Proposal: Rangers/Avalanche

[Avs44]

Besides Barrie and Johnson, who else do you have?

It's the bottom pairing, who cares? Beauchemin, Zadorov, EJ, and Barrie are pretty much all locks. The Avs then have Gelinas, Tyutin, and Weircioch in the last three slots. One of them can play right side, zero problem. There's no need for a mediocre bottom pairing defensman, regardless of handedness.

 

[Boruto]

Will you stop and knock off the trade MCilrath for garbage non sense.. Delete your ideas mr hardy .lol

I think we should be exploring all options to trade McIlrath while looking for an upgrade at the right side.

 

[shadow1]

Grirgorenko is an important part for Colorado moving forward. McIlrath, at best, would be a spot start type player, even on Colorado.

 

[5 4 Fighting]

Can anyone share with me Grigs stats with the Avs last year? He was considered a bust in Buffalo or just under the talented forwards they did have...

 

[The Abusement Park]

Can anyone share with me Grigs stats with the Avs last year? He was considered a bust in Buffalo or just under the talented forwards they did have...

He had 6 goals, 21 assists. On paper it looks quite underwhelming, but he worked his way up from being a scratch and fourth liner to being one of our better top 6'ers by the end of the season. Once he earned his top 6 spot he really flourished and looked at home. He also has a underrated defensive game, which is pretty awesome. Hopefully this season he can help shed his bust reputation and show he's a capable top 6 player.

 

[Ivan13]

Another thread that shows people know nothing about Grigorenko. That kid is going to catch a lot of people by surprise this year.

 

[bernmeister]

Even if that is his best scenario(It's not, dont act like you've actually watched the kid the past year), that's a hell of a lot better then anything else involved in the trade.

McIlrath and Siemens are both busts, career AHL Dmen or MAYBE #6/7 options one day.


Fast is a solid 4th liner who can play on the 3rd line if a team is hurt with injuries or lacks depth. But he's nowhere close to being a Top 6 or even a quality Top 9 guy.


Grigorenko is a better player today, he took some big steps forward last year, and has continued with those steps forward so far this year. He doesn't have much value league wide right now, but he has a lot of value to the Avs and we dont have any reason to move him at all right now.


Instead we can just watch and see what he can turn himself into. A regular 55-60 point player is something he is capable of becoming.

disagree both D are busts
McD, esp if idiot coach AV is not holding back, could be top 4.
let's remember he lost time to knee injury

Siemens unfortunately must yet achieve another level McD already has
I remain interested in him as a project, but the price has gone down with no advance in performance.
Sixth rounder with conditional add up to 2nd IF he proves he can cut the mustard

Fast eval spot on, except consider him already 3rd line material


you want more to move Grig, fine, NY has enough Fs

 

[Freudian]

Grigorenko is a big guy, has great hands and high hockey IQ. If he puts it all together he'll at least be a 50 point guy. He's showing some promising signs playing on a scoring line in pre-season, scoring four goals and generally being involved.

It's possible he'll never put it together and it's possible he will. If he does, he'll be a far better player than Fast, Siemens and McIllrath.

 

[bernmeister]

Will you stop and knock off the trade MCilrath for garbage non sense.. Delete your ideas mr hardy .lol

Concur

I think we should be exploring all options to trade McIlrath while looking for an upgrade at the right side.

Have an open mind to consider upgrade, sure.
Move him at severe discount, without other offset to make that sacrifice worthwhile, no.

honest worth of McIlrath is tainted by AV
dump AV, make use of Mc, field offers but do not move unless profit

also, McIlrath is a serious enforcer.
Should not be moved

 

[Shootertooter]

Grigorenko is a big guy, has great hands and high hockey IQ. If he puts it all together he'll at least be a 50 point guy. He's showing some promising signs playing on a scoring line in pre-season, scoring four goals and generally being involved.

It's possible he'll never put it together and it's possible he will. If he does, he'll be a far better player than Fast, Siemens and McIllrath.

In this NHL 50 pts is a big deal. I think it is a bold assessment you made based on little to back it up. For arguments sake, Chris Kreider, who I consider a rising talent, in a talent bracket above Grigorenko, has not yet scored 50pts in a season but is obviously closer with 43 and 46pt seasons the past 2years in 100 more NHL games played.

We can't simply say that a guy "should score" 50pts if all goes well, because then we would be saying that about every mediocre forward in the game.

 

[Freudian]

In this NHL 50 pts is a big deal. I think it is a bold assessment you made based on little to back it up. For arguments sake, Chris Kreider, who I consider a rising talent, in a talent bracket above Grigorenko, has not yet scored 50pts in a season but is obviously closer with 43 and 46pt seasons the past 2years in 100 more NHL games played.

We can't simply say that a guy "should score" 50pts if all goes well, because then we would be saying that about every mediocre forward in the game.

Kreider is three years older and not a particularly smart player. I don't know what he's got in common with Grigorenko. He's certainly not more talented than Grigorenko. More athletically gifted for sure, but that's it.

As I said, Grigorenko might put it together or he won't. Avs can afford to be patient and find out.

 

[Makar Goes Fast]

Rangers trade Dylan McIlrath and Jesper Fast to Colorado for Duncan Siemens (I know he's on waivers, but I figured the Rangers can send him down to Hartford and let him develop) and Mikhail Grigorenko.

sneaky i like it... let me try

siemens and mitchell for McIlrath and Mats Zuccarello

 

[strictlyrandy]

Concur



Have an open mind to consider upgrade, sure.
Move him at severe discount, without other offset to make that sacrifice worthwhile, no.

honest worth of McIlrath is tainted by AV
dump AV, make use of Mc, field offers but do not move unless profit

also, McIlrath is a serious enforcer.
Should not be moved

The role of the enforcer has gone away in the traditional sense. Team's are learning this more and more. If a player's best skill is fighting, they will soon (very soon) find themselves out of the NHL. Like it or not, the NHL is trending towards removing fighting from the game. Holding onto a guy because "he's a serious enforcer" is archaic thinking and much like enforcers does not have a place in the league anymore.

 

[CobraAcesS]

In this NHL 50 pts is a big deal. I think it is a bold assessment you made based on little to back it up. For arguments sake, Chris Kreider, who I consider a rising talent, in a talent bracket above Grigorenko, has not yet scored 50pts in a season but is obviously closer with 43 and 46pt seasons the past 2years in 100 more NHL games played.

We can't simply say that a guy "should score" 50pts if all goes well, because then we would be saying that about every mediocre forward in the game.

Well Grigorenko scored at a 40 point pace when playing above the 4th line last season.

This year hes been pretty much hands down the best forward in camp, and that includes our core players.

Now a little of that has to do with MacK, Duchy, and Landy being at the WCH, but he continued to be one of if not the best since they all returned as well.

Hes driving the net, and shooting a lot more, and hes really impressed the new coach defensively as well. These things are all a continuation of what he did in the last 20 or so games last season as well. So no, we're not surprised (at least those that are paying close attention), and yeah we have some predictions that look a bit out of place to the stat watchers.

If you know any thing about it, you should also go lookup what Grigorenko did to his linemates production last year.

Both MacK & Duchene doubled, and almost doubled their production with him respectively. His impact on his linemates was exponential.

You just don't trade a 22 year old 6'3" 209lbs Center who went 12th O/A when hes just starting to show signs of realizing the talent level that got him drafted that high. Hes at a breakout point in his development, and absolutely has the talent to be another young core player for us.

A lot of people are operating on a opinion formed about Grigorenko from more than a year ago. Welcome to 2016...

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

I'd be all for getting McIlrath on the Avs, but not at the expense of Grigs

 

[bernmeister]

The role of the enforcer has gone away in the traditional sense. Team's are learning this more and more. If a player's best skill is fighting, they will soon (very soon) find themselves out of the NHL. Like it or not, the NHL is trending towards removing fighting from the game. Holding onto a guy because "he's a serious enforcer" is archaic thinking and much like enforcers does not have a place in the league anymore.

true largely, however, there's always 1 guy and every team needs it's own counterpart to respond

would not want to waste a roster slot on someone 1 dimensional, and happily that is not McIlrath

 

[TT1]

Garbage, garbage, garbage... and Grigorenko. Don't see why Colorado would consider this.

Actually that trade would be a fleece for Colorado. Fast and Grigorenko (personally i'd take Fast) are a wash and McIlrath is MUCH better than Siemens.

 

[Makar Goes Fast]

Actually that trade would be a fleece for Colorado. Fast and Grigorenko (personally i'd take Fast) are a wash and McIlrath is MUCH better than Siemens.

just because you say so doesn't make it true.

 

[Syckle78]

Why are avs fans acting like this is some preposterous offer? Nothing in the op is particularly valuable. The first page is odd in that the reaction was that he tried to slip in some blue chip prospect.

 

[Ivan13]

Why are avs fans acting like this is some preposterous offer? Nothing in the op is particularly valuable. The first page is odd in that the reaction was that he tried to slip in some blue chip prospect.

Watch Grigorenko play, he has been amazing in the preseason and when he was playing above the 4th line last year he was on pace to eclipse 40 points, that's far more valuable to the Avs than anything McIlrath can do.

And to add to that Grigorenko is good at both ends of the ice, fits well with both Nate and Matt, everyone's pp/60 were higher when they were on the ice with Grigorenko, than they were when they were away from him, etc.

 

[TT1]

just because you say so doesn't make it true.

Quality counter-argument dude. Just because Avs fans say so doesn't mean it's true either, your logic works both ways.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Mcilrath hasnt taken the step yet but he hasnt really gotten a fair chance at it either before this season. NYR has had one of the best defensive groups(ye i said it) for the last 3-4 years before last season.
When he got the chance last season he looked solid. Hasnt looked great in the preseason(Clendening has looked very good) so not sure if he will start on opening night.
He had no chance to take a spot from Klein, Girardi and Boyle last season even if he should have played instead of Girardi but you cant really scratch 5,5 mill defensemen for the next 4 years. You either play him or buy him out. He was much better than Girardi when he got the chance and is a very solid depth defensemen with top 4 potential. Calling him a bust is wrong but he needs to show it this season that he can take a spot and run with it. First season he has actually had a chance to do it.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Why are avs fans acting like this is some preposterous offer? Nothing in the op is particularly valuable. The first page is odd in that the reaction was that he tried to slip in some blue chip prospect.

If you feel that way, you won't mind if we replace Fast with JT Miller, right? Consider Grigorenko around Miller in terms of our expectations, not Fast.

 

[tony d]

aside from Grigorenko this deal looks to be a deal of plugs, can't see either team wanting to do this.

 

[Igor Shestyorkin]

McIlrath for Siemens

No thanks.