Post-Game Talk: Rangers @ Oilers - Sather's revenge

[CasusBelli]

Watching some Torts pressers got me all nostalgic

 

[Fitzy]

Miller's "old form" has to be the exception at this point, right?

Which is why I’m not entirely opposed to Brady Skjei-ing him to a high bidder.

His awareness is rough and his board play behind the net is a disaster.

He needs to be producing offense at even strength to be a useful player at his cap hit and he hasn’t been doing that.

 

[Machinehead]

I literally called this team a retread of the Lundqvist era. I never said we were a super talented team. I’ve been beating the drum for stripping it to the nails.

At the same time, Hischier’s top two seasons are 80 and 67 points. Mika has has 72, 74, 75, 81, 91 and 50 in 56. Again, hyperbole. Mika TODAY may have regressed to the point that Hischier is passing him (I f***ing love Hischier, by the way) but what is the excuse for the last 3-4 years? Because it’s been the same roster for 5+ years. This isn’t just a convo about the 24-25 Rangers, it’s a conversation about THIS VERSION of the Rangers, which has been intact for quite some time. So when Mika HADN’T regressed so badly yet and was a 90 point center who also PK’d, what was the excuse? He had Fox, and Panarin, and Shesterkin and 50 goal Kreider. What was the excuse 3 years ago?

It’s time to start packing bags. Mika, Trouba, Panarin and maybe Kreider should all be gone. Trochek could go too but can stay as an affordable veteran so we don’t have absolutely zero center depth. Kreider can stay because he’s got a legacy at this point. None of the veterans deserve to run it back one more time. None. And I don’t believe it’s entirely down to lack of talent.

The analytics nerds were beating the drum about Mika when he scored 41 in 57. Nobody wanted to listen. He used to be capable of finding a bunch of goals. I think he probably still is if he gets hot. He was never a guy that could take the ice against other top centers and tilt play. Not at any point in his career and we were warned not to hitch the wagon to him and try to ride into contention. Nobody wanted to hear it.

Kreider did have a 50 goal season, and over the last three years (plus the part of this one) he's 9th in the NHL in goals. He is an elite goal scorer, but he's a specialist. If you look at every other name on the list, they're all much, much better hockey players all-around than he is.

You keep saying "Fox, Panarin, Mika, Shesterkin, and Kreider!" Kreider is a Cy Young winner who has zero assists in 19 games. He's very good at what he does, but it's a role. You're in trouble if he's one of your top guys. Mika isn't good, and you were warned his entire time here. Goaltending is like Santa Claus -- we just pretend it's real for fun.

Right there, I've shortened that list down to two, and two isn't cutting it. Florida has four great players. Edmonton has arguably the two best in the world. Colorado wouldn't look out of place at the Olympics. That's the competition and we ain't it.

I agree that it's probably about time to let the heads roll. The best way to get talent like that is to be bad.

 

[grachevsceiling]

or maybe it's coaching and environment?

Bennett, Vaerhage, Reinhart all took off in Florida. You would have said they sucked on their previous teams and would want no part of them.

Meh but you could just as easily say that Paul Maurice was coaching in the KHL before the panthers and was just as much of a carousel coach as Lavi. And that the Panthers as an organization had never won a cup.

I mean I think the boring truth is that talent, coach, and environment are all important and all influence each other to some extent.

 

[hardnosed]

Posted this in the Miller thread. It happens so much it's maddening to see. Hell, it happened to us last night. When this play started, Bouchard was on the bench and Panarin and Laf were in the neutral zone and were still f***ing there when he came off the bench and scored.

Lav agrees with you. Every game that we bleed shots, his presser starts with a complaint about our back checking.

 

[will1066]

or maybe it's coaching and environment?

Bennett, Vaerhage, Reinhart all took off in Florida. You would have said they sucked on their previous teams and would want no part of them.

Yeah. There's no reason why our players can't play responsibly. I hate to say it, but the reckless free flowing philosophy coincided with Panarin's arrival. The high low cycling and east west was evolutionary in his first couple of years here but the rest of the league has caught up. According to Vali, we're not even the most east west team anymore.

 

[LokiDog]

Yeah. There's no reason why our players can't play responsibly. I hate to say it, but the reckless free flowing philosophy coincided with Panarin's arrival. The high low cycling and east west was evolutionary in his first couple of years here but the rest of the league has caught up. According to Vali, we're not even the most east west team anymore.

In the east, or the west. Sadly, there’s no north or south conferences to compare against, but i’d bet we would fare poorly by those metrics as well. In fact, I think you’ve hit upon a key problem - we’re directionless.

 

[Wtp99]

Lavi has a shelf life and the expiration date is closing in. Being reliant on this core is not a good thing. They played over their heads last season and got tired out. There just doesn’t seem to be as much of a fire in them. Miller is just absolutely nothing special. Move him for something while he still has value. Mancini could take his spot. Zibanajad is shot. He lost what made him good. Shesty is a great goalie but…, cuylle is a keeper, future captain.
Lafrenier is coming into his own. Build around them.
Put the core in press box or on the fourth line. Panarin is a necessary evil. Keeper nonetheless