Speculation: *Rifai vs. Liljegren. It's a thing and it's happening.

[Roo]

Those two would be my #7 and 8 dmen.

Who are 5 & 6? Timmins has looked good too

 

[TMLAM34]

Who are 5 & 6? Timmins has looked good too

My only issue with Timmins is that he can’t stay healthy.

Rielly - Tanev
Benoit - McCabe
OEL - Hakanpaa
Rafai - Myers

Would be my group if everyone was healthy. I’d look at moving Liljegren in a deal for a center like Frost or Hayton.

 

[Roo]

I could certainly be wrong, but I doubt they would move Liljegren off for journeymen AHLers. Esp based on preseason performance.

Definitely the most intriguing part of camp.

 

[TMLAM34]

Wild side note - if you were to free up Liljegren’s salary, it’s almost dead even with Hakanpaa’s, Rafai’s AND Myers’ salary combined…

 

[thusk]

The zone starts is so misleading... you can use it as a coach not trusting him, but he starts 1 more shift out of 10 in the offensive zone than our defensive pairing.

Zone starts is overrated because 70% of the starts are on the fly.

Benoit started once every 20 shift in offensive start and 1 every 5 shift in defensive start.

Yes most of the time player start on the fly but when they started in defensive... The chance to play the next 20-30-45-60 second in your territory are pretty high and he did it most of the time against top opponent weapon.

Unstead of playing exemple
36,7 % of time in offensive end
36,7% in neutral zone
36,7% in defensive zone

Just the fact to start as much in defensive end is enough to result exemple

27% in offensive end
37 in neutral zone
47% in defensive zone

So yes at the end that's making a pretty huge difference on stats even if 65% of starts come on the rush

 

[notbias]

Benoit started once every 20 shift in offensive faceoff and 1 every 5 shift in defensive faceoff.

Yes most of the time player start on the fly but when they started in defensive... The chance to play the next 20-30-45-60 second in your territory are pretty high and he did it most of the time against top opponent weapon.

Unstead of playing exemple
36,7 % of time in offensive end
36,7% in neutral zone
36,7% in defensive zone

Just the fact to start as much in defensive end will result exemple

27% in offensive end
37 in neutral zone
47% in defensive zone

So yes at the end that's making a pretty huge difference on stats even if 65% of starts come on the rush

For every 10 shift Benoit started one more than Liljegren in the defensive zone... that's the difference.

 

[thusk]

For every 10 shift Benoit started one more than Liljegren in the defensive zone... that's the difference.

liljegren started once every 5 shift in the offensive end and once every 10 shift in defensive end...

Liljegren started 4X more in the offensive end and 2X less in defensive end

 

[Its not your fault]

luligren is signed 3m or someting crazy like that Tre overpayment sttyle

Believe it or not Marshall Rifai cap hit is 1.5 so you get the same amount of relief sending either one down.

 

[Martin Skoula]

liljegren started once every 5 shift in the offensive end and once every 10 shift in defensive end...

Liljegren started 4X more in the offensive end and 2X less in defensive end

4x a small number is irrelevant if the majority are neutral starts. Zone starts aren’t that useful unless you cancel out sequential starts. If you take a D zone start and ice the puck 3 times, you get 4 D zone starts but it’s not because the coach trusts you for being elite defensively, it’s because you suck at clearing the zone and aren’t allowed changing until you do. Likewise if you take an O zone start, support the cycle and get a frozen shot on net, and stay on for another offensive zone start - you’re not getting sheltered you’re just doing your job in the o zone correctly.

The perfect defensive player would get 1 defensive zone faceoff and follow it up with 3 offensive zone faceoffs and one at center ice.

 

[jaric1862]

If we trade Liljergren we are awfully thin on Defence. Don’t see it.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Benoit and Hakanpaa are both lousy puck movers, if Rifai replaces someone it is likely one of those two.

I don't understand some of the moves we made, we have so many repetitive positions or barely upgraded at positions, it feels like moves were made to make moves, not because it improved the team.

They probably could have used some of that wasted cap on depth to upgrade some other spots.

Benoit is better than Rifai in most of the defensive intangibles. Haakinpaa might never play again.

 

[tokyoite]

I would be surprise if timothy is traded before the opening day.

 

[RoadWarrior]

I would be surprise if timothy is traded before the opening day.

He only gets traded if they are desperate for cap space. Otherwise he’s ahead of Rifai who might actually clear waivers unlike Liljegren. I would say Connor Timmins is the actual competition for Lilly. Right now they are very close. Both bottom pairing guys at even strength but can work a second PP unit.

 

[thusk]

4x a small number is irrelevant if the majority are neutral starts. Zone starts aren’t that useful unless you cancel out sequential starts. If you take a D zone start and ice the puck 3 times, you get 4 D zone starts but it’s not because the coach trusts you for being elite defensively, it’s because you suck at clearing the zone and aren’t allowed changing until you do. Likewise if you take an O zone start, support the cycle and get a frozen shot on net, and stay on for another offensive zone start - you’re not getting sheltered you’re just doing your job in the o zone correctly.

The perfect defensive player would get 1 defensive zone faceoff and follow it up with 3 offensive zone faceoffs and one at center ice.

1-not the perfect defensive player... most of 2 way D would be close of 50/50... an unidimentionnal offensive dman will get more offensive start and shutdown D will start much more in defensive end (exemple it wqs the same story with Tanev last year in Dallas)

2- you're entierly missed the point... The fact they are starting more in defensive side or offensive side will affect stats of every D.

If you've got more start andplaying more in offensive , sure that will help to raise your offensive and defensive stats( because you don't need to defend when you've got the puck in the offensive end) the same if you're defending most of the time, that will affect your stats negatively on both side for the same exact reason.

and yes liljegren are better offensively but Benoit clearly better than Liljegren in the defensive side and both are not even close... but at the end that change absolutly nothing on this discussion