazy? Thinking that the Wild’s 5x5 proposal and Rossi’s 7x7 proposal can’t just meet in the middle at 6x6 with everyone being happy.

Okay you're right, Minnesota will somehow manage to do something that literally no other team has managed to do. It is absolute lunacy for me to suggest that Minnesota will have to abide by the NHL trade market when making trades, they'll be able to get the moon for Rossi simply because you're a fan of them and you think they'll get it.

Then when Rossi actually gets moved for the same return that RFAs without contracts always get moved for, you can be shocked when Rossi doesn't have nearly the kind of value you thought he had.

 

[Boxscore]

We need top six centers, not bottom six centers

Then why not lock up Rossi long-term?

I don't see the Flyers doing anything more than kicking tires unless:

1. The trade price is Cates and the Oilers 1st in 2025, nothing more.
2. Rossi is willing to extend for 5-6 years at no more than 5.75 mil.

The Flyers have a long-term plan, and I doubt it includes mortgaging the farm for a 5-9 center whose career high is 14 points more than Morgan Frost (at the same age of 23), and he's looking for a 7-year commitment at 7 mil a pop. Zero chance Briere does that, imho.

 

[AKL]

Then why not lock up Rossi long-term?

Hell if I know, our GM has his own plans

 

[ctmagic]

That would be my belief as well, but with the amount of teams & bloggers I've seen saying they should jump on making the trade happen is significant. I think he'll fetch far more than the majority HFBoards knobs do.

Only takes one team.

 

[Hockeyfan200]

Then why not lock up Rossi long-term?

I don't see the Flyers doing anything more than kicking tires unless:

1. The trade price is Cates and the Oilers 1st in 2025, nothing more.
2. Rossi is willing to extend for 5-6 years at no more than 5.75 mil.

The Flyers have a long-term plan, and I doubt it includes mortgaging the farm for a 5-9 center whose career high is 14 points more than Morgan Frost (at the same age of 23), and he's looking for a 7-year commitment at 7 mil a pop. Zero chance Briere does that, imho.

Cates is not a need and wild don't need a 3c or a freaking late 1st. wild aren't interested in that. Imagine thinking a philly blogger would know jack squat about what wild are looking for.

 

[KaprizovSaveUs]

I think people aren’t familiar with cates game. I wouldn’t want him to be the center of a Rossi trade but he’s really good.

 

[FlyguyOX]

I think people aren’t familiar with cates game. I wouldn’t want him to be the center of a Rossi trade but he’s really good.

Yep. Criminally underrated around here. EDM offered a 1st for him last summer