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Player Discussion Rick Nash

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rick nash beast mode is basically this.

1. try hard. generate chances. produce nothing.
2. look upset and frustrated while sticking mouth guard out and looking at screen overhead.
3. continual accolades from msg sycophants who are serving your choice of koolaide
4. excuse machine reving into high gear churning out stock (BS) reasons for rick nash being " one of the most important players on the team"....
5. hockey fan using "eye test" to determine that rick nash is simply an awful player at 8 mil or 6 mil or 5 mil or......
6. guys like carey and nieves and now with first name vinnie out producing nash at half the minutes.

any questions ?
 
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offdacrossbar said:
rick nash beast mode is basically this.

1. try hard. generate chances. produce nothing.
2. look upset and frustrated while sticking mouth guard out and looking at screen overhead.
3. continual accolades from msg sycophants who are serving your choice of koolaide
4. excuse machine reving into high gear churning out stock (BS) reasons for rick nash being " one of the most important players on the team"....
5. hockey fan using "eye test" to determine that rick nash is simply an awful player at 8 mil or 6 mil or 5 mil or......
6. guys like carey and nieves and now with first name vinnie out producing nash at half the minutes.

any questions ?
Click to expand...
Testify.
 
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True Blue said:
He has scored over 25 goals twice and disappeared when the team needed goals the most.
Click to expand...

Since he joined the Rangers in 12-13, his 5v5 league ranks are:

13th in goals
3rd in goals per 60 among qualified forwards (at least 82gp over this entire timeframe)

You have beef with his goal scoring in the playoffs? Fine, that's a fine argument to make. But to say you've been disappointed with Nash's entire tenure as a Ranger is just baffling.
 
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silverfish said:
You have beef with his goal scoring in the playoffs? Fine, that's a fine argument to make. But to say you've been disappointed with Nash's entire tenure as a Ranger is just baffling.
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To me he was brought here to score big goals. Something he has never done. So yes, his failure in the playoffs weigh very heavily in the analysis.

And you can quote as many /60 extrapolated stats you want. That does not change the fact that scored more than 25 goals just twice. Lump that in with being an abject failure in the playoffs scoring wise, his contract size and the fact that he was brought here to be the team's most important forward, yeah I've been disappointed.
 
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True Blue said:
Overall, Nash's tenure with NYR has been a disappointment to me. Others can have their opinion, but this is mine. He has scored over 25 goals twice and disappeared when the team needed goals the most. Yes, the two way play was very good, but he was brought here to score goals and score them in big spots.
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He's been more of a success in the regular season, scoring 115 goals in 313 games, which is 25th in the league over that span despite missing quite a few regular season games.

Less so in the playoffs. His first two playoff years were marred by concussion issues, including the cup run. People can be angry at him for getting hurt, or pretend he wasn't hurt, (which seems to be a recurring theme in these threads and is... bizarre to say the least) but that doesn't really change anything. After that he was our best forward for a lot of 2015, 2016 and the first series of 2017. Then he disappeared against Ottawa. He's usually been impactful if he's healthy but he hasn't been healthy enough. Overall he's been up and down.

Reality is he's probably somewhere between success and failure. I go back and forth on whether I would still do that trade. I still think he if he was healthy in 2014 (or at least part of our defense was healthy in 2015) we win a cup.
 
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Nash has had good "stats" but has never been what everyone thought he would be....the difference maker. He's had great starts only to disappear as playoff time approaches. He's never been clutch. You give up the likes of Dubi, Anisimov, and more, you expect a crunch time player.

In My opinion, that spells failure. (To be fair -- I always felt he was damaged goods when we got him.)
 
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Regular season

Nash scored 37 goals in 61 consecutive games in 14-15 = ~49 goal pace per 82 games.

Kind of skews his Ranger tenure goal stats as in his other 296 games he has 99 goals = ~27 goal
pace per 82 games
 
silverfish said:
Since he joined the Rangers in 12-13, his 5v5 league ranks are:

13th in goals
3rd in goals per 60 among qualified forwards (at least 82gp over this entire timeframe)

You have beef with his goal scoring in the playoffs? Fine, that's a fine argument to make. But to say you've been disappointed with Nash's entire tenure as a Ranger is just baffling.
Click to expand...

You think it’s baffling that someone could feasibly be disappointed with Rick Nash’s tenure as a Ranger? THAT is baffling.

It’s nice that we can take some data extrapolation and say he ranks here or there in this certain category of qualified players under this specific metric but if you can’t see why making a big trade for a guy who makes 8M a year who goes on to have:

39, 69, 36, 38 and is on pace for 34 points
over his last 5 seasons

Could be disappointing to people, that’s baffling. Traded for a guy who had broken 30 goals 7 times when we acquired him, having broken that streak by scoring 27 once during an 8 year stretch. He broke 30 goals for us once. Yes, he was on pace to do so three times, but whether it was health robbing him of a couple more 30 goal seasons earlier in his NYR tenure or his sharp decline in production later in his tenure (three straight seasons of 36, 38, ~34 points), Rangers fans have every right and reason to be disappointed by Rick Nash’s time with the team.

Would you say he met or exceeded expectations as a Ranger? That would be a lot more baffling to me than saying he was a disappointment.
 
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So disappointing.



Not at all what we thought we traded for. I definitely thought we were getting an elite goal scorer when we made that trade. Doesn't seem to be the case.

Too bad we can't use the fact that his TOI is dramatically lower than all the names around him because that would be EXTRAPOLATING.
 
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mjolnir13 said:
Nash has had good "stats" but has never been what everyone thought he would be....the difference maker. He's had great starts only to disappear as playoff time approaches. He's never been clutch. You give up the likes of Dubi, Anisimov, and more, you expect a crunch time player.

In My opinion, that spells failure. (To be fair -- I always felt he was damaged goods when we got him.)
Click to expand...

He's never been good in the playoffs except when he has been.
 
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mjolnir13 said:
Nash has had good "stats" but has never been what everyone thought he would be....the difference maker. He's had great starts only to disappear as playoff time approaches. He's never been clutch. You give up the likes of Dubi, Anisimov, and more, you expect a crunch time player.

In My opinion, that spells failure. (To be fair -- I always felt he was damaged goods when we got him.)
Click to expand...
Wait you had playoff clutch player expectations for a player with 4 play off games experience when he got to new york? Sounds like a you problem.
 
silverfish said:
So disappointing.



Not at all what we thought we traded for. I definitely thought we were getting an elite goal scorer when we made that trade. Doesn't seem to be the case.

Too bad we can't use the fact that his TOI is dramatically lower than all the names around him because that would be EXTRAPOLATING.
Click to expand...


How is life inside of that vacuum? Getting enough air? Rick Nash was a great goal scorer when we acquired him and has rapidly declined, in a disappointing fashion. Over his past 169 games as a Ranger he has scored 47 goals, or roughly 22 per 82 games. In that time he averages about 20 assists per 82 games. Are we not allowed to be disappointed by an 8M 20g/40p player these past three years because he scored 42 goals four years ago? Should we not be disappointed that he missed 17 games and didn’t even manage to break 40 points the year before that as well? Yes, he still had a great goal scoring season, but that’s four of the past 5 years you’ve paid a forward 8M to not even reach 40 points.

In his first 3 years as a Ranger he averaged 38.8 goals per 82 games. Of course, he has never played 82 games as a Ranger, so the only time he came near (and exceeded) that mark was the one time he managed to stay healthy for 79 games. In the following 3 years he averaged 22.8 goals per 82 games. Again, he never manages to play 82 games, so we don’t actually get those full 22 goals, just like we only once got those full 38 goals.

But it’s illogical to be disappointed with his severe drop in play at age 30, his consistent lack of health so that we never get a full season out of our 8M man or the fact that he only reached 40 points once in the past 5 years. Most of all, it’s illogical to be disappointed by what you see on the ice each year when you watch the games, because what your eyes tell you about Rick Nash (or any player) are irrelevant as long as someone on HF can pull out some statistic that says otherwise.
 
McRanger said:
He's never been good in the playoffs except when he has been.
Click to expand...
Going to hope that you and I do not go down this rabbit hole again, so I will state that this is simply my view. With NYR, 73 playoff games. 14 goals and 24 assists. Pretty pedestrian to me.
 
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silverfish said:
Imagine making a post that's full of stats, and then ending your post with:

"Most of all, it’s illogical to be disappointed by what you see on the ice each year when you watch the games, because what your eyes tell you about Rick Nash (or any player) are irrelevant as long as someone on HF can pull out some statistic that says otherwise."

And not seeing how hilarious that is.

Anyway, I'm done here.

Bye!
Click to expand...

Hey man don't knock life inside a vacuum.
 
SlapshotTheMovie said:
Wait you had playoff clutch player expectations for a player with 4 play off games experience when he got to new york? Sounds like a you problem.
Click to expand...
He was brought here to improve goal scoring, on the heals of getting bounced out of the playoffs while scoring very little. Yeah, I would say that the expectations were that he was brought here to score big goals.
 
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silverfish said:
Imagine making a post that's full of stats, and then ending your post with:

"Most of all, it’s illogical to be disappointed by what you see on the ice each year when you watch the games, because what your eyes tell you about Rick Nash (or any player) are irrelevant as long as someone on HF can pull out some statistic that says otherwise."

And not seeing how hilarious that is.

Anyway, I'm done here.

Bye!
Click to expand...

You seriously don’t see the elitist snobbery in your own dismissal here?

I and others claim to be disappointed by Nash. This initial claim is partially based on production but largely based on performance and our personal feelings about the player.

You claim that Rangers fans CAN’T (or at least shouldn’t) be disappointed in a guy who has not reached 40 points in four of the past five years... because he’s 13th in 5v5 goal scoring since 2012.

That’s a fairly selective stat.

In response to you using selective statistics to tell us how dumb/wrong we are to not have a favorable opinion of Nash’s time as a Ranger, I showed what his ACTUAL annual numbers have been during his tenure and demonstrate that they’ve declined SHARPLY over the past three years.

I then asked if we’re allowed to be disappointed by his steady decline, his inconsistent health or the fact that we paid him ~8M to reach 40 points once in the last five seasons. I also asked if it were okay if we’re simply disappointed because we aren’t satisfied with the player we watch game in and out, which returns us to the beginning of the conversation, when some of us expressed that we’d been disappointed by Nash and you proceeded to tell us that we’re wrong because stat X says so.

Your response isn’t to consider anything I’ve said but to be dismissive. Okay. I’ve got nothing further either than.
 
True Blue said:
Going to hope that you and I do not go down this rabbit hole again, so I will state that this is simply my view. With NYR, 73 playoff games. 14 goals and 24 assists. Pretty pedestrian to me.
Click to expand...

It is. It absolutely is.

But more than half of those games were played in the year and a half span where he had 3 concussions. And pretending thats not the case doesn't make it so.

Which is why its fine to call him a disappointment (him being massively injury prone, especially during critical times is nothing if not disappointing) but its idiotic to keep repeating over and over and over that Nash can't perform in the playoffs.

The HERP DERP HES NOT CLUTCH nonsense really needs to stop.

Like I said I go back and forth about whether I would still pull the trigger on that deal.
 
McRanger said:
It is. It absolutely is.

But more than half of those games were played in the year and a half span where he had 3 concussions. And pretending thats not the case doesn't make it so.

Which is why its fine to call him a disappointment (him being massively injury prone, especially during critical times is nothing if not disappointing) but its idiotic to keep repeating over and over and over that Nash can't perform in the playoffs.

The HERP DERP HES NOT CLUTCH nonsense really needs to stop.

Like I said I go back and forth about whether I would still pull the trigger on that deal.
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How is it nonsense? He's been a big fact ZERO in the playoffs - isn't that when elite players are supposed to rise above the rest? Maybe I missed something, but I certainly do not recall Rick Nash performing like an elite player in the playoffs -- concussed or not.
 
True Blue said:
Overall, Nash's tenure with NYR has been a disappointment to me. Others can have their opinion, but this is mine. He has scored over 25 goals twice and disappeared when the team needed goals the most. Yes, the two way play was very good, but he was brought here to score goals and score them in big spots.
Click to expand...
Can't say I disagree. He tries hard but his beast mode scoring days were nearly behind him when he was traded here and he never produced the type of points a player of his caliper was supposed to in the playoffs. I don't hate the guy. He is very likable because he has and continues to play hard. You have to wonder if all the concussions factored into his very slow, but steady decline. If the Rangers can trade him for a couple of picks at the deadline they should.
 
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Going to hope that you and I do not go down this rabbit hole again, so I will state that this is simply my view. With NYR, 73 playoff games. 14 goals and 24 assists. Pretty pedestrian to me.​
For a player with Nash's pedigree and salary, that is awful.


LeetchisGod said:
For a player with Nash's pedigree and salary, that is awful.
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One thing that sticks out about those numbers is that combined points are very similar what Nash has been putting up point wise since he was traded here. That's not the type of numbers a guy like him should be putting up. Injuries are what they are and they happen but that's only part of the equation.
 
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