agree with you on every point you made except zuccarello being the 4th or 5th best forward on the islanders? REALLY? you honestly think that? lol. would be at WORST their 3rd best, realistically 2nd.
Rangers Are Statistically a "Bad" Team
- Thread starter Fataldogg
- Start date
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HFBoards is well aware that today is election day in the US. We ask respectfully to focus on hockey and not politics.
EdJovanovski
#RempeForCalder
I know this forum is obsessed with trading away good rosters for futures but where does this idea of NYR being old come from?
Buchnevich - 22
Zibanejad - 24
Skjei - 23
Kreider - 26
Vesey - 24
Miller - 24
Hayes - 25
Even their older players; McDonagh’s 28, Shattenkirk is 29, Zucc & Grabner are 30. Their core is young and should not be declining, I think there are issues with AV’s defensive system & a lack of motivation/being too comfortable with having the same coach so long. But they have good players, and their prospect pipeline is pretty good for a team that’s managed to stay very competitive ever since the lockout.
Igor Shestyorkin
Filip Chytil
Lias Andersson
Anthony DeAngelo
Neal Pionk
Sean Day
Ryan Graves
I don’t think they should be rebuilding at all, if anything I’d like a coaching change and maybe a Brassard/Zibanejad-esque trade that is lateral short term yet makes them younger
Buchnevich - 22
Zibanejad - 24
Skjei - 23
Kreider - 26
Vesey - 24
Miller - 24
Hayes - 25
Even their older players; McDonagh’s 28, Shattenkirk is 29, Zucc & Grabner are 30. Their core is young and should not be declining, I think there are issues with AV’s defensive system & a lack of motivation/being too comfortable with having the same coach so long. But they have good players, and their prospect pipeline is pretty good for a team that’s managed to stay very competitive ever since the lockout.
Igor Shestyorkin
Filip Chytil
Lias Andersson
Anthony DeAngelo
Neal Pionk
Sean Day
Ryan Graves
I don’t think they should be rebuilding at all, if anything I’d like a coaching change and maybe a Brassard/Zibanejad-esque trade that is lateral short term yet makes them younger
Kaapo Cabana
Next name: Admiral Kakkbar
haven't had a regulation win in a month.
thats not "analytically" bad, its just old fashioned bad
thats not "analytically" bad, its just old fashioned bad
BrockLobster
Registered User
So realistically he is better than mat Barzal? Lol....
He's also not as good as Bailey, eberle, or lee.
If you think Bailey’s current pace isn’t a result of a ridiculously high shooting percentage and a ridiculous PDO, you’re ignorant. Dude’s a 50 point player who is managing a ridiculously lucky season at the age of 28.
Lee same situation, 22% shooting percentage lmao.
Eberle at least has a history of putting up some points.
Tripod
I hate this team
Don't worry, you have Philly tonight and you always beat us at MSG.
NJ DevLolz
The Many Saints of Newark
- Sep 30, 2017
- 4,709
- 5,651
Aside from Kreider who is a low-end LW1 and Zibanejad who is a borderline 1C, they have a lot of good forwards, but not great ones. There isn't a player on that team who makes you nervous when they have the puck. Look at the guys others teams in the division have: Hall, Tavares, Barzal, Voracek, Giroux, Ovie, Backstrom, Kuz, Crosby, Malkin, Kessel, Panarin. The Rangers have no one near those tiers. McDonagh has fallen off the last few years, Shattenkirk is obviously elite offensively, but not a complete player by any means and Lundqvist has been inconsistent recently, but great this year. Just a whole lot of meh on that team.
PlamsUnlimited
Big Church Bells
Macbanan
Registered User
When they're on top they play like four 2nd lines and overwhelm with depth.
When they're not like they are right now it's four 3rd-lines, just waves of nothing, completely impotent.
Skjei and Shattenkirk have some offensive capabilities but without possession in the offensive zone it just highlights their defensive drawbacks.
Grabner is the only joker that scores independently of how the team is playing with 19 goals and 4 assists.
Rest of players are team players, and the teams sucks right now.
When they're not like they are right now it's four 3rd-lines, just waves of nothing, completely impotent.
Skjei and Shattenkirk have some offensive capabilities but without possession in the offensive zone it just highlights their defensive drawbacks.
Grabner is the only joker that scores independently of how the team is playing with 19 goals and 4 assists.
Rest of players are team players, and the teams sucks right now.
Lays
Registered User
- Jan 22, 2017
- 13,558
- 12,637
Bailey is not a better player than Zucc. Maybe this year sure he's doing great. Before this season he wasn't and he's not close to the 2 way player Zucc is. I doubt Bailey would be on pace for 60+ points like Zucc is had they switched spots.
Anders Lee, also not better right now.
Eberle doesn't touch Zucc
Lays
Registered User
- Jan 22, 2017
- 13,558
- 12,637
Buch could be one and we have Chytil and Andersson coming up. Chytil is an offensively gifted forward who's creative so we're hoping him and Buch can be a nice combo that makes teams scared. Agreed though we need an elite guy on this team. I think Buch and Chytil could end up as 60 point guys but I'm not sure I see them hitting around 70 consistently which is what we need.
NASTY
Registered User
- Jul 29, 2016
- 55
- 28
The coach needs to go but its not entirely his fault he doesn't have much to work with but makes terrible line combos.
If this team makes the playoffs it will be because of Hank and Pavs
They don't have any elite players besides Hank and you cant rely on your goalie to win you every game
There is too many 3rd and 4th liners on this team the only 1st and 2nd line players are Kreider, Zibanejad, Zucc and maybe Buchnevich.
A 3rd liner is their leading goal scorer
They have no finishers
The D is awful
If this team makes the playoffs it will be because of Hank and Pavs
They don't have any elite players besides Hank and you cant rely on your goalie to win you every game
There is too many 3rd and 4th liners on this team the only 1st and 2nd line players are Kreider, Zibanejad, Zucc and maybe Buchnevich.
A 3rd liner is their leading goal scorer
They have no finishers
The D is awful
- Jul 28, 2011
- 15,999
- 10,700
Realistically, he wouldn't be their 2nd best. He's not better than Barzal or JT, lets be real. You can argue overall talent compared to the rest of roster and fit him in where ever, but he's 2nd best.
- Jul 28, 2011
- 15,999
- 10,700
When Buch can take a flick on the back without losing the puck, maybe he'll turn into one.
Lays
Registered User
- Jan 22, 2017
- 13,558
- 12,637
Buch is the most skilled player on this team though. He was producing at a 60+ point pace when playing with Zib and Kreider. His two way game is much improved and statistics back it up. He'll get stronger soon enough, still not a good reason to keep f***ing around with him
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
- 10,959
- 653
Or it emphasizes the fact that hockey results are heavily affected by transient factors. The Caps are 2nd in the league in PDO (save and shooting percentage), and it's high enough that we can expect it to regress toward the mean at some point.
SmellOfVictory
Registered User
- Jun 3, 2011
- 10,959
- 653
As with everything statistical, it's trends and sample sizes. By nature, every statistical trend will have multiple exceptions to it; but over the long term, with a large enough sample size, advanced stats correlate strongly to winning percentage, including winning the cup. The biggest issue with them is people on both sides treat them as gospel: Some people who support them talk as though they can predict outcomes over short periods of time, or there will be huge corrections over the course of days or weeks; similarly, people who don't support them will claim that, because they can't predict outcomes 100% of the time, they're worthless. On both ends there's a pretty bad misunderstanding of statistics and how they actually work.
What makes Zuccarello better than Tavares, Lee, Barzal or Bailey?
Barzal will have a better rookie season than any Zucc season. He isn't close to Tavares. Lee is a 30+ goal scorer. Bailey will beat Zucc in points this season. And they had comparable seasons last year.
It's not an outlandish claim at all.
Very strange thing to see. "Analytics" (which really is just more information, nothing revolutionary) aren't magic pixie dust. You can believe or not, but that doesn't mean the relationships people have found aren't true. There will always be teams that "defy" the analytics because we operate in a world of probabilities, not absolutes.
Teams that control the balance of shots and chances are more likely have a better goal differential, and thus win. However, if you're shooters are running hot or your goalie is stopping everything, then obviously you can "overcome" this. Is it a sustainable way to win though? I'd like to think not. Counting on your goalie to be a world beater, or everyone to have career goal-scoring seasons isn't a reliable way to go about it.
- Jul 28, 2011
- 15,999
- 10,700
Zucc is a better player than Bailey and Lee. Lee will definitely be the better scorer, but Zucc is a better overall player. That doesn't mean he's more valuable, though. And I don't think anybody really considers Bailey a top player. Zucc is nowhere close to being better than Tavares or Barzal.
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One Winged Angel
You Can't Escape
Ovechkin, like Bure, simply just doesn't make other players around him better. Guys like Crosby and Malkin win because a major strength to their game is to make other players around them better. Ovechkin's game doesn't do that.
Crosby has made careers for Dupuis, Sheary, Rust, etc. Even Andy Hilbert had a very small stretch playing with him in which he scored almost a point per game. Ovechkin has become so one dimensional over the years. He used to be a guy that would score 50/50/100. Then after 2010 the goals dropped for 2 years and after that, the assists dropped off the deep end completely.
As good of a player as he is, he's also part of the problem. He tries to do too much come playoff time. If he wasn't worried about hitting everything that moves, maybe he'd be more effective in the playoffs.
Glen Sathers Cigar
Sather 4 Ever
If they're so bad then how did their whole team make the All Star game?
