Proposal: - Quinn for Whitecloud | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League
Toggle sidebar

Proposal: Quinn for Whitecloud

dkollidas

Registered User
Nov 18, 2010
3,846
585
Straight up.

How would fans from both teams feel about this? I think Whitecloud would be a solid guy to try next to power and Quinn could be a buy low candidate for Vegas
 
I don't have any close knowledge of the Vegas situation but since that fanbase doesn't meet on HF, I'll try and make the most basic attempt to analyze the trade suggestion from their end.

Vegas doesn't have any reason to move Whitecloud. He's a good player on a good contract, not easy to replace as an RD. They're more likely to move Hague, who had a worse season analytically and needs a new contract. But he's an LD which isn't what Buffalo needs.

So I think Vegas won't be where Buffalo finds a D. Vegas might trade a 2nd or something for Jack Quinn though, depending on which forwards they bring back. They tried something like that with Holtz, which didn't work, but they might like to try with Quinn.
 
majormajor said:
I don't have any close knowledge of the Vegas situation but since that fanbase doesn't meet on HF, I'll try and make the most basic attempt to analyze the trade suggestion from their end.

Vegas doesn't have any reason to move Whitecloud. He's a good player on a good contract, not easy to replace as an RD. They're more likely to move Hague, who had a worse season analytically and needs a new contract. But he's an LD which isn't what Buffalo needs.

So I think Vegas won't be where Buffalo finds a D. Vegas might trade a 2nd or something for Jack Quinn though, depending on which forwards they bring back. They tried something like that with Holtz, which didn't work, but they might like to try with Quinn.
Click to expand...

They have Korzcak waiting in the wings which is going to force a move of either Whitecloud or Hague. It's just going to come down to whether they A. Value the cost certainty of Whitecloud vs Hague's new deal. B. Is Theodore comfortable moving to the left full time. They tried that this year and it didn't go well. If I had to venture a guess Whitecloud will be the one to go mainly because they won't want to break up the Mcnabb-Theo pair. The right side next year is either going to be Petro/Theo/Korzcack or Petro/Whitecloud/Korzcak.

I was the one that suggested Quinn for Whitecloud in another thread. Buffalo might have to add a bit just because of the term Whitecloud has but at the same time there is some untapped potential with Quinn I think, whereas with Whitey he is what he is. A very steady #4 guy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bossram, Zman5778, Chainshot and 1 other person
The Duck Knight said:
They have Korzcak waiting in the wings which is going to force a move of either Whitecloud or Hague. It's just going to come down to whether they A. Value the cost certainty of Whitecloud vs Hague's new deal. B. Is Theodore comfortable moving to the left full time. They tried that this year and it didn't go well. If I had to venture a guess Whitecloud will be the one to go mainly because they won't want to break up the Mcnabb-Theo pair. The right side next year is either going to be Petro/Theo/Korzcack or Petro/Whitecloud/Korzcak.

I was the one that suggested Quinn for Whitecloud in another thread. Buffalo might have to add a bit just because of the term Whitecloud has but at the same time there is some untapped potential with Quinn I think, whereas with Whitey he is what he is. A very steady #4 guy.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the context - I didn't know Korzczak was expected to take a spot.

I'm surprised to learn that there are questions about whether Theodore can play LD, him being a LHD!

I like Buffalo a lot so I hate to pee all over a trade that would help them, but Whitecloud's value as a low cost #4/5 RD is too high to move him for Jack Quinn. Quinn would be a plus in a Whitecloud trade, not the main piece. I think Quinn has some upside, but he's taken a long time to develop and the Sabres are eager to give that sheltered ice time to other young players. He's a one-dimensional scratchable winger.

Whitecloud would be a desirable piece for a lot of clubs. Maybe he'll end up in Buffalo, maybe Columbus. I personally think the Sabres should aim a little higher - to get a real #3 D at RD, a veteran who can pair with Power and guide him. Not that Whitecloud wouldn't be useful but Power needs more help than that. (Yes I'm thinking of Rasmus Andersson, even if he's only a rental, it is probably worth it).
 
majormajor said:
Thanks for the context - I didn't know Korzczak was expected to take a spot.

I'm surprised to learn that there are questions about whether Theodore can play LD, him being a LHD!

I like Buffalo a lot so I hate to pee all over a trade that would help them, but Whitecloud's value as a low cost #4/5 RD is too high to move him for Jack Quinn. Quinn would be a plus in a Whitecloud trade, not the main piece. I think Quinn has some upside, but he's taken a long time to develop and the Sabres are eager to give that sheltered ice time to other young players. He's a one-dimensional scratchable winger.

Whitecloud would be a desirable piece for a lot of clubs. Maybe he'll end up in Buffalo, maybe Columbus. I personally think the Sabres should aim a little higher - to get a real #3 D at RD, a veteran who can pair with Power and guide him. Not that Whitecloud wouldn't be useful but Power needs more help than that. (Yes I'm thinking of Rasmus Andersson, even if he's only a rental, it is probably worth it).
Click to expand...

Not that anything you are saying about Quinn wasn't true this year..it was. But writing off Quinn for 1 bad year is a mistake. Prior to his injuries last year and even between his two injuries last year the kid was developing beautifully. I think most Sabre fans had him ahead of Peterka and he wasn't a one dimensional winger. He was a pretty good 200 foot player who even PK'd for us. I had him as our most talented forward.

No doubt he struggled mightily this year and deserved all his scratches but one bad year shouldn't be a reason to throw him away at his lowest value.
 
  • Like
Reactions: majormajor and BKarchitect
Seems pretty fair and the type of trade both teams might be interested in.

I really like Quinn. I liked him better than Peterka up until this past year outside the staying in the ice factor. I don’t watch the Sabres specifically enough to know exactly what happened this year but definitely too many games I caught where he was just a complete zero out there. Outside of not being the fastest and making sure he stays healthy, he seems a decent bet to rebound…somewhere.

In a vacuum, I think there is clearly upside with Quinn and thus the long-term value would be with Vegas here, if you just isolate the players. But Buffalo is well past the point where they need to be concerned with winning fan perception polls. To me this would fit along the lines of the Savoie for McLeod deal or the 2nd for Malenstyn deal to try and collect “winning” pieces. I think Whitecloud could scale up to bigger minutes on a team like Buffalo. Plus at age 28 with 3 years left at $2.75, his contract is absolutely perfect. Well below market value and ends right when his prime years end.
 
Sold. I’m still a big believer in Quinn’s talent and think he could quickly bounce back if he has a good offseason and stays healthy this year, but Whitecloud would fill a big need for Buffalo.
 
Whitecloud fills a giant need for Buffalo, and, at 28 years old, is in the age range that they should be adding. Quinn could be a 25-30G 200 ft player, or he could be whatever the hell he was last year. Buffalo needs fewer question marks, which pushes me to want to move the high variance player for a steady player in a position of need.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: tsujimoto74
Beerz said:
Not that anything you are saying about Quinn wasn't true this year..it was. But writing off Quinn for 1 bad year is a mistake. Prior to his injuries last year and even between his two injuries last year the kid was developing beautifully. I think most Sabre fans had him ahead of Peterka and he wasn't a one dimensional winger. He was a pretty good 200 foot player who even PK'd for us. I had him as our most talented forward.

No doubt he struggled mightily this year and deserved all his scratches but one bad year shouldn't be a reason to throw him away at his lowest value.
Click to expand...

I have suggested to all my teams boards at one point or another that they should be bidding on Quinn. It's just the reality of the situation that tells me his price is very low relative to his talent level. If he was struggling at age 21 then I think you obviously wait it out or send him down, but the team and player are both out of time. Or at least they will be if Quinn doesn't start out strong in the Fall.
 
majormajor said:
I have suggested to all my teams boards at one point or another that they should be bidding on Quinn. It's just the reality of the situation that tells me his price is very low relative to his talent level. If he was struggling at age 21 then I think you obviously wait it out or send him down, but the team and player are both out of time. Or at least they will be if Quinn doesn't start out strong in the Fall.
Click to expand...

Honestly someone just pointed out that he is probably a prime candidate for an offersheet after we end up filling out all our RFA's .. Would be a good gamble for a rebuilding team with lots of cap space. Good gamble.
 
i don't watch enough of either to have an informed opinion on swapping these two players specifically, but i think conceptually this kinda trade is very much rooted in nhl reality, as opposed to the much more common video game style proposals.

the idea of moving a u23, skilled, top 10 pick for a reliable but unexciting 2nd/3rd pair d is heretical for a lot of people - assuming the young player has shown almost anything at the nhl level. it's easy to understand...offense and offensive potential are what most fans are drawn to. you don't see many highlight reels of closing out possessions, clean releases from forecheck pressure, and initiating clean breakouts for a reason. you don't get a lot of the plays that end up on highlight reels if you don't have guys to do those things though. my fairly limited impression of whitecloud and quinn would be that this is in the right ballpark in terms of value. from the respective roster perspective, it's the kind of move that absolutely makes sense for buf to pursue. for vegas, i think their def group is strong enough where it makes sense, because i definitely think they need to add a bit more pop up front.

maybe this isn't the deal. maybe buf can find a return they deem better or vegas likewise could do the same. in the big picture, from the org asset mgmt perspective of both teams, it's the type of trade both are likely to be involved in this summer though.
 
majormajor said:
Thanks for the context - I didn't know Korzczak was expected to take a spot.

I'm surprised to learn that there are questions about whether Theodore can play LD, him being a LHD!

I like Buffalo a lot so I hate to pee all over a trade that would help them, but Whitecloud's value as a low cost #4/5 RD is too high to move him for Jack Quinn. Quinn would be a plus in a Whitecloud trade, not the main piece. I think Quinn has some upside, but he's taken a long time to develop and the Sabres are eager to give that sheltered ice time to other young players. He's a one-dimensional scratchable winger.

Whitecloud would be a desirable piece for a lot of clubs. Maybe he'll end up in Buffalo, maybe Columbus. I personally think the Sabres should aim a little higher - to get a real #3 D at RD, a veteran who can pair with Power and guide him. Not that Whitecloud wouldn't be useful but Power needs more help than that. (Yes I'm thinking of Rasmus Andersson, even if he's only a rental, it is probably worth it).
Click to expand...

It's less Theo being able to and more the fact that Theo has struggled playing with anyone but Mcnabb who plays the left. They tried him with Petro this year for about 10 games and it was ummmm not good. Although Theo has said he prefers the right side for the one time options it presents.
 
I think that Whitecloud is worth more than Quinn. One is a legit NHL'er who played 18 minutes/night on a Cup winner, plays an in demand position, and has a good contract. The other guy is iffy, who plays a minor role on one of the worst teams in the league, and is coming off a disappointing year.
 
I think Hague is the one to go if Vegas moves a D. Already had a holdout situation the last negotiation with him, albeit brief. He’s probably gonna want a decent chunk of change on this new deal too.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)

Latest posts

Ad

Ad

Top Bottom