RD Moritz Seider (2019, 6th, DET)

[ijuka]

what would you call a guy who plays 23-24 minutes a night, effectively shutting down other teams offense while putting up 30 points without prime powerplay time

just out of curiosity

I expect offensive contribution out of 1Ds. So 2D, I guess? That's in line with 23-24min as well, 1D would be more.

 

[TheMule93]

He looks comfortable in all situations, including running a powerplay

he completely lacks a 1 timer though. Gonna need to work on that if he wants to be a threat on the PP.

 

[Debrincat93]

he completely lacks a 1 timer though. Gonna need to work on that if he wants to be a threat on the PP.

very true. However, from watching the prospect tournament he did show a good wrist shot that gets through traffic well. but yes, he definitely need to work on the one-timer.

 

[newfy]

Led the team in ice time tonight against a stacked Hawks team for his preseason debut and I have to say he didn't look out of place at all.

Didnt look out of place but his partner Daley sure did. He played about half his minutes matched up against Toews and Kane (probably intentional by Blashill) and he swam but Daley sunk like a rock.

Its one game so hard to draw a bunch of conclusions from but he did look solid on the point for the PP, holding the line and moving the puck. I cant say if he has a good shot or not because he never uses his one timer. He needs to work on getting it off, he has a hard wrister that gets through but in the NHL you score/generate rebounds with a hard slap shot from the point. At his size and wingspan he should be able to generate a tonne of power behind a slap shot, luckily its something thats pretty easy to work on and outside of just gaining experience and picking up on little things at the NHL level, the slapshot is the only thing I think is really lacking right now.

He looks like a guy right now who is ready for NHL minutes but long term could be helped by playing the PP in the AHL for 60 games and playing 20 in Detroit or as an injury call up. Crazy how training camp/prospects tourney has alreadyc hanged a lot of fans minds about him lol

 

[57special]

I'm sure DET will be patient with him, unless his play screams NHL. Fastest way to ruin a young Dman is to stick him on a bad, defensively challenged team.

 

[Winger98]

Didnt look out of place but his partner Daley sure did. He played about half his minutes matched up against Toews and Kane (probably intentional by Blashill) and he swam but Daley sunk like a rock.

Its one game so hard to draw a bunch of conclusions from but he did look solid on the point for the PP, holding the line and moving the puck. I cant say if he has a good shot or not because he never uses his one timer. He needs to work on getting it off, he has a hard wrister that gets through but in the NHL you score/generate rebounds with a hard slap shot from the point. At his size and wingspan he should be able to generate a tonne of power behind a slap shot, luckily its something thats pretty easy to work on and outside of just gaining experience and picking up on little things at the NHL level, the slapshot is the only thing I think is really lacking right now.

He looks like a guy right now who is ready for NHL minutes but long term could be helped by playing the PP in the AHL for 60 games and playing 20 in Detroit or as an injury call up. Crazy how training camp/prospects tourney has alreadyc hanged a lot of fans minds about him lol

Did anyone talk up his offense when he was drafted? I remember a lot of talk about potential, and being very good defensively, etc., but his play with the puck and in the offensive zone has been a big surprise.

 

[newfy]

Did anyone talk up his offense when he was drafted? I remember a lot of talk about potential, and being very good defensively, etc., but his play with the puck and in the offensive zone has been a big surprise.

Nobody talked up his offense which is why your typical internet scouting sources had him rated lower than NHL teams apparently. But I was expecting him to make a good first pass and be a shutdown guy, even just right now until he did some developing. But he has some skills already offensively that make his upside look a lot higher than most thought it was on draft day. His defensive game, physical game, size and skating could have him in the NHL this season I think.

I'm just not sure his offense will develop like it could if he was playing bigger offensive minutes in the AHL. There doesnt really seem to be anyone down there to steal offensive mins from him right now. In the NHL, offensive minutes are gonna go to Green and Hronek over him at the very least. His breakout is good, he looks great at holding the offensive blue line and he can get a hard wrister through traffic. He looks like he can stick handle decently for a guy his size/reach. But his bread and butter wouldnt be as a PP QB as much as a one timer if he can develop it so I think fine tuning all of that in the AHL while getting more accustomed to North American ice would be his best bet

Obviously these are opinions off of about 5 games I've seen now, so they definitely have time to change but those are the impressions I'm getting so far

 

[Martinez]

he completely lacks a 1 timer though. Gonna need to work on that if he wants to be a threat on the PP.

As long as he gets his shot through

 

[Debrincat93]

Did anyone talk up his offense when he was drafted? I remember a lot of talk about potential, and being very good defensively, etc., but his play with the puck and in the offensive zone has been a big surprise.

i believe one of the outlets when he was drafted had his scouting report on there saying he was a "defensive defenseman".. so no, i dont think anyone talked about his offense, really, at all.

 

[GoBoltz56]

I think he missed a good chunk of time last year with an injury and only played 29 games or something. He wasn't given much of an offensive role on his DEL team from what I understand. It wasn't until the WC's that peoples eyes were opened to his potential offensive abilities when he scored 2 goals, one off a wrist shot picking a corner, and i think the other was on a 2 on 1 where he jumped up in the play. That's probably where Yzerman saw him and was wow'ed.

 

[Jacob]

How NHL-ready is his child-like enthusiasm?

 

[ijuka]

i believe one of the outlets when he was drafted had his scouting report on there saying he was a "defensive defenseman".. so no, i dont think anyone talked about his offense, really, at all.

His offense looked good to me at Worlds, first time I saw him. That's why I found it strange how he was touted as simply a defensive defenseman.

Perhaps stat-watchers who are unable to take into account the difficulty of playing in an adult pro league at 17 are to blame.

 

[JohnLennon]

A funny little observation: I find Seider and Kotkaniemi similar in terms of how they were drafted significantly ahead of where they were projected to go. Last year, since Kotkaniemi was drafted ahead of Zadina, and some Wings fans were arguing that many Habs fans were trying too hard to justify the pick. Now fast forward to the Seider pick, and some of those same posters are doing exactly what they criticized. It's pretty funny.

That said, I agree with those Wings fans. I honestly think Seider was drafted in a very reasonable spot, and I agree with those of you who see a 1D potential in him. I think the sky is the limit for this kid, and I wish my team had him (which happens to be the Habs, btw!)

 

[Lampedampe]

A funny little observation: I find Seider and Kotkaniemi similar in terms of how they were drafted significantly ahead of where they were projected to go. Last year, since Kotkaniemi was drafted ahead of Zadina, and some Wings fans were arguing that many Habs fans were trying too hard to justify the pick. Now fast forward to the Seider pick, and some of those same posters are doing exactly what they criticized. It's pretty funny.

That said, I agree with those Wings fans. I honestly think Seider was drafted in a very reasonable spot, and I agree with those of you who see a 1D potential in him. I think the sky is the limit for this kid, and I wish my team had him (which happens to be the Habs, btw!)

Well there were some Habs fans criticizing Zadina to justify the Kotkaniemi pick, which didn't make things better.

 

[Debrincat93]

His offense looked good to me at Worlds, first time I saw him. That's why I found it strange how he was touted as simply a defensive defenseman.

Perhaps stat-watchers who are unable to take into account the difficulty of playing in an adult pro league at 17 are to blame.

yea people make mistakes, i dont think people had a good analysis on him simply because he was in an unconventional market. thats ok, ill take a sleeper.

 

[deca guard]

he completely lacks a 1 timer though. Gonna need to work on that if he wants to be a threat on the PP.

hes not a great shooting dman but helps the pp gigantically via smart passing

 

[TheMule93]

hes not a great shooting dman but helps the pp gigantically via smart passing

hes got a pretty hard wrister, just no one timer

 

[Boxscore]

very true. However, from watching the prospect tournament he did show a good wrist shot that gets through traffic well. but yes, he definitely need to work on the one-timer.

I've said from the beginning, he will be dynamic like Oliver Ekman-Larsson, who rarely uses a one-timer. OEL scores most of his goals by walking the line and releasing a nicely-placed wrist shot.

 

[ijuka]

For a defenseman, getting the shot through is important. A hard clapper isn't really at the top of my list. If the D can shoot a nice wrister that's easy to redirect, that'll cause more than enough goals.

Brent Burns, for example, is all about the wrister and he's done well.

 

[Boxscore]

For a defenseman, getting the shot through is important. A hard clapper isn't really at the top of my list. If the D can shoot a nice wrister that's easy to redirect, that'll cause more than enough goals.

Brent Burns, for example, is all about the wrister and he's done well.

Ray Bourque used his wrister more than anything. I think he did pretty good.

 

[Mrb1p]

a dman like seider doesnt produce goals on his own like a karlsson with skating , hes too big to be that type forward like dman . or with a big slapper like weber . seider needs to be meshed in with a unit to be a valuable offensive weapon that utilizes his smarts / soft hands / skating coordination to generate possesion and chances . and i guarantee seider walking the blue line using soft hands and excellent edges to hold onto puck while looking for good passing opportunitys , while also being able to defend vs break aways , is a valuable offensive weapon whom can play on a 1st pp unit easily and rack up all kinds of assist off beauty passes plus his share of goals . his fans are seeing the coordinated skating - soft hands - smarts formula , along with fire in his veins , and realizing this guys a top level dman

Hes too big to do that ? Better ring in Burns because he didnt get the memo.

 

[Boxscore]

Hes too big to do that ? Better ring in Burns because he didnt get the memo.

Exactly.

Hedman, OEL, Jones and Hamilton are all big, lanky guys who produce well without bringing the big slapper like Weber or Chara.

 

[pgfan66]

Did anyone talk up his offense when he was drafted? I remember a lot of talk about potential, and being very good defensively, etc., but his play with the puck and in the offensive zone has been a big surprise.

Nobody talked up his offense which is why your typical internet scouting sources had him rated lower than NHL teams apparently.

i believe one of the outlets when he was drafted had his scouting report on there saying he was a "defensive defenseman".. so no, i dont think anyone talked about his offense, really, at all.

His offense looked good to me at Worlds, first time I saw him. That's why I found it strange how he was touted as simply a defensive defenseman.

Perhaps stat-watchers who are unable to take into account the difficulty of playing in an adult pro league at 17 are to blame.

These assessments aren't really accurate or fair. Seider was a big-time offensive contributor in juniors. What happened is that he had a massive growth spurt in his final year that hurt his dynamic ability a little, and from there, he turned more and more into defence-first player, also thanks to his role on the pro team.

But even then, it was always clear he was extremely smart and poised with the puck. He created room for himself in the D-zone before playing accurate outlet passes etc. He made lots of smart pinches in the offensive zone to keep the puck in and join the attack. He jumped in on attacks after his team won possession in the D-zone. When he went back to the junior national team, he contributed a lot offensively and on the PP.

However, what people were saying was that he's not super dynamic and doesn't have great puck skills. He's no Bowen Byram. He won't become a Cale Makar, Quinn Hughes, or Sam Girard type D-man. He's decent on breakouts when he carries the puck, but so many of them ended in dump-ins because he couldn't beat defenders one-on-one. On the offensive blue line, he often tried to fool defenders with quick fakes etc., but usually struggled to do that and ended up dumping the puck deep. He scored a couple goals from the blue line, but his wrist shot isn't overly strong and his slapshot/one-timer is almost non-existent.

Yes, the above can partly be attributed to him being a 17-year-old playing against pros. But comparing him to other European D-men who did the same thing in the past years, it looked like the offensive skill and dynamic ability weren't quite there. Yes, he is great with the puck in the D-zone and yes, he can distribute the puck well in the O-zone. But no, he likely won't be a huge offensive contributor. NHL PP2? Sure. PP1? Probably not. And this is what was said all season long.

 

[fEyD08]

For a defenseman, getting the shot through is important. A hard clapper isn't really at the top of my list. If the D can shoot a nice wrister that's easy to redirect, that'll cause more than enough goals.

Brent Burns, for example, is all about the wrister and he's done well.

Burns uses the one timer as well. On the PP he scored a lot of goals like this.

 

[TheWhiskeyThief]

Did anyone talk up his offense when he was drafted? I remember a lot of talk about potential, and being very good defensively, etc., but his play with the puck and in the offensive zone has been a big surprise.

If you don’t run PP1(which I don’t think he’s that guy) your scoring opportunities are based on ice time and deployment.

Play him on his off hand and he could put up 10g just on 1 timers. How do you skin that cat is what matters.