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Re sign Suter?

Dodoooo

  • Yes

    Votes: 55 91.7%

  • No

    Votes: 5 8.3%
  • Total voters
    60
My question is how do you improve this roster if you bring Suter back at $3.5m+?

We've got 12 forwards, 6 dmen, 2 goalies currently on the roster and signed for next year with about $14m to add 3 pieces.

Assuming we go 8 dmen (this math includes Junior and Mancini), I can see Forbort and a vet RHD costing say $3m.

This roster has Karlsson and Aman as 12-13th forwards, so you could spend a bit to upgrade those spots, but assuming those slots remain minimum wagers (also have Lekkerimaki on an ELC...not certain he is ready next year) that leaves around $11m for upgrading the forwards. You can haggle over waiving g Aman or going with 7 d, but the numbers don't change a ton.

So yes, there's room to pay Suter $3.5m and still add a $8m or so forward. But the thing is, bringing Suter back doesn't make us a better team. He keeps us the same. And other than Boeser, there's no other roster spots that come open to be upgraded. And I think both slots NEED upgrading if we are going to improve the roster.

Suter is a great piece. Can play anywhere in the top 12, high end PKer, some PP utility, some skill, and IQ to burn.

But he's also smallish, non-physical, slow, limited offensively, mid at FOs, and LHed. These are all areas I'd like to see improved, and don't think paying 2x the cap hit to bring back these elements is how to use one of our limited roster moves.
 
alternate said:
My question is how do you improve this roster if you bring Suter back at $3.5m+?

We've got 12 forwards, 6 dmen, 2 goalies currently on the roster and signed for next year with about $14m to add 3 pieces.

Assuming we go 8 dmen (this math includes Junior and Mancini), I can see Forbort and a vet RHD costing say $3m.

This roster has Karlsson and Aman as 12-13th forwards, so you could spend a bit to upgrade those spots, but assuming those slots remain minimum wagers (also have Lekkerimaki on an ELC...not certain he is ready next year) that leaves around $11m for upgrading the forwards. You can haggle over waiving g Aman or going with 7 d, but the numbers don't change a ton.

So yes, there's room to pay Suter $3.5m and still add a $8m or so forward. But the thing is, bringing Suter back doesn't make us a better team. He keeps us the same. And other than Boeser, there's no other roster spots that come open to be upgraded. And I think both slots NEED upgrading if we are going to improve the roster.

Suter is a great piece. Can play anywhere in the top 12, high end PKer, some PP utility, some skill, and IQ to burn.

But he's also smallish, non-physical, slow, limited offensively, mid at FOs, and LHed. These are all areas I'd like to see improved, and don't think paying 2x the cap hit to bring back these elements is how to use one of our limited roster moves.
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We're not exactly flush with ELCs who are likely to play above their heads at forward. Can't really load up the Top 6 again because we'll just have too many guys who couldn't get more than a mil in the open market. For every Suter and Sherwood at 1.5, there's a Desharnais and Heinen at 2.

So someone like Suter is pretty important to retain, who has proved himself to contribute as a top 6'er in bursts and still be impactful if he has to get moved to make other lines work. Most likely we'll need not just to keep him, but to find 1-2 other forward at his level and try to make the puzzle pieces work.
 
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Jyrki said:
We're not exactly flush with ELCs who are likely to play above their heads at forward. Can't really load up the Top 6 again because we'll just have too many guys who couldn't get more than a mil in the open market. For every Suter and Sherwood at 1.5, there's a Desharnais and Heinen at 2.

So someone like Suter is pretty important to retain, who has proved himself to contribute as a top 6'er in bursts and still be impactful if he has to get moved to make other lines work. Most likely we'll need not just to keep him, but to find 1-2 other forward at his level and try to make the puzzle pieces work.
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I agree with this. I don't think anyone is advocating overpaying him but he leads the team in EVG with 17 and top among forwards in EVP. It's obviously a career year but as mentioned he brings other elements like penalty killer and he's been strong defensively even at C.


alternate said:
My question is how do you improve this roster if you bring Suter back at $3.5m+?
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Sometimes it's not about just improving the roster but not making it worse. Unless Allvin really is able to improve the C position, having swapped Miller out for Chytil should mean that we need someone filling in at C more often. Despite someone calling Suter a 5C, we have nobody on the roster or on the farm who can filling in at 2C as well as Suter.

There are other moves to make. Boeser is a UFA. Garland is a pending UFA. The two are significant salaries that do affect the makeup of the team. And it's not like we have wingers locked up beyond next year. The makeup of the team can easily change. Even if we decide to move on from Hoglander and or Joshua I think they can be moved without retaining salary or taking an undesirable contract back.
 
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4x4 is pretty reasonable for his production, position, and PK. He might be the best UFA centre option for us. Obviously depends what there is or what we foresee to be available on the trade market.
 
Earlier this year, I wouldn't have given it much chance that the Canucks would re-sign either Suter or Boeser.

The issue is though--where are you going to find better players on the UFA market? And I'm sure both guys desperately want to return to the Canucks.

But as always it comes down to money and term on their deals. But with the Cap going up--I wouldn't be too quick to walk away from either one.
 
it also depends what he wants for the next chapter of his career

does he want to be an overpaid vet in a scoring role higher than he should be on a bad team shepherding lottery picks along, like granlund in san jose or nyquist for a few years there?

does he want to be an overpaid complementary player, like palat in new jersey?

hard to imagine him in either role here. it’s a weird situation, like if on top of manny losing an eye, we traded kesler and henrik got hurt and higgins had a nice stretch sliding in as our de facto number one center.
 
For me, he's the main priority to re-sign this off season. We simply don't have anyone remotely as versatile. Now if it's a choice between Suter or Marner, we obviously pick the superstar. But if we're looking at another DeBrusk type "secondary" option, I'd rather sign Suter.

Looking at the UFA market just now, Suter is 10th in goals amongst upcoming UFAs, and 15th in points. Anything under 4M is a steal given the way he's playing right now.

My hope is we could convince him to take less actual dollars but pay it back in term. Somewhere in the low 3M range but stretched over 5-7 years. While that sounds steep now. With how the cap is soaring, it may end up being good fourth liner money in 6 years.
 
This season he has:

28 games of 18+ minutes (rounded):

19 points in those 28 games (56 points/82 games)

——

19 games of 19+ minutes (rounded):

16 points in those 19 games (70 points/82 games)

——

8 games of 20+ minutes (rounded):

8 points in those 8 games (82 points/82 games)

——

22 points in the 44 games where he played less than 18 minutes.

——

Is it possible that simply because of his profile (lack of size, wheels, pedigree etc…) that he’s fallen through the cracks and has a lot more to offer than he’s been given the chance to?


…he’s an 18 goal scorer per 82 games over his NHL career in a limited role for most of that time and rarely seeing ice with top end talent.

Can a team with Filip Chytil as its 2C afford to let Suter walk?

Yes, there’s bust potential paying a guy coming off a career season, but he just never disappoints.

Even in last years playoffs (I know his numbers were poor) I was continually pleasantly surprised by his game.

He’s seeing hard minutes right now, and instead of getting exposed (what we are seeing with Blueger as he has to play further up the lineup) Suter’s actually taken his game to another level (albeit in a very small sample size).
 
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kcunac said:
4x4 is pretty reasonable for his production, position, and PK. He might be the best UFA centre option for us. Obviously depends what there is or what we foresee to be available on the trade market.
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I think pre-cap increase, something like the Joshua deal (4 yrs, $3.25m per) was in the realm of possibility - probably a bit higher AAV. With the cap going up, I’m just not sure what that does to the hit. I’d think about $4.25 perhaps.
 
He's had a nice run but no lessons will be learned if we're paying 3rd liners $4-$5 million. Raty should be getting his roster spot and I think he could replace his offense as well if given proper ice time.
 
Cancuks said:
He's had a nice run but no lessons will be learned if we're paying 3rd liners $4-$5 million. Raty should be getting his roster spot and I think he could replace his offense as well if given proper ice time.
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I don’t think a successful team should be banking on a rookie. It Raty is ready for 3C then Suter would play top 6 W. he’s 5th in F scoring and 3rd in goals on an offense starved team that might be losing the #1 goal scorer. He’s also good at defense and PK.

Of course I’d also like to upgrade but to who? Centres are hard to come by and the UFAs suck
 
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IComeInPeace said:

Can a team with Filip Chytil as its 2C afford to let Suter walk?
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There's little to no chance that we don't obtain a 2c at some point.........management is obviously very aware this is a need and I'm very confident in them addressing it at some point in the next year.

Remember when a top 4 LHD was a massive priority? Took them a while but they finally addressed it with MP3. Same thing is gonna happen here - at some point they will spend some bullets and go and obtain another C -you can bank on that. I'm thinking something like Garland, a prospect (Mynio etc.) and a couple of draft pics (a 4th & 2nd or so?) could probably get that - people forget things can change in a hurry.

I think Suter is pricing himself out of Van.........he's a nice piece to have but anything much past 4.2 I think we should walk on. At that point our pro scouting can find the next Suter.....
 
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VancouverJagger said:
Remember when a top 4 LHD was a massive priority? Took them a while but they finally addressed it with MP3. Same thing is gonna happen here - at some point they will spend some bullets and go and obtain another C -you can bank on that. I'm thinking something like Garland, a prospect (Mynio etc.) and a couple of draft pics (a 4th & 2nd or so?) could probably get that - people forget things can change in a hurry.
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looking at the really high cost of our top four RD and LD adds, i fear that true 2C is just going to create another hole elsewhere in the lineup

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the magic bullet, as ever, is drafting/developing your own
 
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Could it be that Suter is actually a good option as a second line centre? He has been incredible with an increased role.
 
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