Confirmed with Link: Rangers extend D Will Borgen

[bhamill]

The good news is by then we should have two 2nd round picks available to attach to the trade to get rid of him.

The better news is that won’t be necessary.

 

[GlasgowNewYorkRanger]

Everything is a negotiation. If we gave him less clauses, he'd want a higher AAV, and you'd complain about that.

But it seems like in this instance you're just complaining based on principle. The actual clauses in his contract are largely irrelevant. They won't stop us from trading him if it comes to that.

Whether you like it that UFAs get these clauses is completely irrelevant. The NHLPA collectively bargained for them, and they aren't likely to go away any time soon. Players have rights too, and one of the most important things for them is being able to have some say in where they are playing.

Imagine you had a job where your company could trade you to anywhere in the US or Canada that they want, at any time, and you have absolutely no say in the matter. Yes, these people get paid a lot of money, but money or not, if you were in their situation, you'd want the same thing. So, don't begrudge others for wanting them.

It's a message board based on discussion about the future of hockey, clues in the question, so it's perfectly relevant, and you are certainly not the arbitrator of what is and isn't so as you happen to disagree.

Comparables to athletes who are making millions of dollars is also always a ludicrous apples to oranges comparisson. If we are all so concerned about third liners getting trade protection, then it shouldn't be within a league that has most teams maxed to a cap that pays peanuts compared to other leagues, where a couple of bad contracts can screw your chances for years.

You think in a cap league the best run teams are handing no move protecting to a Goodrow or Borgen? Aside from that, it's one of the main reasons we get about two interesting trades every year. Movement is hamstrung.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Borg

 

[will1066]

Typing on your phone is risky. The page reloads and everything you wrote is gone. Especially a long post.

That's why if you're in the throes of passion writing a long dissertation, keep copying and pasting into a notepad app.

 

[TheWrongWay]

Pizza f*** desperately trying to justify trading Kakko.

What an idiot.

Weird take and my forthcoming response is not singling you out. But...

I am a results person.

This is why I spent 4 decades in commission-based sales. If I sucked ass, and at times I did, I got rightly fired. I’ve also won national sales contests, set sales records at Fortune 250 companies, and had 30-min phone calls where I made over $10k.

On sheer results, what does Drury have to justify regarding the trade?

• SEA 33 games w/ Borgen – .484 pts pct
• SEA 17 games w/ Kakko – .441 pts pct
  
  
• NYR 31 games w/ Kakko – .516 pts pct
• NYR 18 games w/ Borgen – .583 pts pct

We are now closer to a playoff position than before the trade. Seattle was 4 points out of a playoff spot at time of trade and is now an additional 4 points further away from a wild card spot.

^ Those are the bottom-line results.

Why are people still on Kakko? This isn’t Bobby Orr we traded. This is a guy with 5 full prior seasons averaging 11 gls per, with 4 … FOUR … career playoff goals.

It wasn’t a 1-for-1 either. We got two picks, and their 3rd is damn close to a late 2nd at this point.

What, we didn’t put Kakko in an environment to thrive? Did guys like Jordan and Bird enter thriving, winning environments? Their teams sucked absolute ass the season before they arrived. Guys like that are the winning environment.

Executing falls on the player. These are grown men, not 7-year-old kids.

The people saying Borgen is a small sample size. Not even wasting time on this ridiculous nonsense.

We didn’t trade Kakko at peak value? In hindsight, yes, we could’ve gotten more after his one decent season. But how many teams trade a 2OA after a season like that? Few. Most expect/hope it’s a sign of a breakout.

We traded Kakko now. Is what it is. We can hindsight it to death, but it’s done. Our team thus far is winning more and Seattle thus far is winning less. Results. Reality. Period.

The trade is history.

I sincerely wish all the best for Kakko and I am fine if the trade ends win-win. But I hope no one punishes Borgen cuz they don't like a trade Borgen had nothing to do with.

Borgen is a NYR now. He’s going to make mistakes and he will have bad games. All athletes do. But the team so far is better with him here. He also likely would’ve gotten more as a UFA and could’ve chosen his destination. He chose to extend here, at a relatively fair price.

I hope at some point some of y’all can move past the trade and focus on the actual current NYR team, which has looked a heck of a lot better lately.

 

[Claxton]

Hoping we can clear out the country club boy culture over the summer(Zibanejad and Kreider at least) and start a new era next season with Captain Borgen...

 

[McRanger92]

Borgen was an absolute monster in the Avs game. The turnover to end it was far more on K'Andre (for taking the puck deep in that situation) and Panarin (for calling for the puck with Makar exiting the box after a 3 minute shift). Good to see Borg play so well after the extension.

 

[mrmovies779]

Borgen was an absolute monster in the Avs game. The turnover to end it was far more on K'Andre (for taking the puck deep in that situation) and Panarin (for calling for the puck with Makar exiting the box after a 3 minute shift). Good to see Borg play so well after the extension.

It's absolutely on Borgen.You don't pass the puck back to the point to a dead tired Bread when you know Makar is coming out of the box..you get the puck deep and make them go 200 feet

 

[Rongomania]

Weird take and my forthcoming response is not singling you out. But...

I am a results person.

This is why I spent 4 decades in commission-based sales. If I sucked ass, and at times I did, I got rightly fired. I’ve also won national sales contests, set sales records at Fortune 250 companies, and had 30-min phone calls where I made over $10k.

On sheer results, what does Drury have to justify regarding the trade?

• SEA 33 games w/ Borgen – .484 pts pct
• SEA 17 games w/ Kakko – .441 pts pct
  
  
• NYR 31 games w/ Kakko – .516 pts pct
• NYR 18 games w/ Borgen – .583 pts pct

We are now closer to a playoff position than before the trade. Seattle was 4 points out of a playoff spot at time of trade and is now an additional 4 points further away from a wild card spot.

^ Those are the bottom-line results.

Why are people still on Kakko? This isn’t Bobby Orr we traded. This is a guy with 5 full prior seasons averaging 11 gls per, with 4 … FOUR … career playoff goals.

It wasn’t a 1-for-1 either. We got two picks, and their 3rd is damn close to a late 2nd at this point.

What, we didn’t put Kakko in an environment to thrive? Did guys like Jordan and Bird enter thriving, winning environments? Their teams sucked absolute ass the season before they arrived. Guys like that are the winning environment.

Executing falls on the player. These are grown men, not 7-year-old kids.

The people saying Borgen is a small sample size. Not even wasting time on this ridiculous nonsense.

We didn’t trade Kakko at peak value? In hindsight, yes, we could’ve gotten more after his one decent season. But how many teams trade a 2OA after a season like that? Few. Most expect/hope it’s a sign of a breakout.

We traded Kakko now. Is what it is. We can hindsight it to death, but it’s done. Our team thus far is winning more and Seattle thus far is winning less. Results. Reality. Period.

The trade is history.

I sincerely wish all the best for Kakko and I am fine if the trade ends win-win. But I hope no one punishes Borgen cuz they don't like a trade Borgen had nothing to do with.

Borgen is a NYR now. He’s going to make mistakes and he will have bad games. All athletes do. But the team so far is better with him here. He also likely would’ve gotten more as a UFA and could’ve chosen his destination. He chose to extend here, at a relatively fair price.

I hope at some point some of y’all can move past the trade and focus on the actual current NYR team, which has looked a heck of a lot better lately.

Comparing Kakko to Jordan and Bird is one of the more insane things I’ve read on this board since 2011.

 

[noncents]

Borgen was an absolute monster in the Avs game. The turnover to end it was far more on K'Andre (for taking the puck deep in that situation) and Panarin (for calling for the puck with Makar exiting the box after a 3 minute shift). Good to see Borg play so well after the extension.

how in the f*** do you put that on Miller? Taking the puck deep is maintaining possession. Maintaining possession means you can't be scored on.

Borgen made a bad decision at the end of a good game. Panarin didn't back check. And convert on a great chance. Game over.

 

[eco's bones]

The thing with Kakko is he was probably only ever going to break out when he moved to another team. He was running out of free agent time here. When he goes to Seattle the pressure to live up to expectations were finally turned off for him. Now all he has to do his play and he's got all the fundamentals of how to play responsible down.

As for Borgen yesterday. Over the course of a year pretty much every player is going to make some egregious mistake that costs a game or two or whatever. The problem really is when it happens over and over to the same player......and we've seen this from Miller and Zibanejad quite a lot this year. We've seen Panarin overstaying shifts a lot in the past. And to be fair they're not trying to make mistakes.....it's more often than not bad habits that are not being controlled. Miller with shitty pinches or Artemi not leaving the ice when he's completely gassed.

And again this team is chasing the season. When chasing games teams tend to take chances they wouldn't otherwise and there's a tendency for things to get worse. The same can happen to a season. And when that does happen....for the fanbase anyway the highs are going to be higher and the lows are going to be lower. Our mindset the last couple weeks is we're on a run of winning and not losing and even though not in playoff position we're on the right track finally and it's a matter of time before we get there and save the season. It's not that we won't make the playoffs but like it or not we're not in a good spot and there's a very good chance we're not going to make it. There's also a very good chance that Drury is going to do something to try to get us in that's going backfire on us in the future. And trades aren't always the best answer. You can just as easily destabilize a team as correct its course.

Some years also just don't work out. It could be next year the team is firing on all cylinders again.

 

[McRanger92]

It's absolutely on Borgen.You don't pass the puck back to the point to a dead tired Bread when you know Makar is coming out of the box..you get the puck deep and make them go 200 feet

If you want to blame him for that sure. Game wouldve been long over without Borgen's play before that.

how in the f*** do you put that on Miller? Taking the puck deep is maintaining possession. Maintaining possession means you can't be scored on.

Borgen made a bad decision at the end of a good game. Panarin didn't back check. And convert on a great chance. Game over.

Miller took himself out of position. Why did he need to skate it down low? Just dump it in and play your position. It was a tie game. Just a lack of situational awareness from everyone on the ice.

 

[noncents]

If you want to blame him for that sure. Game wouldve been long over without Borgen's play before that.


Miller took himself out of position. Why did he need to skate it down low? Just dump it in and play your position. It was a tie game.

Dumping it in gives the Avalanche the puck. Taking it low maintains possession. Passing it to Borgen maintains possession. Only after Borgen attempts an ill advised pass with Makar bearing down does the play become dangerous.

He did have a good game before that. But contorting this to make the final play somehow not his fault is absurd.

 

[SA16]

Dumping it in gives the Avalanche the puck. Taking it low maintains possession. Passing it to Borgen maintains possession. Only after Borgen attempts an ill advised pass with Makar bearing down does the play become dangerous.

He did have a good game before that. But contorting this to make the final play somehow not his fault is absurd.

All he had to do was skate back into his own zone and stand behind the goalie and run out the clock. It's highly unlikely the Avs would even forecheck hard in that situation in a tie game vs an eastern conference team with 20 seconds left.

If there is one thing he certainly should not do it's be the deepest of all five guys on the ice when he's a defenseman and there's 20-25 seconds left. The fact that he and Borgen were even on the ice together at the end of the PP means they were putting out guys to play safer else they'd have put out the usual 4F/1D. And then he totally went against the safety.

Was Borgen's pass bad? Yes. But he never should have been put in that situation in the first place. Not to mention, Borgen can't see behind him so if nobody told him Makar was there how would he know? From his point of view he has a wide open guy on the left side. Did Key (who was looking back in that direction) or the bench yell at Borgen to let him know Makar was coming hard in that spot? I have no idea. Just because he knew Makar was leaving the box doesn't mean he knew that he was anywhere close to making a play.

I think Borgen's probably the least at fault on that play between Miller/Panarin/Borgen. And this whole "Dead tired Bread" narrative is so stupid. He wasn't tired. It wasn't that long of a shift. If the NHL tracked shifts differently and just called it a new shift after a timeout is called nobody would even be saying he was tired because they would have logged out as a 58 second PP shift at the time of the turnover.

 

[noncents]

All he had to do was skate back into his own zone and stand behind the goalie and run out the clock. It's highly unlikely the Avs would even forecheck hard in that situation in a tie game vs an eastern conference team with 20 seconds left.

If there is one thing he certainly should not do it's be the deepest of all five guys on the ice when he's a defenseman and there's 20-25 seconds left. The fact that he and Borgen were even on the ice together at the end of the PP means they were putting out guys to play safer else they'd have put out the usual 4F/1D. And then he totally went against the safety.

Was Borgen's pass bad? Yes. But he never should have been put in that situation in the first place. Not to mention, Borgen can't see behind him so if nobody told him Makar was there how would he know? From his point of view he has a wide open guy on the left side. Did Key (who was looking back in that direction) or the bench yell at Borgen to let him know Makar was coming hard in that spot? I have no idea. Just because he knew Makar was leaving the box doesn't mean he knew that he was anywhere close to making a play.

I think Borgen's probably the least at fault on that play between Miller/Panarin/Borgen. And this whole "Dead tired Bread" narrative is so stupid. He wasn't tired. It wasn't that long of a shift. If the NHL tracked shifts differently and just called it a new shift after a timeout is called nobody would even be saying he was tired because they would have logged out as a 58 second PP shift at the time of the turnover.

we're gonna have to agree to disagree.

You're saying the best way to play in that situation is to not lose the game, by skating the puck back towards your own net, whereas I'm saying that if you have the puck in the offensive zone, you maintain possession and see if there is an opportunity to create offense. You play to win.

The one thing you can't do, as a forward, as a defenseman, is make a bad pass at the offensive blueline when Makar is coming out of the box.

 

[SA16]

we're gonna have to agree to disagree.

You're saying the best way to play in that situation is to not lose the game, by skating the puck back towards your own net, whereas I'm saying that if you have the puck in the offensive zone, you maintain possession and see if there is an opportunity to create offense. You play to win.

The one thing you can't do, as a forward, as a defenseman, is make a bad pass at the offensive blueline when Makar is coming out of the box.

Yes, I'm saying the best way to play that sequence against a western team who you are not competing with for the playoffs in anyway is to guarantee one point and then have about a 50 percent chance to get a second point.

 

[eco's bones]

At the end of the year if we don't make the playoffs it's not going to be one single f***ed up play that screwed the season up. It will be a lot of plays. Weak goals, giveaways, brain dead plays, crap positioning, bad bounces, bad refs calls---Cuylle seems to be a target for refs calling back goals but yes offsides plays too, etc. etc. etc. It will be an accumulation of things and they can all factor in why this game or that went sideways.

 

[Levitate]

a middle defenseman for $4 mill is just fine. Dunno why people expect to get these kind of players for like $1.5 mill or something these days.

 

[CasusBelli]

Weird take and my forthcoming response is not singling you out. But...

I am a results person.

This is why I spent 4 decades in commission-based sales. If I sucked ass, and at times I did, I got rightly fired. I’ve also won national sales contests, set sales records at Fortune 250 companies, and had 30-min phone calls where I made over $10k.

On sheer results, what does Drury have to justify regarding the trade?

• SEA 33 games w/ Borgen – .484 pts pct
• SEA 17 games w/ Kakko – .441 pts pct
  
  
• NYR 31 games w/ Kakko – .516 pts pct
• NYR 18 games w/ Borgen – .583 pts pct

We are now closer to a playoff position than before the trade. Seattle was 4 points out of a playoff spot at time of trade and is now an additional 4 points further away from a wild card spot.

^ Those are the bottom-line results.

Why are people still on Kakko? This isn’t Bobby Orr we traded. This is a guy with 5 full prior seasons averaging 11 gls per, with 4 … FOUR … career playoff goals.

It wasn’t a 1-for-1 either. We got two picks, and their 3rd is damn close to a late 2nd at this point.

What, we didn’t put Kakko in an environment to thrive? Did guys like Jordan and Bird enter thriving, winning environments? Their teams sucked absolute ass the season before they arrived. Guys like that are the winning environment.

Executing falls on the player. These are grown men, not 7-year-old kids.

The people saying Borgen is a small sample size. Not even wasting time on this ridiculous nonsense.

We didn’t trade Kakko at peak value? In hindsight, yes, we could’ve gotten more after his one decent season. But how many teams trade a 2OA after a season like that? Few. Most expect/hope it’s a sign of a breakout.

We traded Kakko now. Is what it is. We can hindsight it to death, but it’s done. Our team thus far is winning more and Seattle thus far is winning less. Results. Reality. Period.

The trade is history.

I sincerely wish all the best for Kakko and I am fine if the trade ends win-win. But I hope no one punishes Borgen cuz they don't like a trade Borgen had nothing to do with.

Borgen is a NYR now. He’s going to make mistakes and he will have bad games. All athletes do. But the team so far is better with him here. He also likely would’ve gotten more as a UFA and could’ve chosen his destination. He chose to extend here, at a relatively fair price.

I hope at some point some of y’all can move past the trade and focus on the actual current NYR team, which has looked a heck of a lot better lately.

Just had to say: this guy gets it. Bravo.

 

[NYRfan85]

Weird take and my forthcoming response is not singling you out. But...

I am a results person.

This is why I spent 4 decades in commission-based sales. If I sucked ass, and at times I did, I got rightly fired. I’ve also won national sales contests, set sales records at Fortune 250 companies, and had 30-min phone calls where I made over $10k.

On sheer results, what does Drury have to justify regarding the trade?

• SEA 33 games w/ Borgen – .484 pts pct
• SEA 17 games w/ Kakko – .441 pts pct
  
  
• NYR 31 games w/ Kakko – .516 pts pct
• NYR 18 games w/ Borgen – .583 pts pct

We are now closer to a playoff position than before the trade. Seattle was 4 points out of a playoff spot at time of trade and is now an additional 4 points further away from a wild card spot.

^ Those are the bottom-line results.

Why are people still on Kakko? This isn’t Bobby Orr we traded. This is a guy with 5 full prior seasons averaging 11 gls per, with 4 … FOUR … career playoff goals.

It wasn’t a 1-for-1 either. We got two picks, and their 3rd is damn close to a late 2nd at this point.

What, we didn’t put Kakko in an environment to thrive? Did guys like Jordan and Bird enter thriving, winning environments? Their teams sucked absolute ass the season before they arrived. Guys like that are the winning environment.

Executing falls on the player. These are grown men, not 7-year-old kids.

The people saying Borgen is a small sample size. Not even wasting time on this ridiculous nonsense.

We didn’t trade Kakko at peak value? In hindsight, yes, we could’ve gotten more after his one decent season. But how many teams trade a 2OA after a season like that? Few. Most expect/hope it’s a sign of a breakout.

We traded Kakko now. Is what it is. We can hindsight it to death, but it’s done. Our team thus far is winning more and Seattle thus far is winning less. Results. Reality. Period.

The trade is history.

I sincerely wish all the best for Kakko and I am fine if the trade ends win-win. But I hope no one punishes Borgen cuz they don't like a trade Borgen had nothing to do with.

Borgen is a NYR now. He’s going to make mistakes and he will have bad games. All athletes do. But the team so far is better with him here. He also likely would’ve gotten more as a UFA and could’ve chosen his destination. He chose to extend here, at a relatively fair price.

I hope at some point some of y’all can move past the trade and focus on the actual current NYR team, which has looked a heck of a lot better lately.

This is spot on, thank you for explaining this to everyone who doesn't get it!

Come on people, get over Kakko already. He's gone, he's not our problem/project/whatever anymore. It just didn't work out for him here. Borgen has been solid since coming over and provided a need for us.

 

[TGWL]

Borgen was an absolute monster in the Avs game. The turnover to end it was far more on K'Andre (for taking the puck deep in that situation) and Panarin (for calling for the puck with Makar exiting the box after a 3 minute shift). Good to see Borg play so well after the extension.

I'm going to disagree with the Miller blame. Going back down low was 100% an option for Borg. I mean short of waving in the air, he was in direct line of sight to Borg and 100% open. Borgen made the wrong option whether Panarin was calling for the puck or not. We shouldn't put this on Miller when the team is still trying to score in regulation. There wasn't a danger of a turnover here until the decision to pass that puck across was made. Borg wasn't put in a bad situation just because team didn't stop playing and go for the OT point. Borg turned that into a bad situation.

 

[will1066]

This garbage passes as THN content nowadays?

https://thehockeynews.com/nhl/new-york-rangers/latest-news/the-case-against-will-borgens-big-contract-extension

I swear someone is ghostwriting under Fischler's byline and soiling his legacy, but whoever this writer is, they did get the subway reference correctly!

 

[will1066]

I'm going to disagree with the Miller blame. Going back down low was 100% an option for Borg. I mean short of waving in the air, he was in direct line of sight to Borg and 100% open. Borgen made the wrong option whether Panarin was calling for the puck or not. We shouldn't put this on Miller when the team is still trying to score in regulation. There wasn't a danger of a turnover here until the decision to pass that puck across was made. Borg wasn't put in a bad situation just because team didn't stop playing and go for the OT point. Borg turned that into a bad situation.

"Your honor, I've brought in a couple of my assistants from my legal office to play the roles of Miller and Panarin in this courtroom reenactment of yesterday's play. Bailiff, will you assist me? When I throw this ball that's in my hand to my assistant over there, who will be in position, you will intercept it, ok?

I call this a Borgenactment, in which I will play the role of Borgen. As everyone can clearly see, your honor, both of my assistants are available to receive a pass from me, but only one was the safe option. I elected to make a dangerous cross-ice volley to my assistant over there who's directly across from me. Based on this Borgenactment, Will Borgen is 100% to blame for yesterday's tragedy, and I am asking for full restitution of damages plus compensation for the mental anguish caused over the past 23 hours."

 

[NickyFotiu]

This garbage passes as THN content nowadays?

https://thehockeynews.com/nhl/new-york-rangers/latest-news/the-case-against-will-borgens-big-contract-extension

I swear someone is ghostwriting under Fischler's byline and soiling his legacy, but whoever this writer is, they did get the subway reference correctly!

Yeah that sure does not sound like the Stan of old. So Borgs pass yesterday may cost the Rangers a playoff berth with almost half a season to go? Not over a month of horrible play by the team? Not CK and Zibs falling off a table? Okay whoever is blogging under Stan's name.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yeah that sure does not sound like the Stan of old. So Borgs pass yesterday may cost the Rangers a playoff berth with almost half a season to go? Not over a month of horrible play by the team? Not CK and Zibs falling off a table? Okay whoever is blogging under Stan's name.

Not only that but the GM philanthropically raised him from $2.7 million to $4.1 million. And for what? Going minus 2 against Colorado and costing his team two points in a tight playoff race.

What an idiotic take. So one bad game is the reason this was a bad contract? If he had one good game would it be the reason this was a good contract?