Speculation: *Rifai vs. Liljegren. It's a thing and it's happening.

[thusk]

A good defensive player gets a D zone start, wins the puck back, moves it up ice, and gets 1 or more offensive zone starts hemming in the players he was tasked to shut down. A bad defensive player gets a D zone start and fails to win possession or clear the puck clean, when he ices it or allows a shot on goal he’s stuck for another D zone faceoff that isn’t happening because his coach trusts him.

I’m not arguing Liljegren is better on D but raw zone starts are a bad measure of who the coach trusts defensively, guys like Polak were used defensively but would end up with extreme zone start skews because of their own bad decisions forcing them to be on the ice for 4 or 5 D zone faceoffs in a row. The coach only intended for them to get the first one, the other 3 or 4 are off repeat icings. If this impacts your stats, that’s largely your own fault. Get better at clearing the puck and holding the offensive line.

1- I never talk about coach trust...

2- Whatever what you want, starting more in defensive faceoff will put on spot to make mistake and looking bad at the end. Yes good shutdown D will find way to get out puck more easily but that's change nothing in what i said...

and its pretty hard to look bad in Def when you dont have to defend the first 20-45 second of your shift.

3- Yes icing or whatever can raise number of defensive faceoff but it was not the reason why Benoit. The main shutdown pair was mccabe/benoit. Theyvwas the 2 player started the most in defensive end because they was the 2 guy Keefe wanted there and nothing else.

 

[ULF_55]

With one preseason game to go, my D would look like this on opening night:

Rielly - Tanev
OEL - McCabe
Benoit - Liljegren
Timmins
Hakanpaa (LTIR)

I'd send everyone else to the Marlies. I do like Rifai, and others like Myers have looked good too, but I do believe this is likely a classic example of vets trying to get ready for the season (unscathed) vs AHLers fighting to try to make the team. I think the team will prioritize RHD. I really don't see them moving Liljegren based on preseason performance.

Yes, people will say they understand it is preseason and then pretend the results are more important than a previous full season of NHL play against NHL teams.

Like last night, that was not a Leafs NHL team, but it beat a Wings NHL team.

As I suggested run those 2 line-up again in a month and do we expect the same result? I don't!

 

[RoadWarrior]

Timmins IMO has outplayed Liljegren at the moment. My only concern with Timmins is his injury history, guy can’t stay healthy at all. Other than that, I’ve actually been impressed with Timmins “trying” to be a little more physical, something I thought we’d see and hear from Liljegren with Berube as the new head coach.

I’d be fine with trading Liljegren for a centerman like Frost or Hayton and rotating Timmins/Hakanpaa as the 6th. Rafai and Myers have also looked pretty good.

It looks like they’re going to try Nylander at centre to start things off. If that fails then a trade is a very real possibility. However the love affair with Rifai will end when he gives the puck away under pressure when facing faster nhl forecheckers. There’s no evidence Rifai can reliably move the puck up the ice.

 

[TMLAM34]

It looks like they’re going to try Nylander at centre to start things off. If that fails then a trade is a very real possibility. However the love affair with Rifai will end when he gives the puck away under pressure when facing faster nhl forecheckers. There’s no evidence Rifai can reliably move the puck up the ice.

There’s also really no evidence Rifai can’t move the puck up the ice.

 

[hockeywiz542]

How Marshall Rifai is making a name for himself and a tough decision for the Maple Leafs

Marshall Rifai is on the bubble of players vying to make the Leafs on opening night. If he doesn’t, he could be claimed by another NHL club.

www.thestar.com

To be sent down to the Marlies, Rifai would have to go through waivers first and he could be claimed by another NHL team. That makes the Leafs’ decision a bit more complicated.

“He’s very involved out there. He keeps the game simple,” Leafs head coach Craig Berube said. “That’s his game. He’s hard to play against.”

The 26-year-old has taken an unconventional path to the Leafs, beginning when he elected to go to Hotchkiss School, a prep school in Connecticut, instead of playing major junior hockey.

Rifai played his first NHL game with the Leafs in February, when the team was in need of bodies on the back end with Morgan Rielly serving a five-game suspension and Mark Giordano mourning the death of his father.

Rifai immediately told his parents he would be in the lineup and prepared for puck drop at 11 a.m. in St. Louis the following day. His parents made the trek down to Enterprise Centre just in time to catch a glimpse of their son’s NHL debut.

“I didn’t have much time to think, which I think was good,” said Rifai, who had three hits and one shot in 11 minutes and 53 seconds in the Leafs’ 4-2 win over the Blues.

Rifai only made one more appearance with the Leafs, but that didn’t mean management lost faith in him as a player. The Leafs signed him to a two-year deal worth $775,000 (U.S.) annually.

“I try to have the same approach,” he said. “I’m not scoring big goals or anything like that. I try to keep my head down and go to work every day.”

Rifai still thinks he has a lot to prove, but he’s made his goals clear throughout training camp. He wants to help the team in any way, whether it’s with smooth skating or a physical edge. It is “his aggressiveness (and) his physicality as a defenceman” that has impressed Berube.

Regardless of which Toronto team he suits up for to start the season, his mindset remains unchanged.

“I need to improve from now until the end of the season,” Rifai said. “I’ve just got to continue to take steps the way I have over the past few years.”

 

[robertmac43]

At the end of this year Lily will be 26...

We know what this guy is and it's mid... Time to move on and free up that space.

 

[RoadWarrior]

At the end of this year Lily will be 26...

We know what this guy is and it's mid... Time to move on and free up that space.

Rifai doesn’t move the puck and will choke offense. Most D men don’t mature until they’re close to 30. Giordano won the Norris at 35.

 

[ULF_55]

At the end of this year Lily will be 26...

We know what this guy is and it's mid... Time to move on and free up that space.

And Rifai will be 27.

 

[RoadWarrior]

6. Hakanpaa
7. Benoit
8. Rafai
9. Timmins
10. Myers
11. Nimela
12. Webber

The leafs have some nice depth on the Marlies in case of injury

Timmins isn’t 9th on the depth chart. He’s probably 6 or 7.

 

[RoadWarrior]

And Rifai will be 27.

There’s also really no evidence Rifai can’t move the puck up the ice.

His lack of offensive production at the AHL level suggests otherwise. He’s not a great skater or puck mover. Tough in front of the net and on the PK sure but a zero beyond the blue line.

 

[thusk]

for what i saw

Rielly
tanev
mccabe
oel
Benoit

look like lock player

Liljegren
timmins
Hakanppa
Rifai
Myers

fighting for 2 remaining.

But everything is against lilly... if he dont win it, leafs absolutly need to trade him... Even if he win this spot, do you really want to pay 3M for a 6th dman?

 

[tmlfan98]

How Marshall Rifai is making a name for himself and a tough decision for the Maple Leafs

Marshall Rifai is on the bubble of players vying to make the Leafs on opening night. If he doesn’t, he could be claimed by another NHL club.

www.thestar.com

To be sent down to the Marlies, Rifai would have to go through waivers first and he could be claimed by another NHL team. That makes the Leafs’ decision a bit more complicated.

“He’s very involved out there. He keeps the game simple,” Leafs head coach Craig Berube said. “That’s his game. He’s hard to play against.”

The 26-year-old has taken an unconventional path to the Leafs, beginning when he elected to go to Hotchkiss School, a prep school in Connecticut, instead of playing major junior hockey.

Rifai played his first NHL game with the Leafs in February, when the team was in need of bodies on the back end with Morgan Rielly serving a five-game suspension and Mark Giordano mourning the death of his father.

Rifai immediately told his parents he would be in the lineup and prepared for puck drop at 11 a.m. in St. Louis the following day. His parents made the trek down to Enterprise Centre just in time to catch a glimpse of their son’s NHL debut.

“I didn’t have much time to think, which I think was good,” said Rifai, who had three hits and one shot in 11 minutes and 53 seconds in the Leafs’ 4-2 win over the Blues.

Rifai only made one more appearance with the Leafs, but that didn’t mean management lost faith in him as a player. The Leafs signed him to a two-year deal worth $775,000 (U.S.) annually.

“I try to have the same approach,” he said. “I’m not scoring big goals or anything like that. I try to keep my head down and go to work every day.”

Rifai still thinks he has a lot to prove, but he’s made his goals clear throughout training camp. He wants to help the team in any way, whether it’s with smooth skating or a physical edge. It is “his aggressiveness (and) his physicality as a defenceman” that has impressed Berube.

Regardless of which Toronto team he suits up for to start the season, his mindset remains unchanged.

“I need to improve from now until the end of the season,” Rifai said. “I’ve just got to continue to take steps the way I have over the past few years.”

Seems like Rifai is definitely making this team over Timmins.

 

[darrylsittler27]

You won't get much for a $3 mil 6th dman.The Leafs routinely overspend in the wrong places. We need another C but Jarnkrok. Kampf and Liljegren eat up all that cap. Politics says Liljegren and pray Berube can salvage him.

 

[notbias]

for what i saw

Rielly
tanev
mccabe
oel
Benoit

look like lock player

Liljegren
timmins
Hakanppa
Rifai
Myers

fighting for 2 remaining.

But everything is against lilly... if he dont win it, leafs absolutly need to trade him... Even if he win this spot, do you really want to pay 3M for a 6th dman?

In what world is Benoit a lock and Liljegren not? Both looked bad in the playoffs, both looked bad in the preseason.

 

[thusk]

In what world is Benoit a lock and Liljegren not? Both looked bad in the playoffs, both looked bad in the preseason.

You're probabky the only person i ever heard talking about Benoit being bad in playoff last year, not only in this forum...but go ahead if you're think you've the only one right...

 

[notbias]

You're probabky the only person i ever heard talking about Benoit being bad in playoff last year, not only in this forum...but go ahead if you're think you've the only one right...

I mean anyone who thought he was good liked his effort and must have missed his play.

There is nothing to support him being good.

 

[Nineteen67]

You're probabky the only person i ever heard talking about Benoit being bad in playoff last year, not only in this forum...but go ahead if you're think you've the only one right...

Neither are great players, but Benoit brings a different element that Liljegren doesn’t. That bothers some people, I suppose.

It’s too bad the GM forgot there was a salary cap when they signed Liljegren. Otherwise tgey might be able to trade him.

 

[thusk]

[QUE="notbias, post: 196924642, member: 282459"]
I mean anyone who thought he was good liked his effort and must have missed his play.

There is nothing to support him being good.
[/QUOTE]



Its a depht D who played ask to play like a top 3 D in NHL and playing like tanev will do this season. You just can't expect he will play like Tanev, its unrealistic

 

[thusk]

Neither are great players, but Benoit brings a different element that Liljegren doesn’t. That bothers some people, I suppose.

It’s too bad the GM forgot there was a salary cap when they signed Liljegren. Otherwise tgey might be able to trade him.

The moment he signed, i tought it was a mistake but if they can repair it right now by moving him before he bevoming a cap dump. it will be fine

For Benoit vs liljegren for me its starting by we know exactly what Benoit will bring game after game. He steady and why he can be trust. Liljegren is completly the reverse, can look lije an elite D 1 game and like an ahlers next 3... so its pretty hard to trust him because you're never know how he will play.

 

[ULF_55]

The moment he signed, i tought it was a mistake but if they can repair it right now by moving him before he bevoming a cap dump. it will be fine

For Benoit vs liljegren for me its starting by we know exactly what Benoit will bring game after game. He steady and why he can be trust. Liljegren is completly the reverse, can look lije an elite D 1 game and like an ahlers next 3... so its pretty hard to trust him because you're never know how he will play.

The only untouchables are McDavid, Markar, Hellebuyck/Sheshterkin ... so if moving _Leafs_Player_ can make the team better do it.

 

[Roo]

Neither are great players, but Benoit brings a different element that Liljegren doesn’t. That bothers some people, I suppose.

It’s too bad the GM forgot there was a salary cap when they signed Liljegren. Otherwise tgey might be able to trade him.

And Liljegren brings something Benoit doesn’t too, skill. Benoit was a welcome surprise last year, but is a dime a dozen player. Sure, Liljegren hasn’t been consistent, but has upside and isn’t worth giving up on - but he likely is nearing the end of his rope.

And on the cap, you can probably look up what Edmundson and Boosh got paid. Yes, they were UFAs, but also got term in their 30s. You can get players like them for picks any time any the deadline.

Doubt this is about Liljegren vs Benoit though. I believe Rifai is competing for Benoit's spot, and Timmins competing for Liljegren's spot. If Timmins can take the next step many of us believe he can, it can definitely leave Liljegren on the outside looking in.

 

[Machinae]

The Liljegren signing, to me, looked like a panic play. It honestly seemed like Tanev was going to stiff the Leafs as he remained unsigned until free agency started.. Then management had to bend over backwards and give him 6 years and an NMC.

Or maybe it was after they found out they were out on Roy, so they decided to settle for OEL at a cheaper ticket and bring back Liljegren as a right shot..

Either way, I believe if they had Tanev locked up before UFA began and had a good idea that they were getting Roy when UFA began, they wouldn't have even qualified Liljegren.

With that said.. clearing his cap space allows them to keep BOTH Rifai and Timmins, who are both in danger of being claimed off of waivers (Timmins a virtual lock to get claimed).

Coaches love running an 8th D over a 14th F, and the Leafs' depth is the best it has been in a long time.

 

[ULF_55]

The Liljegren signing, to me, looked like a panic play. It honestly seemed like Tanev was going to stiff the Leafs as he remained unsigned until free agency started.. Then management had to bend over backwards and give him 6 years and an NMC.

Or maybe it was after they found out they were out on Roy, so they decided to settle for OEL at a cheaper ticket and bring back Liljegren as a right shot..

Either way, I believe if they had Tanev locked up before UFA began and had a good idea that they were getting Roy when UFA began, they wouldn't have even qualified Liljegren.

With that said.. clearing his cap space allows them to keep BOTH Rifai and Timmins, who are both in danger of being claimed off of waivers (Timmins a virtual lock to get claimed).

Coaches love running an 8th D over a 14th F, and the Leafs' depth is the best it has been in a long time.

Leafs might even make a claim in waivers if there is a better player waived.

Have to wait and see who is available.

Reality check:

It isn't like the Leafs defense is loaded with top end defenders.

The worry is losing a 3rd. pairing defender Rifai/Timmins / potential 2nd. pairing defender Liljegren.

Treliving with Berube will make a call and roll the dice.

 

[robertmac43]

And Rifai will be 27.

I don't think Rifai is the answer either. Better defensively but doesn't move the needle.

I was just alluding to lily being done here. 3 million for a guy that is marginally better then some of the D lower in the lineup is too much. He's had chances, he's gotten some pay raises, when are we going to see the results to match from him?

 

[Its not your fault]

Over 5 years he's played 91 games.

We all wish that he can keep that up as a full time NHL player.

View attachment 912014

Next Justin Holl?

View attachment 912013

Judging by that you would reckon one teams defense is alot better then another if their stats dropped off that much. However he's probably struggling to play the role he should have always been playing even with us. 16 17 minutes a night more if someone is injured or having a hot night or someone that's on the power play is in the box.

Remember this Leafs team was one to not get a 2 man advantage until the last couple games.