RD Zayne Parekh - Saginaw Spirit, OHL (2024, 9th, CGY)

[Zirakzigil]

I am doubtful he makes the Flames next season. He looked completely lost in the pre-season this year. Unless something drastically changes, hes going to need AHL seasoning. Sucks that hes blowing up the OHL, but his decision making without the puck was not close enough to even consider playing him. Flames management is not going to let him get destroyed by NHL forwards game in and game out.

 

[Captain Clutch]

I have a really tough time evaluating Parekh's NHL potential. Like everyone else, I am very very impressed by his offensive game. I just have a tough time visualizing how his game will translate to the NHL, I get the Ryan Merkley vibes from him. I know that's probably unfair but he's really going to need to learn how to defend in the pros and his game has a long way to go before he'll be able to do that.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I find it hilarious how so many get offended by the DeAngelo comparison. DeAngelo is like the average 9OA. That’s who he’s most similar to.

It’s possible Parekh could be better. Yes, you hope for Erik Karlsson or Cale Makar, but it’s also possible he could be worse. You could get Ryan Murphy or Ryan Merkley.

His average outcome certainly isn’t in another tier from DeAngelo, and whether people like it or not some of the off ice noise surrounding him does remind you of DeAngelo.

 

[DJJones]

Getting excited, if the biggest drawback people can come up with is some imagined defensive lacking on a teenager that is lapping his opponents. Giddy up.

Guys hockey IQ and skating are top notch. You can teach defense positioning. Personally I worry more about the 6'4 stay at home guys that dominate defensively at a young age. That advantage disappears in a hurry.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

I find it hilarious how so many get offended by the DeAngelo comparison. DeAngelo is like the average 9OA. That’s who he’s most similar to.

It’s possible Parekh could be better. Yes, you hope for Erik Karlsson or Cale Makar, but it’s also possible he could be worse. You could get Ryan Murphy or Ryan Merkley.

His average outcome certainly isn’t in another tier from DeAngelo, and whether people like it or not some of the off ice noise surrounding him does remind you of DeAngelo.

Because of how you are delivering the message. Statistically — Parekh scoring 11-36-47 per 82 games (Tony D’s #s) and needing some sheltering defensively is a fair median prediction that is probably better than an average 9th overall pick. But you didn’t say it like that.

no shit Flames fans don’t like you calling Parekh’s outcome DeAngelo when he had to go to Russia at age 29 and has played less than than 400 games despite being drafted 11 years ago. That is not a career you want or expect from a top 10 pick.

Youre smart enough to explain the nuance but I think you purposely do not and use initial blanket statements to get a rise out of people.

 

[newmanager]

At the same age

Tony DeAngela 51 15 56 71 1.39 -34
Zane Parekh 50 27 56 83 1.67 +37

In this case the +/- does reflect their d-zone capabilities.
From what I recall Tony D was really weak defensively with the Sting at the same age.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

At the same age

Tony DeAngela 51 15 56 71 1.39 -34
Zane Parekh 50 27 56 83 1.67 +37

In this case the +/- does reflect their d-zone capabilities.
From what I recall Tony D was really weak defensively with the Sting at the same age.

Come on, that's deceiving.

You are comparing DeAngelo in his draft season to Parekh in his DY+1.

Yes, Parekh is an early birthday and DeAngelo is a late birthday, so a statistical comparison isn't easy. There's reason to try to compare apples to oranges with their stats.

The simplest reason why DeAngelo's +/- was so bad that year was because his team was the worst in the OHL (he was tied 5th worst on the team in +/-, so his +/- is nothing alarming). And then look how the next year he was +1 in the +/- category playing for an average team (tied for 8th on the team).

Unsurprisingly, Parekh plays on a good team. He's third on his team in +/-. If his team was terrible, his +/- would be terrible. And it wouldn't make him any worse or better defensively than he is. Parekh is not a good defensive player, and neither was DeAngelo. That's okay because both are known for offense.

 

[Dack]

I have a really tough time evaluating Parekh's NHL potential. Like everyone else, I am very very impressed by his offensive game. I just have a tough time visualizing how his game will translate to the NHL, I get the Ryan Merkley vibes from him. I know that's probably unfair but he's really going to need to learn how to defend in the pros and his game has a long way to go before he'll be able to do that.

That's fair but I do want to point out, and I say this as someone who liked Merkley in his draft year that Parekh is so far past him offensively that I don't even know if they're comparable anymore. Parekh is break the charts good offensively at the OHL level. Even outside of issues with his all around game Merkley's offense never really popped after junior.

I find it hilarious how so many get offended by the DeAngelo comparison. DeAngelo is like the average 9OA. That’s who he’s most similar to.

It’s possible Parekh could be better. Yes, you hope for Erik Karlsson or Cale Makar, but it’s also possible he could be worse. You could get Ryan Murphy or Ryan Merkley.

His average outcome certainly isn’t in another tier from DeAngelo, and whether people like it or not some of the off ice noise surrounding him does remind you of DeAngelo.

I mean the DeAngelo outcome really isn't much better than the worst case scenario here, it's a non-NHLer vs an NHLer with 0 value who can't stick on any team and plays bottom pairing minutes. Like if Parekh turns into DeAngelo we're not going to be saying "it could be worse" we're going to be moving on him from in his early to mid 20s. It's entirely possible that's all Parekh becomes but the Flames didn't pick him 9th with that in mind and even if statistically that's a likely outcome for a 9th pick it would be seen as a big disappointment.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I mean the DeAngelo outcome really isn't much better than the worst case scenario here, it's a non-NHLer vs an NHLer with 0 value who can't stick on any team and plays bottom pairing minutes. Like if Parekh turns into DeAngelo we're not going to be saying "it could be worse" we're going to be moving on him from in his early to mid 20s. It's entirely possible that's all Parekh becomes but the Flames didn't pick him 9th with that in mind and even if statistically that's a likely outcome for a 9th pick it would be seen as a big disappointment.

So you don't think DeAngelo (the 3rd pair PP specialist) has more value than say Ryan Merkley or Ryan Murphy (literally not NHL'ers)?

Get back to me when a "sub NHL" defenseman on your team (because all teams have at least one) have their next bad game and tell me if you'd want an actual NHL'er in that place.

The Flames picked him likely hoping for Karlsson or Makar, recognizing the average outcome is probably like a DeAngelo, and hoping he doesn't become the Merkley or Murphy.

Yeah, maybe that player doesn't end up a star, but of course you have to recognize that 9OA's aren't guaranteed good NHL'ers. If you get a guy who gives you the career of DeAngelo (leaving off anything off ice, which we know might also apply to Parekh), you probably shouldn't be cursing the outcome and claiming it's worst case. It's simply not worst case. 9OA's don't always turn into regular NHL'ers for years and years and years.

Thus, I suggest maybe expectations should be recalculated. The likely outcome is probably DeAngelo/Barrie (give or take a little), not some elite 1D, nor is it likely a complete bust.

 

[WarriorofTime]

I find it hilarious how so many get offended by the DeAngelo comparison. DeAngelo is like the average 9OA. That’s who he’s most similar to.

It’s possible Parekh could be better. Yes, you hope for Erik Karlsson or Cale Makar, but it’s also possible he could be worse. You could get Ryan Murphy or Ryan Merkley.

His average outcome certainly isn’t in another tier from DeAngelo, and whether people like it or not some of the off ice noise surrounding him does remind you of DeAngelo.

DeAngelo would be a below average outcome for a 9th overall pick. Someone like Montour (albeit without taking so long to get there) would be a more average outcome.

 

[Haatley]

Come on, that's deceiving.

You are comparing DeAngelo in his draft season to Parekh in his DY+1.

Yes, Parekh is an early birthday and DeAngelo is a late birthday, so a statistical comparison isn't easy. There's reason to try to compare apples to oranges with their stats.

The simplest reason why DeAngelo's +/- was so bad that year was because his team was the worst in the OHL (he was tied 5th worst on the team in +/-, so his +/- is nothing alarming). And then look how the next year he was +1 in the +/- category playing for an average team (tied for 8th on the team).

Unsurprisingly, Parekh plays on a good team. He's third on his team in +/-. If his team was terrible, his +/- would be terrible. And it wouldn't make him any worse or better defensively than he is. Parekh is not a good defensive player, and neither was DeAngelo. That's okay because both are known for offense.

So you want to compare Parekh's 33 goal 96 point season instead?

 

[newmanager]

Come on, that's deceiving.

You are comparing DeAngelo in his draft season to Parekh in his DY+1.

Yes, Parekh is an early birthday and DeAngelo is a late birthday, so a statistical comparison isn't easy. There's reason to try to compare apples to oranges with their stats.

The simplest reason why DeAngelo's +/- was so bad that year was because his team was the worst in the OHL (he was tied 5th worst on the team in +/-, so his +/- is nothing alarming). And then look how the next year he was +1 in the +/- category playing for an average team (tied for 8th on the team).

Unsurprisingly, Parekh plays on a good team. He's third on his team in +/-. If his team was terrible, his +/- would be terrible. And it wouldn't make him any worse or better defensively than he is. Parekh is not a good defensive player, and neither was DeAngelo. That's okay because both are known for offense.

Parekh's 18 year old season still tops DeAngelo's 19 year old season 1.67ppg to 1.61ppg. Close but that's with the extra year of development for DeAngelo.

In his OHL career DeAngelo played 236 games and scored 55 goals to go along with 186 assists for 241 points and a ppg of 1.02 and was a -20 in those 236 games.

Parekh so far has played 166 OHL games and scored 81 goals and added 135 assists for 216 points and a 1.30ppg pace. He's at +79 at this point.

At this pace, if Parekh were to play 236 games he'd end up with 115 goals and 191 assists for 306 points and +130, quite a bit ahead of DAngelo. Also, one has to consider Parekh entered the league at a younger age than DeAngelo. When one plays a lot of games as a 16 year old it brings their ppg down as their most productive years are almost always their oldest years. Takes those young games out and his ppg goes up.

 

[Dack]

So you don't think DeAngelo (the 3rd pair PP specialist) has more value than say Ryan Merkley or Ryan Murphy (literally not NHL'ers)?

Get back to me when a "sub NHL" defenseman on your team (because all teams have at least one) have their next bad game and tell me if you'd want an actual NHL'er in that place.

The Flames picked him likely hoping for Karlsson or Makar, recognizing the average outcome is probably like a DeAngelo, and hoping he doesn't become the Merkley or Murphy.

Yeah, maybe that player doesn't end up a star, but of course you have to recognize that 9OA's aren't guaranteed good NHL'ers. If you get a guy who gives you the career of DeAngelo (leaving off anything off ice, which we know might also apply to Parekh), you probably shouldn't be cursing the outcome and claiming it's worst case. It's simply not worst case. 9OA's don't always turn into regular NHL'ers for years and years and years.

Thus, I suggest maybe expectations should be recalculated. The likely outcome is probably DeAngelo/Barrie (give or take a little), not some elite 1D, nor is it likely a complete bust.

Of course a DeAngelo is better than nothing, I said that, I just qualified that it's not a lot better. DeAngelo and the other bottom pairing PP specialists/Offensive D are a dime a dozen players who are avaliable at every trade deadline and in free agency every year. They have negligible value, they wind up on waivers, traded for mid/late round picks or unsigned.

I kind of disagree with the "legit NHL D-man thing" the gap between effective AHLer and replacement NHLer is basically non-existent. The Flames defense right now has done a wonderful job and they're a couple top pairing guys and a bunch of waiver wire pickups. I think at the level of #6D vs AHLers that a lot of the time it's just who a coach likes/is willing to play.

I know top 10 picks aren't guaranteed to be anything. I've never said otherwise, I even acknowledge that Parekh could wind up busting or being a 3rd pairing guy. I'm just saying that if he is a 3rd pairing guy, then it'll be seen as a disappointment and that (like pretty much every high pick that doesn't hit) he'll be on a different team before long.

 

[Haatley]

So you don't think DeAngelo (the 3rd pair PP specialist) has more value than say Ryan Merkley or Ryan Murphy (literally not NHL'ers)?

Get back to me when a "sub NHL" defenseman on your team (because all teams have at least one) have their next bad game and tell me if you'd want an actual NHL'er in that place.

The Flames picked him likely hoping for Karlsson or Makar, recognizing the average outcome is probably like a DeAngelo, and hoping he doesn't become the Merkley or Murphy.

Yeah, maybe that player doesn't end up a star, but of course you have to recognize that 9OA's aren't guaranteed good NHL'ers. If you get a guy who gives you the career of DeAngelo (leaving off anything off ice, which we know might also apply to Parekh), you probably shouldn't be cursing the outcome and claiming it's worst case. It's simply not worst case. 9OA's don't always turn into regular NHL'ers for years and years and years.

Thus, I suggest maybe expectations should be recalculated. The likely outcome is probably DeAngelo/Barrie (give or take a little), not some elite 1D, nor is it likely a complete bust.

Trying to figure out why you think that all 9th overall picks are the same.

This is clearly the post of someone who hasn't watched Parekh play. You most likely didn't watch Deangelo in junior either.

 

[Kingpin794]

Trying to figure out why you think that all 9th overall picks are the same.

This is clearly the post of someone who hasn't watched Parekh play. You most likely didn't watch Deangelo in junior either.

DeAngelo just gets thrown out as a comparison because it’s a dog whistle. People just need to cut out the middle man and just say they think he’s an offense only player with an attitude problem. I don’t think that paints a full picture of the player but at least those folks would be honest for once instead of just saying DeAngelo or Merkely all the time.

Edit: this is also why I don’t like player comparisons. Just describe the player instead of throwing out a name.

 

[newmanager]

Trying to figure out why you think that all 9th overall picks are the same.

This is clearly the post of someone who hasn't watched Parekh play. You most likely didn't watch Deangelo in junior either.

The thing is, Parekh might be close to the average 9th overall pick, but DeAngelo isn't. DeAngelo was picked 19th overall in the 2014 draft. Nik Ehlers was selected 9th overall in 2014. Other 9th overall picks were, Michael Granlund, Doug Hamilton, Jacob Trouba, Bo Horvat, Timo Meier, Michael Sergachev, Michael Rasmussen, Vitaly Kravtsov, Trevor Zegras, Marco Rossi, and Dylan Guenther, picked from 2010 to 2022. All turned out significantly better than De Angelo except for Kravtsov and maybe Rasmussen. Jury's still out on Zegras and Rossi on how much better they turn out.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

So you want to compare Parekh's 33 goal 96 point season instead?

I don’t get your point.

I don’t feel the need to make messy statistical comparisons. I can ballpark things with my eyes and say the comparison is a player like DeAngelo or Barrie.

Stats aren’t needed.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Trying to figure out why you think that all 9th overall picks are the same.

This is clearly the post of someone who hasn't watched Parekh play. You most likely didn't watch Deangelo in junior either.

I love someone who confidently tells me who I have and have not watched play and is wrong in doing so.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The thing is, Parekh might be close to the average 9th overall pick, but DeAngelo isn't. DeAngelo was picked 19th overall in the 2014 draft. Nik Ehlers was selected 9th overall in 2014. Other 9th overall picks were, Michael Granlund, Doug Hamilton, Jacob Trouba, Bo Horvat, Timo Meier, Michael Sergachev, Michael Rasmussen, Vitaly Kravtsov, Trevor Zegras, Marco Rossi, and Dylan Guenther, picked from 2010 to 2022. All turned out significantly better than De Angelo except for Kravtsov and maybe Rasmussen. Jury's still out on Zegras and Rossi on how much better they turn out.

This is very deceiving. 9OA’s have had a very good history recently, which is obviously just random. Look at the prior 15 years and tell me about it.

These are 8OA’s (should theoretically be better):

2024: Catton (too early)
2023: Leonard (too early)
2022: Kasper (too early)
2021: Clarke (too early)
2020: Quinn (acceptable)
2019: Broberg (acceptable)
2018: Boqvist (bust)
2017: Mittelstadt (acceptable)
2016: Alex Nylander (bust)
2015: Werenski (home run)
2014: Willy Nylander (home run)
2013: Ristolainen (acceptable)
2012: Pouliot (bust)
2011: Couturier (home run)
2010: Burmistrov (being generous, acceptable)
2009: Glennie (bust)

5 acceptable (middle of the roster)
4 busts (never more than bottom of the roster and not that many games)
3 home runs (top of the roster and a chance for 750-1000 games)

 

[newmanager]

This is very deceiving. 9OA’s have had a very good history recently, which is obviously just random. Look at the prior 15 years and tell me about it.

These are 8OA’s (should theoretically be better):

2024: Catton (too early)
2023: Leonard (too early)
2022: Kasper (too early)
2021: Clarke (too early)
2020: Quinn (acceptable)
2019: Broberg (acceptable)
2018: Boqvist (bust)
2017: Mittelstadt (acceptable)
2016: Alex Nylander (bust)
2015: Werenski (home run)
2014: Willy Nylander (home run)
2013: Ristolainen (acceptable)
2012: Pouliot (bust)
2011: Couturier (home run)
2010: Burmistrov (being generous, acceptable)
2009: Glennie (bust)

5 acceptable (middle of the roster)
4 busts (never more than bottom of the roster and not that many games)
3 home runs (top of the roster and a chance for 750-1000 games)

Not deceiving. Just how things turned out. DeAngelo is nowhere near the quality of the average 9th overall draftpick. And he shouldn't be expected to be that quality, after all, he was selected close to where he belonged, at 19th and not 9th, which is totally out of his league.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Not deceiving. Just how things turned out. DeAngelo is nowhere near the quality of the average 9th overall draftpick. And he shouldn't be expected to be that quality, after all, he was selected close to where he belonged, at 19th and not 9th, which is totally out of his league.

You picked a fluky and small sample, so yes, he is an average 9OA.